Speculation: Free Agent Frenzy Part V: Gorton is on McLeod Nine.

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Why would we have heard about it? Gorton's forte has not been on the side of telegraphing his moves.

Where have we heard this from aside from reading it around here? That is pure speculation.

Krieder is a very valuable trade chip whose value may never be higher. Why is there no speculation on him being traded? Or Zib? Or Henke? There are tons of reasons to explore moving them also.

Why is that safe to say? Because they did not go out and sign him to a 5 year deal? They just signed him for two years, not one. Maybe they want to see what they have without AV running the ship, so that they can make educated decisions about the future of the team and the players?

IF his forte has been not telegraphing moves he hasn't been very good at it. Outside of the Brass trade, we've basically seen everything else coming. His 2 bigger trades (Stepan and McDonagh) are things we heard about weeks in advance to them actually happening.

Kreider very well may be someone they end up moving later this year, but he's already signed and is only under contract for the next 2 seasons. Ditto Zib except hes signed for longer. They've committed to those guys, they may not want to commit to Hayes.
 
Why are people (in general, not directed at you) so insistent that Hayes is not a part of the future or that the Rangers do not want to sign him long term eventually? Depending on how the rebuild is going and how the prospects are progressing, in a few years Hayes would still be a solid contributor and fairly young. And at the center position. I am not so sure that players like Zib, Krieder, Hayes or Vesey are not part of the future.
I actually though that last year we finally got a glimpse of what he is: a third line center with size.
 
IF his forte has been not telegraphing moves he hasn't been very good at it. Outside of the Brass trade, we've basically seen everything else coming. His 2 bigger trades (Stepan and McDonagh) are things we heard about weeks in advance to them actually happening.

The McDonagh was a very different situation.

I don't remember hearing anything about the Stepan trade—other than talk here that was not based on any actual knowledge of what the FO was thinking.
 
The McDonagh was a very different situation.

I don't remember hearing anything about the Stepan trade—other than talk here that was not based on any actual knowledge of what the FO was thinking.

It was reported by the media before the trade freeze happened during the expansion draft.

Multiple people had it.

Same thing with Hayes, we've heard the rumblings that the Rangers may not want to commit to him (McKenzie said this himself in a podcast prior to the TDL) and this was reiterated by Brooks a few weeks ago, plus with the season he had his value may never be higher.

FTR, I'd rather keep him around until someone forces him out, but I can see the logic and value in trading him.
 
I actually though that last year we finally got a glimpse of what he is: a third line center with size.
One that could still develop into a 2nd line center. And if "all" he is is a third line center that also scores 20 goals, well those do not grow on trees either
 
IF his forte has been not telegraphing moves he hasn't been very good at it. Outside of the Brass trade, we've basically seen everything else coming. His 2 bigger trades (Stepan and McDonagh) are things we heard about weeks in advance to them actually happening.
Who did not know that McD was being traded? Everyone could see the Stepan trade coming. At least I think. So not sure those are examples of how we around here would have heard about them not wanting to commit to Hayes.
Kreider very well may be someone they end up moving later this year, but he's already signed and is only under contract for the next 2 seasons. Ditto Zib except hes signed for longer. They've committed to those guys, they may not want to commit to Hayes.
And if they do sign Hayes to a two year deal, that means that they are committed to him? They why do you believe that they are not committed to Vesey, who also just signed a two year deal?
 
Who did not know that McD was being traded? Everyone could see the Stepan trade coming. At least I think. So not sure those are examples of how we around here would have heard about them not wanting to commit to Hayes.

And if they do sign Hayes to a two year deal, that means that they are committed to him? They why do you believe that they are not committed to Vesey, who also just signed a two year deal?

2 years isn't much of a commitment.

We shouldn't really compare the 2 anyway. Vesey doesn't have a ton of value, Hayes does. I don't think signing hayes to a 2 year deal would be very smart. He needs to get either 5+ or be moved.
 
Pay him now a bit above market value as hes coming into his own and the team has the space and save when the team is competing. Going to cost more to sign long term in 2 years then it will if you sign him now.
Having come 1 year off of from AV's defensive system, he will only get better. $$ he is worth is only going up. Lock him up now.
 
Skjei, as it stands, is the only top 4 NHL LHD in the organization. Pay the man. 6 years, 30 million. Buys three UFA years.
I don't really see the appeal of going long-term on Skjei in the $5 million range. The downside is obvious. What's the upside? Are we protecting ourselves from him becoming an $8 million defenseman? Do you see that in Skjei?
 
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I don't really see the appeal of going long-term on Skjei in the $5 million range. The downside is obvious. What's the upside? Are we protecting ourselves from him becoming an $8 million defenseman? Do you see that in Skjei?
The upside is having a really solid second pairing d-man locked up for a deal that's fair today and extremely favorable tomorrow.
 
