Post-Game Talk: Holl and Keefe hand Tampa the victory

[Enniskillen]

It’s holl over again, boys. I guess we can skip game in Tampa and prepare for Monday nightmare.

 

[VanW27]

The thing that really struck me last night is how poorly they exit the D zone. I'm not sure of the right words to describe it other than to say there is a "deliberateness" that is lacking. And this is when they do have a moment to make a decision.

The clearing attempts are too often weak and rushed instead of simple and confident.

It's a symptom of the play style. The Leafs are a possession team, the D are expected to make a tape to tape pass not just dump it out. When the opposition takes away the passing options they need to either delay, make a difficult pass or beat the forchecker. With Sandin gone and Lilly in the press box Rielly is really the only D capable of doing those things with regularity.

And that's why for guys with limited skill (Holl and Schenn in particular) you see them go from having time and space to them holding onto the puck until either losing it or being forced to reverse the puck along the boards.

 

[Throw More Waffles]

The leafs are 0-10 on elimination games. Let's say every elimination game was a 50/50 chance to win. What do you think the percent chance to lose all 10 games are? Maybe 20%? 5%?

Nope.

It's (get ready).... 0.098%.

Read that number again.

0.098%

So clearly this is more than luck. MUCH more than luck.

And there's only been ONE constant thing during that 0.098% chance to happen.

The core. That's IT.

Matthews, Reilly, Marner, Nylander. Those are the only 4 players that have played all 10 of those elimination games.

3 different goalies, 2 different coaches, 2 different gm's.

How many D have we tried working around them? 16. SIXTEEN!!!! Giardano, Holl, Brodie, McCabe, Schenn, Sandin, Lyubushkin, Muzzin, Dermott, Barrie, Ceci, Marincin, Gardiner, Polak, Hainsey, Zaitsev,

How many forwards we tried working around them? 31. THIRTY ONE!!!! Auston-Reese, Kerfoot, Jarnkrok, Knies, Lafferty, Acciari, Kampf, O'Reilly, Tavares, Blackwell, Bunting, Engvall, Kase, Mikheyev, Spezza, Foligno, Galchenyuk, Hyman, Simmonds, Cliffard, Johnsson, Kapanen, Ennis, Brown, Gauthier, Marleau, Moore, Bozak, Kadri, Plecanek, JVR.

Including all skaters, that's FIFTY different players we've tried building around those 4 players. Remember, the odds of losing those 10 games in a row is 0.098%. And there's only FOUR things in common for all 10 games.

If they pull this off and lose in round two then there are some difficult decisions that need to be made. But if they lose this again in typical leafy fashion, then it's time to tear the whole f***ing thing down.

 

[ToneDog]

The 2019 game 6 was a Nationally televised Sunday afternoon game and they were a complete no show.

From that game until now the “Core Fore” have never given anyone a reason to believe they are anything other than what they were on that day.

See any similarities to last night's game ??

 

[JT AM da real deal]

I was looking at the TV ratings thread @ the business forum. The Jets series avg. 500k viewers and the Leafs series hasn't broke the 3 mil mark.

I know a lot of younger demographics are cord cutters so they don't count, but the numbers are depressingly low.

There you go things are changing clearly .. I don't watch hardly any TV as i invest my time in going to things live .. my 3 kids all watch on their computers with different online services .. not sure how numbers get calculated but how do these kids factor in if they watch online? and does Rogers control da online services too?

 

[All Mod Cons]

OTHO, if you bet against the Leafs; I mean, in some ways, Leafs must win enough games to adv.

I've often wondered that and wished to f*** I did it.

There's still time for us all to make a fortune.

 

[MSZ]

There you go things are changing clearly .. I don't watch hardly any TV as i invest my time in going to things live .. my 3 kids all watch on their computers with different online services .. not sure how numbers get calculated but how do these kids factor in if they watch online? and does Rogers control da online services too?

It counts if the viewer uses their official streaming services such as SN Now or CBC app.

But we all know most of the younger generation watch everything on illegal streams.

 

[supermann_98]

after getting embarrassed by that reporter in the post game there's no way Keefe can take Holl out now.

What did the reporter say?

 

[saltming]

Was there a single poster on here that didn't know playing Holl was most likely a bad decision?

 

[Suntouchable13]

See any similarities to last night's game ??

