GDT: Game #4: Edmonton Oilers vs Coyotes - 7:00pm (AZ) - BSAZ & 98.7FM - Is there a Mercy Rule??

[Jakey53]

Even if we're still losing the same amount of games, I'd rather it be with the younger guys on the roster.

Bingo.

 

[MIGs Dog]

I'm giving Ghost an atta boy. Team loses 5-1 and he ends up with +1. That's not easy to do.

my fantasy team thanks him.

 

[Jakey53]

I much prefer the honest sarcasm and negativity here to the doofy homerism on the radio.

That goes on with every NHL team. I hate listening to these announcers. Tell it like it is.

 

[Jakey53]

The roster is too heavy on guys who have no chance of being here or in the league next year. They need to bring in guys who can work toward something. Beagle is the only older guy who has really tried consistently.

That is exactly how I feel. Beagle can join go as well.

 

[Czechboy]

Oilers fan.. not trolling but the game went to 1am in Ontario and I didn't see the third.

How did Vejmelka look? I was surprised he got an NHL start to be honest.

Jaskin? I saw him with 2 great chances in the 2nd and I also see 3 million dollar healthy scratch.

Will we see Korenar any time soon?

How on earth is Jan Jenik not on this roster? Maybe it's my bias but I thought he'd crack the roster for sure.
Obviously, a Czech fan too!

 

[cobra427]

This result doesn't surprise me, I expected it and more of the same. We are way under talented, you can't get blood out of a stone. I don't know why guys on this board are upset, how could anyone not see this season coming? We have close to if not the worst goal tending, worst D and worst offence in the NHL.

The only way we win a few games is if the other team takes us lightly, we get great goal tending for a game, and we capitalize on a few turnovers here and there. It will happen but it will be unusual. I'm not upset, we are tanking and have a 40-50 point team, is what it is.

 

[rt]

This result doesn't surprise me, I expected it and more of the same. We are way under talented, you can't get blood out of a stone. I don't know why guys on this board are upset, how could anyone not see this season coming? We have close to if not the worst goal tending, worst D and worst offence in the NHL.

The only way we win a few games is if the other team takes us lightly, we get great goal tending for a game, and we capitalize on a few turnovers here and there. It will happen but it will be unusual. I'm not upset, we are tanking and have a 40-50 point team, is what it is.

I’m unhappy because you don’t have to lose every game by five goals in order to be the worst team in the league. We could be much better than we are and still be the worst team. That’s what upsets me a little. We could at least have an NHL caliber goaltender. Even the 40th best goalie in the world would be okay with me. But we have maybe the 90th and 130th best goalies in the world? I don’t have a real ranking and this is just an example. But my actual point is that it’s too extreme. This was too far. And I was complaining about this in early September.

 

[rt]

Just got back / read through the thread. Glad this team still has fans... sort of?

Honestly though we played fine / well today, pretty even for the most part even though we still lost 5-1 (which is a ridiculous thing to say, but whatever). Again, this post is for people who can't the watch games on TV.

Overall:
1) Biggest surprise in my view is that Edmonton is actually a good TEAM. This narrative that Edmonton is just McD and Drai is completely wrong. Edmonton's third line (Foegele / Kassian) has some size, their fourth line of Perlini and Turris can skate as we already know, Nurse is a legitimate #1 defenseman which I had no idea about before tonight (plays big, no mistakes, not sure worth 9.5 per but easily 7 or 8m per year). And that's not even counting players like RNH, Hyman etc who are legitimate top-6 forwards and would be on any team.

The only time EDM got sustained high quality pressure at even strength was around the last 5 minutes or so of the 2nd period which incidentally didn't result in a goal. Hopefully having letdowns in the 2nd does not become a pattern for us.

Anyway, my point is that we skated mostly even with a team like this (who is also undefeated by the way), and that is better than what I expected, honestly. The 5-1 score is about what I expected, though, we are not good.

2) All of EDM's goals were started and / or finished by strong individual plays of which we had very few. First goal Foegele turns Mayo inside out (welcome to the league Mayo! more on him below), then a shortie from a partial break, McDavid had a crazy cutback move on goal 3 and then 2 more from the Edmonton power play (both through McD), not much to do there. Shots / chances were pretty even too, we were consistently getting high quality deflections all game even though none of them went in. If Jaskin hits that open net in the first and one or two of those deflections goes in it's a completely game.

Anyway EDM didn't dominate us today anywhere but on the scoreboard... and yes I realize that statement sounds ridiculous. But at 5 x 5 we traded chances mostly evenly, which in my view is all that any of us can reasonably expect.

