WC: General Talk '14 — Canada

[SimplySensational]

Chimera going too.

Capitals had a line of Chimera-Fehr-Ward. Hard workers at ES. I wonder if Fehr will get a invite too now.

 

[OG]

How has Jordan Staal not even been invited?

 

[spacemunky]

I'm very happy to see the kid Rielly on there. Love watching him play and I'm not even a Leafs fan.

 

[Rumcajs]

How has Jordan Staal not even been invited?

He is slow/terrible on the big ice, so not surprised there.

Also no surprise on the no shows this year due to the poor state of the country with the current political administration/economic situation. In other words, not entirely safe to walk around as many of my russian friends have told me!

 

[ChesterNimitz]

Chimera going too.

Capitals had a line of Chimera-Fehr-Ward. Hard workers at ES. I wonder if Fehr will get a invite too now.

Great selection. Chimera is one of the NHL's great skaters. He'll be far more effective on the big ice than a lot of the bigger names that Canadian fans hoped would be selected. The same with Mason Raymond who I hope they select. The big ice makes the good skaters better and the average skaters worse. If they continue this trend and add a little finish, this team will compete for a medal.

 

[JackSlater]

Alzner on the big ice will be exposed. Pick the 15 best skaters you can find, get a competent goaltender and anything is possible. Ask the Latvians. Canada needs skaters not names. Alzner has difficulty with speed on the small ice, over in Europe, he will be pitiful.

I find Alzner to be a good skater for his size, though maybe I don't see him enough. I would like to see him on the larger ice surface to get a sense of his abilities there.

Any News if Strome or Hamonic were invited(I am guessing Strome is a longshot but I thought Hamonic was a lock)

Curious about Hamonic as well.

Chimera going too.

Capitals had a line of Chimera-Fehr-Ward. Hard workers at ES. I wonder if Fehr will get a invite too now.

Chimera has played well for Canada at this tournament before.

 

[ChesterNimitz]

Along with Johansen, Ryan Murray would be available if Columbus goes out in the 1st round.

He's better than Rielly and if Rielly's already going I would assume they'd at least ask him.

They might be equal now, but Reilly's elite skating makes his ceiling much, much higher than Murray's. Within three years Reilly will be among the most dynamic players in the league. It may even happen sooner.

 

[ChesterNimitz]

I find Alzner to be a good skater for his size, though maybe I don't see him enough. I would like to see him on the larger ice surface to get a sense of his abilities there.



That's small comfort. 'He's a good skater for his size.' That's like describing a blind date as, 'well, she's got a good personality.' On the bigger ice, you have to be a superior skater, period. No qualifications. Watching Team Canada at the recent WJC should have driven that point home by now.

 

[xxxx]

I like how this team looks so far.


Seems like a lot of good hard-working players are there. Brouwer, Ward, Burrows, Turris, Chimera... and some young hungry players like Rielly, Ellis, and Monahan.

It would be good to have some real 1st and 2nd liners like Hall or Spezza, but I think that it doesn't really matter what players will play. As a team, we can always win. You just need good work-ethic, enthusiasm, motivation, playing on 100% level, and it will be good. That's why I like players like Chimera, Brouwer, Ward, Burrows and Turris. They won't be just skating.

 

[JackSlater]

That's small comfort. 'He's a good skater for his size.' That's like describing a blind date as, 'well, she's got a good personality.' On the bigger ice, you have to be a superior skater, period. No qualifications. Watching Team Canada at the recent WJC should have driven that point home by now.

It was also driven home when Weber, another defenceman whose skating is good for his size though not elite, was exposed for Canada at the Olympics this year, right? Same with Canada's line of Benn, Getzlaf and Perry being constantly exposed (I actually expected them to stink, and was proven wrong). If you want to bring up WJC, I do remember Alzner's performances... when he performed very well for Canada over two different tournaments taking place in Europe.

 

[leafsfuture]

Any word if Mike Cammalleri has been invited?? Or is him being a UFA likely stopping him from being realistic?

 

[ATLbound]

No Bryan Little. Really.

 

[ChesterNimitz]

It was also driven home when Weber, another defenceman whose skating is good for his size though not elite, was exposed for Canada at the Olympics this year, right? Same with Canada's line of Benn, Getzlaf and Perry being constantly exposed (I actually expected them to stink, and was proven wrong). If you want to bring up WJC, I do remember Alzner's performances... when he performed very well for Canada over two different tournaments taking place in Europe.

You cannot compare Alzner's skating to Weber's. While none of Weber, Benn, Getzlaf or Perry are dynamic or agile skaters, each has adequate straight line speed and the hockey I.Q. and ice presence to mask their skating limitations on the bigger ice. Alzner has neither the straight line speed nor the agility to be effective on the larger ice. He will be exposed.

 

[snizzbone*]

Apparently decisions on the roster haven't been completed.. hence why some players do not know if they are being invited and all that.