I'd think with both Hayes and Skjei the term is somewhat of a valuable commodity whether to the Rangers or on the trade market.

Some teams have trouble signing players to longer term even when they want to, I think giving both of them relatively long term, front loaded turns them into something like a Stepan or a Brassard where the team could keep them or move them if they can find the right partner at some point.
 
Skjei, as it stands, is the only top 4 NHL LHD in the organization. Pay the man. 6 years, 30 million. Buys three UFA years.

The sentiment is correct, the figures are a bit inflated. 6/30 is not necessary. 5/22 is about right. Good for player and team.
 
I don't really see the appeal of going long-term on Skjei in the $5 million range. The downside is obvious. What's the upside? Are we protecting ourselves from him becoming an $8 million defenseman? Do you see that in Skjei?

Yea I said this a couple of months ago. I'd just bridge him fully expecting the AAV of a long term deal we give him now versus one we give him in two years wouldn't be much different. It'll go up a little bit due to cap inflation and buying less RFA years but I don't see a scenario where he would be commanding a huge amount in any case. If the talk is that he's worth 5M now how would he get much more after a 2 year bridge deal? Unless he's putting up like 50 points a year it's not like it's going to jump above 6M for him. For that small of a difference I'd prefer to delay the decision.
 
I don't really see the appeal of going long-term on Skjei in the $5 million range. The downside is obvious. What's the upside? Are we protecting ourselves from him becoming an $8 million defenseman? Do you see that in Skjei?
There is no downside, he is a top 4 Dman, this is the money for a top 4 D. The upside is that he is not a done product, he can improve.
 
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Im of the thinking that the Rangers really shouldn't commit to anybody long-term right now. Part of that is simply where the organization is at this point in time, but the bigger reason is I really don't think we have any young players that warrant a long-term commitment. People are talking Hayes and Skjei in this thread - nice players, evolving players, but neither strike me as slam dunk cogs in the future at this point in time. Another reason is, unless something goes really haywire, the Rangers sure seem like they don't need to be overly concerned about cap space anytime soon. Give them 2 year bridge deals -- if they prove to be $7M players then when we could've had them for $5M, so be it. Thats not a terrible problem to have.
 
Hayes is a risky player to trade. He's a guy who could just keep getting better. I wouldn't give him up for a mediocre return. I still see some upside there, and would expect to get paid based on that. No reason to make a trade that doesn't 100% help the team.
 
If they bridge Skjei (or Hayes for that matter) and leave him with one RFA year left, he could just at that point, sign his qualifier (which if you guys are correct will be about what he'd get for that year anyway by signing longer term then), or go through arbitration, take the one year and in either case become a UFA the year after.

Do they really want to take that chance or just sign him now likely through his prime, buying up some UFA years, save a little on the back end of the cap hit, while front loading the deal so it's more attractive on the trade market for certain teams?

I guess I must be missing something but bridging Skjei or Hayes seems to me like there is no upside to doing so other than they save some cap space now, when essentially they don't need it, and if they do need it within the next year or two they could likely trade either of those players at that time to gain that space and get an pretty fair haul back in the process.

Hypothetically say next off-season they need that space, is Skjei or Hayes on a 5 year ~25M total deal that is at that point a 4 year deal that has an AVV of ~5M but a total salary left of say 18M really going to be something that is not attractive to several teams versus them spending possibly more in real money or in AVV by going the UFA route for a similar player, should that player even want to sign with them?

Term and a reduced salary per cap hit is a thing the Rangers can get, two things that are also attractive to certain teams that have trouble in either or both of those areas. They've already shown it can be done with both Stepan and Brassard, the NHL's landscape has not changed that much since those moves.
 
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The upside is having a really solid second pairing d-man locked up for a deal that's fair today and extremely favorable tomorrow.
So let's say he signs a two year deal that takes him up to one year from UFA. What's the worst case scenario in your mind? What's the maximum they're going to have to shell out to keep him?
 
So let's say he signs a two year deal that takes him up to one year from UFA. What's the worst case scenario in your mind? What's the maximum they're going to have to shell out to keep him?
How much do you think it’ll take on a 2 year deal? IIRC, Matt Cane’s model had him somewhere around $3.5M.
 
I don’t agree at all. The Namestnikov signing gives them the flexibility to deal Hayes if a good enough offer comes up.
How so? Namestnikov has proved absolutely nothing when not on the top line in Tampa. Hayes has shown much more than he did.

Which is not to say "untradeable". There is a price point for everything and everyone.
 
How so? Namestnikov has proved absolutely nothing when not on the top line in Tampa. Hayes has shown much more than he did.

Which is not to say "untradeable". There is a price point for everything and everyone.

Nobody said Namestnikov is on the same level as Hayes. It's about having someone to replace him during our rebuild if a good offer comes along. I love how people don't want to replace Hayes with Namestnikov but at the same time are penciling in Chytil centering our 2nd line :laugh:
 
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