Prospect Info: General Prospect Discussion Thread 2021-22

[Bazeek]

That's hard to say; at one time they had Granlund, Larsson, Phillips, and Coyle. Not all of them turned out that great.



Has McBain mentioned anything about signing with the Wild or any indication? He's from Toronto, his father played in Winnipeg - hard to tell what is going on with him and until he signs, I don't think we can count on him as depth. We literally have Rossi and that might be it for the next few seasons. This was why I was concerned that Minnesota drafted Peart in the 2nd round. It went from Rossi, Khovanov, Marat to...Rossi and maybe McBain?



The problem with Khovanov is between his ears and he hasn't shown any inclination of being anything more than Sokolov at this point.



I'm not dismissing any of them, but it's hard not to be concerned when your center depth for the next two years is Rossi and...Pitlick? Possibly McBain? Marat is gone for the next two years and I don't consider him part of the immediate future for the Wild - sort of like Kaprizov. Pillar is an overager BTW, so, his numbers should be taken with a grain of salt. I just don't see much depth at the group that can push guys like Ek or even Rossi.

But the biggest issue is that the Wild have one S tier (Rossi) and then a bunch of guys that may top out as bottom 6 guys. Yay?

You could pick a position and play a similar game with any prospect pool in the league, though. Uncertainty is kind of the name of the game with prospects. A year ago McBain didn't look like a prospect we'd even look to sign and now we're wondering if he'll just walk to free agency. Sure things are the exception.

 

[thestonedkoala]

You could pick a position and play a similar game with any prospect pool in the league, though. Uncertainty is kind of the name of the game with prospects. A year ago McBain didn't look like a prospect we'd even look to sign and now we're wondering if he'll just walk to free agency. Sure things are the exception.

Honestly, the only reason why I am concerned about McBain is because of the center depth. It went from okay to - uhhhh quickly.

And actually you touched on a great subject:

Hunt, Lambos, Peart and O'Rourke all seem to have huge futures. We have an abundance of really good left handed defensemen coming up in the league. With Brodin signed until the end of the XCel Center, you think we'll move one of them?

 

[AKL]

You could pick a position and play a similar game with any prospect pool in the league, though. Uncertainty is kind of the name of the game with prospects. A year ago McBain didn't look like a prospect we'd even look to sign and now we're wondering if he'll just walk to free agency. Sure things are the exception.

To that point, just because he now looks like a prospect we wanna sign, doesn't mean he doesn't still project as nothing more than a bottom six guy. 22 year old fourth year college player, has no one else taking opportunities from this year because BC hasn't recruited any more top guys since Boldy and Newhook.

He's already starting to cool too. 14 points in 8 games in October. 6 points in 8 games in November/December, including 0 points in 4 of those games.

He's just not very special. You can sign NCAA UFA's like him pretty much every year. Nico Sturm was a better player than him. Like his teammate Marc McLaughlin is going to be a free agent this summer. He may or may not get a contract, but McBain hasn't been any better than him in the previous two seasons.

 

[Bazeek]

Honestly, the only reason why I am concerned about McBain is because of the center depth. It went from okay to - uhhhh quickly.

And actually you touched on a great subject:

Hunt, Lambos, Peart and O'Rourke all seem to have huge futures. We have an abundance of really good left handed defensemen coming up in the league. With Brodin signed until the end of the XCel Center, you think we'll move one of them?

I don't personally see a reason to move one anytime soon. The exception would be if they do go after a higher-end rental for this year, in which case it'd make sense to deal from that position. Having 3 LD make the same WJC with one more being minutes away from making it is pretty nifty. None of those guys is likely to play top pairing or anything but they're also on the Canadian and US teams.

To that point, just because he now looks like a prospect we wanna sign, doesn't mean he doesn't still project as nothing more than a bottom six guy. 22 year old fourth year college player, has no one else taking opportunities from this year because BC hasn't recruited any more top guys since Boldy and Newhook.

He's already starting to cool too. 14 points in 8 games in October. 6 points in 8 games in November/December, including 0 points in 4 of those games.

He's just not very special. You can sign NCAA UFA's like him pretty much every year. Nico Sturm was a better player than him. Like his teammate Marc McLaughlin is going to be a free agent this summer. He may or may not get a contract, but McBain hasn't been any better than him in their time at BC.

