Ideas and suggestions for a true World Cup

[patnyrnyg]

1) The NHL/NHLPA have shown no interest in promoting this event globally. This is odd because all the meetings and discussions which led to the announcement of a return of the World Cup of Hockey emphasized the "global" agenda. There seems to be a serious lack of understanding in NA of the European side of things and probably vice versa as well. Without it you just have two sides shouting down each other and promoting their own provincial versions of the game.

2) Toronto is a major ice hockey city with a cosmopolitan population. It is the most easily accessible city in Canada and could be a great venue for a major international competition.

3) Sorry, can't remember what this point was

4) If you're trying to grow the game don't you want 10 year olds to come with their parents? Mascots may seem gimmicky to an adult but if they add a level of comfort or enjoyment for families, why wouldn't you have them?

5) Fan zones are a major component of any self-respecting international tournament. The World Cup, the Rugby World Cup, The Olympics, etc... all have areas where you can enjoy the atmosphere of a tournament without being inside the stadiums/arenas of play. It's about creating an overall experience where the energy of a tournament is felt in many places, not just one.

6) Hosts matter. You're going to sit there with a straight face and imply that any moron who can speak english should be a host for US or Canadian tv? The quality of competition does come first. But a good set of commentators, a professional set of analysts and hosts and a strategic marketing push can both enhance or conversely detract from the main focus. ESPN's success in covering the World Cup (soccer) is proof positive of this.

Summarily, this tournament can succeed but needs to be run seriously in a collaborative effort between the NA and European/rest of world stakeholders. This is an opportunity to create a lasting legacy for ice hockey that grows and promotes and celebrates the game. In its current format, however, I believe it will not succeed in that. Switzerland and Slovakia may not be able to win but they deserve a spot in this tournament. If it is about spreading hockey then how can you effectively "punish" Switzerland even though they have been the best improved nation of the past decade? And the BS I keep hearing/reading about quality of play is absurd. You cannot arbitrarily manufacture quality. Some games may not be very competitive (look at the foundation of any major tournament, blowouts happen!) but many will be surprisingly so. And the first time an underdog (Switzerland, Slovakia, Germany, Belarus, Denmark, Latvia etc...) beats a major team or even forces overtime, this tried and true format will be validated. Stop the gimmicks, incentivize the European nations to take it seriously and get over yourself! Ice hockey will never grow with the siloed approach that is currently put in practice by NA and European leagues/federations.

1) That wasn't my question. Do the NHL and NHLPA need to promote this in order for REPORTERS to be aware? I would think the reporters from various European countries be all over this in an effort to promote it within their own country.

2) Yeah, no kidding. Did you read my comment about their being MANY hockey fans within driving distance of Toronto?

3) Well, if you went back and looked at my post, compare it to the one I quoted you could figure it out, but it was in reference to a comparison of the soccer world cup.

4) I started playing organized football when I was 11 years old and pick-up football long before that. Didn't attend my first NFL game until I was 18. Never played organized hockey as a kid, but have been watching for as long as I can remember. My first NHL game was when I was 9, Oct 1st, 1985. Rangers-Flyers, highlights of the game can be found on You Tube. Uncle game us tickets and my dad realized Rangers games were not a place for children. Didn't attend my next game until the day before my 18th bday. For years, I couldn't even watch most Rangers games on tv, because I did not have MSG as part of my cable package and my parents wouldn't pay the extra money to get it. My parents were not into sports at all. Now, I am a season ticket holder for both the Giants and Rangers. Used to listen to most games on the radio. My point is, the idea that kids need to be able to go to games to get interested is completely wrong or to play the game to become interested is completely wrong. Secondly, if a kid's only interest in the game is a mascot, then he's not going to be interested in sports.

5) Yes, the Super Bowl, NHL play-offs set-up stuff like this too. Never got the appeal. My friend who lives in Manhattan went to a Rangers viewing in Central Park, said he was surrounded by people whining about ticket prices.

