World Cup: Four Nations Tournament-Team Canada

[JackSlater]

No one is even talking about this. Its insane.

'Hey look we have Joe Sakic, Steve Yzerman two Hall of fame winners that have built cup champions' . 'Na let's go with the nerd who has never played hockey or won anything at any hockey level' Kyle Dubas. He's the man for the job. 1 playoff win his his entire NHL hockey career. Wtf is going on.

It's not that big of a deal, Dubas isn't picking the team or signing the players to terrible contracts. He's one of the guys in the room but clearly not making decisions. Canada has had worse GMs involved before and won.

 

[Hamilton Bulldogs]

This is absolutely insane. What is going on? Honestly? Did Jim Benning and Pierre Dorion turn down the job? Was the goal to hire the worst active Canadian GM in the NHL. His track record is horrid. He never played hockey how would he know how to build a winning team when he has never won a thing in his life.

Canada could win the gold with my dog doing Dubas job. He won't be a factor in the team winning or losing.

 

[HFpapi]

Zach Hyman scored 54 goals last regular season (3rd in the league) and 16 playoff goals (1st in the league). He brings built in chemistry with our best and most important player.

Mitch Marner is a top 3 Canadian point producer and a top 3 Canadian forward defensively (among players realistically in contention). He bring insane versatility where he fits as 1st line RW or 4th line RW, top PP unit or #1 PK unit.

Both are natural wingers which Canada lacks.

People are trying to get way too cute with their picks. In what world has Byfield and/or Laf made those two players obsolete?

 

[1specter]

Management group additions announced for 4 Nations Face-Off

Julien BriseBois and Kyle Dubas have been added to Canada’s management group for the 2025 4 Nations Face-Off.

www.hockeycanada.ca

Not Kyle Dubas

What a joke. Dubas is like the Doc Rivers of the NHL, except Doc at least has a championship. Dude has mastered failing upwards.

 

[JackSlater]

Something I like to consider when it comes to bubble forwards is even strength scoring. Realistically, Canada is going to ride Makar, MacKinnon, and McDavid hard on the power play in the key offensive spots. Most of the bubble forwards won't get meaningful power play time. I started looking at which players might play wing for Canada and are on the bubble to make the team. I included Point for the sake of comparison only - he is on the team already and might play RW, plus he has decent odds of ending up on the main PP unit. I listed how many points the players scored in how many games.

Point – 58 in 81 games
Konecny – 52 in 76 games
Marner – 57 in 69 games
Hyman – 57 in 80 games
Reinhart – 55 in 82 games
Bedard – 40 in 68 games
Johnston – 52 in 82 games
Barzal – 55 in 80 games
Cozens – 34 in 79 games (47 in 81 previous season)
Stone – 35 in 56 games
Lafreniere – 51 in 82 games
Byfield – 41 in 80 games
O’Reilly – 41 in 82 games

A few things stand out. Marner is somewhat above the others on a per game basis, and he has been pretty consistent in terms of even strength offence the last several years. Lafreniere and Johnston are already right there with the top contenders in terms of even strength offence. I think that Konecny looks better than people would think by this measure since Philadelphia's power play stinks. Stone still looks really good on a per game basis. I included Cozens' results for the previous season in parentheses because I believe they are more indicative of his level than his putrid 2024 season was.

It's also important to remember role and who someone plays with. Some players are going to get a bit of a boost playing with elite players at even strength, and some are dragged down a bit by who they play with. Since most of the key power play spots are already accounted for on Canada I do believe that this is a worthwhile consideration, and it demonstrates that some players are closer than they appear offensively and so role/fit has to enter consideration.

 

[JackSlater]

Zach Hyman scored 54 goals last regular season (3rd in the league) and 16 playoff goals (1st in the league). He brings built in chemistry with our best and most important player.

Mitch Marner is a top 3 Canadian point producer and a top 3 Canadian forward defensively (among players realistically in contention). He bring insane versatility where he fits as 1st line RW or 4th line RW, top PP unit or #1 PK unit.

Both are natural wingers which Canada lacks.

People are trying to get way too cute with their picks. In what world has Byfield and/or Laf made those two players obsolete?