Even with the recent surge in points I don't see McBain as more than a Sturm-level prospect, but that's still something we don't have a lot of. Top-6 centers are just hard: even if you draft 4 good ones it seems like chances favor about 3 of them projecting as wings long term anyway.

 

[AKL]

Even with the recent surge in points I don't see McBain as more than a Sturm-level prospect, but that's still something we don't have a lot of. Top-6 centers are just hard: even if you draft 4 good ones it seems like chances favor about 3 of them projecting as wings long term anyway.

That's why it's so concerning that we have about one of them right now.

 

[Bazeek]

That's why it's so concerning that we have about one of them right now.

At a high level, yeah. I guess my level of concern isn't all that acute right now. They'll need to continue to add good prospects and shore up positions of need, but should have recourse to do so. There's not much to be done about it until this summer, though.

 

[DeagleJenkins]

With this talk of quality LD prospects, why dont we just go after a prospect for prospect swap? i understand the need for many and hope just one hits but with the point being that outside of Rossi our C depth may be thinner as Kush is playing wing and not C yet so he may not be a C. example: Orourke for Turcotte. on the surface it makes sense for us, unsure it suites the kings but we talk about trading from position of strength on the nhl roster, why not start doing it with prospects until our cupboard is a bit more evenly spread out rather than super wealthy in just a few areas?

 

[Prior]

Prospect for prospect swaps don’t happen. At least ones that are relevant.

Nothing to be concerned about with the prospect pool. It’s significantly better than most all in the league and all done without an abundance of picks, trades, or high picks.

 

[Bazeek]

With this talk of quality LD prospects, why dont we just go after a prospect for prospect swap? i understand the need for many and hope just one hits but with the point being that outside of Rossi our C depth may be thinner as Kush is playing wing and not C yet so he may not be a C. example: Orourke for Turcotte. on the surface it makes sense for us, unsure it suites the kings but we talk about trading from position of strength on the nhl roster, why not start doing it with prospects until our cupboard is a bit more evenly spread out rather than super wealthy in just a few areas?

There's too much uncertainty around prospect swaps. Ultimately you don't really know what you're trading away and probably have even less of an idea of what you're getting back. It's just not something that GM's ever seem to bite on.

 

[DeagleJenkins]

Prospect for prospect swaps don’t happen. At least ones that are relevant.

Nothing to be concerned about with the prospect pool. It’s significantly better than most all in the league and all done without an abundance of picks, trades, or high picks.

There's too much uncertainty around prospect swaps. Ultimately you don't really know what you're trading away and probably have even less of an idea of what you're getting back. It's just not something that GM's ever seem to bite on.

i understand its hardly done and possibly a bit more risky, that is why i was thinking along the lines of depth for depth. both unproven but positional needs of equivalent upside.

 

[thestonedkoala]

Even with the recent surge in points I don't see McBain as more than a Sturm-level prospect, but that's still something we don't have a lot of. Top-6 centers are just hard: even if you draft 4 good ones it seems like chances favor about 3 of them projecting as wings long term anyway.

That's what I see for McBain is a good mid-6 center. And you just explained why Minnesota should keep drafting centers in the top 60 for...well ever.

 

[BuiumSaveUs]

I'm not to worried about how our prospect pool looks with regards to the next couple years. I'm absolutely not worried about the Khusnutdinov extension. People are acting like now he might not come over. When was the last time a quality NHLer just decided to forego his career and stay in the KHL? He'll be over, and I don't think the odds of him being much of an impact NHLer in the next two years is high. Purely from a depth point of view over the next three years, this is the way I see it going. Note, I'm going to assume Fiala is gone and green way resigns for 2 years

Next Year:
Kaprizov-Hartman-Zuccarello
GREEF
Boldy-Rossi-xxx]
IDC

Brodin-Dumba
Goligoski-Spurgeon
xxx-Addison

The following Year:
Kaprizov-Hartman-Zuccarello
GREEF
Boldy-Rossi-Beckman
IDC

Brodin-Addison
Lambos-Spurgeon
O'Rourke-xxxx

After that, we will need to start thinking about what to do long-term with Hartman, Zuccarello, Greenway, Foligno, Etc. And, I'm not blind to the possibility that some of those prospects will likely flounder in that role and others will have to be brought in, but both of those teams are going to have some-level of flexibility to do that. And, if there's one thing I believe Guerin is well suited to do, it's identify the holes in out depth and fix that. This is around the time where you start thinking about Khusnutdinov, Peart, etc. being in the fold. It doesn't seem like a core that is unrealistic to sustain around the same level of team we have through the next 2/3 years. What I do know, though, is that we definitely need to keep adding to the prospect pool, otherwise we're going to hit a wall in terms of filling the holes of the talent we lose. It does help that the year after we should be sitting pretty well with the cap.