6) Again, the TALENT is what counts. A bad commentator is not going to stop someone from watching and if you are only watching for the commentator, then the sport has no chance to grow. Look at figure skating. During the Olympics, all the women I work with were talking about how they were watching to listen to/see Johnny Weir. They could care less about the actual competition. ESPN had their top hockey guys covering the games in 96 and 2004, not sure why anyone would think it would be different today.

 

[Forsberg21Sakic19]

And, you have that first clue?

Not really concerned that hockey is not as popular as soccer worldwide or as popular as football, baseball, or basketball here in the US. It is not why I watch and follow the sport. Funny thing is, it is only hockey fans who I hear complain about the "relevance" of hockey.

European club teams are going to start beating NHL teams? Ha, yeah, ok. Let me know when you wake up from your fantasy. Remember when the KHL was supposed to become a legitimate contender for the best league in the world? Yeah, that lasted long. If you are referring to national teams, it has already happened. Sweden beat the US in 06, Finland beat the US this past year. I could go on. Not sure what your whole point is about it.

Your provincial and combative attitude towards people who are from a different region than yourself, and may have different ideas from you, but who ultimately love the same game you do, offends me. That's my point.

Look up the Victoria Cup. European teams have already beaten NHL teams. And if you had watched even one game that SKA St. Petersburg played (team that won the Gagarin Cup last year) or taken one look at the roster and quality of player on that club, you would recognize that it was a team that could give a good game to most, if not all of the NHL. The fact that you haven't, or even better, if you have and still don't understand it, delegitimizes your "expertise" clearly.

 

[Forsberg21Sakic19]

1) That wasn't my question. Do the NHL and NHLPA need to promote this in order for REPORTERS to be aware? I would think the reporters from various European countries be all over this in an effort to promote it within their own country.

2) Yeah, no kidding. Did you read my comment about their being MANY hockey fans within driving distance of Toronto?

3) Well, if you went back and looked at my post, compare it to the one I quoted you could figure it out, but it was in reference to a comparison of the soccer world cup.

4) I started playing organized football when I was 11 years old and pick-up football long before that. Didn't attend my first NFL game until I was 18. Never played organized hockey as a kid, but have been watching for as long as I can remember. My first NHL game was when I was 9, Oct 1st, 1985. Rangers-Flyers, highlights of the game can be found on You Tube. Uncle game us tickets and my dad realized Rangers games were not a place for children. Didn't attend my next game until the day before my 18th bday. For years, I couldn't even watch most Rangers games on tv, because I did not have MSG as part of my cable package and my parents wouldn't pay the extra money to get it. My parents were not into sports at all. Now, I am a season ticket holder for both the Giants and Rangers. Used to listen to most games on the radio. My point is, the idea that kids need to be able to go to games to get interested is completely wrong or to play the game to become interested is completely wrong. Secondly, if a kid's only interest in the game is a mascot, then he's not going to be interested in sports.

5) Yes, the Super Bowl, NHL play-offs set-up stuff like this too. Never got the appeal. My friend who lives in Manhattan went to a Rangers viewing in Central Park, said he was surrounded by people whining about ticket prices.

6) Again, the TALENT is what counts. A bad commentator is not going to stop someone from watching and if you are only watching for the commentator, then the sport has no chance to grow. Look at figure skating. During the Olympics, all the women I work with were talking about how they were watching to listen to/see Johnny Weir. They could care less about the actual competition. ESPN had their top hockey guys covering the games in 96 and 2004, not sure why anyone would think it would be different today.

1) The problem is that an NHL run tournament is met with a degree of skepticism from European nations. Coming from a sports background where international federations set the rules and not leagues, it is therefore not a foregone conclusion that people from Europe would be interested. The Olympics and IIHF Worlds already occupy the interest of fans in these nations so a "new" event needs to win over fans/media/sponsorship. It doesn't just become relevant by existing. This is where there is such a difference between NA and Europe.

2) Sorry for agreeing with you....?