If Hyman falls back down to Earth next year, just as Nugent-Hopkins did last year following his outlier year with McDavid, are his goals from the previous year going to help Canada win? It isn't that hard to make a case for Lafreniere over him given role and room for growth. Realistically Canada could take both, or neither, and it wouldn't shock.

Regarding Marner, Canada has a long history of cutting elite playmakers who don't factor into one of the top scoring centre spots. He may make it but if he doesn't no one should be overly surprised. Some players that Canada regularly cut in their primes: Denis Savard, Steve Yzerman, Ron Francis, Adam Oates, Pierre Turgeon, Mark Recchi, Martin St. Louis, Claude Giroux.

 

[NordiquesForeva]

If Hyman falls back down to Earth next year, just as Nugent-Hopkins did last year following his outlier year with McDavid, are his goals from the previous year going to help Canada win? It isn't that hard to make a case for Lafreniere over him given role and room for growth. Realistically Canada could take both, or neither, and it wouldn't shock.

Regarding Marner, Canada has a long history of cutting elite playmakers who don't factor into one of the top scoring centre spots. He may make it but if he doesn't no one should be overly surprised. Some players that Canada regularly cut in their primes: Denis Savard, Steve Yzerman, Ron Francis, Adam Oates, Pierre Turgeon, Mark Recchi, Martin St. Louis, Claude Giroux.

Most of those guys were logjammed at the deep centre position for Canada, though St. Louis is really good analogy. As I see it, the key difference between Marner and St. Louis is defensive play, which makes Marner a significantly more versatile (and potentially useful) player in a 13- or 14-man forward group. In addition to offensive production, Marner can also kill penalties and be trusted to take reasonable care of things and put forth a strong effort in his own end. The drawback I see with Marner is I'm not sure how well he'd mesh with some of the centres like McDavid or potentially Crosby. Maybe he could serve as a play connector on a line with McDavid and Hyman though that seems a little...underwhelming?

Marner needs to have the puck on his stick, making plays, to produce offensively. Him and Point would probably work really well, and he'd probably work fine with MacKinnon.

Something I like to consider when it comes to bubble forwards is even strength scoring. Realistically, Canada is going to ride Makar, MacKinnon, and McDavid hard on the power play in the key offensive spots. Most of the bubble forwards won't get meaningful power play time. I started looking at which players might play wing for Canada and are on the bubble to make the team. I included Point for the sake of comparison only - he is on the team already and might play RW, plus he has decent odds of ending up on the main PP unit. I listed how many points the players scored in how many games.

Point – 58 in 81 games
Konecny – 52 in 76 games
Marner – 57 in 69 games
Hyman – 57 in 80 games
Reinhart – 55 in 82 games
Bedard – 40 in 68 games
Johnston – 52 in 82 games
Barzal – 55 in 80 games
Cozens – 34 in 79 games (47 in 81 previous season)
Stone – 35 in 56 games
Lafreniere – 51 in 82 games
Byfield – 41 in 80 games
O’Reilly – 41 in 82 games

A few things stand out. Marner is somewhat above the others on a per game basis, and he has been pretty consistent in terms of even strength offence the last several years. Lafreniere and Johnston are already right there with the top contenders in terms of even strength offence. I think that Konecny looks better than people would think by this measure since Philadelphia's power play stinks. Stone still looks really good on a per game basis. I included Cozens' results for the previous season in parentheses because I believe they are more indicative of his level than his putrid 2024 season was.

It's also important to remember role and who someone plays with. Some players are going to get a bit of a boost playing with elite players at even strength, and some are dragged down a bit by who they play with. Since most of the key power play spots are already accounted for on Canada I do believe that this is a worthwhile consideration, and it demonstrates that some players are closer than they appear offensively and so role/fit has to enter consideration.

The ES production stat really shines a light on Konecny, and I don't think I'm alone in having him as one of my bubble players for quite some time. I think he'd be able to carve out a useful role for himself in limited minutes, even if just being someone who is miserable to play against for 45 seconds.

