How are you feeling about our goalie situation going into the year after the preseason

[The Hanging Jowl]

Murray made it through with no injuries and he looked good. Samsonov I didn't see enough of but I do believe he let in 3 goals on 4 shots in one game he came in for the second half. Not enough data to compute.

 

[ToneDog]

Found it funny after we acquired both goalies that a radio guy on Fan590 likened the Leafs trying to win the SC with these two goalies to the Jays trying to win the WS with their bullpen. The Jays bullpen just imploded. Dubas better hope the guy goes 1 for 2.

 

[Mess]

TSN placed the Leafs goaltending this year in Tier #4 of 5

Grading every NHL team’s goaltending depth :

Tier 4, Underperform: Toronto Maple Leafs

Toronto: On the plus side, recently acquired Matt Murray played better for the Ottawa Senators down the stretch last season. But for an otherwise elite Maple Leafs lineup, staking your team’s Stanley Cup chances to large gambles on a volatile player like Murray and Ilya Samsonov (who was shelled last year) is an extraordinary risk. Toronto’s cap situation and a very limited supply of available goaltenders may have forced GM Kyle Dubas’ hand, but this is a scary group to bet on.

Yost: Grading every NHL team’s goaltending depth | TSN

Travis Yost's multi-series talent tiers feature continues, now shifting to the goaltenders. Ever the mysterious (and unpredictable) position, take a look at how the goaltending depth charts rank across all 32 teams.

www.tsn.ca

&

ESPN placed the Leafs goaltending 23rd overall ..

NHL goalie tandem rankings for 2022-23

23. Toronto Maple Leafs - Matt Murray, Ilya Samsonov​

Stop us if you've heard this before, but there are a variety of opinions about the relative quality of the Toronto Maple Leafs.

Some of the goalie insiders we spoke with believe the Murray and Samsonov duo is going to be among the worst in the league. Real Clear Analytics has them ranked 27th heading into this season, based on last season's performances. Others look at what Murray did with the Senators, look at the Toronto defense and believe we could see a comeback season for the former Stanley Cup winner: One model shows his performance translating to a .920 save percentage with the Leafs. Samsonov, however, is the trickier call. One insider called him "a project" despite three seasons with the Capitals. The Leafs are going to boom-or-bust with this goaltending.

NHL goalie tandem rankings: Rangers top the list for 2022-23

Heading into a new season, we array all 32 teams in order of their goaltending group.

www.espn.com

 

[BTP]

Never worried for a second. These things just have a way of sorting themselves out.

Any athlete with pride will take advantage of all the doubt people have against them and use it as fuel to have a great year.

Plus we didnt get great goaltending last year, still set a franchise record. We'll be fine.

 

[WTFMAN99]

Better.

Murray was pretty good.

Samsonov is an upgrade over Mrazek imo and $2M in savings.

 

[acrobaticgoalie]

TSN placed the Leafs goaltending this year in Tier #4 of 5

View attachment 592189
Grading every NHL team’s goaltending depth :

Tier 4, Underperform: Toronto Maple Leafs

Toronto: On the plus side, recently acquired Matt Murray played better for the Ottawa Senators down the stretch last season. But for an otherwise elite Maple Leafs lineup, staking your team’s Stanley Cup chances to large gambles on a volatile player like Murray and Ilya Samsonov (who was shelled last year) is an extraordinary risk. Toronto’s cap situation and a very limited supply of available goaltenders may have forced GM Kyle Dubas’ hand, but this is a scary group to bet on.

Yost: Grading every NHL team’s goaltending depth | TSN

Travis Yost's multi-series talent tiers feature continues, now shifting to the goaltenders. Ever the mysterious (and unpredictable) position, take a look at how the goaltending depth charts rank across all 32 teams.

www.tsn.ca

&

ESPN placed the Leafs goaltending 23rd overall ..

NHL goalie tandem rankings for 2022-23

23. Toronto Maple Leafs - Matt Murray, Ilya Samsonov​

Stop us if you've heard this before, but there are a variety of opinions about the relative quality of the Toronto Maple Leafs.

Some of the goalie insiders we spoke with believe the Murray and Samsonov duo is going to be among the worst in the league. Real Clear Analytics has them ranked 27th heading into this season, based on last season's performances. Others look at what Murray did with the Senators, look at the Toronto defense and believe we could see a comeback season for the former Stanley Cup winner: One model shows his performance translating to a .920 save percentage with the Leafs. Samsonov, however, is the trickier call. One insider called him "a project" despite three seasons with the Capitals. The Leafs are going to boom-or-bust with this goaltending.