3) Classy

4) I'm not saying the mascot is the driving factor. Or even that attendance at games is the only way kids enjoy the game. However, attending the game is one way of creating exposure and that can never be a bad thing. Just because you had a certain experience doesn't make it a set in stone fact.

5) Did you really just use "a friend of yours once..." as support for your argument? The difference is international tournaments are meant to be a location related attraction. People in many parts of the world are willing to go to the Olympics, World Cup, Rugby World Cup, etc... to see their team play but also to enjoy the atmosphere and location where the sport(s) is/are being held. The Super Bowl does do this but remember, at the end of the day its one game pitting to two club teams representing one or two cities. The international tournaments draw from a much wider base.

6) I won't disagree with you that the first draw is the attractiveness of the talent, i.e. the on-ice product. Of course it is. But to "new" fans and "marginal" fans, the marketing buzz, the quality of commentary, the "aura" around the event is also massively important. To deny that is ridiculous.

I can't understand the few North Americans who are so anti-European in their view of ice hockey. The growth of the game will not threaten the NHL. It won't threaten the Rangers. I was born in Manhattan and have lived in both North America and Europe. I played ice hockey from when I was 3 and stopped playing competitively in undergrad. I still play occasionally (when my body holds up!). I love this game more than any other on earth and want to see it grow. I think it has the potential to do so and I think all of us will be the better for it.

 

[sting101]

I don't see the problem in having a 16 team tournament. The point of the tournament is to get nations together and grow the game. Of course there are going to be blowout games, but you don't think kids in low IIHF-ranked countries wouldn't love to be able to see Crosby or Ovechkin play their countries? If a nation with a soccer program like Ireland can play in Euro 2012, why can't a hockey nation like Italy play in the WCoH?

For the first expanded WC, hold it in Europe. Make it easier for fans from the European countries to travel there, if we're growing the game we have to make it more accessible to 14 nations rather than 2. Qualification could be something like invite the top 12 teams in the IIHF rankings and have qualifying tournaments the year before for the last 4.

4 groups of 4, teams play 3 games each. top 8 or 12 make the knockout stage. Final best of 3.

Hold it in UTC +1 the first time around so the North American fans don't have to wake up at ungodly hours. As the tournament grows, more countries can grow their programs and go for bids.

Have the tournament in Late August or Early September. Keep delaying the start European leagues to a minimum but try to strike a balance between that and giving enough rest to the NHLers, the real major draw to the tournament. Have every player available, that's what it's all about.

I agree with this.

If it means an absolute best on best it requires a deal between the IAFF and the NHL. An alternating of Europe and NA hosts and I really don't know what you would do with the current Worlds tourney. Maybe it just gets skipped every 4 yrs??

I even think there should be an Australasia - South America qualifying group that allows one entry from Australia Japan China and Korea etc. Could go a long way for advancing development in more obscure nations.

The current format is cringeworthy

 

[patnyrnyg]

Your provincial and combative attitude towards people who are from a different region than yourself, and may have different ideas from you, but who ultimately love the same game you do, offends me. That's my point.

Look up the Victoria Cup. European teams have already beaten NHL teams. And if you had watched even one game that SKA St. Petersburg played (team that won the Gagarin Cup last year) or taken one look at the roster and quality of player on that club, you would recognize that it was a team that could give a good game to most, if not all of the NHL. The fact that you haven't, or even better, if you have and still don't understand it, delegitimizes your "expertise" clearly.

Yes, I am SUUUUUUUUURE the Victoria Cup was taken seriously by NHL teams.

Just looked at SKA's roster. Not impressed. If they were in the NHL, of course they would not go 0-82, but they would be competing for the 1st overall pick.

Finally, not sure how I am being combative. If anyone is being combative it is the Euro fan towards NA's and the NHL. As if the NHL owes anything to the European fan.

