Proposal: Fowler to NJ

[Number1RedWingsFan52]

I wouldn't brag about those 2 NHL assists. Fortunate at best IMO. Is he going to be in the AHL next year? That should be a good indication of whether he's got the goods. Gotta admit, his OHL offensive totals aren't that impressive. Am I missing something?



Based on what? Why would Fowler "test the market" if he gets exactly what he wants from NJ. You've gotta stop sabotaging threads involving players you're interested in. I don't even think Fowler would be a fit in NJ, but you're being ridiculous when you say Fowler will not re-sign in NJ and, thus, they'll only have him for 2 years.

Bottom line is New Jersey doesn't have the pieces that BM would be seeking for Fowler, Zacha is nothing more then futures right now and BM wants a top 6 established LW right now not futures like Zacha that might or might not help right now. New Jersey has a great Goalie in Cory Schneider no denying that and their D is pretty decent as well but their forward core still needs a lot to be desired right now. and If stating a fact means that i'm sabotaging a thread then so be it.

 

[mytduxfan*]

Bottom line is New Jersey doesn't have the pieces that BM would be seeking for Fowler, Zacha is nothing more then futures right now and BM wants a top 6 established LW right now not futures like Zacha that might or might not help right now. New Jersey has a great Goalie in Cory Schneider no denying that and their D is pretty decent as well but their forward core still needs a lot to be desired right now. and If stating a fact means that i'm sabotaging a thread then so be it.

Where is the facts in this?

That's a lot to give up for 2 years of Fowler, I seriously doubt that Fowler would be willing to resign with New Jersey he will want to test the market in 2 years. Devil fans aren't going to like this.

So you know for a "fact" that Fowler won't re-sign in NJ. How'd you get that information?

The argument presented above is a completely different argument to the one presented in your OP. NJ not having the pieces is a legitimate point to make. Saying that Fowler won't re-sign in NJ is pure ass-gas and a feeble attempt to sabotage a thread where the discussion surrounds a player you're interested in.

 

[Number1RedWingsFan52]

Where is the facts in this?



So you know for a "fact" that Fowler won't re-sign in NJ. How'd you get that information?

The argument presented above is a completely different argument to the one presented in your OP. NJ not having the pieces is a legitimate point to make. Saying that Fowler won't re-sign in NJ is pure ass-gas and a feeble attempt to sabotage a thread where the discussion surrounds a player you're interested in.

I was up home in Detroit a few years ago, He trains in the offseason with the Detroit Red Wings known fact and he was interviewed and said that his dream and desire one day is to come home and play for the Red Wings that's his life long dream not saying that he's coming to Detroit but that he would like to one day it was an interview i watch a Red Wings practice game and Cam Fowler was up there training as well. If he's moved to the Devils and agrees to reup great doesn't matter it just matters what the best situation is for him.

 

[mytduxfan*]

I was up home in Detroit a few years ago, He trains in the offseason with the Detroit Red Wings known fact and he was interviewed and said that his dream and desire one day is to come home and play for the Red Wings that's his life long dream not saying that he's coming to Detroit but that he would like to one day it was an interview i watch a Red Wings practice game and Cam Fowler was up there training as well. If he's moved to the Devils and agrees to reup great doesn't matter it just matters what the best situation is for him.

Yeah, not a fact.

Personally, I'd love for BM move Fowler to DET. As well as being a fan of Fowler, I really think he could flourish there and then us Duck fans could all shove it in everyone who doubted him because of his "terrible advanced stats". Works for both parties involved.

 

[Smitty426]

I Dont buy this playing for my home team garbage.
And we are the ones who had Parise go home to play with his bestie!

Okposo was going to Minny-NO
Stamkos to Toronto-NO
Yandle to Boston-NO

Is it ideal, sure, is it real-world, almost never
Money, Term, state of the team: contending, rebuilding, all youth, all vets, ownership. These all play into it more and if those boxes are checked then I think a player says yeah home!

 

[mytduxfan*]

I Dont buy this playing for my home team garbage.
And we are the ones who had Parise go home to play with his bestie!

Okposo was going to Minny-NO
Stamkos to Toronto-NO
Yandle to Boston-NO

Is it ideal, sure, is it real-world, almost never
Money, Term, state of the team: contending, rebuilding, all youth, all vets, ownership. These all play into it more and if those boxes are checked then I think a player says yeah home!

Agreed, generally it just comes down to money and term. However, when the shoe fits. I mean, Palms ended up in NJ, his home area, and has been a huge success. BM, in particular, is the type of GM that does care where his guys end up.

 

[HBK27]

I Dont buy this playing for my home team garbage.
And we are the ones who had Parise go home to play with his bestie!