View attachment 698357

Holy! Can we get different writers? Because the same script gets stale after a while.

 

[Nineteen67]

That was my feeling too, but I got stupid and thought this year was different. To be honest, even if they pull this series off, I still think this core needs to be exploded.

I really thought they were going to win this series in 6 , but they’ve been worse than last three of the Montreal series.

 

[GoonieFace]

The leafs are 0-10 on elimination games. Let's say every elimination game was a 50/50 chance to win. What do you think the percent chance to lose all 10 games are? Maybe 20%? 5%?

Nope.

It's (get ready).... 0.098%.

Read that number again.

0.098%

So clearly this is more than luck. MUCH more than luck.

And there's only been ONE constant thing during that 0.098% chance to happen.

The core. That's IT.

Matthews, Reilly, Marner, Nylander. Those are the only 4 players that have played all 10 of those elimination games.

3 different goalies, 2 different coaches, 2 different gm's.

How many D have we tried working around them? 16. SIXTEEN!!!! Giardano, Holl, Brodie, McCabe, Schenn, Sandin, Lyubushkin, Muzzin, Dermott, Barrie, Ceci, Marincin, Gardiner, Polak, Hainsey, Zaitsev,

How many forwards we tried working around them? 31. THIRTY ONE!!!! Auston-Reese, Kerfoot, Jarnkrok, Knies, Lafferty, Acciari, Kampf, O'Reilly, Tavares, Blackwell, Bunting, Engvall, Kase, Mikheyev, Spezza, Foligno, Galchenyuk, Hyman, Simmonds, Cliffard, Johnsson, Kapanen, Ennis, Brown, Gauthier, Marleau, Moore, Bozak, Kadri, Plecanek, JVR.

Including all skaters, that's FIFTY different players we've tried building around those 4 players. Remember, the odds of losing those 10 games in a row is 0.098%. And there's only FOUR things in common for all 10 games.

If they pull this off and lose in round two then there are some difficult decisions that need to be made. But if they lose this again in typical leafy fashion, then it's time to tear the whole f***ing thing down.

You’re wrong, it’s the officiating

 

[Nineteen67]

See any similarities to last night's game ??

View attachment 698357

Yep, but Tampa‘s stars didn’t score

 

[WTFMAN99]

Tampa winning the series if Keefe keeps dressing Holl.

Literally ever metric available says he's sinking the team.

 

[Sniper99]

I know that sounds dramatic but you're right, it's been almost 10 years since the rebuild really started and we drafted Nylander and it's been complete failure.

Preach. Get another top pairing dman and a goaltender out of it too would be nice.

 

[egd27]

It's a symptom of the play style. The Leafs are a possession team, the D are expected to make a tape to tape pass not just dump it out. When the opposition takes away the passing options they need to either delay, make a difficult pass or beat the forchecker. With Sandin gone and Lilly in the press box Rielly is really the only D capable of doing those things with regularity.

And that's why for guys with limited skill (Holl and Schenn in particular) you see them go from having time and space to them holding onto the puck until either losing it or being forced to reverse the puck along the boards.

Yea, but it's just not the D......it happens to the forwards as well.

 

[Nineteen67]

The leafs are 0-10 on elimination games. Let's say every elimination game was a 50/50 chance to win. What do you think the percent chance to lose all 10 games are? Maybe 20%? 5%?

Nope.

It's (get ready).... 0.098%.

Read that number again.

0.098%

So clearly this is more than luck. MUCH more than luck.

And there's only been ONE constant thing during that 0.098% chance to happen.

The core. That's IT.

Matthews, Reilly, Marner, Nylander. Those are the only 4 players that have played all 10 of those elimination games.

3 different goalies, 2 different coaches, 2 different gm's.

How many D have we tried working around them? 16. SIXTEEN!!!! Giardano, Holl, Brodie, McCabe, Schenn, Sandin, Lyubushkin, Muzzin, Dermott, Barrie, Ceci, Marincin, Gardiner, Polak, Hainsey, Zaitsev,

How many forwards we tried working around them? 31. THIRTY ONE!!!! Auston-Reese, Kerfoot, Jarnkrok, Knies, Lafferty, Acciari, Kampf, O'Reilly, Tavares, Blackwell, Bunting, Engvall, Kase, Mikheyev, Spezza, Foligno, Galchenyuk, Hyman, Simmonds, Cliffard, Johnsson, Kapanen, Ennis, Brown, Gauthier, Marleau, Moore, Bozak, Kadri, Plecanek, JVR.