 

[patnyrnyg]

1) The problem is that an NHL run tournament is met with a degree of skepticism from European nations. Coming from a sports background where international federations set the rules and not leagues, it is therefore not a foregone conclusion that people from Europe would be interested. The Olympics and IIHF Worlds already occupy the interest of fans in these nations so a "new" event needs to win over fans/media/sponsorship. It doesn't just become relevant by existing. This is where there is such a difference between NA and Europe.

2) Sorry for agreeing with you....?

3) Classy

4) I'm not saying the mascot is the driving factor. Or even that attendance at games is the only way kids enjoy the game. However, attending the game is one way of creating exposure and that can never be a bad thing. Just because you had a certain experience doesn't make it a set in stone fact.

5) Did you really just use "a friend of yours once..." as support for your argument? The difference is international tournaments are meant to be a location related attraction. People in many parts of the world are willing to go to the Olympics, World Cup, Rugby World Cup, etc... to see their team play but also to enjoy the atmosphere and location where the sport(s) is/are being held. The Super Bowl does do this but remember, at the end of the day its one game pitting to two club teams representing one or two cities. The international tournaments draw from a much wider base.

6) I won't disagree with you that the first draw is the attractiveness of the talent, i.e. the on-ice product. Of course it is. But to "new" fans and "marginal" fans, the marketing buzz, the quality of commentary, the "aura" around the event is also massively important. To deny that is ridiculous.

I can't understand the few North Americans who are so anti-European in their view of ice hockey. The growth of the game will not threaten the NHL. It won't threaten the Rangers. I was born in Manhattan and have lived in both North America and Europe. I played ice hockey from when I was 3 and stopped playing competitively in undergrad. I still play occasionally (when my body holds up!). I love this game more than any other on earth and want to see it grow. I think it has the potential to do so and I think all of us will be the better for it.

1) They are mostly NHL players and are used to NHL officials and rules. Where in the 96 or 04 World Cup was the officiating biased? Fans are interested in the Olympics, but time for fans to wake up are realize WHY the NHL started sending players to the Olympics. To convert the once every four year fans into NHL fans in North America and they haven't seen that after 5 attempts. Secondly, in NA, the IIHF Worlds are meaningless, so bringing them up really is a waste of time. Was the World Cup of Soccer as big the first few times as it is now? Did it take time to grow?

4) You want a mascot, fine. To even say the lack of a mascot a year in advance is an issue is ridiculous. That was my whole point. Bringing it up is grasping at straws. When people talk about past International events, what do they talk about? Michael Phelps, Nancy vs Tonya, Miracle On Ice, Olga Korbut, Nadia Comaneci (sp?) or the damn mascot?

5) What would you like me to compare it to? So, a few thousand people watching a game on a huge lawn and tv is what makes an event? Is that why people watch the world cup of soccer, so that when the team scores they can see the fans at the nation's capital celebrating on a big lawn? Come one, give me a break.

6) The NHL has been trying to get the casual and marginal fans for a long time and has alienated many of its hardcore fans. I watch the soccer world cup, even watched a few womens soccer world cup games. Guess what, I could not tell you the name of a single commentator, analyst, or host. But, I can tell you who won the games. I can tell you how I was watching the Brazil-Germany semi-final game, it was 1-0, ran out to pick up my daughter and when I came home only 15 minutes later or so, it was 5-0.

Who says I am anti-European? I just do not expect the NHL to cater to the European fan. You also can't expect the NHL owners to make sacrifices to benefit the "growth" of the game and this growth is minimal. Wow, someone from CHina was drafted, does that make the NHL better? By the time any of these sacrifices people are expecting the NHL to make reaps any benefits, most of these owners will no longer own the teams. For the millionth time, I HATE this format for the World Cup. HATE this U23 team and HATE this Euro left-over team. However, the complaints that they do not have a mascot or haven't announced the host and some of the other complaints are ridiculous.

 

[Theokritos]

Yes, I am SUUUUUUUUURE the Victoria Cup was taken seriously by NHL teams.