NHL goalie tandem rankings: Rangers top the list for 2022-23

Heading into a new season, we array all 32 teams in order of their goaltending group.

www.espn.com

That list is kind of B.S. to be honest. Half of those teams ahead of us are no more of a sure thing or gambles than our tandem.

Colorado for example is running with 2 guys who are career backups to this point and are no more promising than Murray and Samsonov.

 

[Hoglund4MvP]

That list is kind of B.S. to be honest. Half of those teams ahead of us are no more of a sure thing or gambles than our tandem.

Colorado for example is running with 2 guys who are career backups to this point and are no more promising than Murray and Samsonov.

So investigate for tie breakers.

Murray you have to pay to get rid of.

Samsonov has a history of being a head case with his former team.

They ranked us fine. If you know it's a gamble then who cares about ranks. You need the gamble to prove itself

 

[Mess]

Colorado for example is running with 2 guys who are career backups to this point and are no more promising than Murray and Samsonov.

Stats don't lie unfortunately .. Leafs tandem statistically when it comes to SV% for example has been among the worst in the NHL last 3 years combined with both goalies finishing in the bottom 12 overall.

Only 2 NHL goalies for example Joonas Korpisalo and Martin Jones have a worst sv% than Murray past 3 seasons combined.

Ilya Samsonov appeared in 44 games last year with Washington with a sv% of .896. (45th overall).

Last year our Leafs were 32nd overall in 5v5 sv% (the worst in the NHL) behind essentially this Dcore.

So these prognosticators are not making this up, they're basing their articles on verifiable stats.

We as Leaf fans have to hope that these trends don't continue and a few split squad AHL level talent warmup exhibition games shouldn't alter that perception yet. There is potential for vast improvement and that is what Leaf Nation is hoping and praying for.

 

[A1LeafNation]

Stats don't lie unfortunately .. Leafs tandem statistically when it comes to SV% for example has been among the worst in the NHL last 3 years combined with both goalies finishing in the bottom 12 overall.

View attachment 592211

Only 2 NHL goalies for example Joonas Korpisalo and Martin Jones have a worst sv% than Murray past 3 seasons combined.

Ilya Samsonov appeared in 44 games last year with Washington with a sv% of .896. (45th overall).

View attachment 592212

Last year our Leafs were 32nd overall in 5v5 sv% (the worst in the NHL) behind essentially this Dcore.

So these prognosticators are not making this up, they're basing their articles on verifiable stats.

We as Leaf fans have to hope that these trends don't continue and a few split squad AHL level talent warmup exhibition games shouldn't alter that perception yet. There is potential for vast improvement and that is what Leaf Nation is hoping and praying for.

Guess we should have kept Mrazek.

 

[notbias]

TSN placed the Leafs goaltending this year in Tier #4 of 5

View attachment 592189

This list is trash since Colorado is not in the bottom tier, not sure how anyone thinks their goaltending is better than ours.

Stats don't lie unfortunately .. Leafs tandem statistically when it comes to SV% for example has been among the worst in the NHL last 3 years combined with both goalies finishing in the bottom 12 overall.

Why did you stop using GSAx?

 

[HockeyVirus]

Stats don't lie unfortunately .. Leafs tandem statistically when it comes to SV% for example has been among the worst in the NHL last 3 years combined with both goalies finishing in the bottom 12 overall.

View attachment 592211

Only 2 NHL goalies for example Joonas Korpisalo and Martin Jones have a worst sv% than Murray past 3 seasons combined.

Ilya Samsonov appeared in 44 games last year with Washington with a sv% of .896. (45th overall).

View attachment 592212

Last year our Leafs were 32nd overall in 5v5 sv% (the worst in the NHL) behind essentially this Dcore.

So these prognosticators are not making this up, they're basing their articles on verifiable stats.

We as Leaf fans have to hope that these trends don't continue and a few split squad AHL level talent warmup exhibition games shouldn't alter that perception yet. There is potential for vast improvement and that is what Leaf Nation is hoping and praying for.

This is a bad argument because you are assuming many things here. 1. That past results indicate future results and 2. That the leafs were acquiring these goalies without this performance in mind.

First, this is hockey. Players come out of no where and become NHL stars late in their careers, some come in and immediately contribute to cups. Sometimes players have a few rough years and have to adapt and change and then have a career resurgence.

I'd like to see who you would have gotten today, and reflect at the end of the year if your choice was any better than what we got. Give me some realistic names of who you would have gotten and I'll book make this thread and we can talk in April / June

 

[Isaac Nootin]

I worry more. It's not at all about Murray's ability. Can he stay healthy?

You worry more? So what about the preseason where Murray played well and stayed healthy leads you to now worry more than before.

 

[Mess]

Guess we should have kept Mrazek.

