World Cup: Four Nations Tournament-Team Canada

[Nucks2001]

Eh, I don't see a guy who has scored 30 twice, after age 30, and who generally plays with McDavid and on the Edmonton powerplay as someone who scores 30 goals no matter what team he's on. Last year if he could shoot that high on any team then yes, but even in 2023 he doesn't get 30+ on just any team. Hyman knows where to go and will work hard to get there. There is value in that. I think that plenty of players who don't currently look like great goal scorers could have matched or surpassed Hyman's results, and most of those players are younger and more projectable to the 2026 Olympics. On the other hand, I do like that Hyman is a bit more battle tested now after a nice long playoff run.

Brayden Point is a good comparison. Point is more skilled than Hyman and smarter too. If you watch Point play, he just knows where to go and how to sneak past defences with his speed and IQ of the game. Makes him the perfect player alongside Kucherov. He’s different from Hyman tho in that he’s one of the most lethal threats on the break in the NHL, a better puck distributor and his shot is so underrated. Imagine putting Point beside McDavid? They tore it up together in the 2015 WJC.

 

[JackSlater]

Brayden Point is a good comparison. Point is more skilled than Hyman and smarter too. If you watch Point play, he just knows where to go and how to sneak past defences with his speed and IQ of the game. Makes him the perfect player alongside Kucherov. He’s different from Hyman tho in that he’s one of the most lethal threats on the break in the NHL, a better puck distributor and his shot is so underrated. Imagine putting Point beside McDavid? They tore it up together in the 2015 WJC.

Point is good, I'd like to see him on the wing I think. Could be a good fit with McDavid. Point was not McDavid's linemate in 2015, as McDavid centered the second line and Point was centre on the third or fourth line, but it make sense as a pair. While I'm not willing to overrate Hyman, a Hyman - McDavid - Point line would probably be very effective. I'd hope for a bit better though.

 

[Nucks2001]

Point is good, I'd like to see him on the wing I think. Could be a good fit with McDavid. Point was not McDavid's linemate in 2015, as McDavid centered the second line and Point was centre on the third or fourth line, but it make sense as a pair. While I'm not willing to overrate Hyman, a Hyman - McDavid - Point line would probably be very effective. I'd hope for a bit better though.

In an ideal world where Leon gets Canadian Citizenship….

*Drai-McDavid-Hyman
*Crosby-MacKinnon-Bedard
Marchand-*Point-Marner

Put whoever you want on your 4th line. No one is stopping that.

 

[ChesterNimitz]

Bouchard > Ekblad/Pietrangelo/Rielly

Dobson should be in over those three as well.

Bouchard has the mobility of a tool shed. He will be preyed upon.

 

[Nucks2001]

Bouchard has the mobility of a tool shed. He will be preyed upon.

Makar, Dobson and Doughty are my 3 RHD. Can’t believe people are taking Bouchard over the London Beauty, Drew Doughty. No one that I trust more other than Crosby in Canada’s own end

 

[NordiquesForeva]

You're drastically overrating Hyman. He isn't one of Canada's best goal scorers who happens to play with McDavid, he's a Canadian who happened to play with McDavid and thus looked better at goal scoring. Going into last season Hyman's career shooting percentage was around 12.6%. Not really surprising for a non-skill player, and even Ovechkin's career shooting percentage isn't much higher. If Hyman shot at 12.6% last year rather than almost 19% he'd have scored 36 goals. I can see Hyman settling in general at a percentage above 12.6% if he's with McDavid, but that 19% was not the norm and should not be expected as he gets furhter into his 30s. There is next to no chance that Hyman scores 35 goals on a team like Seattle.

The only argument for Hyman is that he can play both wings, do dirty work on special teams, and knows his role well as third banana on a team Canada level line. Canada is lacking top goal scorers, but even then Hyman isn't really one of them.

I think there is value in how Hyman scores his goals too, with his willingness to go hard to the net and pay a physical price. Canada has other wingers that can do that, but Hyman's ability to read off of McDavid and get himself into the right positioning to convert does have value (in addition to the other "intangible" type stuff that's been mentioned). While not a pure shooter like others at Canada's disposal, I like the package he brings to the table, at least for the 2025 4 Nations Cup. Insofar as the 2026 Olympics are concerned, that's a ways away and I certainly wouldn't pencil Hyman into that lineup at this point.

