Grub's Canucks & NHL News, Rumours, and & Fantasy GM | Trade Breezes

[Rowlet]

i would hope we could get more than an expiring ufa we are unlikely to re-sign for hoglander.

and if we traded for p3 right now that eats all of our cap, whereas if we wait until the tdl we can afford two contracts that size.

also, marcus pettersson trivia

Marcus Pettersson Is The NHL’s Most Bodychecked Player

Marcus Pettersson Is The NHL’s Most Bodychecked Player

www.prohockeyrumors.com

The problem is that other teams may not wait that long.

 

[F A N]

I beg to differ. He has NHL size, plays 17-19 mins a game and is a + player on a shit team. He's young and should come at a low cost because he's in ruff doghouse right now. He's on a cheap 1 year contract too. So if we can get him for a b prospect and a day 2 pick there's no harm in cutting ties next year if we want to let him go.

Last year he thrived when playing with dahlin. I see him as a #4 guy that can stick around for a while.

I'd like to play him with Hughes and bump Hronek down to play with sushi.

You highlighted the keys points. 17-19 mins a game is not top 4 minutes. But he has been good on the bottom pairing. I think the jury is still out on whether he can be a #4 going forward. Personally I think he’s serviceable but we will look to upgrade if he’s playing 20+ minutes here.

Acquisition cost aside, he is making $3.1M now and a pending UFA. It’s basically the Zadorov situation when we first acquired Z. If you want to re-sign him, you are probably looking at paying him top 4 money. He’s really not a player with a ceiling that he has yet to reach IMO. He was great with Dahlin because Dahlin was/is good. He isn’t a shutdown defensive D who can anchor his own pairing.

 

[krutovsdonut]

The problem is that other teams may not wait that long.

but whoever gets him is out of the bidding on the next guy.

cam fowler retained at 50% is something worth paying assets for.

 

[JanBulisPiggyBack]

I’d prefer Byram over any of the previously mentioned defenseman
But my pipe dream is Noah Dobson

 

[kanucks25]

I beg to differ. He has NHL size, plays 17-19 mins a game and is a + player on a shit team. He's young and should come at a low cost because he's in ruff doghouse right now. He's on a cheap 1 year contract too. So if we can get him for a b prospect and a day 2 pick there's no harm in cutting ties next year if we want to let him go.

Last year he thrived when playing with dahlin. I see him as a #4 guy that can stick around for a while.

I'd like to play him with Hughes and bump Hronek down to play with sushi.

You highlighted the keys points. 17-19 mins a game is not top 4 minutes. But he has been good on the bottom pairing. I think the jury is still out on whether he can be a #4 going forward. Personally I think he’s serviceable but we will look to upgrade if he’s playing 20+ minutes here.

Acquisition cost aside, he is making $3.1M now and a pending UFA. It’s basically the Zadorov situation when we first acquired Z. If you want to re-sign him, you are probably looking at paying him top 4 money. He’s really not a player with a ceiling that he has yet to reach IMO. He was great with Dahlin because Dahlin was/is good. He isn’t a shutdown defensive D who can anchor his own pairing.

Yeah, I think if you asked Buffalo fans, most would say he's a guy with an intriguing toolset that has had some good stretches but has never really put it together in a way where you would call him a legit top-4. He's a healthy scratch in Buffalo right now.

That said, Buffalo is a complete shitshow and there are a lot of recent examples of players blossoming once they leave there. If our pro scouting feels like there's more there they can tap into in a heathier environment, I wouldn't be opposed to it assuming the acquisition cost is modest.

 

[MS]

You highlighted the keys points. 17-19 mins a game is not top 4 minutes. But he has been good on the bottom pairing. I think the jury is still out on whether he can be a #4 going forward. Personally I think he’s serviceable but we will look to upgrade if he’s playing 20+ minutes here.

17 no, but 18-19 minutes actually is top-4 in today's NHL in most cases due to the way teams load up a top pairing and due to the D minutes that are lost with forwards playing D on the PP.

Tyler Myers has been around 18:55 the past two seasons and is pretty clearly the #3 defender on this team.

 

[krutovsdonut]

byram's minutes over the last five games suggest there is less than a zero chance buffalo trades him. he played 32 minutes against calgary where dahlin played 28.

 

[Peen]

It’ll be 2047 and there will still be people having semantics debates about if a top four defenseman is defined as such by A. minutes B. role C. context of team talent level D. true talent level

w/o realizing it’s a combination of all the above.

Myers has absolutely been A/B/C the last two seasons, but you saw the result of using him in the playoffs. if that’s Tanev in that spot, we aren’t in our own end as much against McDavid.

I still think this Soucy thing is a blip rather than his new normal and that he’s a 4 - Myers has been better than him this season tho. regardless, the team IMO needs two defensemen. Forbort out for a Zadorov type midseason acquisition & Juulsen/Desharnais for a legitimate top four D.