We all saw how much of train wreck bad Mrazek was last year, and still statistically he was better than Murray and Samsonov sv% past 3 years combined.

&

What should make Leaf fans nervous is that a lot of fans believe goalies coming to Toronto will have their #'s improve magically, but with Mrazek the opposite occurred.,

Mrazek went from a .923 sv% to .888 sv%

&

His GSAx went from +7.1 (8th overall) to -11.6 (61st overall).

 

[Stephen]

TSN placed the Leafs goaltending this year in Tier #4 of 5

View attachment 592189
Grading every NHL team’s goaltending depth :

Tier 4, Underperform: Toronto Maple Leafs

Toronto: On the plus side, recently acquired Matt Murray played better for the Ottawa Senators down the stretch last season. But for an otherwise elite Maple Leafs lineup, staking your team’s Stanley Cup chances to large gambles on a volatile player like Murray and Ilya Samsonov (who was shelled last year) is an extraordinary risk. Toronto’s cap situation and a very limited supply of available goaltenders may have forced GM Kyle Dubas’ hand, but this is a scary group to bet on.

Yost: Grading every NHL team’s goaltending depth | TSN

Travis Yost's multi-series talent tiers feature continues, now shifting to the goaltenders. Ever the mysterious (and unpredictable) position, take a look at how the goaltending depth charts rank across all 32 teams.

www.tsn.ca

&

ESPN placed the Leafs goaltending 23rd overall ..

NHL goalie tandem rankings for 2022-23

23. Toronto Maple Leafs - Matt Murray, Ilya Samsonov​

Stop us if you've heard this before, but there are a variety of opinions about the relative quality of the Toronto Maple Leafs.

Some of the goalie insiders we spoke with believe the Murray and Samsonov duo is going to be among the worst in the league. Real Clear Analytics has them ranked 27th heading into this season, based on last season's performances. Others look at what Murray did with the Senators, look at the Toronto defense and believe we could see a comeback season for the former Stanley Cup winner: One model shows his performance translating to a .920 save percentage with the Leafs. Samsonov, however, is the trickier call. One insider called him "a project" despite three seasons with the Capitals. The Leafs are going to boom-or-bust with this goaltending.

NHL goalie tandem rankings: Rangers top the list for 2022-23

Heading into a new season, we array all 32 teams in order of their goaltending group.

www.espn.com

For me, it doesn't make sense that San Jose, Ottawa, Edmonton could be an entire "tier" above Toronto since they have many of the tandem question marks, and lacking some of the long shot upside the Leafs have, which is a former 2x Stanley Cup winner and a former franchise level prospect (both having struggled in recent years).

The fact they have Boston and Detroit two tiers above Toronto with similar uncertainty makes no sense whatsoever since Swayman, Husso and Ned are all probably at a similar career stage as Samsonov himself, who is our number 2.

I have my doubts, but this ranking is lazy.

 

[as Pure as Evil]

i will say the same thing i said in the last thread

the goaltending consistently will be better and it wont be close

 

[Gallagbi]

For me, it doesn't make sense that San Jose, Ottawa, Edmonton could be an entire "tier" above Toronto since they have many of the tandem question marks, and lacking some of the long shot upside the Leafs have, which is a former 2x Stanley Cup winner and a former franchise level prospect (both having struggled in recent years).

The fact they have Boston and Detroit two tiers above Toronto with similar uncertainty makes no sense whatsoever since Swayman, Husso and Ned are all probably at a similar career stage as Samsonov himself, who is our number 2.

I have my doubts, but this ranking is lazy.

Its a really bizarre list IMO. Not sure how Colorado's goaltending gets any respect with 2 backups platooning to start the year.

 

[saltming]

We all saw how much of train wreck bad Mrazek was last year, and still statistically he was better than Murray and Samsonov sv% past 3 years combined.

&

What should make Leaf fans nervous is that a lot of fans believe goalies coming to Toronto will have their #'s improve magically, but with Mrazek the opposite occurred.,

View attachment 592220

Mrazek went from a .923 sv% to .888 sv%

&
View attachment 592222

His GSAx went from +7.1 (8th overall) to -11.6 (61st overall).

A groin injury will do that

 

[TheTotalPackage]

Was not a fan of the acquisitions over the summer as hopeful solutions to the goaltending problem. But truthfully, I worry less. Samsonov is a better backup option than Mrazek. And I got a hunch that coming to Toronto is going to rejuvenate Murray in which he puts up better than expected stats. Of course, fingers and toes will be crossed all year that he can remain relatively healthy.

 

[Mess]

For me, it doesn't make sense that San Jose, Ottawa, Edmonton could be an entire "tier" above Toronto since they have many of the tandem question marks, and lacking some of the long shot upside the Leafs have, which is a former 2x Stanley Cup winner and a former franchise level prospect (both having struggled in recent years).

