How many first round loses is Dubas allowed before he should be fired?

[ShaneFalco]

I appreciate the fact that Dubas has gone a 180 on his philosophy after realizing he'd f***ed up. However, I don't think he actually knows what to look for in a player when it comes to "intangibles".

Vet who talks slot in the room/bench

 

[keonsbitterness]

tough to reason with anyone who says the Marleau contract was "not bad."

Giving a 38 year-old soft player 3 x $6.25M with a NMC is arguably the worst contract in team history.

 

[Stamkos4life]

Of course I care. I've been a fan for over 50 years FFS, what a stupid thing to say.

You're obviously very angry and unable to think straight. I'd suggest you take a break from posting but that would probably just make even angrier so I have no idea what to say to you.

Have a nice day. Is it Ok to say that?

I'm really not that mad. I've known dubas was trash since 2019. This loss has done nothing except further validate my position. Losing to Tampa did literally nothing to me.

I'm not a mod and I don't tell others what to do. So be my guest.

Also your posts seem to suggest that first round loses don't bother you and that dubas should stay on.

You would think an actual fan would rather get rid of management who can't win even one round.

You obviously are just a dubas fan boy so carry on simping for the guy.

 

[keonsbitterness]

I'm really not that mad. I've known dubas was trash since 2019. This loss has done nothing except further validate my position. Losing to Tampa did literally nothing to me.

I'm not a mod and I don't tell others what to do. So be my guest.

Also your posts seem to suggest that first round loses don't bother you and that dubas should stay on.

You would think an actual fan would rather get rid of management who can't win even one round.

You obviously are just a dubas fan boy so carry on simping for the guy.

Passive-aggressive posts for a thousand, Alex.

 

[Stamkos4life]

Lou's job was to get rid of crap contracts, and when he lefft.. he left us with a bunch of crap contracts and 3 years of shit drafting and dealing good picks for TDL duds.
+ he pissed of Marner unnecessarily by denying him the bonuses.

So these "3 crap contracts" and "pissing off marner" outweigh all the results?

Lous job was to turn this franchise around. We had made the PO once in the past dozen years. With him as gm we drafted matthews. He turned this team around.

That's what I find amusing about the dubas cult, the actual results and facts mean absolutely nothing to them.

I was told right when dubas traded Kadri for kerfoot and barrie that it was a huge win for us. That was obviously false.

I was told keeping sparks over mcbackup was the right move. Wrong.

I was told that lilj was the steal of the draft lol

I was told that signing four forwards to ~50% of the cap was intelligent.

They raved when dubas acquired an injured foligno for a 1st.

Dubas has us exactly where we were in 2017, still unable to win a round.

You guys have been wrong over and over and yet you still come up with excuses to favour dubas.

The fact you and about a dozen others can vote for the final option and still pretend to be leaf fans is quite shocking.

 

[Suntouchable13]

So these "3 crap contracts" and "pissing off marner" outweigh all the results?

Lous job was to turn this franchise around. We had made the PO once in the past dozen years. With him as gm we drafted matthews. He turned this team around.

That's what I find amusing about the dubas cult, the actual results and facts mean absolutely nothing to them.

I was told right when dubas traded Kadri for kerfoot and barrie that it was a huge win for us. That was obviously false.

I was told keeping sparks over mcbackup was the right move. Wrong.

I was told that lilj was the steal of the draft lol

I was told that signing four forwards to ~50% of the cap was intelligent.

They raved when dubas acquired an injured foligno for a 1st.

Dubas has us exactly where we were in 2017, still unable to win a round.

You guys have been wrong over and over and yet you still come up with excuses to favour dubas.

The fact you and about a dozen others can vote for the final option and still pretend to be leaf fans is quite shocking.

Hey, in 2017 we took the president's trophy winners to 6 games. 6 years later, we take the back-to-back champs to 7 games. Progress!

