Speculation: Free Agent Frenzy Part III - Will EK stay or will EK go?

[TheGuarantee]

https://nypost.com/2018/07/07/how-erik-karlsson-represents-dilemma-rebuilding-rangers-face/

No thanks

 

[NYRFAN218]

That's literally just the 6 teams with fewer ROW than us last year, plus the Islanders. I'd be very surprised if the Canucks don't improve to a bubble team this year. Buffalo, Detroit and Arizona will improve too, although it's questionable how much.

I really have no handle on what the Rangers will do in the standings next year, barring any roster changes, though. I honestly could see them finishing anywhere from a wild card playoff spot to last in the conference. No idea.

Yeah, it can really go any direction for me. Looking at the team on paper, there's a lot of things they lack such as game breakers both up front and on D but I also don't see a team that's bottom 3 or maybe even 5 in the league tbh. I think a lot depends on how well does Georgiev/backup play as well as how often, does Brendan Smith bounce back into the player he was when he was first acquired, and do Lias/Chytil both make a smooth jump into the NHL and contribute.

Kreider - Mika - Buch
Namestnikov - Chytil - Zucc
Spooner - Hayes - Fast
Vesey - Lias - Beleskey/Lindqvist/Meskanen/Etc with whoever being the extra forward

Skjei - Shattenkirk
Smith - Pionk
Staal - DeAngelo
Claesson

Henrik
Georgiev

They could use another forward either via cap dump or free agency but that looks like the team and just looking at the names, I don't think it's worst in the league or near worst in the league. Great? No, but having a new coach with a new system where they don't look like lost souls running around the defensive zone should help. I'm just not sold on them being the worst of the worst but I generally agree it could be anywhere from wild card spot to convincingly out of the playoffs.

 

[Chaels Arms]

Yeah, it can really go any direction for me. Looking at the team on paper, there's a lot of things they lack such as game breakers both up front and on D but I also don't see a team that's bottom 3 or maybe even 5 in the league tbh. I think a lot depends on how well does Georgiev/backup play as well as how often, does Brendan Smith bounce back into the player he was when he was first acquired, and do Lias/Chytil both make a smooth jump into the NHL and contribute.

Kreider - Mika - Buch
Namestnikov - Chytil - Zucc
Spooner - Hayes - Fast
Vesey - Lias - Beleskey/Lindqvist/Meskanen/Etc with whoever being the extra forward

Skjei - Shattenkirk
Smith - Pionk
Staal - DeAngelo
Claesson

Henrik
Georgiev

They could use another forward either via cap dump or free agency but that looks like the team and just looking at the names, I don't think it's worst in the league or near worst in the league. Great? No, but having a new coach with a new system where they don't look like lost souls running around the defensive zone should help. I'm just not sold on them being the worst of the worst but I generally agree it could be anywhere from wild card spot to convincingly out of the playoffs.

Plus, keep in mind the Rangers have yet to use their cap space as a weapon. Even if we're taking on a bad contract that player might still be good enough to force another player down the roster.

There's also no way we don't add or sign another veteran D man which, again, will push everybody down a slot.

Not having McD has left a giant gap in the D corps, there's no doubt about it. I still don't think the roster looks terrible.

 

[Kakko]

At the end of the day it depends largely on how the kids perform. If Chytil and Andersson come in as 60 point guys (certainly not expecting it, but not impossible), this is a completely different team than if they're not ready. I'm not expecting anything going into the season. That includes expecting to suck.

