How do you fix the Wings?

[Gniwder]

Just have the honesty and self-awareness that had Yzerman signed Trocheck to 7 years at $5.6M you'd be the leader of the "Trocheck sucks balls and someone better should have been signed instead" bandwagon.

If you think the difference between the Rangers and the Wings is the difference between Copp and Trocheck and not the rest of the rosters... I don't know what to tell you...

Nice double strawman there bud. That's not what I said at all.

Trotchek is better than Copp, which part of that don't you understand? And why would I be complaining about a 77pt center that makes $5.6M?

If you're gonna just spew strawman arguments, just argue with yourself.

 

[norrisnick]

Nice double strawman there bud. That's not what I said at all.

Trotchek is better than Copp, which part of that don't you understand? And why would I be complaining about a 77pt center that makes $5.6M?

If you're gonna just spew strawman arguments, just argue with yourself.

Because it's nothing more or less than insanity to believe that Trocheck would be a 77pt center on the Wings.

Copp had 14 goals and 18 assists in 36 games on a line with Panarin.

 

[Gniwder]

Because it's nothing more or less than insanity to believe that Trocheck would be a 77pt center on the Wings.

Probably not 77, but it depends on his chemistry with Cat and Kane. Plus Stevie might have signed a winger instead of Compher.

Guaranteed I wouldn't be hating him as much as Copp. I'd just hate on Holl like everyone else.

 

[Lazlo Hollyfeld]

Did you even read the article? NYR knew he wasn't 2C and wanted too much money.

"the two sides talked over the weekend, but there is reluctance to back off the big contract ask from Copp’s side (seven years at around $5.5 million per) and reluctance from the Rangers’ side to commit big term and dollars to a player who may not fit in the No. 2 center spot."

$5.5M was a red flag for them and Stevie gave him $5.6M, lol. It was a bad signing. Realbaad.

The end point is that NYR made the right choice and are in the playoffs, while the Red Wings are now golfing.

Weird that you point out the $5.5 million was the red flag and not the 7 years.

Your Copp posts per 60 is off the charts though, even in the offseason.

 

[OgeeOgelthorpe]

I liked when this thread was about the Wings.

 

[Gniwder]

I liked when this thread was about the Wings.

It'd be nice if someone could come up with a viable way to fix the Wings for next season. I can't come up with one, so Imma just gonna bitch about Copp, lol.

If Copp and Holl weren't tying up a combined $9M, I'd go after one of the top wingers in UFA. Chiarot, despite his flaws, at least adds some much needed physicality. Petry doesn't bother me as a slightly overpaid 6/7D for another season.

I'm thinking just ride it out next season, then go for it the season after. Fabbri, Maatta, Petry, and Husso contracts expire after next season. Copp and Holl will have to be dumped or bought out. Lots of pending UFAs next season, we'll see which ones become available.

 

[WingsToPick4th]

What would you guys offer for Shea Theodore? Hes a lefty but plays the Right side

Walman - Seider
Edvinsson - Theodore

nice top 4 for next year

 

[Ricelund]

Nice double strawman there bud. That's not what I said at all.

Trotchek is better than Copp, which part of that don't you understand? And why would I be complaining about a 77pt center that makes $5.6M?

If you're gonna just spew strawman arguments, just argue with yourself.

Maybe, and I know this is a radical idea so bear with me, Trocheck wasn't interested in signing with Detroit and wanted to play in New York.

 

[SoupNazi]

Maybe, and I know this is a radical idea so bear with me, Trocheck wasn't interested in signing with Detroit and wanted to play in New York.

That’s the fallacy I see around HF constantly: the only thing the players care about is money. They don’t take anything else into consideration. So surely if you offer the most money, they’ll sign with you. They must!

 

[Gniwder]

Maybe, and I know this is a radical idea so bear with me, Trocheck wasn't interested in signing with Detroit and wanted to play in New York.

Maybe. But that's also not an excuse to sign Copp.

$9M tied up in Copp and Holl, wouldn't you rather have someone else? That $9M makes it really difficult to come up with a viable fix for next season.

 

[Voodoo Glow Skulls]

That’s the fallacy I see around HF constantly: the only thing the players care about is money. They don’t take anything else into consideration. So surely if you offer the most money, they’ll sign with you. They must!

Or the GM had a hole in the roster that player x can fill, why didn't he sign him?

 

[RRhoads]

I don't understand why some people would want a long term contract to fix a short term problem.

Copp's and Compher's contracts are long enough to begin with, but yeah, let's sign a player that is a year older to a seven year deal.

I am not a fan of Copp's and Compher's contract length, but I will take those over Trocheck when I look at the Wings prospects and outlook.

 

[norrisnick]

Maybe. But that's also not an excuse to sign Copp.

$9M tied up in Copp and Holl, wouldn't you rather have someone else? That $9M makes it really difficult to come up with a viable fix for next season.

He signed Copp because that's exactly the type of player he wanted to sign. Need proof? He signed the exact same player the following summer to almost the same deal. If not Copp it would have been someone else just like him.

 

[SirloinUB]

Copp vs Trocheck is nuanced.

Trochek seems like the better player now but he plays with Panarin. Copp was a point/game player when he played with Panarin.