 

[JackSlater]

Most of those guys were logjammed at the deep centre position for Canada, though St. Louis is really good analogy. As I see it, the key difference between Marner and St. Louis is defensive play, which makes Marner a significantly more versatile (and potentially useful) player in a 13- or 14-man forward group. In addition to offensive production, Marner can also kill penalties and be trusted to take reasonable care of things and put forth a strong effort in his own end. The drawback I see with Marner is I'm not sure how well he'd mesh with some of the centres like McDavid or potentially Crosby. Maybe he could serve as a play connector on a line with McDavid and Hyman though that seems a little...underwhelming?

Marner needs to have the puck on his stick, making plays, to produce offensively. Him and Point would probably work really well, and he'd probably work fine with MacKinnon.



The ES production stat really shines a light on Konecny, and I don't think I'm alone in having him as one of my bubble players for quite some time. I think he'd be able to carve out a useful role for himself in limited minutes, even if just being someone who is miserable to play against for 45 seconds.

I don't think it really matters that some of those guys were centres. Yzerman for instance almost always played RW for Canada, and many Canadian centres have been shifted to wing. Savard definitely would have been a winger for Canada (and Canada should have taken both of them at times). I certainly don't see a good fit for Marner, as Canada's centres are almost always the playmakers. I think his only realistic fit is as a RW with MacKinnon or maybe Point if he plays centre. McDavid is going to be very puck dominant on his line and Crosby is going to have a lot of the puck and play a cycle game with Marchand. That Marner is a solid defensive player who can PK is the only chance I see for him to make the team honestly.

I've thought for a while that people are sleeping on Konecny. I had him with Thomas on the fourth line of my projected team but to me he is also a great fit with Crosby and Marchand. If he picked up an extra 10-15 power play points every year people would be all over him making this team, but Konecny isn't going to play on the power play anyway so it doesn't matter. As it is, on that list of players his even strength scoring is as good as or better (accounting for who people play with) than anyone except Marner. Good scoring without that much support in Philadelphia, good two way play and a solid penalty killer, and a gritty element that is pretty much a hallmark of Canadian hockey. I think his odds of making the team are strong if he's healthy.

 

[Nucks2001]

Something I like to consider when it comes to bubble forwards is even strength scoring. Realistically, Canada is going to ride Makar, MacKinnon, and McDavid hard on the power play in the key offensive spots. Most of the bubble forwards won't get meaningful power play time. I started looking at which players might play wing for Canada and are on the bubble to make the team. I included Point for the sake of comparison only - he is on the team already and might play RW, plus he has decent odds of ending up on the main PP unit. I listed how many points the players scored in how many games.

Point – 58 in 81 games
Konecny – 52 in 76 games
Marner – 57 in 69 games
Hyman – 57 in 80 games
Reinhart – 55 in 82 games
Bedard – 40 in 68 games
Johnston – 52 in 82 games
Barzal – 55 in 80 games
Cozens – 34 in 79 games (47 in 81 previous season)
Stone – 35 in 56 games
Lafreniere – 51 in 82 games
Byfield – 41 in 80 games
O’Reilly – 41 in 82 games

A few things stand out. Marner is somewhat above the others on a per game basis, and he has been pretty consistent in terms of even strength offence the last several years. Lafreniere and Johnston are already right there with the top contenders in terms of even strength offence. I think that Konecny looks better than people would think by this measure since Philadelphia's power play stinks. Stone still looks really good on a per game basis. I included Cozens' results for the previous season in parentheses because I believe they are more indicative of his level than his putrid 2024 season was.

It's also important to remember role and who someone plays with. Some players are going to get a bit of a boost playing with elite players at even strength, and some are dragged down a bit by who they play with. Since most of the key power play spots are already accounted for on Canada I do believe that this is a worthwhile consideration, and it demonstrates that some players are closer than they appear offensively and so role/fit has to enter consideration.

Some things to note on your analysis of 5v5 Scoring for the upcoming 4-Nations:

-2024; MacKinnon (92 ESP) and McDavid (87 ESP) are so far ahead of the next player that’s playing in the 4 Nations tournament, Matthews (77 ESP) that it’s not even funny.

-Sidney Crosby is still one of the best 5v5 players in the world with 71 ESP and the 4th highest eligible ESP skater after McDavid, MacKinnon and Matthews.

