Confirmed with Link: Hronek traded to Vancouver for ‘23 1st (NYI) and ‘23 2nd (VAN)

[Pavels Dog]

I get where you are coming from, but....

I am having a hard time being happy about having more lottery tickets when I just see more holes on the roster to fill.

Although folks on here have always loved the mystery box over the known quantity.

I think it's a calculated gamble by Yzerman that we have the means to replace what Bert and Hronek bring, more easily than we can solve the problem of elite talent.

 

[Retire91]

If Detroit is going to compete in the future we have a lack of complete elite players. Hronek was good but he was not 'core' good. I would rather see Yzerman's scout at work in the first round than just have an okay 3rd pairing undersized offensize defenseman to help us wild card into the playoffs. People seem to have a lack of appreciation that Seider and Raymond are the only currently known early career roster players that have elite all star career arch potential. Throw Larkin in the core because he has a good shot at career longevity. I don't think it's safe to hang onto a 3rd paring small offensive D when you are not even a playoff team and lacking a core. I really don't understand the difficulty in seeing that. Thankfully we have a GM that does. This is kind of a similar argument to the Krug debate. Its not the talent of the player, its just not the player we need at this time. In all honestly I am kind of not sure why Vancouver pulled the trigger.

 

[haulinbass]

If Detroit is going to compete in the future we have a lack of complete elite players. Hronek was good but he was not 'core' good. I would rather see Yzerman's scout at work in the first round than just have an okay 3rd pairing undersized offensize defenseman to help us wild card into the playoffs. People seem to have a lack of appreciation that Seider and Raymond are the only currently known roster players that have elite all star career arch potential. Throw Larkin in there who will probably has the makeup for career longevity. I don't think it's safe to hang onto a 3rd paring small offensive D when you are not even a playoff team and lacking a core. I really don't understand the difficulty in seeing that. Thankfully we have a GM that does. This is kind of a similar argument to the Krug debate. Its not the talent of the player, its just not the player we need at this time. In all honestly I am kind of not sure why Vancouver pulled the trigger.

What has Raymond done to show any signs of elite?

Ok 3rd pairing D huh? Wow, do you even watch what is happening on the ice? Guys been our best player on the entire team many nights this season.

 

[Retire91]

What has Raymond done to show any signs of elite?

Ok 3rd pairing D huh? Wow, do you even watch what is happening on the ice? Guys been our best player on the entire team many nights this season.

Out of context much? I said potential, 23 goals as a rookie. I'm not penciling it in but its hard to get a reading on most anyone with this depleted of a roster. I think a teenager scoring 20+ goals is at least notable.

Yeah most anyone is a first pairing D on this team. Put Hronek on a real team and he's third paring who can move to second if there isn' a legit D there to slot in. Wings have the benefit of average players catching fire because the ice time is available. It's good for sell high trade value which is something Yzerman is really good at to aquire draft capital which is also something Yzerman is good at.

 

[Pavels Dog]

What has Raymond done to show any signs of elite?

Forwards who produced more as U20 players than Raymond since 2005:

Crosby (elite)
McDavid (elite)
Stamkos (elite)
Kane (elite)
Laine (not elite)
Matthews (elite)
Seguin (elite)
Duchene (not elite)
Keller (not elite)
Skinner (not elite)
Mackinnon (elite)
Svechnikov (not elite)
Kopitar (elite)
Marner (elite)
Stützle (elite)

Can also list some names who were slightly below:

Toews
Tavares
Landeskog
Hishier
RNH
Aho
PLD
Matt Tkachuk
Larkin
Brady Tkachuk

Guarantee to be elite? Of course not. But he said "potential" and how could you realistically say being among those names doesn't indicate potential?

 

[jaster]

It had less to do with money and more to do with the return. We’ll be fine with a RD free agent replacement and Edvinsson, dude. Way better off.

