Seravalli: I wouldnt be shocked if Necas is traded before Game 1 of Cup Finals

[MarkusNaslund19]

you seem to know hronek as much as you know what i watch. I get it you have homer observations. Luckily the canes have already said no to Hronek so its unimportant. Really no need for you to mansplain (lol) anything.

Yawn.

Keep avoiding the direct question. How many of Hronek's games have you watched? And how many times have you focused on Hronek and not just been yelling near a TV with a beer in your hand?

I'm not even arguing that Carolina should trade for Hronek, there are contractual reasons and stylistic reasons that may well mean it doesn't make sense.

But 'hurr durr he sucks because m-m-m-my spreadsheets tell me' is just not worth saying or taking seriously.

 

[Chan790]

Carolina asking for the moon is why I don’t think he gets traded.

Carolina seeking their value for him because he's the one that wants the trade. Why should they take a step back? They've been clear they want him back and aren't actively listening to offers. Someone's going to have to want him enough to grab the Canes FO's attention and pay for the privilege of paying him.

Most of the offers we're getting are worse (or simply not-useful) than the RFA compensation if he signs an OS...or we match...or he opts for arbitration and we elect the 2-year term and have 2 years to figure it out.

We have no impetus to take a bad (for us) deal.

 

[Nikishin Go Boom]

Yawn.

Keep avoiding the direct question. How many of Hronek's games have you watched? And how many times have you focused on Hronek and not just been yelling near a TV with a beer in your hand?

I'm not even arguing that Carolina should trade for Hronek, there are contractual reasons and stylistic reasons that may well mean it doesn't make sense.

But 'hurr durr he sucks because m-m-m-my spreadsheets tell me' is just not worth saying or taking seriously.

He isn’t a top pairing guy because of his play which is reinforced by those spreadsheets. We have been through this. I don’t owe you a single answer on how many times I have watched. Its enough to know he isn’t a top pairing guy and not a 7+ million dollar defender.

I do love those that dismiss metrics though because they believe their eye is the best observation. Its laughable and this isn’t worth continuing with an obvious biased fan.

 

[HawksDub89]

Carolina seeking their value for him because he's the one that wants the trade. Why should they take a step back? They've been clear they want him back and aren't actively listening to offers. Someone's going to have to want him enough to grab the Canes FO's attention and pay for the privilege of paying him.

Most of the offers we're getting are worse (or simply not-useful) than the RFA compensation if he signs an OS...or we match...or he opts for arbitration and we elect the 2-year term and have 2 years to figure it out.

We have no impetus to take a bad (for us) deal.

Great, then keep him lol.

These trades always get watered down in reality. I’ll be shocked if a team gives up a first, a prospect and a solid NHL player. AND, pays him 8M+

I think he stays in Carolina. He’s a solid player, so I understand asking for a lot.

 

[bleedgreen]

Reports a day or two ago say the Canes haven’t even started shopping him and are still trying to sign him. I’m sure teams have called but the rest of this is probably all bunk at this point. They probably won’t get back equal value in trade so I’m sure they’re trying to see if they can talk him into coming back first.

 

[Nucklehead Supreme]

You're arguing with neutral fans and keep ignoring all logic. Clearly you can't be reasoned with. As a neutral fan Necas has substantially more value than Hronek.

Hronek was shipped off because he got steam rolled in the two game set against the sens and wings. Same thing happened in the playoffs he can't handle a heavy forcheck when the games get tight. Nhl teams know it, literally everyone except you seem to acknowledge it.


He just showed his point totals with and without Hughes... are you serious?

Oh we have an insider here, so that's why he was shipped off, my mistake you clearly have an insider POV, I mean most have said it was because he wanted too much money, and because he is a top pairing dman he'll get it, but I am sure, because of those 2 games, that is why.....

The fact that he was injured had nothing to do with this, and even though the only thing that dried up was his offense, and he was on a pairing that barely allowed any 5 on 5 goals in the playoffs, he definitely got steamrolled, again total insider right here.......

He played with Hughes pretty much the whole year, and even though, he is the first dman to really succeed with Hughes, the only reason he was able to succeed is because of Hughes, not because of how good of a player he is, again, got it......

It doesn't. A player can be capable of producing offensive on their own and still simultaneously benefit from playing with an elite offensive player.

Without Hughes, Hronek averaged 28 ES points per 82 games in his first 5 seasons, with a career high 31 ES points. That's a fine level of production for a top 4 dman. Then in his first season with Hughes, he put up 37 ES points.

I know this might surprise you, but playing with guys like Quinn Hughes can be beneficial to your stat line.

I am sure it has, but pretending like it was all Hughes is incredibly misguided.

 

[Nucklehead Supreme]

I think in this case him saying 'that's your Stanley Cup' which is often needlessly derogatory, is him pointing out that you are using a tiny sample size of 2 regular season games between two teams who were barely on the cusp of relevance in said season (neither of whom made the playoffs) to draw far too broad conclusions.

Hronek played well in the playoffs other than the fact that it was clear he had an arm injury.