Regardless, it sounds like we'll need to agree to disagree on Hyman, and that is fine.

I do think that who ends up lining up with McDavid will be an interesting narrative for the 2025 tournament. Point has been mentioned several times, and I agree he'd probably look good next to McDavid. The speed to play at McDavid's pace is there, as is the shooting ability, the defensive awareness, and the ability to make reads off of elite playmakers. I like that Point wouldn't necessarily need to drive play on a line with McDavid (though he is certainly capable of doing so). I'll leave it to Cooper to decide whether Point is best optimized next to McDavid, or centering his own line. A McDavid-Point combination would likely require some puck retrieval capability on the other wing. Other options would be Hyman, or perhaps someone like Reinhart that can serve as the defensive conscience of the line and has the shooting ability (if not the skating ability) to complement McDavid. If Lafreniere continues his development, he might be an option. Johnston too. I like how Reinhart, Lafreniere and Johnston aren't necessarily players that need the puck on their sticks to contribute/score. Nugent-Hopkins has chemistry with McDavid (and is a good player in his own right) that can likely complement McDavid.

 

[Habsforever14]

I've been wondering, will the players give max effort in this tournament?

 

[TruePowerSlave]

I've been wondering, will the players give max effort in this tournament?

Hard to imagine they will go the absolute max like in the playoffs. The tournament feels more like an exhibition with only 4 teams and no history behind it.

 

[HighLifeManIsHigh]

I can’t believe the amount of people that have Crosby playing wing. I don’t think he’s ever played wing in his life.

MacKinnon will play wing before Crosby does

 

[JackSlater]

I can’t believe the amount of people that have Crosby playing wing. I don’t think he’s ever played wing in his life.

MacKinnon will play wing before Crosby does

Most seem to have him as a centre but yeah nothing about Crosby's game indicates he should play wing. Crosby hasn't played wing since both times he was at the WJC. MacKinnon even stated that he would play wing on a Nova Scotia line, and has played wing for Canada as an adult and has a game that translates well to the wing, but I don't see it anymore. Canada isn't deep enough to have MacKinnon on the wing.

 

[HighLifeManIsHigh]

Most seem to have him as a centre but yeah nothing about Crosby's game indicates he should play wing. Crosby hasn't played wing since both times he was at the WJC. MacKinnon even stated that he would play wing on a Nova Scotia line, and has played wing for Canada as an adult and has a game that translates well to the wing, but I don't see it anymore. Canada isn't deep enough to have MacKinnon on the wing.

McDavid
Crosby
Point

That’s pretty deep

Edit:

So you either want MacKinnon in Point’s place on the third line (won’t happen), or Mac playing wing in the top six. Which proves my point

 

[JackSlater]

McDavid
Crosby
Point

That’s pretty deep

Edit:

So you either want MacKinnon in Point’s place on the third line (won’t happen), or Mac playing wing in the top six. Which proves my point

I don't know what you're talking about. McDavid, MacKinnon, and Crosby should be Canada's top three centres.

 

[HighLifeManIsHigh]

I don't know what you're talking about. McDavid, MacKinnon, and Crosby should be Canada's top three centres.

My initial post was about Crosby playing the wing. If you think Crosby should be on the third line, that’s fine. I misinterpreted your post.

 

[JackSlater]

My initial post was about Crosby playing the wing. If you think Crosby should be on the third line, that’s fine. I misinterpreted your post.

Yeah I am saying that Crosby on the wing doesn't make sense, as you too suggested. MacKinnon was a wing candidate before, for example if the NHL had been at the 2018 Olympics I'm certain that MacKinnon would have been there as a RW, but he's too valuable to shift to the wing now To me the top three centres are very clear.

 

[Nucks2001]

Yeah I am saying that Crosby on the wing doesn't make sense, as you too suggested. MacKinnon was a wing candidate before, for example if the NHL had been at the 2018 Olympics I'm certain that MacKinnon would have been there as a RW, but he's too valuable to shift to the wing now To me the top three centres are very clear.