Thoughts on individuals:
1) Ladd has easily been one of our better forwards in both home games so far -- he's driving the net, breaking up passes in the D-zone etc, just doing every single little thing out there. I'm not sure anyone anticipated this (I certainly didn't) but based on this, I have no problem at all with him wearing an A and playing 16-18 minutes a night in all situations. He is absolutely leading by example out there.

2) Vejmelka was not good today, what is most concerning is that his rebounds were consistently uncontrolled from every shot that wasn't routine. My guess is he's likely still getting used to the pace and quality of shot in this league (which would make sense). I did a deep dive on him prior to last game, he and Vanecek were basically the two top Czech goalies from since they were little kids, Vanecek was able to adjust so hopefully Vej does too. Either way Vej is probably still good enough as a stopgap until Prosvetov (or someone else) is ready, it's not like we need anyway to be good for another 3-5 years anyway.

3) It was Mayo's first game in the NHL (he took the place of Soderstrom), I literally had never heard of him before this game. At a top level, he seems like a stay at home D-man that's spent quite a few years in Tucson... and yet today he looked like a legitimate NHL top-4 defender (he was paired with Ghost which is a pairing that makes a lot of sense). Yes he got walked badly on that first goal but what I liked is that Tourigny put Ghost and Mayo right back out there immediately after allowing that first goal.

When Mayo scored in the 3rd, I was really happy for him, he played an excellent game especially considering it was his first ever game in the NHL. Would absolutely like to see more of him, if he keeps playing this well he absolutely should be in our lineup.

Anyway! Good night. See you Saturday against the Isles (ouch)

You know, I thought Ladd had a good game, too. I was surprised to see him taking heat in this thread. Schmaltz was the guy that I found to be a complete liability. He was making such stupid decisions with the puck in the offensive zone, and executing so poorly, that it was killing all of our zone possession and leading to chances all the way down the ice and onto our own goal. It wasn’t even necessarily that he was a liability defensively (which we all know he is) but that he was so horrendous offensively, that it was creating chances against. Absolutely wild stuff.

 

[Bonsai Tree]

This result doesn't surprise me, I expected it and more of the same. We are way under talented, you can't get blood out of a stone. I don't know why guys on this board are upset, how could anyone not see this season coming? We have close to if not the worst goal tending, worst D and worst offence in the NHL.

The only way we win a few games is if the other team takes us lightly, we get great goal tending for a game, and we capitalize on a few turnovers here and there. It will happen but it will be unusual. I'm not upset, we are tanking and have a 40-50 point team, is what it is.

Point made. You’re right.

 

[Jakey53]

I thought Jaskin looked a lot better, at least.

Yes he did. I was really impressed with Keller. Much better on his skates, much faster, much more involved. It's for sure he wants to be traded.

 

[Jakey53]

I’m unhappy because you don’t have to lose every game by five goals in order to be the worst team in the league. We could be much better than we are and still be the worst team. That’s what upsets me a little. We could at least have an NHL caliber goaltender. Even the 40th best goalie in the world would be okay with me. But we have maybe the 90th and 130th best goalies in the world? I don’t have a real ranking and this is just an example. But my actual point is that it’s too extreme. This was too far. And I was complaining about this in early September.

I totally agree. BA killed me off as a fan, and I'm sure there are others. Until I see hope, this team has no hope of seeing any $$$ from me. Twenty years of this was bad, but there were reasons for being bad before. Being this bad was avoidable.

 

[PainForShane]

You know, I thought Ladd had a good game, too. I was surprised to see him taking heat in this thread. Schmaltz was the guy that I found to be a complete liability. He was making such stupid decisions with the puck in the offensive zone, and executing so poorly, that it was killing all of our zone possession and leading to chances all the way down the ice and onto our own goal. It wasn’t even necessarily that he was a liability defensively (which we all know he is) but that he was so horrendous offensively, that it was creating chances against. Absolutely wild stuff.

Yeah I also wonder about Schmaltz (and have been wondering since we got him) -- imo the past few years he's shown flashes but nothing consistent. But I mean... he put up points in Chicago playing with Kane, next year he's in and out of their lineup, we trade for him and Chayka immediately gives him a long term deal worth almost 6m per. "Nick Schmaltz is a hell of a player" he says. But if he were in Chicago would he even be able to stay in the lineup? Not sure. Certainly not ahead of Toews or Dach as a top 6 C, and personally I think Schmaltz would make a horrible bottom six forward. Might be another example of Chayka not evaluating talent correctly.