-Brandon Hagel had 66 ESP and is the 5th highest ESP skater eligible for 4 nations.

-10/25 leading ESP scorers are Canadian.

-Brayden Point seems like he has benefitted immensely from playing alongside Kuch. I think putting him along a McDavid, MacKinnon and Marner would get the most out of him offensively.

-Barzal is being overlooked on this list. I’m actually surprised his ESP is that high considering NYI’s system of hockey.

-I love Konecny and I had him on my roster earlier this year, but I would take Stone over him if he’s healthy. Stone has a higher ESPPG from your post and is able to drive a line better. Yes, Konecny is a great utility player, but it’s clear that he’s not elite if he’s getting 1st line, 1st PP AND 1st PK unit time and not being above ppg. Still a great player to have, but the ceiling for Jarvis, Byfield, Johnston and Laf might be higher than that and I’m willing to gamble.

 

[JackSlater]

Some things to note on your analysis of 5v5 Scoring for the upcoming 4-Nations:

-2024; MacKinnon (92 ESP) and McDavid (87 ESP) are so far ahead of the next player that’s playing in the 4 Nations tournament, Matthews (77 ESP) that it’s not even funny.

-Sidney Crosby is still one of the best 5v5 players in the world with 71 ESP and the 4th highest eligible ESP skater after McDavid, MacKinnon and Matthews.

-Brandon Hagel had 66 ESP and is the 5th highest ESP skater eligible for 4 nations.

-10/25 leading ESP scorers are Canadian.

-Brayden Point seems like he has benefitted immensely from playing alongside Kuch. I think putting him along a McDavid, MacKinnon and Marner would get the most out of him offensively.

-Barzal is being overlooked on this list. I’m actually surprised his ESP is that high considering NYI’s system of hockey.

-I love Konecny and I had him on my roster earlier this year, but I would take Stone over him if he’s healthy. Stone has a higher ESPPG from your post and is able to drive a line better. Yes, Konecny is a great utility player, but it’s clear that he’s not elite if he’s getting 1st line, 1st PP AND 1st PK unit time and not being above ppg. Still a great player to have, but the ceiling for Jarvis, Byfield, Johnston and Laf might be higher than that and I’m willing to gamble.

That's a good point about Hagel, I wasn't really considering him that much. He's a good player.

Crosby is a suitable person to reference in this context. He's still an excellent player. That he isn't a dominant power play player at this point is perfectly fine for Canada. Honestly I'd rather have him take the shift following the power play (or the end of the power play) to bring about some stability. For MacKinnon and McDavid it does matter how well they play on the power play, but yeah McDavid is a step up from MacKinnon and MacKinnon is a step up from Matthews. It's a team game though. Canada's biggest advantage over any team is that McDavid is much better than any team's first line centre, MacKinnon is much better than any team's second line centre, and Crosby is much better than any team's third line centre.

I agree about Point. He's a valid pick to make the team in the starting cohort but he isn't going to drive a line at this level. He definitely benefits from playing with Kucherov in terms of points, since Kucherov is ridiculous. I do wonder if Cooper will be willing to play him at RW.

If Stone is fully healthy, which seems like a longshot, I'd take both. I don't need either of them to drive a line but both are versatile RW options. It doesn't really matter that Konecny isn't at a point per game, that's the whole point of looking at their even strength production only. If Philadelphia had a skilled power play quarterback (it doesn't) then Konecny easily could have had 8 more points and been at a point per game - but that doesn't matter for Canada since Konecny won't be playing on the power play anyway. If he is there he will play at even strength (and probably penalty kill) so that's far more important. For what it's worth, Konecny was just over a point per game the previous season and Philadelphia's next best scorer had 54 points in 81 games.

 

[Mathieukferland]

Anyone know anything about Misha Donskov?

 

[JackSlater]

View attachment 898389
Anyone know anything about Misha Donskov?

Looks like they hired Bear12Good as an assistant.