Okposo was going to Minny-NO
Stamkos to Toronto-NO
Yandle to Boston-NO

Is it ideal, sure, is it real-world, almost never
Money, Term, state of the team: contending, rebuilding, all youth, all vets, ownership. These all play into it more and if those boxes are checked then I think a player says yeah home!

Even if that were the case, I don't see why the Devils would be interested in trading young assets for a guy 2 years away from potentially being UFA. Absolutely goes against Shero's stated plan.

 

[caliamad]

Remember the Bobby Ryan to Philadelphia stuff?

 

[Rhodes 81]

Please don't tell me NJ-Ana is the new NJ-Oilers around here...

If NJ is trading for Fowler, it can't involve Zacha or McLeod. Those are the guys we're building around Hall with. It's got to be something more like Boucher+++, and Anaheim has no reason to go for that.

 

[mytduxfan*]

Please don't tell me NJ-Ana is the new NJ-Oilers around here...

If NJ is trading for Fowler, it can't involve Zacha or McLeod. Those are the guys we're building around Hall with. It's got to be something more like Boucher+++, and Anaheim has no reason to go for that.

I don't know how NJ plans to rebuild their D with only that to offer. Only 5 guys on roster, 2 of which are into their 30s. It's all well and good having Hall, Palms, and Henrique, but what's the point if you've got no D behind them. Schneider can't do it all.

Shatty makes the most sense here given he's RH, bring a lot more offence then Fowler and is from the area i.e. likely to re-sign. However, you're probably giving up at least 2 nice pieces in that deal... and I'm not talking about Boucher+++. Start with your 1st and add.

 

[Hally BlackWood]

I don't know how NJ plans to rebuild their D with only that to offer. Only 5 guys on roster, 2 of which are into their 30s. It's all well and good having Hall, Palms, and Henrique, but what's the point if you've got no D behind them. Schneider can't do it all.

Shatty makes the most sense here given he's RH, bring a lot more offence then Fowler and is from the area i.e. likely to re-sign. However, you're probably giving up at least 2 nice pieces in that deal... and I'm not talking about Boucher+++. Start with your 1st and add.

Boucher

 

[VoidCreature]

I wouldn't brag about those 2 NHL assists. Fortunate at best IMO. Is he going to be in the AHL next year? That should be a good indication of whether he's got the goods. Gotta admit, his OHL offensive totals aren't that impressive. Am I missing something?



Based on what? Why would Fowler "test the market" if he gets exactly what he wants from NJ. You've gotta stop sabotaging threads involving players you're interested in. I don't even think Fowler would be a fit in NJ, but you're being ridiculous when you say Fowler will not re-sign in NJ and, thus, they'll only have him for 2 years.

Clearly you didn't watch the game. The two assists he got were grindy types, but he had four or five other cross crease through defender's sticks type passes that his teammates couldn't finish.

Go look at the junior point totals of Ryan Getzlaf, that guy who's your captain. That's the kind of player Zacha is. And that's why the OP is ludicrous.

 

[Kurt Cobain]

Oh hell no.

 

[mytduxfan*]

Clearly you didn't watch the game. The two assists he got were grindy types, but he had four or five other cross crease through defender's sticks type passes that his teammates couldn't finish.

Go look at the junior point totals of Ryan Getzlaf, that guy who's your captain. That's the kind of player Zacha is. And that's why the OP is ludicrous.

*Yawn* Weak response. Try something original next time.

I watched the game. One was a weird bounce of a face-off and the other was a 2nd assist on an EN goal where he just shoveled the puck forward. Again, not that impressive. Did he make some nice passes? Sure. However, that was one weak-ass TOR side. I'll see how he does in the AHL before I start calling him a future superstar.

Comparing Zacha to Getzlaf is laughable right now. If Zacha projects to be the next Getzlaf, he'd have gone 3rd OA behind McDavid (Crosby) and Eichel (Toews). Strome is more likely to end up like the next Getzlaf and Strome just put up 111pts in 56 OHL games. Meanwhile, Zacha only managed 64 in 51.

Not convinced about Zacha just yet.

 

[VoidCreature]

*Yawn* Weak response. Try something original next time.

I watched the game. One was a weird bounce of a face-off and the other was a 2nd assist on an EN goal where he just shoveled the puck forward. Again, not that impressive. Did he make some nice passes? Sure. However, that was one weak-ass TOR side. I'll see how he does in the AHL before I start calling him a future superstar.

Comparing Zacha to Getzlaf is laughable right now. If Zacha projects to be the next Getzlaf, he'd have gone 3rd OA behind McDavid (Crosby) and Eichel (Toews). Strome is more likely to end up like the next Getzlaf and Strome just put up 111pts in 56 OHL games. Meanwhile, Zacha only managed 64 in 51.