Personally I don't have a strong opinion on him either way, will pay more attention next game

 

[The Feckless Puck]

How did Vejmelka look? I was surprised he got an NHL start to be honest.

He looked outmatched all night. But so have all of our other goalies. Our team sucks.

Jaskin? I saw him with 2 great chances in the 2nd and I also see 3 million dollar healthy scratch.

He's been injured so I don't know how much of that is playing into things. He did look good when he went to the net front.

Will we see Korenar any time soon?

God I hope not. That kid is a sieve.

How on earth is Jan Jenik not on this roster? Maybe it's my bias but I thought he'd crack the roster for sure.
Obviously, a Czech fan too!

If you have a tire fire going in your back yard, you don't want your kid to go anywhere near it.

 

[rt]

I totally agree. BA killed me off as a fan, and I'm sure there are others. Until I see hope, this team has no hope of seeing any $$$ from me. Twenty years of this was bad, but there were reasons for being bad before. Being this bad was avoidable.

They could have addressed the goaltending issue. Signing Hutton, at all, was never even remotely okay. Picking up the phone and talking to Hutton’s representation even for a minute is gross negligence.

They have FIVE 2nd round picks. It would have been absolutely okay to trade a 3rd round pick for a half decent goaltender. That’s not counter to the rebuild. Getting smoked every single game by 4+ goals is absolutely counter to the rebuild.

Chychrun will demand out. Any progress Keller has made will be completely mitigated, and the brand-new head coach will immediately lose all credibility with his players. That’s detrimental to the rebuild. Losing a 3rd round pick is survivable. This isn’t.

 

[rt]

Yeah I also wonder about Schmaltz (and have been wondering since we got him) -- imo the past few years he's shown flashes but nothing consistent. But I mean... he put up points in Chicago playing with Kane, next year he's in and out of their lineup, we trade for him and Chayka immediately gives him a long term deal worth almost 6m per. "Nick Schmaltz is a hell of a player" he says. But if he were in Chicago would he even be able to stay in the lineup? Not sure. Certainly not ahead of Toews or Dach as a top 6 C, and personally I think Schmaltz would make a horrible bottom six forward. Might be another example of Chayka not evaluating talent correctly.

Personally I don't have a strong opinion on him either way, will pay more attention next game

I would trade Nick Schmaltz for another Johan Larsson in an instant if I could. We need to find some team that’s willing to trade some version of Larsson for Schmaltz and make that happen.

 

[Heldig]

I would trade Nick Schmaltz for another Johan Larsson in an instant if I could. We need to find some team that’s willing to trade some version of Larsson for Schmaltz and make that happen.

To Ottawa for Tierney.

 

[rt]

To Ottawa for Tierney.

If they would. Was also thinking Minny for Hartman maybe.

 

[ujju2]

Just got back / read through the thread. Glad this team still has fans... sort of?

Honestly though we played fine / well today, pretty even for the most part even though we still lost 5-1 (which is a ridiculous thing to say, but whatever). Again, this post is for people who can't the watch games on TV.

Overall:
1) Biggest surprise in my view is that Edmonton is actually a good TEAM. This narrative that Edmonton is just McD and Drai is completely wrong. Edmonton's third line (Foegele / Kassian) has some size, their fourth line of Perlini and Turris can skate as we already know, Nurse is a legitimate #1 defenseman which I had no idea about before tonight (plays big, no mistakes, not sure worth 9.5 per but easily 7 or 8m per year). And that's not even counting players like RNH, Hyman etc who are legitimate top-6 forwards and would be on any team.

The only time EDM got sustained high quality pressure at even strength was around the last 5 minutes or so of the 2nd period which incidentally didn't result in a goal. Hopefully having letdowns in the 2nd does not become a pattern for us.

Anyway, my point is that we skated mostly even with a team like this (who is also undefeated by the way), and that is better than what I expected, honestly. The 5-1 score is about what I expected, though, we are not good.

2) All of EDM's goals were started and / or finished by strong individual plays of which we had very few. First goal Foegele turns Mayo inside out (welcome to the league Mayo! more on him below), then a shortie from a partial break, McDavid had a crazy cutback move on goal 3 and then 2 more from the Edmonton power play (both through McD), not much to do there. Shots / chances were pretty even too, we were consistently getting high quality deflections all game even though none of them went in. If Jaskin hits that open net in the first and one or two of those deflections goes in it's a completely game.

Anyway EDM didn't dominate us today anywhere but on the scoreboard... and yes I realize that statement sounds ridiculous. But at 5 x 5 we traded chances mostly evenly, which in my view is all that any of us can reasonably expect.