 

[Rude Dog]

Its on him because the players and the coach are on him. The clubs ahead of them all made more significant adds at the TDL as did Tampa. The goaltending was .897 and 3.15 and we knew that might happen based on his second half issues. The Canes are going to get to the finals with the Leafs discarded goalie, meanwhile the Leafs have to pay to get rid of Mrazek. The lack of spending at this TDL compared to last season almost looks like they bailed because of how hard the road was going to be to get to the finals.

Okay maybe maybe thats a bit overdramatic but if this is their window to ride their MVP into the playoffs, was Gio and calling it a day the best and only play at the TDL? And when you look at their comments at the presser, its like they don't have a clue how to improve things. Special teams, consistency, killer instinct. So what will they do to address that? The pp was the best in the league and the pk was 8th so basically they just got out playoffed by Tampa. In the end, if it really is on the players, you change the players, you don't ask them to do what they apparently aren't capable of.

All of that, and the leafs were still one Kerfoot breakaway from shutting all this up. There is no way for me to defend not getting it done. But all these posts won't convince me Dubas didn't do a good job or more importantly that a new shiny toy will get them further along next year.

 

[Suntouchable13]

All of that, and the leafs were still one Kerfoot breakaway from shutting all this up. There is no way for me to defend not getting it done. But all these posts won't convince me Dubas didn't do a good job or more importantly that a new shiny toy will get them further along next year.

IMO, they don't care enough about going far. They are just happy making the playoffs, and having a team that is setting records in the regular season. I just hope they prove me wrong, till then they don't deserve the love or my money. I know, I am only 1 fan, I am just saying there are so many fans who are so gullible and have unconditional love. Why should the team strive to improve? There is not enough fan backlash. People are willing to make excuses for these guys like they are their family members. What did they really accomplish here? They turned the team around and they are making the playoffs every year? That should be the minimum expectation. I am not kissing their feet.

 

[egd27]

Overall, I think Dubas has done a decent job and probably has more hits than misses, but the misses have been in critical areas.

1. Tavares was not the right move at the time and cost $11M/yr, a first to dump Marleau, and Kappy & Johnsson
2. The Marner contract (when coupled with Tavares) was far too much
3. He should have put his foot down and fired Babcock after the 2019 playoffs and did a proper coaching search
4. There is currently a significant goalie issue as he enters his next "do or die" season.

So aside from cap, coaching, and goaltending mistakes, he's been pretty good.

 

[Racer88]

Overall, I think Dubas has done a decent job and probably has more hits than misses, but the misses have been in critical areas.

1. Tavares was not the right move at the time and cost $11M/yr, a first to dump Marleau, and Kappy & Johnsson
2. The Marner contract (when coupled with Tavares) was far too much
3. He should have put his foot down and fired Babcock after the 2019 playoffs and did a proper coaching search
4. There is currently a significant goalie issue as he enters his next "do or die" season.

So aside from cap, coaching, and goaltending mistakes, he's been pretty good.

In baseball that would be three strikes and your out

 

[Gabriel426]

tough to reason with anyone who says the Marleau contract was "not bad."

Unless you are Marleau bc that contract was really not bad for him

 

[Sammy Kat]

tough to reason with anyone who says the Marleau contract was "not bad."

Really,Dubas could not weather the storm of 1 last year????

Oh right I forgot he had already plunged the team into cap hell and had to make a panic move to open up space.
He should have never even been anywhere near needing that space at that point and it was not Lou's fault that he was.

So right back at ya,tough to reason with anyone that turns a blind eye to all the Dubas disasters and points a finger at what was down to 1 year of a contract as being a reason the team is a mess.

 

[Gabriel426]

In baseball that would be three strikes and your out

Dubas been fouling off tough pitches, lol.

I am with you. I think the team from top to bottom needs a shake up. Would go for Trotz to replace Keefe but if Dubas pulls that trigger it means he is staying for another few years unless the boys tank again.
Personally, I think the team needs to retool this summer and see if they can make Hockey trade for both MM and Willie due to restructuring of the cap. Or gets a taker for JT and it will solve a lot of problems.