 

[JackSlater]

You cannot compare Alzner's skating to Weber's. While none of Weber, Benn, Getzlaf or Perry are dynamic or agile skaters, each has adequate straight line speed and the hockey I.Q. and ice presence to mask their skating limitations on the bigger ice. Alzner has neither the straight line speed nor the agility to be effective on the larger ice. He will be exposed.

I am comparing Alzner's skating to Weber's (similar ability, though I suspect Alzner is a bit quicker), and at the very least in the case of Perry he is a better skater (though it is a more significant factor for a defenceman). You ignored the more important point though, which was that Alzner has already been effective on the larger ice surfaces at the only two tournaments he has played on the surface. WJC does not directly translate to the senior level, but it is a decent precursor. Uncertainty about how Alzner would translate to the ice surface is why I would like to see him at this tournament. There is no guarantee that he would be a liability.

 

[ChesterNimitz]

I am comparing Alzner's skating to Weber's (similar ability, though I suspect Alzner is a bit quicker), and at the very least in the case of Perry he is a better skater (though it is a more significant factor for a defenceman). You ignored the more important point though, which was that Alzner has already been effective on the larger ice surfaces at the only two tournaments he has played on the surface. WJC does not directly translate to the senior level, but it is a decent precursor. Uncertainty about how Alzner would translate to the ice surface is why I would like to see him at this tournament. There is no guarantee that he would be a liability.

I guess we will have to agree to disagree. I think its safe to say that Alzner has never, and will never, live up to the reasonable expectations that any team would have for a player drafted 5th overall. In two WJCs he scored 1 goal. Over his NHL career he has scored only 7 goals. This is a player that has journeyman written all over him. Alzner is now 25 and has largely reached the peak of his development. What you see is what you will get from him: a useful 4th or 5th defenceman at best. And that's on the less challenging smaller ice surface. If Canada picks the right team, this year's world championship is eminently winnable. There are at least 10 other defencemen that are nominally available that I would take before him.

 

[Aceonfire*]

This team looks horrible. Very little top 6 talent and its stocked with 5-6 D outside of Bieksa.

Perron and Bozak will have to carry the team.

 

[1Gold Standard]

I don't know if it really matters. Out of the teams likely to be eliminated in the first round, I doubt Seguin and Benn go given how this roster looks. I think Johansen would go. The best thing for this team would be a Colorado loss, as maybe MacKinnon, O'Reilly or Barrie would go.

I was sort of counting on that as well when it appeared their 1st. rd opponent would have been Chicago, Anaheim or SJ... but since it's Minni and I have no rooting interest in that team or their players (other than Moulson) I'm now officially aboard the Avs playoff train and am rooting for them to take out the Wild. Plus, the NHL playoffs will be better for Mackinnon, O'Reilly and Duchene and their development than any Skoda Invitational in Minsk.

besides, Barrie will be starting the 1st. rd. either hurt or on the IR. So, even if the Avs go out quick, I doubt Barrie would be in.

And another thing, every year for the last 4 years my rants against HC have included ways in which they could better pick rosters. i.e. limit the number of 18-20 year old fresh faced rookies, maximum 2 per year and build the roster around more NHL vets ages 25-28. So far HC has been listening... so, if it all goes south..everybody can direct their anger at me this year. I'm to blame.

 

[JackSlater]

I guess we will have to agree to disagree. I think its safe to say that Alzner has never, and will never, live up to the reasonable expectations that any team would have for a player drafted 5th overall. In two WJCs he scored 1 goal. Over his NHL career he has scored only 7 goals. This is a player that has journeyman written all over him. Alzner is now 25 and has largely reached the peak of his development. What you see is what you will get from him: a useful 4th or 5th defenceman at best. And that's on the less challenging smaller ice surface. If Canada picks the right team, this year's world championship is eminently winnable. There are at least 10 other defencemen that are nominally available that I would take before him.

Yes we will have to disagree. Alzner performed well at those WJC (particularly when he was captain in 2008) in a purely defensive role, which is the role he would take on any significant edition of team Canada. Similar to the Vlasic role, as a defensive defenceman on the weaker (left) side for Canada. I expect that his game also has much room for improvement as well, and I suspect HC agrees given his invitation to the summer orientation camp for the Olympic team.

I was sort of counting on that as well when it appeared their 1st. rd opponent would have been Chicago, Anaheim or SJ... but since it's Minni and I have no rooting interest in that team or their players (other than Moulson) I'm now officially aboard the Avs playoff train and am rooting for them to take out the Wild. Plus, the NHL playoffs will be better for Mackinnon, O'Reilly and Duchene and their development than any Skoda Invitational in Minsk.

besides, Barrie will be starting the 1st. rd. either hurt or on the IR. So, even if the Avs go out quick, I doubt Barrie would be in.

And another thing, every year for the last 4 years my rants against HC have included ways in which they could better pick rosters. i.e. limit the number of 18-20 year old fresh faced rookies, maximum 2 per year and build the roster around more NHL vets ages 25-28. So far HC has been listening... so, if it all goes south..everybody can direct their anger at me this year. I'm to blame.