Thoughts on individuals:
1) Ladd has easily been one of our better forwards in both home games so far -- he's driving the net, breaking up passes in the D-zone etc, just doing every single little thing out there. I'm not sure anyone anticipated this (I certainly didn't) but based on this, I have no problem at all with him wearing an A and playing 16-18 minutes a night in all situations. He is absolutely leading by example out there.

2) Vejmelka was not good today, what is most concerning is that his rebounds were consistently uncontrolled from every shot that wasn't routine. My guess is he's likely still getting used to the pace and quality of shot in this league (which would make sense). I did a deep dive on him prior to last game, he and Vanecek were basically the two top Czech goalies from since they were little kids, Vanecek was able to adjust so hopefully Vej does too. Either way Vej is probably still good enough as a stopgap until Prosvetov (or someone else) is ready, it's not like we need anyway to be good for another 3-5 years anyway.

3) It was Mayo's first game in the NHL (he took the place of Soderstrom), I literally had never heard of him before this game. At a top level, he seems like a stay at home D-man that's spent quite a few years in Tucson... and yet today he looked like a legitimate NHL top-4 defender (he was paired with Ghost which is a pairing that makes a lot of sense). Yes he got walked badly on that first goal but what I liked is that Tourigny put Ghost and Mayo right back out there immediately after allowing that first goal.

When Mayo scored in the 3rd, I was really happy for him, he played an excellent game especially considering it was his first ever game in the NHL. Would absolutely like to see more of him, if he keeps playing this well he absolutely should be in our lineup.

Anyway! Good night. See you Saturday against the Isles (ouch)

I was about to say thanks for your kind review of the Oilers. Then I noticed you have Neil as your avatar. You might be my new favourite person

Sorry to jump on your board guys, just wanted to say that. I'll see myself out.

 

[Bonsai Tree]

Well, welcome to the rebuild. We really, really need elite talent, and this is the way to get it. I cringe in my seat watching the play. I thought that I could simply tolerate a tank season, but it's hard. Reminds me of that great sports philosopher Mike Tyson, who said "Everyone has a plan until they get punched in the face." I feel punched in the face.

 

[Arizonatah Coyetis]

Who said this is our way out of it. All these picks sure in hell will not guarantee success going forward. This is the second year we picked up shit UFA's and next year will be the same. I'm sure BA can find kids that have been waived from other teams instead of these dead beats. At least we could cheer for some under dog kid instead of these over the hill washed up vets.

Insanity was the rinse and repeat we'd been doing. Even if we go through all this and end up never winning a cup, I believe we'll still be a better team in the end. Even if we end up right back where we were I'll feel still better knowing that we at least tried.

Edit: I'm so tired of what this team has been forever that I was inching ever closer to getting off of this sinking ship. Being bottom half of the league every season with no hope (EVER!) was not worth my time. Every season we could predict ahead of time that the outcome would be some version of mediocre. This is the first time I truly believe we have a chance. That's all I want. A real chance with a real effort to win. I'm just waiting for this long term investment to grow into whatever it's gonna be. Excited to see it regardless.

 

[zerekstar]

Sometimes I think we trade too much. If we could undo all the trades of the last five years and would have stood pat we no doubt would have been a much better team. I find trades exciting but a lot of times they don't work out. Even just having back what we gave for Hall would put us in a much better place. I just wish we had never gone down the Rick Toccet/Chayka road. That mistake set us back a lot but that is not solely on Toccet because we could not develop to save our lives. And one more thing, the Bunting ordeal makes me sick. Why would we not have offered him a one year deal and see how it played out? Bad move by BA

 

[Arizonatah Coyetis]

I'm sure BA can find kids that have been waived from other teams instead of these dead beats.

I'd prefer this for sure. Find some kids that you can teach some stuff to instead of the guys that have not only peaked, but are hampered by age. Veteran leadership isn't gonna do crap for this team at this point in the rebuild. At least not for wins.

 

[Mangosteen]

Coyotes pick 4, 31, 32.

This is the highest odds out come for this year is fourth. The Canadians pick will be protected it’s looking like.

 

[Mosby]

Need to 4D chess this thing and ship Kessel to Montreal so they can score some goals.

 

[XX]

And one more thing, the Bunting ordeal makes me sick. Why would we not have offered him a one year deal and see how it played out? Bad move by BA

Can't force a guy to sign. He went to Toronto and is in the top 6 of one of the best offenses in the league.

I'm giving Ghost an atta boy. Team loses 5-1 and he ends up with +1. That's not easy to do.

Feels like the team is Ghost, Keller, Crouse vs the world most nights. Chychrun has been unusually quiet.