Including all skaters, that's FIFTY different players we've tried building around those 4 players. Remember, the odds of losing those 10 games in a row is 0.098%. And there's only FOUR things in common for all 10 games.

If they pull this off and lose in round two then there are some difficult decisions that need to be made. But if they lose this again in typical leafy fashion, then it's time to tear the whole f***ing thing down.

It’s actually quite simple. The Leafs often rely on the opposition to beat themselves, more so than taking control.
When a team is facing elimination they buckle down and pay attention to details.

I dont expect the Leafs to all of sudden be assertive and take control in games 6 and 7, I don’t expect Vasilevskiy to be a sieve in games 6 and 7, but I do expect Samsonov to let in soft goals in both games 6 and 7.

 

[GrizzGreen]

The leafs are 0-10 on elimination games. Let's say every elimination game was a 50/50 chance to win. What do you think the percent chance to lose all 10 games are? Maybe 20%? 5%?

Nope.

It's (get ready).... 0.098%.

Read that number again.

0.098%

I agree with the take on replacing the front office but you can't apply a 50/50 chance of winning to sporting events

 

[LeafalCrusader]

Was there a single poster on here that didn't know playing Holl was most likely a bad decision?

Can they be worse?

 

[Superstar]

Can they be worse?

Why not? They aren't exactly prime Bobby Orr and Kevin Stevens.

 

[maskingagent]

its the "Leafs way" to make it more stressful. Fear not, they will wrap it up in Tampa. Hotel stays have the players more focused, unlike being at home (dealing with house chores, kids, wives, girlfriends..etc. etc. and driving to the rink, are just too many distractions for pro's nowadays. They are not focused on the game. You watch, it will be a different Leaf team 1st period on Sat night.

 

[57 Years No Cup]

OTHO, if you bet against the Leafs; I mean, in some ways, Leafs must win enough games to adv.

Holy shit! I need Marty McFly's DeLorean....

 

[MapleLeafs77]

I would have that cooper quote about game 7 on repeat in the dressing room from now until game 6.

If that doesn’t make you want to destroy the bolts next game then you are pathetic

 

[57 Years No Cup]

The leafs are 0-10 on elimination games. Let's say every elimination game was a 50/50 chance to win. What do you think the percent chance to lose all 10 games are? Maybe 20%? 5%?

Nope.

It's (get ready).... 0.098%.

Read that number again.

0.098%

So clearly this is more than luck. MUCH more than luck.

And there's only been ONE constant thing during that 0.098% chance to happen.

The core. That's IT.

Matthews, Reilly, Marner, Nylander. Those are the only 4 players that have played all 10 of those elimination games.

3 different goalies, 2 different coaches, 2 different gm's.

How many D have we tried working around them? 16. SIXTEEN!!!! Giardano, Holl, Brodie, McCabe, Schenn, Sandin, Lyubushkin, Muzzin, Dermott, Barrie, Ceci, Marincin, Gardiner, Polak, Hainsey, Zaitsev,

How many forwards we tried working around them? 31. THIRTY ONE!!!! Auston-Reese, Kerfoot, Jarnkrok, Knies, Lafferty, Acciari, Kampf, O'Reilly, Tavares, Blackwell, Bunting, Engvall, Kase, Mikheyev, Spezza, Foligno, Galchenyuk, Hyman, Simmonds, Cliffard, Johnsson, Kapanen, Ennis, Brown, Gauthier, Marleau, Moore, Bozak, Kadri, Plecanek, JVR.

Including all skaters, that's FIFTY different players we've tried building around those 4 players. Remember, the odds of losing those 10 games in a row is 0.098%. And there's only FOUR things in common for all 10 games.

If they pull this off and lose in round two then there are some difficult decisions that need to be made. But if they lose this again in typical leafy fashion, then it's time to tear the whole f***ing thing down.

Wow. This is eye opening.

 

[ToneDog]

If we lose the series, no way does Keefe get the respect in the handshake line that he got last year. IMO, after 5 games, we played them harder and were full credit for our three wins last year. Were are now lucky to be up 3-2 with them not being as good as they were last year and us being better. On paper we should win this series but Tampa is no paper lion.

I swear if Holl is in next game ...

Holl is our cryptonite.