Hockey Cards - Part III

[Muffin]

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Got that. Beckett 10s are fairly rare. Getting a beckett 10 black label.... that's going to be expensive.

Canvas cards are a much easier grade than regular cards.

 

[Cubs2024WSChamps]

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Got that. Beckett 10s are fairly rare. Getting a beckett 10 black label.... that's going to be expensive.

There's over 10k bgs 10's on ebay alone. There's nothing rare about them like there was around 2015.

Now if you want to say that Roy card in a 10 is rare you might have a case considering its a common card that investors ain't paying to have graded, sure. Buy all the 10s, corner the market then set the sell price at 1 million dollars.

 

[Mr Kot]

Synergy 2024 been good to me lately:

2 Connor Bedard Away Rookies, one is 333/599, the other is 73/149 from same box

Cale Makar Flammable!

Juraj Slavkofsky and Rasmus Dahlin 2023

Mikko Rantenan Let's Gooooooooooooo!

Mario Lemieux basic 10/14

Jack Hughes and Luke Hughes synergistic duos 133/149

Troy Terry Cracked 102/399

Nick Suzuki and Maurice Richard Duos 262/599

 

[Gaylord Q Tinkledink]

There's over 10k bgs 10's on ebay alone. There's nothing rare about them like there was around 2015.

Now if you want to say that Roy card in a 10 is rare you might have a case considering its a common card that investors ain't paying to have graded, sure. Buy all the 10s, corner the market then set the sell price at 1 million dollars.

I should have stated for Roy, as in the past year, maybe longer I've definitely seen under 10 and that's being generous on the numbers.

Compared to a worse grading system like PSA that has a bunch of 10s, included cards most people wouldn't ever bother to get graded.

 

[Cubs2024WSChamps]

I should have stated for Roy, as in the past year, maybe longer I've definitely seen under 10 and that's being generous on the numbers.

Compared to a worse grading system like PSA that has a bunch of 10s, included cards most people wouldn't ever bother to get graded.

Roy has 10 bgs 10 opc rookies. That's the card you would want a bgs 10 of with zero bgs 10 topps.

Roy has around 100 bgs 10s with, if the pop report is legit, zero black labels. Nobody is really subbing Roy cards outside of his rookies.

100 bgs 10s is a solid low number, but you're competing with the other 10s with his rookie being the most desirable and that number itself is low and from a really crappy condition set on top of it compared to a UD base card.

If Roy cards became the rage, there's so many of those cards out there along with warehouses full of unopened product that the market could be flooded at any time.

Great card. Good investment? Idk.....

 

[Cubs2024WSChamps]

And I'm not trying to burst anybodys bubble, but BGS has zero credibility in the hobby after the one guy got exposed grading his own cards and black labeling them and had 60% of all black labels on ebay while working for Leaf I will never by another bgs graded card even for cheap.

In 2007 bgs was the grading company and held that title until around 2016. They earned where they're at right now at the bottom of a sinkhole and are on par with Gem Elite grading where you write and tell them what grade number you want for your card or that other company whose name I forgot who graded counterfeit cards and cards made from printers and deemed them authentic.

It's PSA for me until a legitimate grading company with legitimate financial backing who uses AI instead of some moron with a jewelers loop and plastic gloves inspects your cards and depending on how good a day he/she is having has an impact on the grade.

 

[BostonBob]

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I'm a bit confused by the " 10 Pristine " grading that Roy card got. The Centering was graded a 9.5 and I always thought that all the grades had to be 10 in order to get an overall 10 grade. Is Centering not considered as important as the other criteria ????

 

[Ajex12x]

And I'm not trying to burst anybodys bubble, but BGS has zero credibility in the hobby after the one guy got exposed grading his own cards and black labeling them and had 60% of all black labels on ebay while working for Leaf I will never by another bgs graded card even for cheap.

In 2007 bgs was the grading company and held that title until around 2016. They earned where they're at right now at the bottom of a sinkhole and are on par with Gem Elite grading where you write and tell them what grade number you want for your card or that other company whose name I forgot who graded counterfeit cards and cards made from printers and deemed them authentic.

It's PSA for me until a legitimate grading company with legitimate financial backing who uses AI instead of some moron with a jewelers loop and plastic gloves inspects your cards and depending on how good a day he/she is having has an impact on the grade.

Finally something worth reading from you

 

[Gaylord Q Tinkledink]

I'm a bit confused by the " 10 Pristine " grading that Roy card got. The Centering was graded a 9.5 and I always thought that all the grades had to be 10 in order to get an overall 10 grade. Is Centering not considered as important as the other criteria ????