Why wouldn’t Crosby work on the wing? I too think that Crosby works best as a centre, but I’m more than fine with him on Mack’s wing and Crosby taking face-off responsibilities. There’s not too many people that can puck retrieve and create plays from those dirty areas like Crosby. I think it's a no-brainer putting Crosby and Mack together. It's what Crosby and Mack want, it's what Canada wants and likely what the coaching staff wants. So the question is who centers that line? At this point in their careers, Mack is the clear choice.

 

[JackSlater]

Why wouldn’t Crosby work on the wing? I too think that Crosby works best as a centre, but I’m more than fine with him on Mack’s wing and Crosby taking face-off responsibilities. There’s not too many people that can puck retrieve and create plays from those dirty areas like Crosby. I think it's a no-brainer putting Crosby and Mack together. It's what Crosby and Mack want, it's what Canada wants and likely what the coaching staff wants. So the question is who centers that line? At this point in their careers, Mack is the clear choice.

I certainly hope it isn't what the coaches want, it's a bad use of resources. I don't personally care that MacKinnon and probably Crosby want it, but if it needs to get out of their system then do it at this tournament so it can be finished before the Olympics.

The way Crosby generates offence is pretty much the classic way a centre generates offence, while MacKinnon is more of a freelancer. Crosby is the more cerebral player and has better defensive awareness than MacKinnon does, which matters a lot more for a centre. MacKinnon loses little by moving to the wing, as he can still attack off the rush and in bursts like he does now, but Crosby loses a fair amount of effectiveness. If they have to be a line then Crosby should be the centre, but they shouldn't be a line unless Crosby loses some effectiveness and cannot be the focus of his own line anymore.

 

[HFpapi]

If Hyman falls back down to Earth next year, just as Nugent-Hopkins did last year following his outlier year with McDavid, are his goals from the previous year going to help Canada win? It isn't that hard to make a case for Lafreniere over him given role and room for growth.

Little late replying to you here but don't understand your POV.

Hyman, the guy who just put up 54 RS goals + 16 playoff goals, preceded by 36 goals and 27 goals and who we know fits like a glove next to our best and most important centre, needs to have a "prove it" year next year because we can't be sure he won't fall down to earth.

On the other hand, the guy with one 20+ goal season who was being written off as a bust until about the 30 game mark of last season "isn't a hard case to make?"

Why does the more proven player with proven chemistry and literally double the goals last season get zero benefit of the doubt and Laf gets all of it?

This isn't to hate on Laf at all. I too am excited by what he showed 2nd half of last year and think he can make a strong push for the team if he picks up where he left off, I just don't get the idea of viewing Hyman as a risk but thinking Laf is the logical replacement.

 

[JackSlater]

Little late replying to you here but don't understand your POV.

Hyman, the guy who just put up 54 RS goals + 16 playoff goals, preceded by 36 goals and 27 goals and who we know fits like a glove next to our best and most important centre, needs to have a "prove it" year next year because we can't be sure he won't fall down to earth.

On the other hand, the guy with one 20+ goal season who was being written off as a bust until about the 30 game mark of last season "isn't a hard case to make?"

Why does the more proven player with proven chemistry and literally double the goals last season get zero benefit of the doubt and Laf gets all of it?

This isn't to hate on Laf at all. I too am excited by what he showed 2nd half of last year and think he can make a strong push for the team if he picks up where he left off, I just don't get the idea of viewing Hyman as a risk but thinking Laf is the logical replacement.

Because Hyman isn't as good as the numbers indicate, Lafreniere is better than the numbers indicate. That doesn't necessarily mean that Lafreniere is better, but pointing to Hyman's obviously inflated numbers isn't enough. One plays with the best player in the NHL and on the NHL's best powerplay, one plays on a good line but doesn't get first power play unit time. Hyman, playing with McDavid, had a whopping six more points than Lafreniere did at even strength. One is young and projects to get better next season and then the next Olympic year, one is 32 and is likely coming off a complete outlier season. Lafreniere has also proven himself internationally while Hyman has never played a game internationally.

There is stuff to like about Hyman's game but yes he absolutely needs to continue proving himself. The only thing that matters is how good Hyman is, or more honestly how good he will be in winter 2026, not how many goals he happened to score last year. He isn't as good as that goal total indicates, just like Nugent-Hopkins isn't as good as his point total indicated the year before when McDavid boosted him. I'm not even convinced that there is noteworthy chemistry as opposed to just a really good player who happens to play with McDavid.