 

[fahad203]

If Hyman falls back down to Earth next year, just as Nugent-Hopkins did last year following his outlier year with McDavid, are his goals from the previous year going to help Canada win? It isn't that hard to make a case for Lafreniere over him given role and room for growth. Realistically Canada could take both, or neither, and it wouldn't shock.

Regarding Marner, Canada has a long history of cutting elite playmakers who don't factor into one of the top scoring centre spots. He may make it but if he doesn't no one should be overly surprised. Some players that Canada regularly cut in their primes: Denis Savard, Steve Yzerman, Ron Francis, Adam Oates, Pierre Turgeon, Mark Recchi, Martin St. Louis, Claude Giroux.

It could also go the other way. Maybe he'll score 60 goals next year
Hyman last year also 36 goals and 27 goals the year before

Hyman earned every right to be that team. Even if he had scored lets say 20 goals regular season. His playoff performance alone makes him a shoe in

 

[JackSlater]

It could also go the other way. Maybe he'll score 60 goals next year
Hyman last year also 36 goals and 27 goals the year before

Hyman earned every right to be that team. Even if he had scored lets say 20 goals regular season. His playoff performance alone makes him a shoe in

I guess we can fantasize about what if Hyman has an almost unprecedented progression from his peak at age 32.. who knows, maybe he somehow shoots higher than 19% next year or McDavid goes for 120 assists or something. I'd rather be realistic about the guy. He's a good player and a very hard worker, but the main reason people have him on this team is that he plays with McDavid. On his own he wouldn't make this team and wouldn't generate much discussion.

 

[fahad203]

I guess we can fantasize about what if Hyman has an almost unprecedented progression from his peak at age 32.. who knows, maybe he somehow shoots higher than 19% next year or McDavid goes for 120 assists or something. I'd rather be realistic about the guy. He's a good player and a very hard worker, but the main reason people have him on this team is that he plays with McDavid. On his own he wouldn't make this team and wouldn't generate much discussion.

You could make that argument like about 100 players that played in NHL especially with wingers

Kurri
Hull
John Leclair
Stamkos modern day with kuch ans St Louis in the earlier years
To name a few

 

[Nucks2001]

I'm a little shocked that Tocchet was named instead of Maurice as a Canucks fan.

You could make that argument like about 100 players that played in NHL especially with wingers

Kurri
Hull
John Leclair
Stamkos modern day with kuch ans St Louis in the earlier years
To name a few

I'll somewhat give you today's Stamkos tho not really cuz he's still better than Hyman. You're out here comparing Zach Hyman to the St. Louis years??? Too young to have seen and attest to the other guys, but I don't think you can put Hull and Hyman in the same sentence.

If anything, St. Louis benefited more from Stamkos from 2010-2014. I don't think you remotely remember how good Stamkos was during those years. There was a serious argument between him and Ovi on who the best goal scorer was. He no doubt benefited from St. Louis' superb playmaking, but I think the only centres that I would have taken over him at the time would be Crosby or Malkin. In fact, I just checked the Top 3 PPG players from 2010-2014:

Crosby- 1.47 PPG
Malkin- 1.20 PPG
Stamkos- 1.17 PPG

From a pure offensive perspective, he was one of the most dominant forces I witnessed during that time period. I would put him in the Crosby, Malkin, and Ovi tier. Now, were there more impactful forwards? Sure. Datsyuk, Toews, Kane and Kopitar are the first ones to come to mind. But if we're talking about pure offensive fire power; Stamkos was 3rd imo behind Crosby and Malkin with Ovi being right there.

It's a shame what injuries did to his speed. He was able to score 60 in one of the lowest scoring eras post-expansion. People used to dream about having Stamkos on Crosby's wing for the 2014 Olympics. Sadly, that did not happen. Even from 2015-2019, I don't think anyone could argue him out of the top 10 centres, and he'd be closer to 5 than 10. Developed his playmaking and all-around game exponentially. He probably would of hit 50 Goals 2x more if his health permitted.


Please, don't compare Prime Stamkos (though we never actually got to witness his true prime) to Zach Hyman.

