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Speculation: Free Agent Frenzy Part III - Will EK stay or will EK go?

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Steve Kournianos said:
I love Hajek, FWIW. That kid carried brutal teams. Like AV gave all his coaches defense tips.

I'm thinking/hoping Chytil, Hajek, Andersson, Kravtsov, Pionk, Skjei, Shestyorkin, Buchnevich end up as core guys who don't go anywhere. Think Rykov and Sjalin are my surprise types like Stralman. And I like Ronning's compete level. Think he has a nice career in the NHL.

The rest may just end up being trade bait or Hartford regulars. Always turns out that way. The key is selling high, which the Rangers rarely do.
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What are your thoughts on Howden and Miller?
 
Ola said:
Fact is — unless either or both of Howden and Hajak really becomes really good NHLers for us — we didn’t get 2x value for Ryan McDonagh AND JT Miller as we got for rental Rick Nash. That is just not good.

None of the great Ds have hit the UFA market. And it’s very likely that none will either.

Further, everyone is complaining on McD having regressed. Well not in his skating, but sure, he didn’t play his best hockey with a broken hand...

If you are patient — you are going to get a really good return for a No 1 D over some kind of not so long period. If Hajak can become a really good top 2-3D, Howden can become a really solid top 9 forward, sure the trade is OK. But if not, it’s a complete and utter night mare of a trade. We would have traded our captain and No 1 D and a 50-60 pts young forward with an edge for an in essence high 2nd round pick and a high 3rd round pick.

So it comes down to Hajak and/or Howden. Or Namestnikov who clowned out his first months here, but who knows.
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Ultimately I do agree with you. Gorton may have “done fine” given the circumstances but that doesn’t mean he is blameless.

There is a ton to be optimistic about RE Hajek, Howden, AND Lundkvist. They are all really solid to good prospects. But realistically as we sit here 4+ mos removed from the trade, it’s not unreasonable to fear that Gorton failed to get a player as good as McD OR Miller which is a pretty poor look. Lot of hockey to be played though, as cliche as that is...
 
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HatTrick Swayze said:
Ultimately I do agree with you. Gorton may have “done fine” given the circumstances but that doesn’t mean he is blameless.

There is a ton to be optimistic about RE Hajek, Howden, AND Lundkvist. They are all really solid to good prospects. But realistically as we sit here 4+ mos removed from the trade, it’s not unreasonable to fear that Gorton failed to get a player as good as McD OR Miller which is a pretty poor look. Lot of hockey to be played though, as cliche as that is...
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How many times has a high level player been traded because a rebuild is coming and the team trading him gets equal value? Not excusing Gorton, but I feel like that never happens.
 
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I think the Karlsson trade (if it ever goes down) will be a good indication of what McDs value was.

Karlsson is 2 tiers above McD I'd say.
 
GregSirico said:
How many times has a high level player been traded because a rebuild is coming and the team trading him gets equal value? Not excusing Gorton, but I feel like that never happens.
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I don’t know off the top of my head, but yes obviously the leverage is tough. Could they really have not made the call on McD last summer? The inclusion of Miller is the real aspect that takes the deal downward for me, not to rehash the same argument. Regardless of “character” he is a 50-60 pt player with RFA years left...hardly a throw in and I don’t think appropriate value was returned.
 
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Steve Kournianos said:
Well I disagree with everything you said here. Cirelli was their best forward on a deep Syracuse team, produced as an NHL rookie and appeared in every playoff game for a Cup contender. Don't think Howden is an NHL player next year, let alone one that plays over 13 mins a game during a Cup run. Think Tampa is very happy they kept him.

Both Andersson and Cirelli are two-way centers that can finish, except Cirelli is faster. Both are 200-foot competitors. Aside from not being twins, they share a lot of similarities.

I would rather have Cirelli, TBH. Quickness as a center is the tipping point for me.
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Cirelli is a nice player. That said, picking him over Andersson is very subjective...a little like picking Svechnikov over Dahlin.
 
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It’s easy to say you would have liked better players in return for a trade. But unless there is evidence that Gorton turned down a better player it’s a tad pointless. There is no proof that any of those players were ever available or an option. Second guessing trades even in hindsight is much more difficult than the draft
 
GregSirico said:
I think it was fair. I wouldn't say OUTSTANDING like we robbed TB and I don't think we got taken to the cleaners either.
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McDonagh has done himself any favors with the way hes played the last 2 years.