I happen to believe it was taken seriously by NHL teams, but one game just doesn't tell you that much. The overall record of NHL teams vs European teams from some years ago when they still played each other is much more telling and (not surprisingly, at least not to me) it clearly speaks in favour of the NHL.

 

[patnyrnyg]

I happen to believe it was taken seriously by NHL teams, but one game just doesn't tell you that much. The overall record of NHL teams vs European teams from some years ago when they still played each other is much more telling and (not surprisingly, at least not to me) it clearly speaks in favour of the NHL.

I am going to the Rangers home opener Saturday night, I will look for the Victoria Cup Banner they put when they "won" it a few years ago.

 

[Theokritos]

I am going to the Rangers home opener Saturday night, I will look for the Victoria Cup Banner they put when they "won" it a few years ago.

Have fun.

 

[ForumNamePending]

1) ...Was the World Cup of Soccer as big the first few times as it is now? Did it take time to grow?...

No it wasn't, but after 40 years and 8 or 9 editions it was a pretty big deal...

...I just do not expect the NHL to cater to the European fan. You also can't expect the NHL owners to make sacrifices to benefit the "growth" of the game and this growth is minimal. Wow, someone from CHina was drafted, does that make the NHL better? By the time any of these sacrifices people are expecting the NHL to make reaps any benefits, most of these owners will no longer own the teams...

...and why would you expect it to grow when based on your own comments it isn't worth the league/owner's time or effort?

I HATE this format for the World Cup. HATE this U23 team and HATE this Euro left-over team.

You're confident this format, or something very similar, isn't going to be the norm moving forward? Given the NHL(PA)'s stated reasons for going with this format, the probable real reasons they went with the format, and your own comments above, why would they be motivated to change it?

5) What would you like me to compare it to? So, a few thousand people watching a game on a huge lawn and tv is what makes an event? Is that why people watch the world cup of soccer, so that when the team scores they can see the fans at the nation's capital celebrating on a big lawn? Come one, give me a break.

I don't think people taking an interest to watch the crowd was his/her point. I think the point was people take an interest to be part of the crowd and feel like they are involved in something significant. Large public gatherings are just a side effect, and IMHO this can very much help make something into an "event" and build further interest. But ya... Given the way this tournament has been managed over the years, whether or not public gatherings take place in Toronto, Stockholm, Prague, etc. to watch should be way down on the list of concerns.

 

[habsrule4eva3089]

I am going to the Rangers home opener Saturday night, I will look for the Victoria Cup Banner they put when they "won" it a few years ago.

No wonder your so bitter, you have no idea what it means to watch Hockey. That's one of the worst atmosphere's to watch a game in in the World, it's probably up there with watching the maple leafs play in Toronto in terms of depressive Hockey experiences.

Just goes to show most of the posters have never been really seen what an actual Hockey crowd looks like in an international setting, so they have nothing to compare to. If only you nhl fans knew what it meant to be in a festive Hockey atmosphere.

 

[patnyrnyg]

Have fun.

I will have a great time, I'll get a picture of that banner for you.

 

[patnyrnyg]

No it wasn't, but after 40 years and 8 or 9 editions it was a pretty big deal...



...and why would you expect it to grow when based on your own comments it isn't worth the league/owner's time or effort?



You're confident this format, or something very similar, isn't going to be the norm moving forward? Given the NHL(PA)'s stated reasons for going with this format, the probable real reasons they went with the format, and your own comments above, why would they be motivated to change it?



I don't think people taking an interest to watch the crowd was his/her point. I think the point was people take an interest to be part of the crowd and feel like they are involved in something significant. Large public gatherings are just a side effect, and IMHO this can very much help make something into an "event" and build further interest. But ya... Given the way this tournament has been managed over the years, whether or not public gatherings take place in Toronto, Stockholm, Prague, etc. to watch should be way down on the list of concerns.

1) Is the World Cup of Hockey on their 8th or 9th edition and going on 40 years?

