GDT: Game 4: Coyotes @ Vegas (#2 of 4) - 2000 hrs (8 pm) - FSAZ+ ESPN+

[RemoAZ]

Offensively I thought we were pretty good considering who we were playing. Good goalie and no luck.

Defensively we're a complete mess. Can't wait to have OEL back to eat minutes.

Tocc said he wanted the Dmen more into the offense. They suck at that and are not getting back on defense fast enough to boot. Whatever the plan is there, it couldn't be working any worse. Forward play looks better. Defensively they've taken a step back.

 

[moosemeister]

Capo looked better. Still some bone headed mistakes, but shit, at least he wasn’t Goligoski and Demers.

Trade Goligoski and Demers for a GameCube with one controller and no games and give Capo and Soderstrom some game time.

 

[RemoAZ]

Thought he had a few really good shifts, actually. It was a nice response after Monday night. Tipp and pre-BA Tocc would have made sure he never saw the NHL again after Monday. Get these kids some time and see what we've got so we can make a plan for next year.

He needs to find more shots.

 

[WrinkledPossum]

Tocc said he wanted the Dmen more into the offense. They suck at that and are not getting back on defense fast enough to boot. Whatever the plan is there, it couldn't be working any worse. Forward play looks better. Defensively they've taken a step back.

It works with OEL/Chychrun/Toaster and kind of Capo. Too early to tell. Rest can't do it, too slow to get back.

Goose is especially infuriating in the Ozone. Weak af passes. Weak chip ins instead of being able to control the puck. Absolutely hate the 6 foot chip ins he does as soon as he senses danger. It's youth hockey level crap.

 

[Gurglesons]

The fact that Gologoski wanted to sign with us should have caused alarm. Not like we were a contender and he was a vet without a championship. Tippet wined and dined him and showed him the golf courses and the weather.

Goligoski's name is on the Cup for 2009 for the record.

 

[BUX7PHX]

The fact that Gologoski wanted to sign with us should have caused alarm. Not like we were a contender and he was a vet without a championship. Tippet wined and dined him and showed him the golf courses and the weather.

He was one of the top 3 D available, which was a need for us behind OEL. We traded a 5th for his rights to be able to talk with him.

Goligoski even stated that until that moment, AZ may never have been on his list. Has he been great? Probably not. Serviceable enough? Yes.

Eventually, one of these players who doesn't consider AZ as a place to go will work out. For a while, we fished with the smallest of nets to catch. At some point, when the fish get bigger, we have to cast a wide net to find these types.

 

[87turbobuick]

Comparing the #2 or 3 favorite to win the cup to our team is foolhardy. The talent gap is immense. Even with a better coach we would be a long shot for the playoffs. Dump
Kuemper to Edmonton and ride the balsa wood Raanta for the rest of the year. Although the border issues would cause a 2 week delay maybe the Oil will be desperate enough.

 

[Jakey53]

It probably peaked last season. Luckily we will have a fresh blueline in 52 more games.

A few of us were saying last year that Kuemper and Raanta made this D, and team in general look good. I thought our D was average last year and was flamed and told our D is top five. Now, that we are not getting that stand on your head goal tending, the weakness is showing. Thankfully, their expiring contracts will force BA to make moves.

 

[Jakey53]

Offensively I thought we were pretty good considering who we were playing. Good goalie and no luck.

Defensively we're a complete mess. Can't wait to have OEL back to eat minutes.

Didn't most you guys want to trade OEL? Now we see how valuable he is. OEL always plays against the other teams top lines. I hope Chick can keep on improving and take some of those tough minutes from OEL.

 

[Jakey53]

I've been really impressed with Brassard's compete. He is completely clapped out but that A really means something to him and he is trying his best to keep this team in it every night. I did not expect that out of him.

Polar opposite of Stepan.

I agree. I was pissed they gave him a A, and equally pissed that they put Keller on his line, the third line at that, which I thought was stupid. I guess I was the one who was stupid because so far it's working.

 

[Jakey53]

Well, how much closer is Tocchet to losing his job when we go 0-4 vs Vegas?

I believe RT will be here all year.

 

[MIGs Dog]

I believe RT will be here all year.

Hopefully, you only mean all season.

 

[Jakey53]

33 needs to sit a game. The coaches have to hold guys accountable and show some balls. It's about more than winning the next game.

No, it's all about winning. Having said that, if sitting is the best option then it should be done, but playing D is tough, just ask Capo. Gross and Ness are not the answer, so we are left with Bush and Soderstrom.

 

[The Feckless Puck]

No goalie tandem is going to survive high quality screened shots forever

For the record, I was actually referring to the staff that Armstrong hired to "whisper" the goalies, not the goalies themselves. Remember all those stories about our "unprecedented" coaching/advising team we put together to develop and coach goalies in the offseason?

I gotta tell you, it doesn't look like it's paying off so far.

 

[_Del_]

The fact that Gologoski wanted to sign with us should have caused alarm. Not like we were a contender and he was a vet without a championship. Tippet wined and dined him and showed him the golf courses and the weather.

He signed a five-year deal. We got four good years even he remains bad this entire year. That's pretty good for a UFA signing. Hopefully he and Demers knock off the rust and show up to play for a new contract. Might be that conditioning is an issue. I think we expected they'd both be dealt at the deadline anyway.