In the first half of the season, his heavy shot injured so many forwards it was crazy. His shot would either create a high danger chance, or lead to an opposing forward absolutely crawling off of the ice.

Now, the fact that happened a notable amount in the first 50 or so games, and then stopped happening entirely over the last 32 +playoffs, when his play dipped to just playing like a decent top 4 is either a wild coincidence, evidence of an injury, or 'pRoOf hE cAn'T hAnDlE tHe tOuGh gOiNg'.

His problem isn't that he can't handle physical play.
Occasionally he doesn't protect himself well enough from a big hit from a forechecker, but he never shies away from the tough stuff, and doesn't p***yfoot around because there are big players.

I know Detroit looked like a broken team in that two game set and I can imagine how exciting it was to watch your team do that to a rival, but drawing massive conclusions about a player based on that set is incredibly fallacious.

It's so funny because he says we can't be reasoned with, yet that logic went right over his head.

 

[Nucklehead Supreme]

He isn’t a top pairing guy because of his play which is reinforced by those spreadsheets. We have been through this. I don’t owe you a single answer on how many times I have watched. Its enough to know he isn’t a top pairing guy and not a 7+ million dollar defender.

I do love those that dismiss metrics though because they believe their eye is the best observation. Its laughable and this isn’t worth continuing with an obvious biased fan.

This comment is why the eye test will always be king, relying on those numbers just shows you don't watch the player.

 

[WhiskeyYerTheDevils]

I am sure it has, but pretending like it was all Hughes is incredibly misguided.

Who said it was "All Hughes"? That just sounds like you're intentionally misinterpreting my comments because of your own insecurities.

Let's just look at his 5v5 productivity this season with Hughes and without Hughes:

Hronek 5v5 production	TOI	Points	P60
w/ Hughes	1183	26	1.32
w/o Hughes	323	6	1.11

That 1.11 P/60 without Hughes is still a fair amount higher than his career average of 0.86 P/60 in Detroit. So the data suggests that the increase in his production is almost exclusively due to his time with Hughes.

Not only that, he benefited significantly from an extremely high on ice shooting percentage of 11.9% (his career average coming into this season was 7.6%). Which is why I say it's extremely unlikely that he repeats his point totals from last season.

 

[Nucklehead Supreme]

Who said it was "All Hughes"? That just sounds like you're intentionally misinterpreting my comments because of your own insecurities.

Let's just look at his productivity this season with Hughes and without Hughes:

Hronek 5v5 production	TOI	Points	P60
w/ Hughes	1183	26	1.32
w/o Hughes	323	6	1.11

That 1.11 P/60 without Hughes is pretty much identical to his career average of 1.15 P/60 in Detroit. So the data suggests that the increase in his production is almost exclusively due to his time with Hughes.

Fair enough, his point totals went up playing with Hughes.

 

[Frankie Blueberries]

Who said it was "All Hughes"? That just sounds like you're intentionally misinterpreting my comments because of your own insecurities.

Let's just look at his productivity this season with Hughes and without Hughes:

Hronek 5v5 production	TOI	Points	P60
w/ Hughes	1183	26	1.32
w/o Hughes	323	6	1.11

That 1.11 P/60 without Hughes is pretty much identical to his career average of 1.15 P/60 in Detroit. So the data suggests that the increase in his production is almost exclusively due to his time with Hughes.

You have a point but it’s not as strong as you seem to think it is.


During the time Hronek was paired with Hughes he was healthy. The latter half of the season and playoffs, he was dealing with some issue. I only recall him taking one slap shot in the period of like 3-4 months despite him having the hardest and best slapshot on the team.

 

[24 others]

Meanwhile, Necas is busy showcasing his moves for NHL GMs

https://x.com/i/web/status/1798441249197707506

 

[NotOpie]

Regardless of where and what team Necas ends up on he is a player who has publicly requested a trade and won’t sign in Carolina. This significantly handicaps Carolina in negotiations as “we will just keep him” isn’t an option.

Can you show me that quote about asking for a trade? The only person asking for a trade is Martin Necas's father.

 

[Big Daddy Cane]

~27:49

Looking for a star return for Necas. “Not a middling pick and a B-prospect or a 1st rounder and a decent prospect, like, that’s not going to do it.” They’re willing to move forward with him whether he likes it or not.

In the context of the other news mentioned there, Guentzel’s rights being available for a mid-round pick, this approach makes sense. Losing both could be a catastrophic loss of skill. See if a hockey trade for another forward is out there or maybe a high quality future. Otherwise, kick the can down the road.

 

[thedjpd]

~27:49

Looking for a star return for Necas. “Not a middling pick and a B-prospect or a 1st rounder and a decent prospect, like, that’s not going to do it.” They’re willing to move forward with him whether he likes it or not.

In the context of the other news mentioned there, Guentzel’s rights being available for a mid-round pick, this approach makes sense. Losing both could be a catastrophic loss of skill. See if a hockey trade for another forward is out there or maybe a high quality future. Otherwise, kick the can down the road.

Wow. Some reporting. Who wouldn’t want to trade a star for a one who could be a star? Not to mention a “star” that they play on their 3rd line with their high end offensive talent.