2) THIS tournament can grow. Whether it will or not is another story. However, the growth will not be determined on the mascot or the commentator. Do I think it will ever be as big as the soccer world cup? No, absolutely not. Just do not think hockey will ever be as popular as soccer world-wide and all the attempts in the world to grow the game won't put a dent in the soccer stronghold. Biggest reason is the costs to play the game.

3) No, not confident in anything at this point. However, taking a wait and see approach for 2020. If they keep this, then to me it isn't a World Cup, it is simply the NHL International Championship.

4) What is wrong with how it was managed in 96 or 04 or how the Canada Cups were managed?

 

[patnyrnyg]

No wonder your so bitter, you have no idea what it means to watch Hockey. That's one of the worst atmosphere's to watch a game in in the World, it's probably up there with watching the maple leafs play in Toronto in terms of depressive Hockey experiences.

Just goes to show most of the posters have never been really seen what an actual Hockey crowd looks like in an international setting, so they have nothing to compare to. If only you nhl fans knew what it meant to be in a festive Hockey atmosphere.

whatever you say.

 

[joelef]

They should model it base of the WBC. Have Canada, USA, Russia, Finland, Sweden, Czech Republic automacally qualify then fill out the rest. Have loose rules like The WBC so countries can get the best players they can.

 

[ForumNamePending]

1) Is the World Cup of Hockey on their 8th or 9th edition and going on 40 years?

Considering it pretty much was/is the CC rebranded I don't think it's unfair to say it has been around that long.

2) THIS tournament can grow. Whether it will or not is another story. However, the growth will not be determined on the mascot or the commentator. Do I think it will ever be as big as the soccer world cup? No, absolutely not. Just do not think hockey will ever be as popular as soccer world-wide and all the attempts in the world to grow the game won't put a dent in the soccer stronghold. Biggest reason is the costs to play the game.

Ya, hockey is obviously never going to be remotely close to soccer. Where you have me a bit confused is... You think a WCup can grow but at the same argue it isn't worth the NHL's time or effort to do anything to actually grow it. I'm not sure how you reconcile those two lines of thought. By "grow" do you simply mean there might still be some low hanging fruit on the Canada (and specifically Toronto) tree that the NHL has yet to pick? If so, then ya, it could grow.

4) What is wrong with how it was managed in 96 or 04 or how the Canada Cups were managed?

I think we may have had this conversation before. I personally think a "World Cup" shouldn't be limited to a 8 team invite only tournament (so I guess I'm just hard to please) but I actually think the '96 tournament was a nice ambitious step forward from the CC days. The problem has been they have only bothered to host it once since then. Now that it's back you yourself have said "I HATE this format for the World Cup" and a lot of people who liked the previous CCs and WCups seem to agree... On the whole does it sound like it has been a well managed tournament?

 

[patnyrnyg]

Considering it pretty much was/is the CC rebranded I don't think it's unfair to say it has been around that long.



Ya, hockey is obviously never going to be remotely close to soccer. Where you have me a bit confused is... You think a WCup can grow but at the same argue it isn't worth the NHL's time or effort to do anything to actually grow it. I'm not sure how you reconcile those two lines of thought. By "grow" do you simply mean there might still be some low hanging fruit on the Canada (and specifically Toronto) tree that the NHL has yet to pick? If so, then ya, it could grow.



I think we may have had this conversation before. I personally think a "World Cup" shouldn't be limited to a 8 team invite only tournament (so I guess I'm just hard to please) but I actually think the '96 tournament was a nice ambitious step forward from the CC days. The problem has been they have only bothered to host it once since then. Now that it's back you yourself have said "I HATE this format for the World Cup" and a lot of people who liked the previous CCs and WCups seem to agree... On the whole does it sound like it has been a well managed tournament?

I'm saying THIS tournament can grow and it is worth the NHL's time to grow this tournament, not sure why the NHL needs to be concerned about growing THE GAME in Bangladesh, China, or South America.