I agree that it is better for their development (and better for the future of HC) if they go deep into the playoffs, and I am not expecting Colorado to lose until the second round.

I think the way that Canada has picked these teams in recent years has been pretty effective. Pretty much every player on the Olympic roster in 2014 had engaged in a positive experience at the WC before making their Olympic debut. Even players on losing teams (Tavares, Pietrangelo, Duchene, etc.) have put in some very good performances for Canada at this tournament in leadership roles. The crop who debuted in 2010 (Getzlaf, Crosby, Weber etc.) had all put on great performances at the WC before 2010 as well. Unfortunately this year it looks like there are no obvious future Olympic candidates. Rielly looks closest, but that would probably be quite some time.

 

[1Gold Standard]

Yes we will have to disagree. Alzner performed well at those WJC (particularly when he was captain in 2008) in a purely defensive role, which is the role he would take on any significant edition of team Canada. Similar to the Vlasic role, as a defensive defenceman on the weaker (left) side for Canada. I expect that his game also has much room for improvement as well, and I suspect HC agrees given his invitation to the summer orientation camp for the Olympic team.



I agree that it is better for their development (and better for the future of HC) if they go deep into the playoffs, and I am not expecting Colorado to lose until the second round.

I think the way that Canada has picked these teams in recent years has been pretty effective. Pretty much every player on the Olympic roster in 2014 had engaged in a positive experience at the WC before making their Olympic debut. Even players on losing teams (Tavares, Pietrangelo, Duchene, etc.) have put in some very good performances for Canada at this tournament in leadership roles. The crop who debuted in 2010 (Getzlaf, Crosby, Weber etc.) had all put on great performances at the WC before 2010 as well. Unfortunately this year it looks like there are no obvious future Olympic candidates. Rielly looks closest, but that would probably be quite some time.

While I don't discount that having at least some international experience on the senior level is useful, I wouldn't use the lack of it as a knock against any player when roster spots on the A team come up. If Stamkos and Tavares hadn't played in any WHC, would you really doubt that they are players worthy of an Olympic team? No doubt in my mind.

There won't be any obvious choices for a while.. as I've written here time and time again, 1993/94 are not our strongest groups of players. We may as well skip forward to the years 95-96-97 please.

 

[JackSlater]

While I don't discount that having at least some international experience on the senior level is useful, I wouldn't use the lack of it as a knock against any player when roster spots on the A team come up. If Stamkos and Tavares hadn't played in any WHC, would you really doubt that they are players worthy of an Olympic team? No doubt in my mind.

There won't be any obvious choices for a while.. as I've written here time and time again, 1993/94 are not our strongest groups of players. We may as well skip forward to the years 95-96-97 please.

If the player is Stamkos, then obviously he is worthy, but it helps that he has performed well in international tournaments. Tavares is a guy that became a lock for the team on the strength of his international play, in my opinion anyway. The way he played in the 2013-14 season was obviously enough tog get him on the team regardless though. More significant are other instances, like Pietrangelo (top defenceman 2011) or Duchene (good tournaments in 2010 and 2013). These guys do not grow up playing on the larger ice. Any experience they can get is a positive.

 

[ChesterNimitz]

If the player is Stamkos, then obviously he is worthy, but it helps that he has performed well in international tournaments. Tavares is a guy that became a lock for the team on the strength of his international play, in my opinion anyway. The way he played in the 2013-14 season was obviously enough tog get him on the team regardless though. More significant are other instances, like Pietrangelo (top defenceman 2011) or Duchene (good tournaments in 2010 and 2013). These guys do not grow up playing on the larger ice. Any experience they can get is a positive.

No one can argue with your assertion that experience on the larger ice surface must be seen as a positive. But an elite skater will adapt to and take advantage of the larger venue quickly, while a player with a lesser level of skating, regardless of his experience, will be of limited value to his/her team.

 

[Nixa]

Wow, Team Canada is shaping up fast. Hopefully they will leave some spots open for the players who are out after first round.

 

[Marc the Habs Fan]

Darren Dreger ‏@DarrenDreger 2m
Canada: Garrison,Ellis,Gudbranson added on D. Schiefele + Hodgson primary centres. Huberdeau added on wing. 1 spot to fill plus goalie.G

Good to see Scheif healthy enough to be there.

 

[Mr. Canucklehead]

Darren Dreger ‏@DarrenDreger 2m
Canada: Garrison,Ellis,Gudbranson added on D. Schiefele + Hodgson primary centres. Huberdeau added on wing. 1 spot to fill plus goalie.G

Good to see Scheif healthy enough to be there.

Garrison as in Jason?

Thrilled for the guy, but there's been speculation all season long that he's playing through some sort of lower body injury. His skating hasn't been as great as it should be, and I wonder how that will transpose onto the big ice.

EDIT: Yes, that is Jason Garrison.

News1130 Sports‏@News1130Sports·1m
Jason Garrison becomes the 3rd #Canucks player named to Team Canada for the WHC's.
Expand