Not convinced about Zacha just yet.

If Ryan Getzlaf projected to be Ryan Getzlaf he wouldn't have gone 19th overall.

It doesn't really matter what you think of him since we're not trading him, but you and a lot of other people are going to be quite surprised by what he can do.

 

[mytduxfan*]

If Ryan Getzlaf projected to be Ryan Getzlaf he wouldn't have gone 19th overall.

It doesn't really matter what you think of him since we're not trading him, but you and a lot of other people are going to be quite surprised by what he can do.

All I can go on is what I've seen of the kid and his numbers. I haven't watched a tonne of him, but I have watched a little bit. That combined with his numbers and I'm giving you my opinion that I'm not convinced he'll be a superstar #1C. That doesn't mean it won't happen, that's just the vibe I'm getting from what I know. I did ask if I was missing something that could have affected his performance i.e. serious injury? bad team mates? however, I've heard nothing so far.

As far as Getzlaf going 19th OA, it's probably best not to choose one of the deepest drafts in NHL history to make examples like that.

 

[VoidCreature]

All I can go on is what I've seen of the kid and his numbers. I haven't watched a tonne of him, but I have watched a little bit. That combined with his numbers and I'm giving you my opinion that I'm not convinced he'll be a superstar #1C. That doesn't mean it won't happen, that's just the vibe I'm getting from what I know. I did ask if I was missing something that could have affected his performance i.e. serious injury? bad team mates? however, I've heard nothing so far.

As far as Getzlaf going 19th OA, it's probably best not to choose one of the deepest drafts in NHL history to make examples like that.

He had an injury to an adductor in his leg about halfway through the season at the U-20s. You could see the difference in his play when he came back, the way he was favoring one side of his body and taking short shifts. He had been on a 2 points per game pace for a number of games before that, and didn't get back to that pace until right before the playoffs, where he scored 13 in 7.

It's also fair to point out that the 2015 draft is considered to have one of the strongest top 10s ever. Zacha was a highly regarded prospect in Czech before his first year in the OHL, and according to Bob Mckenzie there was even talk that Zacha could challenge McDavid for 1st overall.

Obviously, he struggled in his adaptation to the North American game, but the potential has always been there. And I believe we saw hints of it last season.

 

[Sojourn]

If Ryan Getzlaf projected to be Ryan Getzlaf he wouldn't have gone 19th overall.

It doesn't really matter what you think of him since we're not trading him, but you and a lot of other people are going to be quite surprised by what he can do.

And yet you're already projecting Zacha as a Getzlaf caliber player? Seems a tad contradictory, no?

We already know what Getzlaf has become. I don't see what Zacha has done in one season to go from the player he was seen at the draft, to a potential 80-90 point dominant center. That's basically your argument, right? That, despite being drafted 6th overall, that he's on his way to being a superstar?

 

[VoidCreature]

And yet you're already projecting Zacha as a Getzlaf caliber player? Seems a tad contradictory, no?

We already know what Getzlaf has become. I don't see what Zacha has done in one season to go from the player he was seen at the draft, to a potential 80-90 point dominant center. That's basically your argument, right? That, despite being drafted 6th overall, that he's on his way to being a superstar?

Not many people do, but I watched him all season and I see where all the hype back in his homeland is coming from. We'll be able to have a more interesting discussion on this after his rookie year, when everyone has had a chance to see him in action over a long period of time.

 

[mytduxfan*]

He had an injury to an adductor in his leg about halfway through the season at the U-20s. You could see the difference in his play when he came back, the way he was favoring one side of his body and taking short shifts. He had been on a 2 points per game pace for a number of games before that, and didn't get back to that pace until right before the playoffs, where he scored 13 in 7.

It's also fair to point out that the 2015 draft is considered to have one of the strongest top 10s ever. Zacha was a highly regarded prospect in Czech before his first year in the OHL, and according to Bob Mckenzie there was even talk that Zacha could challenge McDavid for 1st overall.

Obviously, he struggled in his adaptation to the North American game, but the potential has always been there. And I believe we saw hints of it last season.

Now that's makes more sense. The kids got skills. I just couldn't understand why he didn't have the numbers to show for it. Like I said, let's see how he does in the AHL. However, I'd hold back on comparing Zacha to the likes or McDavid or Getzlaf. That's only going set you up for disappoint if he doesn't reach those lofty heights. I believe that's the reason some Duck fans dislike Cam. He was expected to be a poor mans Niedermayer and he never made it there. Hence, rather then focusing on the parts of Fowler's game that he excels in, they focus on the weak parts of his game. Kind of sad really. Wouldn't want the same for Zacha.