GMs are becoming like HF posters. So afraid to lose a deal that they’d rather just stand pat. Until they get fired.

 

[WhiskeyYerTheDevils]

Wow. Some reporting. Who wouldn’t want to trade a star for a one who could be a star? Not to mention a “star” that they play on their 3rd line with their high end offensive talent.

GMs are becoming like HF posters. So afraid to lose a deal that they’d rather just stand pat. Until they get fired.

Yeah, a star who led the 2nd best team in the NHL in scoring last year as a 23 year old and has led the Canes in ES ice time each of the last two seasons.

The kid is already a star. He's an absolute game breaker. People who watch him play know this. People who stat watch seem to have a harder time understanding....

 

[Patdud]

Running out of time there Frank

 

[Chan790]

Wow. Some reporting. Who wouldn’t want to trade a star for a one who could be a star? Not to mention a “star” that they play on their 3rd line with their high end offensive talent.

GMs are becoming like HF posters. So afraid to lose a deal that they’d rather just stand pat. Until they get fired.

Nobody's getting fired over Marty Necas. The Canes hold all the cards here...this ain't a junk auction, there's a reserve price and it's high.

 

[Torontonian]

Not sure whose trading a established "star" player for Necas? Or are they looking for a potential up and coming star like how they see Necas lol.

 

[RangerBoy]

~27:49

Looking for a star return for Necas. “Not a middling pick and a B-prospect or a 1st rounder and a decent prospect, like, that’s not going to do it.” They’re willing to move forward with him whether he likes it or not.

In the context of the other news mentioned there, Guentzel’s rights being available for a mid-round pick, this approach makes sense. Losing both could be a catastrophic loss of skill. See if a hockey trade for another forward is out there or maybe a high quality future. Otherwise, kick the can down the road.

Necas doesn't want to stay there.

 

[thedjpd]

Yeah, a star who led the 2nd best team in the NHL in scoring last year as a 23 year old and has led the Canes in ES ice time each of the last two seasons.

The kid is already a star. He's an absolute game breaker. People who watch him play know this. People who stat watch seem to have a harder time understanding....

The old "you must not watch him" argument.

I've seen him plenty. He has a lot of skill, and a lot of warts. I guess I just don't view 60ish point players as game breakers yet. Not enough to trade an actual one, and especially one who hasn't even been the game braker on his own team or a top line leader for the past season. Canes fans need to be clear on one thing: Necas has the ability to be a game breaker, he is not one now. That's the bet that a team is taking in even trying to acquire him, and it's far from a guarantee. So no, they will not get an established star-level return. If they can offer that up, they'd do it for an actual star.

Nobody's getting fired over Marty Necas. The Canes hold all the cards here...this ain't a junk auction, there's a reserve price and it's high.

Nobody's getting fired because their latest GM has already left. Only on HF is the "he's stuck here and he'll be happy or else" type of attitude. Teams don't want those things around their team, and around their players.

If Necas truly wants out, he's going to get moved. It's happened almost every single time. They always get moved. Whether it's now or a bit later, or he signs a 1 year deal only to UFA, he's going to go if he wants.

And I never implied he'd be moved for scraps. Every team takes the position of "the price is high" for one of their skilled players. What does that mean? It's not high for anybody, it's just market. Like if I were to tell you Joel Farabee's price is "high" - what does that mean? Nothing. It's justifiable. But both teams will always claim their own asset's value is high.

 

[Dr Jan Itor]

Time's running out Frank...

 

[WhiskeyYerTheDevils]

~27:49

Looking for a star return for Necas. “Not a middling pick and a B-prospect or a 1st rounder and a decent prospect, like, that’s not going to do it.” They’re willing to move forward with him whether he likes it or not.

In the context of the other news mentioned there, Guentzel’s rights being available for a mid-round pick, this approach makes sense. Losing both could be a catastrophic loss of skill. See if a hockey trade for another forward is out there or maybe a high quality future. Otherwise, kick the can down the road.

The point about Necas' impact 3v3 is actually pretty compelling, moreso than you would think.

He's a career 17GF 6GA at 3v3, so that's 17W 6L with him on the ice at 3v3. In that span, he leads all players in 3v3 goals (9) and 2nd in 3v3 points (15). That sort of OT boost could very lead to an extra 2-3 points for a team that struggles in OT, which is pretty significant.

 

[Chan790]

Or are they looking for a potential up and coming star like how they see Necas lol.

Probably that. Or...someone's near-NHL blue-chip spec. It's not the "late 1st and mediocre spec" certain teams want to offer or the aging vet.

 

[Double Dion]

Yeah, a star who led the 2nd best team in the NHL in scoring last year as a 23 year old and has led the Canes in ES ice time each of the last two seasons.

The kid is already a star. He's an absolute game breaker. People who watch him play know this. People who stat watch seem to have a harder time understanding....

I disagree with you on this. He's talented offensively, but he hurts you a lot defensively. Like a better Kuzmenko. He's not a player I'd be interested in acquiring at a high price. If it's a late 1st and B prospect, then sure. If they're thinking a star level return it would be a hard pass from me.