Doubt it. Long-term, maybe, but not next season. Ed isn't part of the equation, he's coming to Detroit at some point, Hronek being here or not being here doesn't change that.

So you're telling me the Wings will easily pick up a UFA to replace Honek and that UFA will be better. I'm not seeing it. I can see Yzerman doing something involving flipping assets to accomplish that, but we're not going to improve on Hronek through free agency.

 

[norrisnick]

Doubt it. Long-term, maybe, but not next season. Ed isn't part of the equation, he's coming to Detroit at some point, Hronek being here or not being here doesn't change that.

So you're telling me the Wings will easily pick up a UFA to replace Honek and that UFA will be better. I'm not seeing it. I can see Yzerman doing something involving flipping assets to accomplish that, but we're not going to improve on Hronek through free agency.

What makes you say Ed isn't part of the equation? If Ed's in the top 4 next season, there isn't room for Hronek in the top 4 as there are two truths. 1. Walman and Seider are pairing 1 and 2. Chiarot is in the top 4.

What good is Hronek on the bottom pairing when we've got a stable of kids needing ice time?

 

[jaster]

What makes you say Ed isn't part of the equation? If Ed's in the top 4 next season, there isn't room for Hronek in the top 4 as there are two truths. 1. Walman and Seider are pairing 1 and 2. Chiarot is in the top 4.

What good is Hronek on the bottom pairing when we've got a stable of kids needing ice time?

Lol, I really hope this is a joke, but in case it's not..... Had Hronek not been traded, he wasn't getting bumped down to the 3rd-pair next season, that's silly talk. 2nd in TOI, 1st in points, and a righty who plays the right side. No chance in hell that either of Chiarot or Ed would jump him for the 2nd-pair RD spot.

Most people who watch Edvinsson have been saying lately he probably won't be ready for Detroit to start next season, now he's jumping Hronek for 2nd-pair RD? Nah.

 

[norrisnick]

Lol, I really hope this is a joke, but in case it's not..... Had Hronek not been traded, he wasn't getting bumped down to the 3rd-pair next season, that's silly talk. 2nd in TOI, 1st in points, and a righty who plays the right side. No chance in hell that either of Chiarot or Ed would jump him for the 2nd-pair RD spot.

Most people who watch Edvinsson have been saying lately he probably won't be ready for Detroit to start next season, now he's jumping Hronek for 2nd-pair RD? Nah.

Ed was ready for top 4 this season.

Just for whatever reason coaches allow guys 5-10+ yrs removed from their draft to make mistakes but not kids 1-2 years removed from their draft.

 

[OgeeOgelthorpe]

Doubt it. Long-term, maybe, but not next season. Ed isn't part of the equation, he's coming to Detroit at some point, Hronek being here or not being here doesn't change that.

So you're telling me the Wings will easily pick up a UFA to replace Honek and that UFA will be better. I'm not seeing it. I can see Yzerman doing something involving flipping assets to accomplish that, but we're not going to improve on Hronek through free agency.

I didn’t say they would be better or worse. But it is possible to find a better (Dumba) or a better fit through free agency or trade.

 

[jaster]

That’s not fair. He got a neck injury like immediately upon landing here.

I just got an image of Red Bird III landing so hard that Erik Cole hurt his neck, and Jakub Vrana still clapping for the landing.

(yes, I know Vrana wasn't here at that time)

 

[OgeeOgelthorpe]

Ed was ready for top 4 this season.

Just for whatever reason coaches allow guys 5-10+ yrs removed from their draft to make mistakes but not kids 1-2 years removed from their draft.

He really wasn’t. I’m a huge Ed fan but so many fans here would have wanted to trade him for some of the mistakes he’s made in GR.

 

[jaster]

I didn’t say they would be better or worse. But it is possible to find a better (Dumba) or a better fit through free agency or trade.

It had less to do with money and more to do with the return. We’ll be fine with a RD free agent replacement and Edvinsson, dude. Way better off.

Hm?