It is.

For beckett you can only get .5 higher than your lowest grade (mostly I have cards that have gotten higher than that, but the grades variety a fair amount)

Beckett 9.5 is pretty much equal to a PSA 10. So, it's as close to pristine as possible.

The true pristine cards are beckett black label. That's where everything is a 10.

 

[BostonBob]

^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^

Thanks for the explanation. By the way - it is a nice card.......even if it is a Habs player.

 

[Craig Ludwig]

How much can one expect a $1000 Gretzky to go up the next say 20 years? Like outside him dying what would cause a massive spike at this point?

Let me ask you this. How much will a silly Owen Power 1/1 Signed go up from the $5000 he claims is it worth. The WORST investment you can make is this useless 1/1 Purple Rainbow Foiled etc etc crap. Seriously, how much will that card appreciate versus a Maurice Richard or Wayne Gretzky rookie. All these people paying thousands for a Kirill Kaprizov or Slavkovsky rarer card, give your head a shake.

 

[Craig Ludwig]

With Slaf, specificaly, I'd agree it's much higher risk. He was double hyped up, as he's a former #1 and also playing for Montreal, a big market. The most likely scenario is a slow decline, unless he emerges as a 90+ point player, which he still may.

I do not see a $1000 Gretzky going up to $20k in the next 20 years though. That wasn't even the trend in the last big surge. If you'd bought a Gretzky for $300-400 in 2004, you might have sold it, at the peak for $1500. I actually did that, so I know. And the Covid peak was pretty unprecedented and not normal growth by any means.

A Gretzky is still a solid investment, as it will go up slowly over time, but $20k in 20 years from $1k is $1k/year. You're not getting that kind of return.

The best return is getting ahead of the hype and picking up guys on the discount. For example I bought a bunch of Heskainen cards for under $5. I sold them, after grading, for $150-200 during his very peak.

That being said, my biggest overall gain was from a Gretzky PSA 9 year 2, which I bought in 2013 or so for $350 CAD. sold it for about $5500 at the very peak of the Covid market. That card is now going for $2k. Once again, that's unusual and a lot of the gains on Gretzky, and other collectibles generally, has already been eaten up.

Anyways, long story short, for a good return, your best bet is to predict which players will be good and buy their rookies at a low point. Then flip them a few years later. That's obviously a gamble, as predicting who will be good isn't always easy. The safer bet is in vintage, but that's, generally, a lower return and more of a long term hold.

You should also remember that being in a hobby is supposed to be fun. Collect what you like too.

Good points. Here's my advice to all of you though. Spend some fun money on cards because you enjoy it, put your big money on big, safer stocks like Berkshire Hathaway, have a look at those 20 year returns (10 year return alone is 208%). All these cards coming out these days will not be worth much in 20 years, your Celebrinis, Kaprizovs, Heiskanens, Lafrenieres, Bedards and the likes will NEVER surpass great careers like Gretzky and Richard and Howe and Orr.

 

[Craig Ludwig]

If you do sell them. Don't auction them. Put them up BIN w/ Best Offer. Auctions are a good way to give your stuff away, especially niche items like this. They might do okay for a Connor McDavid Young Guns, where hundreds of people are looking for one every day so an auction will probably realize a similar price to a BIN - but not for most items.

Send w/ tracking to the same address you sell it to, and you're probably good. I can't see bottle cap collectors being big into scams, but who knows.

Your best bet is to join this Vintage Hockey group of 15,000 collectors on Facebook: Vintage Hockey and Sports Cards Plus

There you can ask opinions and possibly sell them all at a reasonable price. There are many experts there.

 

[Ajex12x]

Good points. Here's my advice to all of you though. Spend some fun money on cards because you enjoy it, put your big money on big, safer stocks like Berkshire Hathaway, have a look at those 20 year returns (10 year return alone is 208%). All these cards coming out these days will not be worth much in 20 years, your Celebrinis, Kaprizovs, Heiskanens, Lafrenieres, Bedards and the likes will NEVER surpass great careers like Gretzky and Richard and Howe and Orr.

I love a great photograph of a player along with a nice card design. There's plenty of really inexpensive cards that fit that bill for everyone's budget.

That's why I personally dislike the Leaf brand since they don't have the rights to show the team logo, so they Photoshop it out. Looks bad imo.