They need a #3 & a second #5 imo.

Hughes - Hronek
Soucy - ?/Tanev level
?/Zadorov level - Myers
Brannstrom - Desharnais/Juulsen

 

[Vector]

 

[Peen]

byram's minutes over the last five games suggest there is less than a zero chance buffalo trades him. he played 32 minutes against calgary where dahlin played 28.

They’ve got to make some calls there. There’s a lot of money going to left handed defenders on that team.

 

[Burke's Evil Spirit]

Might not be worth making this move until the off-season, but I'm really interested in what's going on with Morgan Frost . He might be an interesting buy-low candidate - the Canucks need to succession plan for Miller at C. I don't think Raty is the guy.

 

[VanillaCoke]

Marcus Pettersson is a solid target among many solid targets but doesn't really solve the defense now or future. If spending decent assets like hog ++ there's certainly several other defensemen that could fit just as well or better.

Idk how and it's unlikely but a bigger trade for two D might be a better possibility, Samuelsson/Byram, Provorov/Jiricek etc solves issues now and forward, if the cap & assets are manageable.

Basically we need another cheap Hronek Lite to pair with Hughes (maybe brannchise), defensive dman to pair with Hronek on his own pairing (maybe soucy) and then myers, Desharnais, Forbort whomever rotation third pairing.

 

[bossram]

Pettersson's corsirel and fenwickrel are like +7% above his teammates, he's having a good year, that roster is a disaster though

Pettersson has been the Pens' best defenseman for some time.

He is my preferred defender target, and he's a Rutherford guy so...

But he will be very highly sought after by many teams.

O'Connor impresses me a lot when I watch them. I think he can still evolve into more with the right usage. Really fast, big, and when he gets a half stride on you he's gone.

DOC will be a big add for someone at the deadline. A top Pens poaching target.

 

[Agent007]

Allvin should be looking to make a trade like Dubas did acquiring Jake McCabe at extreme retention for multiple seasons.

Hawks fans seem to suggest Murphy at 50% retention

 

[F A N]

17 no, but 18-19 minutes actually is top-4 in today's NHL in most cases due to the way teams load up a top pairing and due to the D minutes that are lost with forwards playing D on the PP.

Tyler Myers has been around 18:55 the past two seasons and is pretty clearly the #3 defender on this team.

True. I think it does vary season to season and it is team dependent but I think it has more to do with how much the team plays their 3rd pairing rather than teams loading up a top pairing. The old standard for #1 Dman is 25+ minutes and Hughes has been averaging less than 25 minutes the past two seasons. Hronek (which affects Myers' ice time) is averaging pretty standard top pairing minutes.

Just general math, if your top RHD is averaging 23 minutes and 2nd pairing RHD is averaging 20 minutes then that leaves 17 minutes for the 3rd pairing RHD. Hronek is averaging less than 23 minutes this season. If Myers is averaging 19 minutes that means there's ~18 minutes for the 3rd pairing RHD. Of course it doesn't work that simply but you would agree that 18 minutes a night isn't traditional 3rd pairing Dman minutes?

 

[LemonSauceD]

Hawks fans seem to suggest Murphy at 50% retention

If you can send Forbort or Desharnais the other way, I’d look at Murphy being an option.

 

[Vector]

So......how do you make this work if you're the Canucks?

 

[Just A Bit Outside]

Might not be worth making this move until the off-season, but I'm really interested in what's going on with Morgan Frost . He might be an interesting buy-low candidate - the Canucks need to succession plan for Miller at C. I don't think Raty is the guy.

Sanheim + Frost for a package around Hoglander + Raty.

So......how do you make this work if you're the Canucks?

Is it purely because he's a pending RFA and can't pay him what he wants?

Or is it based on play as well?

Cause he's a guy mgmt should go all out for if even remotely available.

 

[Russian_fanatic]

It’ll be 2047 and there will still be people having semantics debates about if a top four defenseman is defined as such by A. minutes B. role C. context of team talent level D. true talent level

w/o realizing it’s a combination of all the above.

Myers has absolutely been A/B/C the last two seasons, but you saw the result of using him in the playoffs. if that’s Tanev in that spot, we aren’t in our own end as much against McDavid.

I still think this Soucy thing is a blip rather than his new normal and that he’s a 4 - Myers has been better than him this season tho. regardless, the team IMO needs two defensemen. Forbort out for a Zadorov type midseason acquisition & Juulsen/Desharnais for a legitimate top four D.

They need a #3 & a second #5 imo.

Hughes - Hronek
Soucy - ?/Tanev level
?/Zadorov level - Myers
Brannstrom - Desharnais/Juulsen

We need a RHD who can legitimately play in the top 4. Imagine if we where to get Rasmus Anderson (unlikely)

Hughes-Hronek
Soucy-Anderson
Brannstrom-Myers

That's a great d core who can do it all.