The fact they have Boston and Detroit two tiers above Toronto with similar uncertainty makes no sense whatsoever since Swayman, Husso and Ned are all probably at a similar career stage as Samsonov himself, who is our number 2.

I have my doubts, but this ranking is lazy.

When one compares Swayman

&
Husso

to
Samsonov

When you compare these 3 goalies on SV% and GA/G this past season the results are not close.

If you like Goalies based on "Goals saved above expected" results.

Then those are not close also.

Agreed Leaf Nation fans are banking on upside but the starting points of that are very different, if you see these 3 as comparable players. If the Leafs entered this year with Swayman or Husso in net based on last years performance the expectations would be very different. IMO.

 

[PROUD PAPA]

The only concern i have after the preseason is that Murray could do a better job of absorbing some of the shots that resulted in rebounds.
Otherwise, bring it on!

 

[Stephen]

When one compares Swayman

View attachment 592228
&
Husso

View attachment 592229
to
Samsonov

View attachment 592230

When you compare these 3 goalies on SV% and GA/G this past season the results are not close.

If you like Goalies based on "Goals saved above expected" results.

View attachment 592232

Then those are not close also.

I agree with you in theory - Samsonov wouldn't have been a cheap UFA add if his career didn't take a wrong turn somewhere and Husso and Swayman have been better as the most current snapshot in time.

But digging a little deeper, Samsonov's rookie year produced a 2.55 GAA and a .913 SV% before coming off the rails in 2022 in Year 3. Husso only has one year of production behind him (as much as I like him). Ned is a Samsonov level disaster. And I predict a very tough road for Boston coming up. So we'll see. Can only let the games decide these rankings moving forward.

 

[garce]

For me, it doesn't make sense that San Jose, Ottawa, Edmonton could be an entire "tier" above Toronto since they have many of the tandem question marks, and lacking some of the long shot upside the Leafs have, which is a former 2x Stanley Cup winner and a former franchise level prospect (both having struggled in recent years).

The fact they have Boston and Detroit two tiers above Toronto with similar uncertainty makes no sense whatsoever since Swayman, Husso and Ned are all probably at a similar career stage as Samsonov himself, who is our number 2.

I have my doubts, but this ranking is lazy.

As always TSN is over compensating for the tired Toronto Sports Network trope that remains prevalent outside the GTA. They always appease the whiners across the country by consciously dumping on the leafs where ever they can. They were blaming the Leaf bias around here for the Sens/Habs maritimes games this past weekend not being on English TV. It’s laughable how far the national media goes to keep the babies happy.

 

[Mess]

I agree with you in theory - Samsonov wouldn't have been a cheap UFA add if his career didn't take a wrong turn somewhere and Husso and Swayman have been better as the most current snapshot in time.

But digging a little deeper, Samsonov's rookie year produced a 2.55 GAA and a .913 SV% before coming off the rails in 2022 in Year 3. Husso only has one year of production behind him (as much as I like him). Ned is a Samsonov level disaster. And I predict a very tough road for Boston coming up. So we'll see. Can only let the games decide these rankings moving forward.

Our Leafs are really hoping either/or new goalie can at least post Jack Campbell like #'s this year as his past season (then that would rival Husso and Swayman from last year).

Jack Campbell

Jack Campbell's departing #'s SV% and GAA are the ones that compare favourably to Husso and Swayman of this past season.

At least those ranges is what I'm hoping one of the new guys can hit.. 47 starts 31 wins 2.64 GAA and .914 sv% with 5 shutouts. If one does than Leafs will be OK as far as regular season goes.

Campbell also started last year on fire with a 15-5-2 record his first 22 games of the season. Going to be interesting how the new tandem compare this year coming out of the gate in front of new teammates.

 

[Gary Nylund]

I'm feeling a bit better myself. I haven't watched any of the preseason but from what I've heard, our goalies looked pretty good. I'd say that I was feeling cautiously optimistic before preseason, now still the same basically but perhaps just a little bit more optimistic than before.

Goaltending still a wild card for us obviously, but we have two guys who both have the pedigree/potential to carry us deep in the playoffs. Two's a lot better than one so yeah, I'm optimistic that this will work out just fine.

Stay healthy boys, and play your hearts out! GLG!!

 

[kb]

This thread is an absolute Mess of misinformation and then appealing to authorities with less knowledge than a sack of dead mice (which....well.....shows....).

Pathetic doesn't even begin to describe this Messive waste of bandwidth.

Looks like weeks were spent looking for anything that agrees with the hilarious take that Colorado or Edmonton could have better goaltending. That takes all kinds of special to believe.

I'll just leave this right here.