 

[Leetch3]

I’m sorry, but I fundamentally disagree with that approach. Everything you could hope to draft by tanking for ten years is starring us right in the face. Play the kids next year with Karlsson as a mentor and continue drafting the next few years. The last thing you want, in my opinion, is to try to develop these kids in a losing environment. That is the quickest route to an Edmonton or Buffalo.

i gotta laugh at the dramatic reactions like this. told to not make a 'go for it now' move one time and it gets turned into we are never going to sign another free agent or try to win ever again. we aren't going to trade everything and anything for karlsson today so that means we are the oilers and sabres

the rebuild or whatever you want to call it is more about a change in philosophy and team management than draft picks and you are looking to throw away that plan and go back to doing things the way we always have for the first shiny object waved in front of your face cause this guy is different and this guy is special....we've said that before every big star we've gone after. with the exception of messier the first time, they are never different and they are never special. the mentality has worked 1 time in 78 years

 

[SA16]

Karlsson is not a go for it now move. That is why he will get an 8 year extension. He's a go for it over the next 9 years type of move.

 

[KOVALEV022473]

i gotta laugh at the dramatic reactions like this. told to not make a 'go for it now' move one time and it gets turned into we are never going to sign another free agent or try to win ever again. we aren't going to trade everything and anything for karlsson today so that means we are the oilers and sabres

the rebuild or whatever you want to call it is more about a change in philosophy and team management than draft picks and you are looking to throw away that plan and go back to doing things the way we always have for the first shiny object waved in front of your face cause this guy is different and this guy is special....we've said that before every big star we've gone after. with the exception of messier the first time, they are never different and they are never special. the mentality has worked 1 time in 78 years

Lol. Did you even read that post?

 

[KOVALEV022473]

Karlsson is not a go for it now move. That is why he will get an 8 year extension. He's a go for it over the next 9 years type of move.

Thank you.

 

[DutchShamrock]

Maybe its apples to oranges but Rick Nash was supposed to be this amazing super star that was the missing piece. 28 years old, no signs of dropping off. No major injuries. Ended with an 8 year contract at $7.8m per.

Erik Karlsson is elite, down year (relative term) whether it's the ankle or the team. 28 years old, some injuries, not routine. Looking at 7 or 8 years, after he turns 29, $11-12m per.

Call me gun shy, but you can't just deny concerns. You can't say there aren't similarities or chances EK becomes a shell of his former self while collecting insane cash. There's a potential bidding war. This team is 2-3 years away before the piece are ready to even open the window let alone contend. Nash was only remotely close to a star for 2-3 years and he at least had the team in its stride. But this time it'll be different with Karlsson, right?

I don't see how this is even a conversation with this current team. Pump the breaks. Let these guys marinate a bit. Let the Russians sort out the cease. Have the Girardi and Staal contracts end. Tend to the cupboard 1 more year. Crosby, Malkin and Ovechkin lose the same battle to age that every star loses. TB and Toronto face the cap burdens of perennial contention. Just swim with the current for 2 more years. This is not the time for bold acquisitions.

 

[GeorgeKaplan]

Maybe its apples to oranges but Rick Nash was supposed to be this amazing super star that was the missing piece. 28 years old, no signs of dropping off. No major injuries. Ended with an 8 year contract at $7.8m per.

Erik Karlsson is elite, down year (relative term) whether it's the ankle or the team. 28 years old, some injuries, not routine. Looking at 7 or 8 years, after he turns 29, $11-12m per.

Call me gun shy, but you can't just deny concerns. You can't say there aren't similarities or chances EK becomes a shell of his former self while collecting insane cash. There's a potential bidding war. This team is 2-3 years away before the piece are ready to even open the window let alone contend. Nash was only remotely close to a star for 2-3 years and he at least had the team in its stride. But this time it'll be different with Karlsson, right?

I don't see how this is even a conversation with this current team. Pump the breaks. Let these guys marinate a bit. Let the Russians sort out the cease. Have the Girardi and Staal contracts end. Tend to the cupboard 1 more year. Crosby, Malkin and Ovechkin lose the same battle to age that every star loses. TB and Toronto face the cap burdens of perennial contention. Just swim with the current for 2 more years. This is not the time for bold acquisitions.