 

[AKL]

Prospect for prospect swaps don’t happen. At least ones that are relevant.

Nothing to be concerned about with the prospect pool.

Sure there is. Lack of centers, no right wingers, very few right defensemen. No true high end talent. All valid concerns.

It’s significantly better than most all in the league and all done without an abundance of picks, trades, or high picks.

This doesn't mean anything. It was ranked highly 10 years ago too and didn't produce results. The other consideration is that quite a few of the teams behind us, and even ahead of us, have much better pieces in terms of U23-25 roster players already. We have Kaprizov and Ek.

 

[thestonedkoala]

I'm not to worried about how our prospect pool looks with regards to the next couple years. I'm absolutely not worried about the Khusnutdinov extension. People are acting like now he might not come over. When was the last time a quality NHLer just decided to forego his career and stay in the KHL? He'll be over, and I don't think the odds of him being much of an impact NHLer in the next two years is high. Purely from a depth point of view over the next three years, this is the way I see it going. Note, I'm going to assume Fiala is gone and green way resigns for 2 years

I think it's a good thing to think about as the team will need cheap players, and the best way to get cheap players is talented young players.

Kovalchuk decided to head off to the KHL, came back and went back. Radulov took a lot of time off to go to the KHL. Burmistrov is another (he was fairly young when he gave up). Kaprizov took 5 years to get to the NHL as well.

I don't think it's necessarily being an impact, but having him under the Wild system AND in case of injuries and depth.

 

[AKL]

Khusnutdinov wasn't going to be in the NHL full time in the next two years anyway, and the KHL is a far better league than the AHL. On the list of concerns about the team and its future, Khusnutdinov signing a two year extension should be toward the bottom. If he signs for another 2-3 years after this one is over, then we can start worrying.

 

[MuckOG]

 

[Circulartheory]

Sure there is. Lack of centers, no right wingers, very few right defensemen. No true high end talent. All valid concerns.



This doesn't mean anything. It was ranked highly 10 years ago too and didn't produce results. The other consideration is that quite a few of the teams behind us, and even ahead of us, have much better pieces in terms of U23-25 roster players already. We have Kaprizov and Ek.

Personally, I found that players that play their natural side is definitely a positive but not a dire requirement like the difference between a winger and a center.

In terms of high end talent, I disagree. We got one of the best goalie prospect (Wallstedt), one of the best center prospects (Rossi), and one of the better winger prospects (Boldy). There is no defensive prospect with immediate star power but neither did Brodin when he got drafted and we got a plethora of young defenseman that are showing some very promising development and more upside than their draft year (projection is never linear) - Lambos, Hunt, O'Rourke and Peart all part or in consideration for their respective U20 team.

Yes, we should always strive to high end talent and talent to fill all sides and positions but I don't feel it rises to the area of "concern". More like areas of improvement. Concern implies urgency.

 

[AKL]

Personally, I found that players that play their natural side is definitely a positive but not a dire requirement like the difference between a winger and a center.

In terms of high end talent, I disagree. We got one of the best goalie prospect (Wallstedt), one of the best center prospects (Rossi), and one of the better winger prospects (Boldy). There is no defensive prospect with immediate star power but neither did Brodin when he got drafted and we got a plethora of young defenseman that are showing some very promising development and more upside than their draft year (projection is never linear) - Lambos, Hunt, O'Rourke and Peart all part or in consideration for their respective U20 team.

Yes, we should always strive to high end talent and talent to fill all sides and positions but I don't feel it rises to the area of "concern". More like areas of improvement. Concern implies urgency.

That's all well and good but we had a bunch of guys on their U20 teams 10 years ago and it never amounted to anything meaningful. Rossi and Boldy should both be good players and I like them a lot, but they're not going to be top 10-15 scorers in the league. Wallstedt might be a top 5-10 player at his position, but that's certainly not a given.

And we're adding this to a U23-25 core that isn't very good. Kaprizov and Fiala, but Fiala is probably gone. Ek is borderline. Good, useful player, but we use him as a third liner.

Lots of areas of concern. Doesn't mean what we do have isn't any good.

