GDT: Group A • Dec. 31 • Germany vs. Finland
- Thread starter Systemfel
- Start date
The biggest problem is probably the lack of teams/rinks here in Germany. Its not like nobody cares about hockey, the 3 biggest clubs in Germany have like 10,000+ in attendance during the regular season and a lot of people are following the DEL, at least in the area where I live. My city has a population of 55k and doesnt have a rink, neither have the smaller towns with simular population around us. The next team and rink i know is in a city with a population of maybe 200.000-250.000 about 25 minutes away. (on the other hand we have about 13 football clubs in our city[55.000 population]) And there the junior teams have to train together so one team only has half a rink to train 2 times a week for about 1,5-2 hours. So you never get in a situation where you would start playing hockey as a child unless your parents are like totally in it. So you are probably just play football with your friends which doesnt cost much and you can play in your village.
Then you can imagine what the leagues are looking like if there is a league at all.
The structure down there is just terrible and its hard to get into hockey. Not everything is the fault of the DEB of course and a lot of time they dont have the money to do anything about it, but sometimes it seems like they dont want to realize how bad the situation is and act like everything is fine.
Another thing is that the top 2 leagues in Germany ( DEL [2] ) and the DEB dont really work together, therefor we have the problem TSN is mentioning a lot: we dont have a junior league. We have a u16 and u18 league where the DEL teams have there youth teams but they only play during the weekend and the quality of the games is obviously not that great. There also is a huge disparity between the teams resulting in the fact that a guy like rieder scored around 115 goals in around 35 games in the u16 league when he played there. So you can tell that the top playes dont have the competition they would need. So its also hard for them to present themselfs unless they are players like draisaitl and rieder. (we have 0 drafted players in this wjc) And as long as they arent good enough to play at the DEL level when they come out of the u18 league they have no league to play. They can play like 4-8 minutes on a del team or can compete in the 3rd league (a lot of 3rd league teams have an agreement with DEL teams, so they are like a farm team) where they again wont have the level of competition they would need to get a lot better.
sry for my english, not that good anyway+ 3:10 am and new year -> a bit drunk
Several of these issues have been or are being addressed at the moment.
The DNL was an U18 league until last season. This year it is U19 and it will be turned in an U20 league soon.
I am too tired right now to get into more detail about the other changes that have been made. But the cooperation between the different leagues particularly between DEL and DEL2 has also been improved in order to give younger players more options to play.
now i think finland will be saved
good to know that we can travel to helsinki next year
How ridiculous would that be?
2-0 after 2. But still not feeling too confident. I think my my balls will look like a pair plums tomorrow after squeezing my private parts watching this finnish team trying to score.
behemolari
öh¨ns-ä
- Dec 1, 2011
- 6,603
- 3,201
that goal didn't look easy! 
they are making it so difficult it's beyond ridiculous. or they are just playing hockey and trying some things, not so much fighting to success. this team is somehow epic fail-coached, everyone is trying to do plays not capable to do.
they are making it so difficult it's beyond ridiculous. or they are just playing hockey and trying some things, not so much fighting to success. this team is somehow epic fail-coached, everyone is trying to do plays not capable to do.
Yeah it has been started to get adressed now at some parts, but it was like way to late, at least in my opinion and while I think the DEL and DEL 2 try to do their best in terms of getting a good solution for junior players there is still a lot of room for improvements regarding the cooperation between DEL and DEB. But you probably know more about the upcoming changes than I do. While some people know the problems and want to fix them there are still some people in the DEB who dont want to change the things they have been doing for a long period of time, at least in my opinion, like the cut is not clear enough in some points.
Jussi
Registered User
Kari Jalonen is also present at the tournament. And MTV (got the AceStream working) just showed some footage of the infamous press conference and Jortikka looked really pissed off.
Giuseppe Sallo
ELE-VAT-ED
AtNightWeFly
You better run.