An 8-team invite tournament IS appropriate for hockey. They already have the tiers for the World Championships. There is not point in having teams like Hungary, Italy, or France coming to the World Cup to get slaughtered by Canada, Russia, or the US. I am not opposed to there being a qualifying tourney for the lower nations. No, I do not think so far this is a well-managed tourney with these 2 silly teams, but my response was to how they have been run in the past.

While the CC/Summit Series/World Cup has been around since 72, it hasn't been consistent since 91. THAT is where they made a mistake.

 

[patnyrnyg]

No wonder your so bitter, you have no idea what it means to watch Hockey. That's one of the worst atmosphere's to watch a game in in the World, it's probably up there with watching the maple leafs play in Toronto in terms of depressive Hockey experiences.

Just goes to show most of the posters have never been really seen what an actual Hockey crowd looks like in an international setting, so they have nothing to compare to. If only you nhl fans knew what it meant to be in a festive Hockey atmosphere.

What's funny, is YOU started this thread, had questions and all you do is bash any suggestion from a non-Euro. Yet, I have not yet seen any suggestions from YOU for a TRUE World Cup.

 

[Hardyvan123]

It's obvious most North Americans have never traveled abroad to watch International Hockey or support their National teams for whatever sport. The view is so one dimensional it's hilarious.

Can you imagine going through an entire life just following one league, one business and not knowing what the game means to people around the World and seeing the atmosphere that's created when an actual World reunion is gathered for one's sport ala the Olympics and World Championships. That's what it must be like living in North America I suppose, sad, most of these people will never understand what Hockey's truly about.

Well 95% of fans of any sport have a thing called life.

The other 5% might care too much about their own thoughts on hockey, or whatever sport they follow, and forget that it's just a sport and there are alot more important things going on in life.

I'm part of the 5% BTW but the reason people in Europe, or outside of North america, follow the NHL is plain and simple.

the NHL is by far and away the best hockey league in the world with the esbt players.

 

[FiLe]

I'm part of the 5% BTW but the reason people in Europe, or outside of North america, follow the NHL is plain and simple.

the NHL is by far and away the best hockey league in the world with the esbt players.

Slight correction: The reason people outside North America follow the NHL is not because it has the best players, period (and I don't mean to say they don't have those too), but because it has the best players from their country.

 

[sandysan]

Slight correction: The reason people outside North America follow the NHL is not because it has the best players, period (and I don't mean to say they don't have those too), but because it has the best players from their country.

so if all the european players got demoted to the ahl, your saying that people in europe would be interested in following them in that league ? I don't think so.

The draw of the NHL is that its, by leaps and bounds, the best hockey league on the planet. the talent, and specifically the depth of talent, IS the draw. I think that most fans couldn't care less if some guy from their hometown is tearing it up in some second or third rate league even if he's the best player to ever come out of that town.

if the notion that a private league is holding their own tournament offends you so, don't watch. you might get your wish and it will end up a dumpster fire. but if it succeeds it just means that the shift of power towards NA hockey, gets far more permanent.

 

[FiLe]

so if all the european players got demoted to the ahl, your saying that people in europe would be interested in following them in that league ? I don't think so.

You're free to think whatever you want. But I know for a fact that if the NHL didn't have any Finnish players, very few Finns would bother with the NHL. And if the rest of the countries in Europe are the same...

You know, we here in Finland also have a game that is hugely reminiscent of baseball, practically a variant - leading to the logical conclusion that Finns might enjoy watching baseball as well. But how many Finns do follow the MLB? The number is pretty close to zero. Now, if the MLB were to feature Finnish players, however...

The draw of the NHL is that its, by leaps and bounds, the best hockey league on the planet. the talent, and specifically the depth of talent, IS the draw. I think that most fans couldn't care less if some guy from their hometown is tearing it up in some second or third rate league even if he's the best player to ever come out of that town.