Anyway. Trade? Sure. Free agency? Highly doubtful. There's 29 other teams. Your odds are low.

 

[norrisnick]

He really wasn’t. I’m a huge Ed fan but so many fans here would have wanted to trade him for some of the mistakes he’s made in GR.

One of our top 2 pairings has been a clusterf*** all season. And that's perfectly fine because the players involved are older.

That's dumb.

Hm?

Anyway. Trade? Sure. Free agency? Highly doubtful. There's 29 other teams. Your odds are low.

Get with the times, BOOMER!

31 other teams.

 

[Lil Sebastian Cossa]

One of our top 2 pairings has been a clusterf*** all season. And that's perfectly fine because the players involved are older.

That's dumb.


Get with the times, BOOMER!

31 other teams.

I mean, does Arizona really count as a team anymore?

 

[GettingYourMoms]

People who undervalued Hronek´s abilities that made this team competitive and not total garbage or straight up hating on him are delusional. This TDL was Yzerman´s signal to burn this whole team to the ground and starting from scratch. He signed Larkin only because fans would boo him outta town, otherwise he would trade him too. I hate it, there is no sign we are going to be better anytime soon. Dead Wings round 2.

 

[norrisnick]

I mean, does Arizona really count as a team anymore?

They beat us...

 

[jaster]

Get with the times, BOOMER!

31 other teams.

Hang on, checking....

What the hell is a kraken anyway?

 

[norrisnick]

Since this is the active thread... WTF is the board taking a shit? Nothing is left to happen. Are the nerds hitting refresh to watch the scrub for other scrub trades that are left?

 

[GettingYourMoms]

Ed was ready for top 4 this season.

Just for whatever reason coaches allow guys 5-10+ yrs removed from their draft to make mistakes but not kids 1-2 years removed from their draft.

I haven´t seen anything from Edvinsson that would scream top4 guy so far, he is not there yet.

 

[jkutswings]

I would support that. The lottery does not prevent intentional tanking 100% anyway. Maybe it is not rigged, but it is hard to deny that some teams have "better luck than others." Since 2010, Edmonton "won" four times, If these were actual lottery odds, I´d be buying Powerball tickets every day.

Here's the fix:

1) Eliminate the lottery altogether. Draft order is based on record only.

2) Every year the NHL Competition Committee will investigate the bottom 5 teams. If there is evidence that a team did not use reasonable effort to ice a competitive product throughout the entire season, said team forfeits their 1st round pick.

Now nobody tanks, and the worst teams get the most help.

 

[JediOrderPizza]

I haven´t seen anything from Edvinsson that would scream top4 guy so far, he is not there yet.

I don't agree.

 

[GettingYourMoms]

I don't agree.

And that´s fine.

 

[redwings8831]

 

[SirloinUB]

What has Raymond done to show any signs of elite?

Ok 3rd pairing D huh? Wow, do you even watch what is happening on the ice? Guys been our best player on the entire team many nights this season.

Forwards who produced more as U20 players than Raymond since 2005:

Crosby (elite)
McDavid (elite)
Stamkos (elite)
Kane (elite)
Laine (not elite)
Matthews (elite)
Seguin (elite)
Duchene (not elite)
Keller (not elite)
Skinner (not elite)
Mackinnon (elite)
Svechnikov (not elite)
Kopitar (elite)
Marner (elite)
Stützle (elite)

Can also list some names who were slightly below:

Toews
Tavares
Landeskog
Hishier
RNH
Aho
PLD
Matt Tkachuk
Larkin
Brady Tkachuk

Guarantee to be elite? Of course not. But he said "potential" and how could you realistically say being among those names doesn't indicate potential?

Exactly.

In the last 10 years Raymond has the 19th most productive rookie season. Off the top of my head, only 6 of the players ahead of him were also teenagers. Zegras, Matthews, Marner Keller Petterson & Mackinnon. (I might have overlooked a couple of guys but that wouldnt materially change the point.)