 

[Vector]

Is it purely because he's a pending RFA and can't pay him what he wants?

Or is it based on play as well?

Cause he's a guy mgmt should go all out for if even remotely available.

The answer to both questions is, yes. Rangers want to pay Shesterkin and he's already rejected a massive contract. They can't really go any higher while also keeping Miller. Miller also has arbitration rights and is offer sheet eligible.

Plus his play has, apparently, fallen off this season. 1g1a and the only defenceman on the roster with a negative +/- (-5).

 

[wonton15]

Hoglander for Pettersson
Desharnais + Klimovich + picks+ for Murphy with retention

Hughes Hronek
Pettersson Murphy
Soucy Myers
Brannstrom Forbort

Is this realistic and even good enough? Is Pettersson a good enough puck mover?

 

[DFAC]

If Nashville continues to falter - I'd take a serious look at Sissons out of Nashville.

Local boy, RH shot, good at faceoffs and PK. Seems like a Tocchet type player too.

 

[Vector]

Seravalli's interview with Halford and Brough this morning.

GM Meetings

• Lots of talking but not a lot of action
• NCAA rule change was the hot topic

Neck Guards

• Only 7% of the NHL wears neck guards; league is tracking “close calls”
• NHL is giving trainers products and are educating players
• Notices and other material available in locker rooms
• Have seen an uptick in protection worn on the wrists and ankle
• If the league had their choice, would have mandated neck guards
• Mandating would be a CBA issue
• NHLPA has pushed back and said this is player choice
• NHL hopes that since wearing them is mandatory in the junior leagues, players will grow up wearing them; similar to visors
• 4 skaters left in the league that don’t wear a visor

Next CBA

• Increasing contact term limits might be on the NHL’s list of things to pursue but it’s not universally supported by all GMs; would be met with vehement resistance from players
• League is preparing for CBA talks that are expected to begin early next year
• Arbitration process, salary cap for the playoffs, LTIR changes, post-deadline recall rule, and 84-game regular season schedule, and pre-season are all discussion topics

Buffalo Sabres

• Sabres are interested in making a deal but most other organizations are not in trade mode right now
• Can’t do anything right; if they defend well, can’t score and if they score they can’t defend

Ken Holland

• NHL Hockey Operations Consultant role for the rest of the season
• Had conversations with NHL teams about advisory roles
• Lives in Vernon

Erik Karlsson on the 4 Nations Swedish Roster

• Former Team Sweden coach, Johan Garpenlov, criticized the selection of Karlsson to the roster
• Pretty big story in Sweden
• Swedes don’t usually publicly criticize each other
• Karlsson has zero compete

Pittsburgh Penguins & Marcus Pettersson

• Argues that in his first month on the job, Dubas plunged the Penguins further down the standings with his trades and signings
• Does anyone want most of the Penguins players?
• Rust, Malkin, Letang, and almost half the roster has a NMC or NTC
• Rackell and Jarry are untradeable
• Sees some value in Marcus Pettersson
• When Rutherford and Allvin first took over, they had some interest in acquiring Marcus Pettersson
• Pettersson’s biggest struggle is he can’t make an outlet pass so he’s exactly what the Canucks don’t need

 

[MS]

True. I think it does vary season to season and it is team dependent but I think it has more to do with how much the team plays their 3rd pairing rather than teams loading up a top pairing. The old standard for #1 Dman is 25+ minutes and Hughes has been averaging less than 25 minutes the past two seasons. Hronek (which affects Myers' ice time) is averaging pretty standard top pairing minutes.

Just general math, if your top RHD is averaging 23 minutes and 2nd pairing RHD is averaging 20 minutes then that leaves 17 minutes for the 3rd pairing RHD. Hronek is averaging less than 23 minutes this season. If Myers is averaging 19 minutes that means there's ~18 minutes for the 3rd pairing RHD. Of course it doesn't work that simply but you would agree that 18 minutes a night isn't traditional 3rd pairing Dman minutes?

The issue with this is that JT Miller plays 3:57/game on the PP as essentially a RD (I guess technically based on the setup Miller might be at LD and Hughes at RD but same net effect) so you have Hronek at 23:00, Myers at 19:00, Miller at 4:00 and that leaves 14:00 for the 3RD.

And that's assuming a 2D setup on PP2 which doesn't usually happen, either. Basically there are 5-6 minutes of D play that just disappear because forwards are playing D on the PP.

 

[Vector]

The issue with this is that JT Miller plays 3:57/game on the PP as essentially a RD (I guess technically based on the setup Miller might be at LD and Hughes at RD but same net effect) so you have Hronek at 23:00, Myers at 19:00, Miller at 4:00 and that leaves 14:00 for the 3RD.

And last year they handled it by rotating the two pairs minutes every game. One game it was Soucy-Myers nearing 20 minutes then the next it was Zadorov-Cole.