 

[Sammy Kat]

We don't need to make Lou look like a hero. We have 4 years of Lou strategy on Long Island. Might want to check what he gave Devon Toews away for, and how much combined cap space guys like Lee, Nelson, Pageau, Bailey, Palmieri take up as the price of success for those 2 runs which feel like a distant memory now.

I am not making Lou look like a hero,only that up to the point he left we were in good shape,and then Dubas took over and has been a failure.

I would also say at this point I and many Leaf fans would be a lot happier having gone as deep as the Islanders did twice over never getting out of the first round.

Sure the guys you mentioned are not as good,supposedly,as our high priced talent and we took away their star player but they did have 2 good runs and we have none so I would say that puts Lou in a much better light than Dubas.

At least he had 2 runs even if they become a distant memory.

Dubas has given us no runs and that will remain a very bad memory for years to come.

 

[Anthrax442]

So these "3 crap contracts" and "pissing off marner" outweigh all the results?

Lous job was to turn this franchise around. We had made the PO once in the past dozen years. With him as gm we drafted matthews. He turned this team around.

That's what I find amusing about the dubas cult, the actual results and facts mean absolutely nothing to them.

I was told right when dubas traded Kadri for kerfoot and barrie that it was a huge win for us. That was obviously false.

I was told keeping sparks over mcbackup was the right move. Wrong.

I was told that lilj was the steal of the draft lol

I was told that signing four forwards to ~50% of the cap was intelligent.

They raved when dubas acquired an injured foligno for a 1st.

Dubas has us exactly where we were in 2017, still unable to win a round.

You guys have been wrong over and over and yet you still come up with excuses to favour dubas.

The fact you and about a dozen others can vote for the final option and still pretend to be leaf fans is quite shocking.

"wtf were told" wtf, are you 5?

 

[TheDoldrums]

So right back at ya,tough to reason with anyone that turns a blind eye to all the Dubas disasters and points a finger at what was down to 1 year of a contract as being a reason the team is a mess.

I didn't say any of that...

All I said was calling the Marleau contract "not bad" is absurd.

 

[ToneDog]

I am not making Lou look like a hero,only that up to the point he left we were in good shape,and then Dubas took over and has been a failure.

I would also say at this point I and many Leaf fans would be a lot happier having gone as deep as the Islanders did twice over never getting out of the first round.

Sure the guys you mentioned are not as good,supposedly,as our high priced talent and we took away their star player but they did have 2 good runs and we have none so I would say that puts Lou in a much better light than Dubas.

At least he had 2 runs even if they become a distant memory.

Dubas has given us no runs and that will remain a very bad memory for years to come.

Lou had a couple of good runs but they are a tire fire. Dubas is building a dynasty. Be patient.

 

[keonsbitterness]

"wtf were told" wtf, are you 5?

Everything he said is true. I had him locked in a room with bright lights shining in his eyes and I forced him to believe all that.

 

[Lightsol]

I didn't trust my Leafs to win a series potential game, but I trusted the math and odds with the probability of losing in 5 consecutive series clinching final games which had never happened in pro sports in the NHL or Major league Baseball nor NBA previously, with Leafs now setting a new standard in futility in major sports series, was something only Leafs could pull off. Leafs entered the Tampa series 0-8 with this core.

View attachment 550447

On some sports show I saw those probability odds of 5 consecutive series clinging losses something like +27,000 to 1, before I placed my Vegas bet.



Dubas is an analytics guru as some say anyways, so he knew himself how unlikely losing game #7 was historically, but still Dubas managed to hit on the 0.0036% and run Leafs record up to 0-10 in the process. That sure is something he can put on his resume as he is now the Guinness record holder in this category as a GM, and never achieved in pro sports history previously.

If this dismal achievement, establishing new levels of futility in pro sports gets you a full endorsement from your boss, that you're doing great then the end is clearly not near. In fact just think of the odds next year of Leafs making another 1st round loss when having an opportunity to advance now by doubling down on this core again and then what +56,000 to 1. So stay the course is the Leafs management plan because sooner or later the odds have to break your way and you will win a round with Dubas as GM, on the mere thought you can't defy them forever.