 

[miscs75]

Not sure if anyone else experienced this but 23-24 Extended Series was shorted either in print or most likely by distributors being shady. Usually I’ve been able to snag a case in everything based on previous order amount but he couldn’t even do it with extended.

 

[Gaylord Q Tinkledink]

Not sure if anyone else experienced this but 23-24 Extended Series was shorted either in print or most likely by distributors being shady. Usually I’ve been able to snag a case in everything based on previous order amount but he couldn’t even do it with extended.

Probably being shady and selling it through themselves and not a store so they can charge more.

 

[miscs75]

Probably being shady and selling it through themselves and not a store so they can charge more.

The distributor shorted people for s2 and refused to say they had more. Added people to a waitlist then solicited it for a substantial markup. I’m waiting for the same thing for this run. Even UD shorted him and that never happens. I guess smaller print run for the first waive since the Bedard 1/1 wasn’t pulled yet.

 

[Cubs2024WSChamps]

Not sure if anyone else experienced this but 23-24 Extended Series was shorted either in print or most likely by distributors being shady. Usually I’ve been able to snag a case in everything based on previous order amount but he couldn’t even do it with extended.

He's being shady.

A. I order 10 cases of every UD product and get 10 cases.

B. There's nothing limited in anything UD has ever made in the history of UD.

 

[miscs75]

He's being shady.

A. I order 10 cases of every UD product and get 10 cases.

B. There's nothing limited in anything UD has ever made in the history of UD.

Not at all on the LCS. I’ve known him for 30 years at this point and he’s only been shorted with s2 (one case) and extended (2 or 3 cases, I forget the exact number) this year. This isn’t something I’ve ever seen happen to him before. He doesn’t have enough to even put boxes out for sale on the shelves.
I’m not saying it’s limited. I’m saying the distributors are holding back inventory to claim they were shorted so they can jack the price up 2 weeks later and cash in on the hype even though they agreed to a specific amount from what was ordered of s1/2 in the past.

 

[Cubs2024WSChamps]

I’m saying the distributors are holding back inventory to claim they were shorted

Then who's the distributor?

That's the kind of shit that gets your account closed.

Series 2 is sitting on retail shelves collecting dust. I highly doubt extended won't be clearance a few months after release like it has been since its inception.

This scenario just screams pump and dump.

 

[Arthur Morgan]

is card collecting worth getting into? I really have no clue what to look for but I find it interesting. or is this just a money pit type thing?

 

[TheYardMachine]

is card collecting worth getting into? I really have no clue what to look for but I find it interesting. or is this just a money pit type thing?

Well its a hobby so if you are interesting in collecting cards, its important that you have fun doing in before having a consideration for money. Its possible to do money by flipping cards but the main goal is to have fun with this

 

[Arthur Morgan]

Well its a hobby so if you are interesting in collecting cards, its important that you have fun doing in before having a consideration for money. Its possible to do money by flipping cards but the main goal is to have fun with this

ok understandable. I was kinda interested in collecting young guns or something but Id mostly have the thought of finding something with real value. does look kinda fun, but seems like each pack has mostly base cards with potential for good ones I guess?

 

[Cubs2024WSChamps]

is card collecting worth getting into? I really have no clue what to look for but I find it interesting. or is this just a money pit type thing?

Depends.

If you want a hobby that's fun then yes.

If you are trying to make money then no. And I mean lol no.

You can make money, but you either need an inventory that was started decades ago or alot of money to gamble with on the new crap that comes out.

 

[blankall]

Depends.

If you want a hobby that's fun then yes.

If you are trying to make money then no. And I mean lol no.

You can make money, but you either need an inventory that was started decades ago or alot of money to gamble with on the new crap that comes out.

You definitely won't make money opening up new product. The best way to make money is by spot picking rookies flying under the radar and investing in those when they are dirt cheap. That part of the hobby can be fun too, as you are applying your own knowledge of hockey to come up with good investments. My best pickups were a bunch of 2018/19 Dallas breaks, where I picked up a bunch of Heskianen YGs and 2016/17 Flames breaks where I picked up a bunch of M. Tkachuk. Sold the Tkachuks during last year's playoff run for thousands after only paying a few hundred to enter the breaks in the first place.

If you're opening up new product, you have to find it on sale to make money. I'm way ahead in the hobby, but also bought in around 2013, when the hobby was at a major low (post Crosby and pre-McDavid/Covid hype).

Anyways, making money in the hobby can definitely be done. Just don't blow $1000 on a tin of cup that's likely to give you $200 in cards back, because you're chasing a big rookie. That's just gambling, but with horrible odds.