 

[JackSlater]

You could make that argument like about 100 players that played in NHL especially with wingers

Kurri
Hull
John Leclair
Stamkos modern day with kuch ans St Louis in the earlier years
To name a few

I don't think those are good comparisons. First off each of them had multiple elite years, not a sudden one in their 30s, and they did more away from the other player. Kurri had an elite season after Gretzky was gone. Hull was elite after Oates was gone, and also scored less in collaboration with Oates than most would think. LeClair managed to nearly keep his scoring pace when Lindros missed time. Stamkos' best season (2012) he wasn't even St. Louis' even strength linemate.

Even ignoring stats, visually it's pretty clear those guys are a league or two above Hyman. Hyman is a Kunitz. I think he's a better player than Kunitz was, but that is what he is. I'd be fine to have him as a complementary player on my top line in the NHL, but at this level... not nearly so confident.

 

[Rabid Ranger]

I'm interested in seeing how veteran laden Canada and the U.S. will be. For instance, I saw chatter of Tavares making the Canadian team. Ugh.

 

[NordiquesForeva]

I guess we can fantasize about what if Hyman has an almost unprecedented progression from his peak at age 32.. who knows, maybe he somehow shoots higher than 19% next year or McDavid goes for 120 assists or something. I'd rather be realistic about the guy. He's a good player and a very hard worker, but the main reason people have him on this team is that he plays with McDavid. On his own he wouldn't make this team and wouldn't generate much discussion.

McDavid, and his Leafs linemates before him, have driven him to be a much better player than he was expected to be early in his NHL career. If he was traded to, say, Seattle tomorrow I'd still put him down for ~35 goals and he'd probably be a bubble player for the 4 Nations Cup team because of everything that he brings to the table and he has a replicable and sustainable work ethic and skillset.

Kunitz should never have made the 2014 Olympic team because Canada already had in spades, what Kunitz brought to the team in terms of grit, corner work, and goal scoring.

At this point in the cycle, unless players like Lafreniere or Johnston step up their goal scoring in a major way this upcoming season and even assuming Reinhart continues at a 40+ goal pace, Canada lacks goal scoring on the wings. Leaving a guy who found the back of the net 50+ times off of a team because he benefited from playing alongside the best player in the world would seem like a classic case of the Canadian brain trust over-thinking things. We have good options on the wing if some of the youngsters develop like we expect them to, but we're not abundant in goal scoring ability like we used to be. That's the strongest case for Hyman, imo.

 

[JackSlater]

I'm interested in seeing how veteran laden Canada and the U.S. Will be. For instance, I saw chatter of Tavares making the Canadian team. Ugh.

Tavares was good at the iihf world championship and I fully expect Armstrong to be conservative. USA always seems to be conservative. I wouldn't be totally shocked by Tavares but it would be disappointing.

 

[NordiquesForeva]

I'm interested in seeing how veteran laden Canada and the U.S. Will be. For instance, I saw chatter of Tavares making the Canadian team. Ugh.

It's unfortunate that Jeff Carter recently retired, though Armstrong is probably on the horn with Jonathan Toews right now to see if he'd be willing to come out of retirement for the 4 Nations Cup.

 

[JackSlater]

McDavid, and his Leafs linemates before him, have driven him to be a much better player than he was expected to be early in his NHL career. If he was traded to, say, Seattle tomorrow I'd still put him down for ~35 goals and he'd probably be a bubble player for the 4 Nations Cup team because of everything that he brings to the table and he has a replicable and sustainable work ethic and skillset.

Kunitz should never have made the 2014 Olympic team because Canada already had in spades, what Kunitz brought to the team in terms of grit, corner work, and goal scoring.

At this point in the cycle, unless players like Lafreniere or Johnston step up their goal scoring in a major way this upcoming season and even assuming Reinhart continues at a 40+ goal pace, Canada lacks goal scoring on the wings. Leaving a guy who found the back of the net 50+ times off of a team because he benefited from playing alongside the best player in the world would seem like a classic case of the Canadian brain trust over-thinking things. We have good options on the wing if some of the youngsters develop like we expect them to, but we're not abundant in goal scoring ability like we used to be. That's the strongest case for Hyman, imo.