 

[P10p]

That's all well and good but we had a bunch of guys on their U20 teams 10 years ago and it never amounted to anything meaningful. Rossi and Boldy should both be good players and I like them a lot, but they're not going to be top 10-15 scorers in the league. Wallstedt might be a top 5-10 player at his position, but that's certainly not a given.

And we're adding this to a U23-25 core that isn't very good. Kaprizov and Fiala, but Fiala is probably gone. Ek is borderline. Good, useful player, but we use him as a third liner.

Lots of areas of concern. Doesn't mean what we do have isn't any good.

Well that's just the nature of prospects in general, there is a certain amount of risk attached. What happened with the old guard shouldn't be held against Rossi, Boldy, Wallstedt, etc... Sure they could flame out. As it stands they are all amongst the top prospects in their respective positions.

 

[AKL]

Well that's just the nature of prospects in general, there is a certain amount of risk attached. What happened with the old guard shouldn't be held against Rossi, Boldy, Wallstedt, etc... Sure they could flame out. As it stands they are all amongst the top prospects in their respective positions.

Yeah, so like I said, those top rankings and U20 spots don't mean anything. Thanks.

I'm not confused about the nature of prospects looking good and then not panning out. That is my entire point.

 

[57special]

I'm not to worried about how our prospect pool looks with regards to the next couple years. I'm absolutely not worried about the Khusnutdinov extension. People are acting like now he might not come over. When was the last time a quality NHLer just decided to forego his career and stay in the KHL? He'll be over, and I don't think the odds of him being much of an impact NHLer in the next two years is high. Purely from a depth point of view over the next three years, this is the way I see it going. Note, I'm going to assume Fiala is gone and green way resigns for 2 years

Next Year:
Kaprizov-Hartman-Zuccarello
GREEF
Boldy-Rossi-xxx]
IDC

Brodin-Dumba
Goligoski-Spurgeon
xxx-Addison

The following Year:
Kaprizov-Hartman-Zuccarello
GREEF
Boldy-Rossi-Beckman
IDC

Brodin-Addison
Lambos-Spurgeon
O'Rourke-xxxx

After that, we will need to start thinking about what to do long-term with Hartman, Zuccarello, Greenway, Foligno, Etc. And, I'm not blind to the possibility that some of those prospects will likely flounder in that role and others will have to be brought in, but both of those teams are going to have some-level of flexibility to do that. And, if there's one thing I believe Guerin is well suited to do, it's identify the holes in out depth and fix that. This is around the time where you start thinking about Khusnutdinov, Peart, etc. being in the fold. It doesn't seem like a core that is unrealistic to sustain around the same level of team we have through the next 2/3 years. What I do know, though, is that we definitely need to keep adding to the prospect pool, otherwise we're going to hit a wall in terms of filling the holes of the talent we lose. It does help that the year after we should be sitting pretty well with the cap.

Kulikov has a two year contract, so you can pencil him in beside Addison for next year. Gaudreau(Bottom six C) and Duhaime(bottom six RW) are also signed for next year. Would love to have Sturm back, but if he prices himself out of the team then I think Dewar(another ELC contract) will be able to play. Rask will be gone, as will Bjugstad...too soon to say about Pitlick.
I do think that either Hartman or Duhaime can play RW on the JEE line, allowing Guerin to lose Greenway's salary.

 

[keppel146]

That's all well and good but we had a bunch of guys on their U20 teams 10 years ago and it never amounted to anything meaningful. Rossi and Boldy should both be good players and I like them a lot, but they're not going to be top 10-15 scorers in the league. Wallstedt might be a top 5-10 player at his position, but that's certainly not a given.

And we're adding this to a U23-25 core that isn't very good. Kaprizov and Fiala, but Fiala is probably gone. Ek is borderline. Good, useful player, but we use him as a third liner.

Lots of areas of concern. Doesn't mean what we do have isn't any good.

So do you want to tank or trade up at the draft?

 

[keeneyedobserver]

So do you want to tank or trade up at the draft?

If we get a comp pick in the 50’s for Johanson, I doubt they sign him. I would expect a push to sign McBain for the reasons others have noted.

 

[Wasted Talent]

If we get a comp pick in the 50’s for Johanson, I doubt they sign him. I would expect a push to sign McBain for the reasons others have noted.

Wild has to offer Johansson a contract and have him decline signing to receive that compensatory pick.

 

[57special]

Addison with a beautiful breakaway deke goal, assisted by Rossi