Hyman may make the team but it's completely a Kunitz style pick. Those picks work sometimes, and I do think that Hyman is better than Kunitz was, but those picks often don't work out too. If McDavid can shoot properly next year and Hyman is back to being the ~30 goal scorer he likely is, playing with McDavid, then he'll need more than goal totals to justify being on the team.

 

[McMoMoney29]

I think Hyman should be on the team not solely on his production, yeah Point may be a more skilled version of him but after than no other player is as good at forechecking the D hard, taking the puck and giving it to star players and parking in front of the net. We will need a guy somewhat like that on each line. And it makes the line Hyman is on more productive. McDavid doesn’t just help Hyman it goes both ways

I've been wondering, will the players give max effort in this tournament?

I think so. National pride always comes into place, no one’s gonna want to lose any game at all. Just look how passionate players were playing the gimmicky 2016 World Cup

 

[Nucks2001]

Thought it would be interesting to see who Hockey Canada is actually targeting, near-locks, vs. our own rosters or what the best possible roster would look like:

Goalies

Most wide open position. I don't think there's any locks here by Hockey Canada. Any Canadian goalie has a chance if they start the season off hot. Skinner and Hill have probably put themselves in the convo ahead of others in talks due to the past playoffs, but it's negligible. I do not think that Sam Montembeault is on HC's radar though he should be.

Defensemen

Josh Morrissey-Lock: Easily Canada's 2nd best defencemen after Makar and their best LHD. Not much to be said here.

Devon Toews-Lock: Im 99% sure management has a consensus that Toews will be Makar's partner 5v5, as well as on the PK. I can't see a Canadian roster with Makar not having Toews as his D-partner.

Drew Doughty-Lock: Yes, I think Doughty is more of a lock than we realise. HC loves to select veterans with past success in the playoffs and international stage. Doughty fills that role to a tee. He still eats a ton of minutes, is still a top 20 d-man in the NHL, and provides more poise and stability than some of the other RHD options.

Evan Bouchard-On the Radar: Bouchard has certainly put himself in conversation for the 4 Nations after this past post-season. I still think that management is hesitant as of now to make him a clear lock on the blueline due to his past defensive hiccups, but his offensive upside has him as prime suspect #1 on radar watch for Canada's blueline.

Noah Dobson-On the Radar: Though his name isn't mentioned as much in convos after Bouchard's historical post-season, Dobson is most definitely on HC's radar.

Alex Pietrangelo-On the Radar: Pietrangelo has offensively regressed from his 2022 season, where he was named to the initial Olympic roster. I do think Doughty has filled the veteran role of Pietrangelo with his play in recent years. With that being said, Pietrangelo adds poise, size, elite defensive play and a winning pedigree to Team Canada. You add in the fact that Armstrong and Bruce Cassidy will have a say in who's getting selected and there's no doubt that Pietro's name is one of the many that is being talked about.

Shea Theodore-On the Radar: The biggest thing for Theodore is if he can stay healthy. If healthy, Theodore is a Top 20 defensemen in the NHL and likely makes Team Canada.

Morgan Rielly-Unlikely: For what Rielly provides, I do not think that HC is seriously looking at Morgan Rielly unless some injuries were to happen. If you already have Makar, Morrissey, Dobson, Bouchard and Theodore providing offence, Rielly becomes the odd man out.

Aaron Ekblad-On the Radar: A couple of reasons why I think HC is keeping a watchful eye on Ekblad. Ekblad has transformed into a solid defensive defenceman after losing a step offensively. The Ekblad-Forsling pairing was key to Florida's success this past playoffs. With Montour's departure, Ekblad takes back PP1 responsibilities w/ PK1 duties. We might see Ekblad's best season yet with a huge uptake in minutes played.

Colton Parayko-Unlikely: I’ve seen Parayko’s name thrown around by users and I don’t think HC is looking at him as a serious option. Yes, it helps that Armstrong is heading the selection process and Parayko does provide the defensive work and size that Canada is lacking from previous bluelines. With that being said, there are far too many skilled RHD options for him being remotely close to a reserve on this roster.