This year was supposed to be a development year and reshape. I'm not too worried about losing to one of the best teams in the league. It was pretty ugly at times, but it's still a long (okay, short-er) season.

Across the board effort level is much higher. Kessel can actually skate and has been effective. Keller is involved. All the new guys have good motors and are overperforming expectations so far.

As rt said, it's easier to spot the passengers when there are fewer of them.

 

[_Del_]

Didn't most you guys want to trade OEL? Now we see how valuable he is. OEL always plays against the other teams top lines. I hope Chick can keep on improving and take some of those tough minutes from OEL.

Everyone knows how valuable he can be. We're rebuilding. He could jumpstart the rebuild and give us caproom we needed at the time. He's also not a great captain, and moving on would have sent a message to the room about passengers, which he is one of too often for a $8M long-term contract.

You have to present the shallowest understanding and ignore all context to generate this kind of hottake. Sort of like, "We shouldn't fire Tippett. He's a good coach".

 

[Coyotedroppings]

We're seeing too much of last year in this game, but I still think we're having moments when we look pretty good. Worst game in the season, but I feel like this team can actually score two more goals. It's early in the season. Forgive my optimism.

Forgive? Hell I'm pleasantly SHOCKED!!!

 

[SR]

I think some of our expectations were blown away in the Sharks series. Players played hard, showed girt and tenacity which set us up for failure going into this Vegas series. We’re not a team that’s going to win or even hang with the heavy clubs (St. Louis/Vegas/Colorado) we may win a couple games against them, but they’re a better team than we are.

Now with that said, we have a lot of cap space coming off the books at the end of the year. We have seen what BA wants to do and we still have a few country club members on the roster. I think we’ll see that new brand of hockey after we see what BA does with the money and who he brings in.

Fire the coach first, though.

 

[_Del_]

Forgive? Hell I'm pleasantly SHOCKED!!!

BA is doing all the things I've been wanting for a decade, so I'm giving him lots of slack haha

Expectations should be fairly low. Everyone knew we downgraded the roster on paper. We wanted to see a culture shift, good energy, and expanded roles for young guys. We're getting all that so far.


Edit: SR beat me to it. He knows what's up!

 

[Coyotedroppings]

I guess just rooting for the progression of the kids. Chychrun sure is finding his offensive game.

Yeah? I like the way he screened Keumper instead of moving his man from the front of the net on LV's first goal.

 

[Coyotedroppings]

We're not there yet, but I think closer to being there than many here are feeling..... after this tough loss. It's early and we're not a competitor for the cup by any means yet, but improved for certain.

 

[BUX7PHX]

I agree. I was pissed they gave him a A, and equally pissed that they put Keller on his line, the third line at that, which I thought was stupid. I guess I was the one who was stupid because so far it's working.

The replacement of Soderberg with Brassard has been good. Brassard has been great at finding open ice and setting up the defense so that we can get some offensive life.

Even with the new life, our offense is still filled with a number of poorly executed moments. Every so often, the team will show a sign of great movement and spacing, but I can't tell if it is solely because opposition is tired and we are not, or if we have these moments, only for the opposing coaches to change part of their gameplan, and we keep going on using the same methods.

I just think that on paper, what Tocchet preaches makes sense, but as soon as the puck is dropped, we don't manage the games well at all with what is preached.

 

[RemoAZ]

Yeah? I like the way he screened Keumper instead of moving his man from the front of the net on LV's first goal.

We haven't had a Dman that clears the crease in...I can't remember the last one. It's been way too long.

 

[rt]

We haven't had a Dman that clears the crease in...I can't remember the last one. It's been way too long.

Closest I can think of is Schenn. He barely counts.

 

[BUX7PHX]

I think some of our expectations were blown away in the Sharks series. Players played hard, showed girt and tenacity which set us up for failure going into this Vegas series. We’re not a team that’s going to win or even hang with the heavy clubs (St. Louis/Vegas/Colorado) we may win a couple games against them, but they’re a better team than we are.

Now with that said, we have a lot of cap space coming off the books at the end of the year. We have seen what BA wants to do and we still have a few country club members on the roster. I think we’ll see that new brand of hockey after we see what BA does with the money and who he brings in.

Fire the coach first, though.

Agreed. I think we kind of swapped out some pieces, but in the end, it is the same song and dance.

Pitlick replaces Grabner. Less speed, same energy, a little more bite. But nothing more elevated than that.

Cags for Hinostroza. Brassard and Larsson replace Soderberg and Stepan. We did not really upgrade, and while we see a little more zip, it is all of 4 games into a season. If we still have this zip 35 games in, okay, we have a little more fight in us to work with. I don't think we have a country club, but the staff does not challenge the players enough, and that is where complacency comes in.

Just out of curiosity, we know who Armstrong brought in, and we were aware that at least one player in the $3-6 M per year AAV would be traded to get 2 or 3 bottom 6 types in. Would Armstrong and Chayka's lists be extremely different? Personally, i think that Larsson, Brassard and Pitlick would have been high on Chayka's list, along with Maroon. I don't believe Hayden would have been on his list.

Prout, maybe? Or maybe the Stepan trade could have been a little different to add a bottom 6 and a 4th round pick?

Probably not worth getting answers, but i don't think that the lineup between Armstrong's pickups and Chayka's (if still present) would have been that terribly different at all.