You're drastically overrating Hyman. He isn't one of Canada's best goal scorers who happens to play with McDavid, he's a Canadian who happened to play with McDavid and thus looked better at goal scoring. Going into last season Hyman's career shooting percentage was around 12.6%. Not really surprising for a non-skill player, and even Ovechkin's career shooting percentage isn't much higher. If Hyman shot at 12.6% last year rather than almost 19% he'd have scored 36 goals. I can see Hyman settling in general at a percentage above 12.6% if he's with McDavid, but that 19% was not the norm and should not be expected as he gets furhter into his 30s. There is next to no chance that Hyman scores 35 goals on a team like Seattle.

The only argument for Hyman is that he can play both wings, do dirty work on special teams, and knows his role well as third banana on a team Canada level line. Canada is lacking top goal scorers, but even then Hyman isn't really one of them.

 

[Regal]

You're drastically overrating Hyman. He isn't one of Canada's best goal scorers who happens to play with McDavid, he's a Canadian who happened to play with McDavid and thus looked better at goal scoring. Going into last season Hyman's career shooting percentage was around 12.6%. Not really surprising for a non-skill player, and even Ovechkin's career shooting percentage isn't much higher. If Hyman shot at 12.6% last year rather than almost 19% he'd have scored 36 goals. I can see Hyman settling in general at a percentage above 12.6% if he's with McDavid, but that 19% was not the norm and should not be expected as he gets furhter into his 30s. There is next to no chance that Hyman scores 35 goals on a team like Seattle.

The only argument for Hyman is that he can play both wings, do dirty work on special teams, and knows his role well as third banana on a team Canada level line. Canada is lacking top goal scorers, but even then Hyman isn't really one of them.

I wouldn’t say he’s a goal scorer in a traditional sense of being an elite shooter but I think he’s become a guy who’d find a way to score 30+ regardless of who he’s with at this point. While he shot at a high percentage last year, his individual expected goals was still actually highest in the league at over 50 and his high danger chances were first in the league by a huge margin. He had 255, and Tavares and Kreider tied for 204 after him. Obviously a big part of that is McDavid, but even if McDavid doubled his high danger chances last year, he’d still be top 20

 

[Nucks2001]

I don't think our wing situation is as bad as some people are making it out to be. Obviously Team USA blows us out of the water when it comes to pure wingers, but we have:

Marchand
Stone
Verhaege
Stamkos
Marner
Barzal
Reinhart
Konecny
Hagel
Laf
Byfield
Marchesseault
Hyman

We still have very good wingers, but I get the sentiment. We don't have a tournament-changing big goal-scoring winger like an Iginla, Nash or Carter. A lot of undersized fiesty guys in Marchand, Konecny and Hagel. Solid shooters in Stamkos and Verhaege. Untapped potential in Byfield and Lag. Good role players in Hyman, Marchessault and Reinhart.

The winger position is wide open and is less certain than previous tournaments, but we have enough to contend for a gold medal IMO. One of Canada's strengths is shifting centres to the wings anyways. For example, you can roll out a 2nd line of Crosby-Mack-Bedard (all 3 centres) and still have your 3rd line centre as Brayden Point, who would be better than any other country's 3rd line centre.

 

[JackSlater]

I wouldn’t say he’s a goal scorer in a traditional sense of being an elite shooter but I think he’s become a guy who’d find a way to score 30+ regardless of who he’s with at this point. While he shot at a high percentage last year, his individual expected goals was still actually highest in the league at over 50 and his high danger chances were first in the league by a huge margin. He had 255, and Tavares and Kreider tied for 204 after him. Obviously a big part of that is McDavid, but even if McDavid doubled his high danger chances last year, he’d still be top 20

Eh, I don't see a guy who has scored 30 twice, after age 30, and who generally plays with McDavid and on the Edmonton powerplay as someone who scores 30 goals no matter what team he's on. Last year if he could shoot that high on any team then yes, but even in 2023 he doesn't get 30+ on just any team. Hyman knows where to go and will work hard to get there. There is value in that. I think that plenty of players who don't currently look like great goal scorers could have matched or surpassed Hyman's results, and most of those players are younger and more projectable to the 2026 Olympics. On the other hand, I do like that Hyman is a bit more battle tested now after a nice long playoff run.