Not terrible, but not outstanding either.

I think that we as a fan base expected more because he was the best of a bad lot.

But there a sea of GMs that see who he is and how hes played and what he would expect on a new deal and as much as EK65 is guiding g gia own destination, I bet there were quite a few GMs unwilling to even make an offer for Ryan.
 
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HatTrick Swayze said:
Ultimately I do agree with you. Gorton may have “done fine” given the circumstances but that doesn’t mean he is blameless.

There is a ton to be optimistic about RE Hajek, Howden, AND Lundkvist. They are all really solid to good prospects. But realistically as we sit here 4+ mos removed from the trade, it’s not unreasonable to fear that Gorton failed to get a player as good as McD OR Miller which is a pretty poor look. Lot of hockey to be played though, as cliche as that is...
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Now this I disagree with.

With where the Rangers are at right now it's all about compiling as many assets as possible and getting as many cheap controllable players as possible. It's not crazy to assume that Hajek/Howden on ELC's or even 2nd contracts are going to be more valuable than Miller/McDonagh on their current deals, particularly the latter as much as I hate to say it.
 
Go Away Staal said:
Now this I disagree with.

With where the Rangers are at right now it's all about compiling as many assets as possible and getting as many cheap controllable players as possible. It's not crazy to assume that Hajek/Howden on ELC's or even 2nd contracts are going to be more valuable than Miller/McDonagh on their current deals, particularly the latter as much as I hate to say it.
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That’s a slightly different point than what I was making, should have clarified. My point was meant to be around upside (not forward projection of value to the NYR), specifically JG not getting enough on that front from 2 prime assets.

Disappointing to be looking at our prospect pool right now and not seeing anyone with more than an outside shot at 1D potential. Ditto Howden (and I guess Namestnikov) vs a 50-60pt Miller. You can argue he has that potential, but for me it’s a bit too remote based on the package given.
 
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Steve Kournianos said:
I would trade the entire McDonagh/Miller return for only Sergachev or Point. Stars over stockpile.

But that's just me.
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Don’t think you in your infinite wisdom overvalue McD? Many had done it prior to the trade even though we’ve seen indications with poor decision making and execution that would be very questionable of 1D. Most of us were able to adjust our expectations closer to market. Did McD played so well for TBL to question market? Not really - he played like a good 2nd pair guy. And look at all offseason signings and extensions. And look at McD extension. Well under $8m that seems to be the market for a franchise 1D.

Now to the trade: let’s say hypothetically Gorton asked for Sergachev or Point and was refused by Yzerman. What does he do now? He can 1) not trade, 2)trade with another team for a package he think has the best return or 3) continue to negotiate until he gets something that is the best return same as in 2) but with TBL. What other genius move or negotiation tactic Gorton missed?
 
Hajek will be a very good defense men. He will be head and shoulders above Mac in the 2019 season.
 
Pavel Buchnevich said:
I wouldn't agree with the characterization that he's a very, very good prospect. Tampa was willing to let him go. Weren't willing to let Foote or Sergachyov go. Who ranks him as very, very good? Because I haven't seen it, unless its coming from a Rangers-related source. And even if he was very, very good instead of elite, we've acquired a lot of those types of prospects recently. We need elite players. Same problem this team had with the past generation, aside from the goalie. As I've mentioned, its unfair to Hajek that you are making him the center-piece of trading away your best player for the past five years. The team is completely setting him up to fail.

I think the neutral-zone is important, but I think there's a big mistake in overrating its importance. There are goals in two of the zones, the other is the neutral zone. I think there are things the new staff could implement in regards to our NZ tactics and I think its important to have some players who are good in the neutral zone, but what wins Stanley Cups are having the offensive and defensive difference makers. The Penguins, Hawks, Kings weren't the dynasties they were the last decade due to their neutral zone play. They were the dynasties they were because of the elite players they had. It upsets me when the most complimentary thing our GM can say about a player he drafted in the first round is that he moves the puck out of the zone well.
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Seriously bro come on. There are prospects someteams wont let go and tb had thered. If there was a better offer out there gorton would have taken it. If he waited then the offers would have gotten worse. Would you rather he walk out the door like JT.

We basically got 2 top 4 d and a middle 6 center in the trade. McD is on a downhill slope and will never be what he was. Gorton got a good deal. You seem to lead the charge of the type of poster I ranted on earlier.

And yes I'm hammered again.
 
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