Karlsson isn’t really comparable at all to the Nash IMO

 

[TheTakedown]

I mean Buch, Georgiev, Pionk and a lottery protected 2019 #1 is something I'd consider.

Still don't think Gorton has any interest in trading for Karlsson though.

I'd absolutely do this trade. I have to agree with Brooks here. That's all the pieces Ottawa needs for a quick rebuild.

If the rangers want to get that 1st back, they can trade zuccarello for one.

 

[broadwayblue]

I'm not even saying we should get Karlsson. This is more that I'm against trading every proven NHL player we have for picks.

Karlsson might become an option if he forces himself here. We'll see how it plays out. Maybe Ottawa ends up waiting until the deadline as well.

I'm not suggesting we trade every player for picks. Identify who is part of the long term core and who is part of the transition. Move anyone that is not critical to the future of this team. It can be for picks or prospects or younger roster players. But again, it's all about asset management. If you don't see player X as part of your team in 2 years or don't plan on re-signing him next summer you should be looking to see what you can get for him now.

 

[duhmetreE]

Maybe its apples to oranges but Rick Nash was supposed to be this amazing super star that was the missing piece. 28 years old, no signs of dropping off. No major injuries. Ended with an 8 year contract at $7.8m per.

Erik Karlsson is elite, down year (relative term) whether it's the ankle or the team. 28 years old, some injuries, not routine. Looking at 7 or 8 years, after he turns 29, $11-12m per.

Call me gun shy, but you can't just deny concerns. You can't say there aren't similarities or chances EK becomes a shell of his former self while collecting insane cash. There's a potential bidding war. This team is 2-3 years away before the piece are ready to even open the window let alone contend. Nash was only remotely close to a star for 2-3 years and he at least had the team in its stride. But this time it'll be different with Karlsson, right?

I don't see how this is even a conversation with this current team. Pump the breaks. Let these guys marinate a bit. Let the Russians sort out the cease. Have the Girardi and Staal contracts end. Tend to the cupboard 1 more year. Crosby, Malkin and Ovechkin lose the same battle to age that every star loses. TB and Toronto face the cap burdens of perennial contention. Just swim with the current for 2 more years. This is not the time for bold acquisitions.

Rick Nash was straight up dominating his first 10-15 games. . Truly, beast mode.... until the concussion... which then turned into concussions. He was never the same after that.

Karlsson had an 'off' year, coming off an injury, on a terrible team, in a bad situation while losing his child. I'd give him the benefit of the doubt.

 

[HatTrick Swayze]

Karlsson is not a go for it now move. That is why he will get an 8 year extension. He's a go for it over the next 9 years type of move.

It’s possible. I don’t think it’s as black and white as you paint it though.

I remember when MSL would “easily” be elite for several more years because he relied on his smarts and was a gym rat.

Or how Brad Richards IQ would keep him in the league as a useful player through his contract, even if other aspects declined.

The aging curve is different for everyone. EK is as good as a bet as there has been lately, and I could handle taking that gamble with cap space and $, but it still carries a decent amount of risk.

 

[broadwayblue]

People just love to go after the big UFAs. It's sexy. But it rarely works out...and to do so when your team stinks is just folly.

 

[duhmetreE]

It’s possible. I don’t think it’s as black and white as you paint it though.

I remember when MSL would “easily” be elite for several more years because he relied on his smarts and was a gym rat.

Or how Brad Richards IQ would keep him in the league as a useful player through his contract, even if other aspects decline.

The aging curve is different for everyone. EK is as good as a bet as there has been lately, and I could handle taking that risk with cap space and $, but it still carries risk.

MSL was 39 years old... Comparing him to a 28 year old is silly

Brad Richards had all the warnings of a player that could fall off a cliff... The type of player you need to be weary of after 30.

 

[HatTrick Swayze]

MSL was 39 years old... Comparing him to a 28 year old is silly

Brad Richards had all the warnings of a player that could fall off a cliff... The type of player you need to be weary of after 30.