"Town" is not the same as "country".

if the notion that a private league is holding their own tournament offends you so, don't watch. you might get your wish and it will end up a dumpster fire. but if it succeeds it just means that the shift of power towards NA hockey, gets far more permanent.

So the people of Toronto hold the entire future of the sport at their mercy?

Dear lord.

 

[sandysan]

You're free to think whatever you want. But I know for a fact that if the NHL didn't have any Finnish players, very few Finns would bother with the NHL. And if the rest of the countries in Europe are the same...

You know, we here in Finland also have a game that is hugely reminiscent of baseball, practically a variant - leading to the logical conclusion that Finns might enjoy watching baseball as well. But how many Finns do follow the MLB? The number is pretty close to zero. Now, if the MLB were to feature Finnish players, however...

"Town" is not the same as "country".

So the people of Toronto hold the entire future of the sport at their mercy?

Dear lord.

and if the ahl was chock full of finns, your saying that would be the defacto draw in finland ? that a guy could make bank by starting a beer league and fill it with fins ?

And as its been said in many blues songs, toronto is paying the costs to be the boss. the tournament is going to be there because a) most of the players are already in close proximity 2) the demand there exceeds the demand anywhere else on the planet. If it fails in toronto, it wont work anywhere. If it succeeds in toronto, they don't need anywhere else. if you dont like it, enjoy the WC's when what little sheen it had on it is completely lost.

If you are so nationalistic that you simply want to support ANY home country boy regardless of what he does ( hockey, soccer, painiting, contortion) does that really make you primarily a hockey fan or a fan of your countrymen ?

 

[FiLe]

and if the ahl was chock full of finns, your saying that would be the defacto draw in finland ? that a guy could make bank by starting a beer league and fill it with fins ?

You obviously missed the bit where it was stated that they need to be the *best* Finns there are.

So any beer league wouldn't work. I doubt filling the AHL with them would be much help either. We already have our own league chock full of players on roughly the same level.

And as its been said in many blues songs, toronto is paying the costs to be the boss. the tournament is going to be there because a) most of the players are already in close proximity 2) the demand there exceeds the demand anywhere else on the planet. If it fails in toronto, it wont work anywhere. If it succeeds in toronto, they don't need anywhere else. if you dont like it, enjoy the WC's when what little sheen it had on it is completely lost.

WHC is popular in Toronto?

Dear lord.

If you are so nationalistic that you simply want to support ANY home country boy regardless of what he does ( hockey, soccer, painiting, contortion) does that really make you primarily a hockey fan or a fan of your countrymen ?

Well, they're at least more eloquent than some Canadians I have the honor of conversing with...

Probably far less prone to missing the point, too.

 

[habsrule4eva3089]

and if the ahl was chock full of finns, your saying that would be the defacto draw in finland ? that a guy could make bank by starting a beer league and fill it with fins ?

And as its been said in many blues songs, toronto is paying the costs to be the boss. the tournament is going to be there because a) most of the players are already in close proximity 2) the demand there exceeds the demand anywhere else on the planet. If it fails in toronto, it wont work anywhere. If it succeeds in toronto, they don't need anywhere else. if you dont like it, enjoy the WC's when what little sheen it had on it is completely lost.

If you are so nationalistic that you simply want to support ANY home country boy regardless of what he does ( hockey, soccer, painiting, contortion) does that really make you primarily a hockey fan or a fan of your countrymen ?

You do realize the World Championships is a much more large scale event then this nhl exhibition cash grab right?

There's only two tournaments in the World of Hockey that have significance, the Olympics and the Worlds and nothing will ever change that.

The 2015 Worlds had a cumulative TV audience of over 1 billion, a spectator crowd totaling 741,690

Do you realize how many countries in the World tune into the IIHF World Championships each spring? More so then Olympic Hockey which it in itself attracts hundreds of millions of viewers across the World for medal games.

Let's not even compare to nhl playoff games which are meaningless on a global scale.

This Canadian tournament is not known to anyone else other then 1 country. It's not an event, it's a cash grab and a waste of time.