The biggest problem is probably the lack of teams/rinks here in Germany. Its not like nobody cares about hockey, the 3 biggest clubs in Germany have like 10,000+ in attendance during the regular season and a lot of people are following the DEL, at least in the area where I live. My city has a population of 55k and doesnt have a rink, neither have the smaller towns with simular population around us. The next team and rink i know is in a city with a population of maybe 200.000-250.000 about 25 minutes away. (on the other hand we have about 13 football clubs in our city[55.000 population]) And there the junior teams have to train together so one team only has half a rink to train 2 times a week for about 1,5-2 hours. So you never get in a situation where you would start playing hockey as a child unless your parents are like totally in it. So you are probably just play football with your friends which doesnt cost much and you can play in your village.
Then you can imagine what the leagues are looking like if there is a league at all.
The structure down there is just terrible and its hard to get into hockey. Not everything is the fault of the DEB of course and a lot of time they dont have the money to do anything about it, but sometimes it seems like they dont want to realize how bad the situation is and act like everything is fine.
Another thing is that the top 2 leagues in Germany ( DEL [2] ) and the DEB dont really work together, therefor we have the problem TSN is mentioning a lot: we dont have a junior league. We have a u16 and u18 league where the DEL teams have there youth teams but they only play during the weekend and the quality of the games is obviously not that great. There also is a huge disparity between the teams resulting in the fact that a guy like rieder scored around 115 goals in around 35 games in the u16 league when he played there. So you can tell that the top playes dont have the competition they would need. So its also hard for them to present themselfs unless they are players like draisaitl and rieder. (we have 0 drafted players in this wjc) And as long as they arent good enough to play at the DEL level when they come out of the u18 league they have no league to play. They can play like 4-8 minutes on a del team or can compete in the 3rd league (a lot of 3rd league teams have an agreement with DEL teams, so they are like a farm team) where they again wont have the level of competition they would need to get a lot better.
sry for my english, not that good anyway+ 3:10 am and new year -> a bit drunk
Your English is great and that was very informative.
that goal didn't look easy!
To me it looks more like incredibly unimaginative play because they're being stifled by the coaching rather than being undercoached. It's baffling how the PP is still stuck in their old ways even though it's obviously not working. I still believe they are better than this.
Mens team didnt qualify for the olympics, junior team will get relegated and still the DEB will think they do everything right
Seriously?
Up until last year, when they changed the relegation format of the tournament, Germany went down every single time they were at the world juniors in at least the last 20 years.
To think that a single tournament like the Olympic qualification or the World juniors - were Germany was known for going up and down every single year - would be any indication of the way German hockey is heading, is simply ludicrous. Austria and Slovenia made it to the Olympics, yet sucked hardcore at any other time, what do you make out of that?
Germany completely falling apart in the 2012 World Championship and then blowing the Olympic qualification (and it wasn't even Austria they lost to, they beat them) was incredibly stupid and wasted some very succesful tournament prior to that. In itself, these tournaments say nothing whatsoever about the quality of German hockey. No single tournament can do that.
Simply put, Germany is among a bunch of average hockey-nations. They all have their ups and downs and rarely do you see any of them string more than two, maybe three good tournament together in a row. Germany's success in 2010 and 2011 didn't suggest that they were close to joining the elite teams, nor did the last few years suggest that Germany is falling behind the other average teams, it is the completely normal circle that every average teams goes through. Look at every other team behind the top six, they all had some good moments and failed utterly in others, even Slovakia wasn't immune to that, and they are supposed to be part of the elite, not the average.
German hockey will stay exactly where it has been in the past, far behind the best teams, on basically one level with quite a few other teams. A level where injuries, luck, a good head coach or simply running hot can make all the difference.
I don't think the way you present the Oberliga (3rd tier) is all that close either. The problem with that league isn't that it's not good enough for the young players, on the contrary, the level would be fine if not too good for most of them (and the few who are too good are playing elsewhere anyway). The problem is that coaches at that level are still far more interested in short-term success than in development. It's not a development-league, it's semi-pro, and the coaches fear losing their job and prefer to play it safe, not giving youngsters to many chances.
What still needs to be fine-tuned is the path from juniors to men's hockey, which can be too big for many players. Raising the maximum age in the DNL is the obvious first step in improving that. It's also doubtful that you would see an 18 year old play a big role in the DEL, like it occasionally happens in Sweden or Finland. Rieder and Kühnhackl played a decent role in tier two at that age, but even the best rarely get the chance to play an important role at that age, which is probably while many of the most talented went over to North America pretty early.
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Jussi
Registered User
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