And what about two years from now when Simon Edvinsson is up for a new contract? Would you rather have Copp at 31 with 1 more season remaining at 5.6 or 32 year old Trocheck with 3 more seasons at 5.6?

 

[Gniwder]

He signed Copp because that's exactly the type of player he wanted to sign. Need proof? He signed the exact same player the following summer to almost the same deal. If not Copp it would have been someone else just like him.

We don't need a Copp, much less 2 of them. Compher couldn't do crap with Kane/Cat. Besides Copp is even worse.

I get the argument that Trochek may not have wanted to play in Detroit, but what about others like Strome? He signed with the Caps despite knowing that's a team going downhill. Would've been worth it just to troll Blackhawk fans.

Copp + Holl = $9M dumpster fire sponsored by Priority

Just because Stevie wanted Copp/Compher doesn't make it the right move. It's a really weird argument.

 

[The Zetterberg Era]

We don't need a Copp, much less 2 of them. Compher couldn't do crap with Kane/Cat. Besides Copp is even worse.

I get the argument that Trochek may not have wanted to play in Detroit, but what about others like Strome? He signed with the Caps despite knowing that's a team going downhill. Would've been worth it just to troll Blackhawk fans.

Copp + Holl = $9M dumpster fire sponsored by Priority

Just because Stevie wanted Copp/Compher doesn't make it the right move. It's a really weird argument.

Copp’s biggest problem post core surgery is his top end speed, never great but a step off where it was. For the record that is still two steps faster than Strome so that seems a really poor request on our team. Washington’s biggest problem was in transition a part of that is some of their slower players.

 

[Gniwder]

Copp’s biggest problem post core surgery is his top end speed, never great but a step off where it was. For the record that is still two steps faster than Strome so that seems a really poor request on our team. Washington’s biggest problem was in transition a part of that is some of their slower players.

Well, they have an old core.

The only attraction with Strome is to put together the old Blackhawks line of Cat/Strome/Kane. Without Kane, he's probably another Copp/Compher clone. It was tongue in cheek, more or less. Plus he's even softer than the Copp twins.

I'm glad you noticed Copp is getting slower, nobody else is acknowledging that. That contract is gonna look even worse every season.

 

[ricky0034]

Maybe, and I know this is a radical idea so bear with me, Trocheck wasn't interested in signing with Detroit and wanted to play in New York.

even if that's true that's like when Holland signed Nielsen when Stamkos wasn't interested

people here loved that one

 

[RRhoads]

even if that's true that's like when Holland signed Nielsen when Stamkos wasn't interested

people here loved that one

Would have been an OK deal if Nielsen was 4 years younger. Biggest problem, atleast for me, was the term for a 32 year old player.

 

[FMichael]

What would you guys offer for Shea Theodore? Hes a lefty but plays the Right side

Walman - Seider
Edvinsson - Theodore

nice top 4 for next year

As a righty who preferred to play the left side D in pick-up - I approve of this message.

 

[SoupNazi]

Copp lives rent-free in some heads around here.

 

[norrisnick]

Copp lives rent-free in some heads around here.

With all the money he's fleecing from the Wings you'd think he could afford to pay rent...

 

[Oddbob]

It'd be nice if someone could come up with a viable way to fix the Wings for next season. I can't come up with one, so Imma just gonna bitch about Copp, lol.

If Copp and Holl weren't tying up a combined $9M, I'd go after one of the top wingers in UFA. Chiarot, despite his flaws, at least adds some much needed physicality. Petry doesn't bother me as a slightly overpaid 6/7D for another season.

I'm thinking just ride it out next season, then go for it the season after. Fabbri, Maatta, Petry, and Husso contracts expire after next season. Copp and Holl will have to be dumped or bought out. Lots of pending UFAs next season, we'll see which ones become available.

I have a much larger issue with Petry logging 19-20 minutes a night then at least a competent defensive forward in Copp logging 16-17 a night, much larger. Copp is about 1.5 too high, and I would rather have someone else, but the defence needs to get corrected long before Copp. Lalonde seems to think Petry is still quite good, which he is not.

 

[Gniwder]

I have a much larger issue with Petry logging 19-20 minutes a night then at least a competent defensive forward in Copp logging 16-17 a night, much larger. Copp is about 1.5 too high, and I would rather have someone else, but the defence needs to get corrected long before Copp. Lalonde seems to think Petry is still quite good, which he is not.

Petry's cap hit is 3rd pair D, he needs sheltered minutes as 3rd pair D. I think the major problem this season was that Ghost also needed sheltered minutes. Replacing Ghost with a RHD that can actually play defense would be an improvement. That and Holl sucked even worse.

 

[Vector Cereal]

I've been playing around on cap friendly trying to make space to land a legit offense creator in the top 6 (whether it's re-signing Kane or another UFA). Starting to wonder about if it's worth making cap space to land a top 4 defenseman and a goalie upgrade instead. We don't have the cap or roster space to bring in upgrades at all three positions, so I think I'd rather rotate Berggren/Danielson/Mazur/Kasper through on the second line with the odds that one should be a fit.

I'm not excited about any of the goalie trades out there though. Sounds like Markstrom will take a first - which we shouldn't be giving up for a goalie his age right now - and Gibson might be worth it only if his value has dipped. Otherwise look for someone on a cheaper contract to make a true tandem with Lyon. Ingram/Vejmelka?