Dougie Hamilton-Unlikely: 2 seasons ago, Hamilton may have made this roster. The emergences of Bouchard and Dobson on the right side have made Hamilton expendable. You add in the injury history and HC being weary of taking injured players in the past and I do not think he is being talked about a lot by HC’s brass. However, I do think Hamilton can put himself back on HC’s radar if he has a strong start to the upcoming season.

Owen Power-On the Radar: Power’s game is so mature for his age that he will garner attention from HC. HC has historically taken young and promising 2-way defencemen at previous tournaments (See Doughty-2010 and Muzzin-2016 WCoH). Byram was the most speculated defenceman for the 2022 Olympics, and I think Power has eclipsed him to fill that void for Canada.

 

[Nucks2001]

Roster Mock before Season Start:

Hyman-McDavid-Bedard
Marchand-Crosby-Mackinnon
Byfield-Point-Marner
Hagel-O'Reilly-Reinhart
Extras: Thomas-Verhaege

Toews-Makar
Morrissey-Doughty
Theodore-Pietrangelo
Bouchard-Dobson

Hill
Skinner
Binnington

PK1
Marchand-ROR
Toews-Makar

PK2
Point-Reinhart
Morrisey-Doughty

PP1
Hyman-McDavid-Crosby
MacKinnon-Makar

PP2
Marner-Point-Marchand/Verhaege
Bedard-Morrissey

 

[EveryDay]

Roster Mock before Season Start:

Hyman-McDavid-Bedard
Marchand-Crosby-Mackinnon
Byfield-Point-Marner
Hagel-O'Reilly-Reinhart
Extras: Thomas-Verhaege

Toews-Makar
Morrissey-Doughty
Theodore-Pietrangelo
Bouchard-Dobson

Hill
Skinner
Binnington

PK1
Marchand-ROR
Toews-Makar

PK2
Point-Reinhart
Morrisey-Doughty

PP1
Hyman-McDavid-Crosby
MacKinnon-Makar

PP2
Marner-Point-Marchand/Verhaege
Bedard-Morrissey

They won't take Hagel, Byfield or even Verhaegen ahead of Nick Suzuki.

 

[Nucks2001]

They won't take Hagel, Byfield or even Verhaegen ahead of Nick Suzuki.

All these players provide roles that Suzuki can’t. Verhaege (high-volume shooter), Hagel (tenacious forechecker and great at creating turnovers in the o-zone), Byfield (front-of-net presence, SIZE, puck retrieval, athleticism). Suzuki is a great two-way playmaker, but you already have that in Point, Thomas, Crosby, etc. on the team. It’s about filling roles in your bottom 6. Suzuki isn’t a better center than McDavid, Crosby, MacKinnon, Point, or Thomas. Could I see him knocking out ROR for that 3rd line spot? Sure, but I think he needs to get on the same level of ROR defensively for that to happen. Again, this is my roster, I think Suzuki has a good chance of making it.

 

[Mathieukferland]

https://www.cbc.ca/sports/hockey/hockey-canada-appeal-adjourned-2018-world-junior-1.7320191

Makar apparently already got himself cleared but this delay could present Issues for Thomas and (much less likely) Batherson going forward into this tournament

 

[NordiquesForeva]

All these players provide roles that Suzuki can’t. Verhaege (high-volume shooter), Hagel (tenacious forechecker and great at creating turnovers in the o-zone), Byfield (front-of-net presence, SIZE, puck retrieval, athleticism). Suzuki is a great two-way playmaker, but you already have that in Point, Thomas, Crosby, etc. on the team. It’s about filling roles in your bottom 6. Suzuki isn’t a better center than McDavid, Crosby, MacKinnon, Point, or Thomas. Could I see him knocking out ROR for that 3rd line spot? Sure, but I think he needs to get on the same level of ROR defensively for that to happen. Again, this is my roster, I think Suzuki has a good chance of making it.

Friedman, on his 32T podcast a few days ago, predicted that Byfield would make the 4 Nations Cup team.

Given this will a World Cup-style event with a certain "marketing/advertising" aspect to it in North America, I could easily see Suzuki making Team Canada. Young, versatile captain of an O6 franchise. Not that he doesn't deserve to make the team otherwise (I have him on the bubble personally, leaning towards including him as the 13/14th F), but much like Toews in 2010 I think GMs and managers value versality, safety and 200-foot play at the bottom of the lineup.