Lets "run it back" and see if 6 straight round #1 losses in winner-take-all games is possible., Just a little fine tweaking around the edges away from a Cup now.

Some organizations with a +55 year Cup drought and a 18 year and counting run without a playoff win, with now a new record in series collapses, would desire change, but not in Toronto they send the stability message instead, and feed Leaf Nation fans perhaps the lamest reason ever of earning respect in the handshake line as the reason they like the teams progress and proving to the World that results simply do not matter in their decision making process.

Such is the Life of Leaf fan, hand over a 105 point record setting and playoff team, and the new GM takes it to new record setting highs but not the ones we wanted.

Hey, let's ignore that getting this record requires a team to play 5 consecutive Game 7's... Something that is kind of rare in most sports leagues to begin with. Just a reminder that Leaf fans would have been less angry with missing the playoffs or getting swept...

 

[ToneDog]

Dubas been fouling off tough pitches, lol.

I am with you. I think the team from top to bottom needs a shake up. Would go for Trotz to replace Keefe but if Dubas pulls that trigger it means he is staying for another few years unless the boys tank again.
Personally, I think the team needs to retool this summer and see if they can make Hockey trade for both MM and Willie due to restructuring of the cap. Or gets a taker for JT and it will solve a lot of problems.

You want Dubas trading MM and WM ?? Let him run it back and if it fails, kick his ass back to the Soo.

 

[Racer88]

Dubas been fouling off tough pitches, lol.

I am with you. I think the team from top to bottom needs a shake up. Would go for Trotz to replace Keefe but if Dubas pulls that trigger it means he is staying for another few years unless the boys tank again.
Personally, I think the team needs to retool this summer and see if they can make Hockey trade for both MM and Willie due to restructuring of the cap. Or gets a taker for JT and it will solve a lot of problems.

Sign me up for that plan. Wait a minute I changed my mind……..Tonedog had a good point……..do we really want Dubas making those kinds of decision.
lol

 

[Sammy Kat]

I didn't say any of that...

All I said was calling the Marleau contract "not bad" is absurd.

It was not absurd.
Yes it was a year more than it should have been but considering where the team was at the time and the team plan at the time the 3rd year was not going to be a factor.

When signed it was for him to help the young guys and be a locker room presence.
Matthews and Marner loved the guy,made them happy,so he did his job.

The contract viewed at the time had the Leafs with tons of cap space until it ended and no threat to the team structure going by the plan of building slowly and slow cooking young guys and building piece by piece for 5 years.

Dubas took over and decided to speed it up and started spending like mad and did a terrible job of money management.
That final year should have been nothing but Dubas turned it into something so it was all blame to Dubas.

 

[Gabriel426]

You want Dubas trading MM and WM ?? Let him run it back and if it fails, kick his ass back to the Soo.

Sign me up for that plan. Wait a minute I changed my mind……..Tonedog had a good point……..do we really want Dubas making those kinds of decision.
lol

When I made that point, I assume Dubas will not be GM. I don’t trust him trading top players.

 

[hockeyisgud]

Overall, I think Dubas has done a decent job and probably has more hits than misses, but the misses have been in critical areas.

1. Tavares was not the right move at the time and cost $11M/yr, a first to dump Marleau, and Kappy & Johnsson
2. The Marner contract (when coupled with Tavares) was far too much
3. He should have put his foot down and fired Babcock after the 2019 playoffs and did a proper coaching search
4. There is currently a significant goalie issue as he enters his next "do or die" season.

So aside from cap, coaching, and goaltending mistakes, he's been pretty good.

Dubas is fantastic, just needs to work on communication, drafting, teambuilding, contracts, trades, hiring, preparation, team culture, game understanding, negotiation, accountability and winning in the playoffs

 

[notdoneyet]

He should be fired just for the matthews contract alone

The best player in the league was given a massive payday coming off his ELC. Nothing wrong with that. Completely agree.

Giving him a 5 year deal with a no trade clause in the last year was the stupidest thing he could have done.

For what he was giving matthews on his second deal it should have been a max length contract of 8 years.