In hindsight sure.

The amount of posts at the time making justification after justification to rationalize the short term bliss could fill a book.

EK has more risk than is being acknowledged is my only point. Could make your exact same post five years from now about how obvious it was given his serious ankle injury, past achilles injury, etc.

 

[NikC]

Maybe its apples to oranges but Rick Nash was supposed to be this amazing super star that was the missing piece. 28 years old, no signs of dropping off. No major injuries. Ended with an 8 year contract at $7.8m per.

Erik Karlsson is elite, down year (relative term) whether it's the ankle or the team. 28 years old, some injuries, not routine. Looking at 7 or 8 years, after he turns 29, $11-12m per.

Call me gun shy, but you can't just deny concerns. You can't say there aren't similarities or chances EK becomes a shell of his former self while collecting insane cash. There's a potential bidding war. This team is 2-3 years away before the piece are ready to even open the window let alone contend. Nash was only remotely close to a star for 2-3 years and he at least had the team in its stride. But this time it'll be different with Karlsson, right?

I don't see how this is even a conversation with this current team. Pump the breaks. Let these guys marinate a bit. Let the Russians sort out the cease. Have the Girardi and Staal contracts end. Tend to the cupboard 1 more year. Crosby, Malkin and Ovechkin lose the same battle to age that every star loses. TB and Toronto face the cap burdens of perennial contention. Just swim with the current for 2 more years. This is not the time for bold acquisitions.

Rick Nash received several concussions as a ranger... his career is ending because of it.

 

[GeorgeKaplan]

In hindsight sure.

The amount of posts at the time making justification after justification to rationalize the short term bliss could fill a book.

EK has more risk than is being acknowledged is my only point. Could make your exact same post five years from now about how obvious it was given his serious ankle injury, past achilles injury, etc.

I think the difference with Karlsson’s ankle injuries is that he still played 30+ minutes a night, and carried a team that had no business getting there to game 7 overtime of the ECF on one leg

 

[AlternateSideParking]

This so-called rebuild has yet to produce or fetch a player or prospect with legitimate superstar potential. Lots of good prospects but nothing close to a franchise changer (although Kravtsov has that potential).

As long as Gordie Clark is running the draft, no way I ask for more picks from Tampa.

The Rangers should be the ones going after Karlsson. Skilled puck movers age a lot better than the shot blockers. Dorion is a fool. Yzerman isn't.

To me, the answer is right in front of them.

 

[Dr. Ogrodnick]

Rick Nash received several concussions as a ranger... his career is ending because of it.

The Rangers also went to a cup finals and an ECF with Nash, would have been 2 ECFs if AV didn't completely blow the Ottawa series.

 

[bobbop]

One of the reasons that those states are tax free is because they get more funds back from the federal government than they send. The states with state income taxes tend to get less back then they send and they have to tax thier residents more. I don’t like paying taxes but I don’t applaud states that take more then they give. The fact that it helps them to sign guys on better deals is just the damn cherry on top of a crap sundae.

Come live in a low tax state and you will get a completely different perspective on the federal government.

 

[Pavel Buchnevich]

If Gorton is actually thinking what was in that Brooks article, this organization is in big trouble.

How could someone think Lindgren is untouchable but Zibanejad and Buchnevich aren't? By all means, they should all be available to be traded. We suck, and none of them are McDavid, but leaving out two of your best players in favor of a picked out of a hat group of prospects? Makes no sense. Thats not a rational thought, and I'd hope thats just Brooks speculating more than actually being told thats the group of players who are untouchable and the group who aren't.

 

[Amazing Kreiderman]

Nah. They are related. They're actually triplets. The third one plays in San Jose.

Their half-brother signed an extension in Washington

 

[aufheben]

People just love to go after the big UFAs. It's sexy. But it rarely works out...and to do so when your team stinks is just folly.

This isn't really a normal situation. The guy is one of the best players in the world.