 

[Sojourn]

Not many people do, but I watched him all season and I see where all the hype back in his homeland is coming from. We'll be able to have a more interesting discussion on this after his rookie year, when everyone has had a chance to see him in action over a long period of time.

Yes, but did you watch Ryan Getzlaf at the same age? Can you actually compare them at the same age? Beyond points?

It's easy to look at a young player, and picture all these things coming together for them to turn them into this great player. Whether it's realistic or not is a different story.

 

[VoidCreature]

Yes, but did you watch Ryan Getzlaf at the same age? Can you actually compare them at the same age? Beyond points?

It's easy to look at a young player, and picture all these things coming together for them to turn them into this great player. Whether it's realistic or not is a different story.

I'll admit I did not, but people like Steve Kournianos of The Draft Analyst calling him a "dynamic 200-foot player" who's "super smart" with "elite skills" combined with what I've seen in my own viewings gives me reason to be hopeful.

http://hfboards.mandatory.com/showthread.php?t=1552557&page=39

Can't quote the post, but it's there at the bottom of the page.

 

[Sojourn]

I'll admit I did not, but people like Steve Kournianos of The Draft Analyst calling him a "dynamic 200-foot player" who's "super smart" with "elite skills" combined with what I've seen in my own viewings gives me reason to be hopeful.

http://hfboards.mandatory.com/showthread.php?t=1552557&page=39

Can't quote the post, but it's there at the bottom of the page.

I think the problem is that descriptions like that can be used to describe just about any top six potential player when they are a prospect. I think people forget that this is the NHL, and top six talents in this league are usually elite prospects.

My issue is that you're comparing him to a player who wasn't just an elite talent prospect, but has proven to be elite at the NHL level. He's the kind of player that, in hindsight, could realistically be put above a number of 1st overall picks, and he's all but a lock to go top 3 in every draft of the past decade. At the very least, he'd be in the discussion every time.

I'm not saying that Zacha can't become that guy with certainty, but I think you can go through a lot of drafts and see a prospect described as being dynamic, smart, or having elite skills, and those are the guys you see end up as top six guys. That's just how competitive, and skilled the game is at the NHL level.

 

[VoidCreature]

I think the problem is that descriptions like that can be used to describe just about any top six potential player when they are a prospect. I think people forget that this is the NHL, and top six talents in this league are usually elite prospects.

My issue is that you're comparing him to a player who wasn't just an elite talent prospect, but has proven to be elite at the NHL level. He's the kind of player that, in hindsight, could realistically be put above a number of 1st overall picks, and he's all but a lock to go top 3 in every draft of the past decade. At the very least, he'd be in the discussion every time.

I'm not saying that Zacha can't become that guy with certainty, but I think you can go through a lot of drafts and see a prospect described as being dynamic, smart, or having elite skills, and those are the guys you see end up as top six guys. That's just how competitive, and skilled the game is at the NHL level.

Ryan Getzlaf wasn't an elite prospect. Go back and watch the 2003 draft videos. He and Perry were barely talked about.

I guess it's an extraordinary claim that the 6th overall pick in a strong draft class could be a great player, but if the proofs I've provided so far aren't convincing nothing will be.

 

[NJDevils17]

I think the problem is that descriptions like that can be used to describe just about any top six potential player when they are a prospect. I think people forget that this is the NHL, and top six talents in this league are usually elite prospects.

My issue is that you're comparing him to a player who wasn't just an elite talent prospect, but has proven to be elite at the NHL level. He's the kind of player that, in hindsight, could realistically be put above a number of 1st overall picks, and he's all but a lock to go top 3 in every draft of the past decade. At the very least, he'd be in the discussion every time.

I'm not saying that Zacha can't become that guy with certainty, but I think you can go through a lot of drafts and see a prospect described as being dynamic, smart, or having elite skills, and those are the guys you see end up as top six guys. That's just how competitive, and skilled the game is at the NHL level.

Hindsight is 20/20. If people knew Getzlaf was going to be as good as he is, he would've gone a lot higher in the draft.

I think it's unfair to compare any prospect to any NHL player at that point, especially an elite one. At the same age, their numbers in junior are pretty similar which is where this comparison comes from. I don't think stylistically it's that accurate though (I think Zacha will be LW).

As for Zacha, the Kournianos quote is a little more than that. He says he thinks NJ made the right pick at #6. That's a lot different than throwing those buzz words around.

Zacha is one of the most polarizing prospects in the league because Devils' fans see him as the savior who was picked 6th overall while others see him as a guy with a lot of tools but can't put it together consistently. I don't claim to know what he'll be at all but I've seen my fair share of him and I think a lot of criticism is unfounded. Obviously the points aren't always there but he excels in games where he doesn't put up points.

Bottom line: we simply won't know until he makes it to the NHL.