OT: Football Thread

[Bob Richards]

Awful

 

[Ben Grimm]

If Deebo gets traded, I'll take the Jets.

 

[sbjnyc]

If Deebo gets traded, I'll take the Jets.

Would he?

 

[Filip Chytil]

Leonard at NY Daily News is saying NYG are looking to trade Toney.

Link: Giants looking to trade wide receiver Kadarius Toney: sources

 

[Filip Chytil]

Which is why GM Joe Schoen doesn’t appear to be using one of his swings on Oregon’s edge rusher Kayvon Thibodeaux. According to reports, Schoen and the rest of the front office have concerns about Thibodeaux's character.

“It would be a surprise if the Giants draft Thibodeaux because some members of the front office have been turned off by his personality, according to a source,” writes The Athletic’s Dan Duggan. “But Schoen will make the final call, so it’s impossible to say with certainty what he’ll do if Thibodeaux is available when the Giants are on the clock.”

Some Giants front office members 'turned off' by Kayvon Thibodeaux's personality ahead of NFL Draft: report

With the fifth and seventh overall picks in the 2022 NFL Draft, the Giants must feel some pressure to hit big on these two prospects.

sports.yahoo.com

Miller over at ESPN says there is buzz connecting NYG and Charles Cross. Daniel Jeremiah has said the same as well:

"There's a lot of buzz. Sometimes it's hard to tell when you're talking to your friends in the league if the buzz is coming from them or coming from it being in the media and them kind of repeating what they hear in the media. But there's been a lot connection between Charles Cross of Mississippi State and the Giants. I don't know how much to buy into that or believe that, but for me he's the third guy. I know, in terms of pass protection, he's pretty polished."

2022 NFL Draft: 11 takeaways from Daniel Jeremiah's conference call

NFL Network draft analyst Daniel Jeremiah answered questions for an hour and a half on Thursday, previewing the 2022 NFL Draft (April 28-30 on NFL Network/ESPN/ABC) during a media conference call. As you might expect, he offered insight on some of the jui

www.nfl.com

But that could get tricky, because some league sources believe the Giants are high enough on Cincinnati corner Ahmad “Sauce” Gardner that he is in play at No. 5 overall.

James Bradberry, Sauce Gardner take center stage in Giants’ corner dance

The NFL Draft is a week away, and the Giants need a corner.

www.nydailynews.com

 

[RangerBlues]

My take is both teams should go O line and pass rusher.
Derek Stingley is a stud!
Anybody who takes a safety top ten is a dumbass.
Any team who goes broke for a QB is a double dumbass so the Jets and Giants should be looking for one

 

[LeetchisGod]

Leonard at NY Daily News is saying NYG are looking to trade Toney.

Link: Giants looking to trade wide receiver Kadarius Toney: sources

Not surprised. This guy gave me Beckham vibes.

 

[Bob Richards]

Dave Gettleman's parting gift

I will loathe that man until the day I die

 

[bbny]

Looking at how much WRs are getting on the market, it's probably wise for the Jets to draft one with one of their two 1sts. If the Giants trade Toney, they should consider potentially OT/WR combo with their 1st two picks.

 

[17futurecap]

I'm hoping for KT and Jameson Williams for the Jets, go with the high risk/high reward.

Not really interested in them taking Sauce at 4, and please no Kyle Hamilton with 4 or 10.

Not really sure what they do if the first 3 picks are Hutch/KT/Ekwonu

 

[HFsNumber1Heel]

Looking at how much WRs are getting on the market, it's probably wise for the Jets to draft one with one of their two 1sts. If the Giants trade Toney, they should consider potentially OT/WR combo with their 1st two picks.

Giants should not even be thinking about WRs or RBs at this point. They need to build the OLine or give Wink some toys. I'd be more than happy with a combo of Ekwonu/Cross/Thibodeaux for #5 and 7. I know reports say they don't love Thibodeaux's attitude but it could be poker.

Unless they're getting a first for Toney he's not going anywhere this year. He hasn't proven a thing in the NFL. Talk about a reach. Gettelman's tenure was brutal.

 

[I Eat Crow]

They're not the sexy choices, but I'd be perfectly OK with Johnson and Cross at 5 and 7. Johnson is shooting up boards fast and he's still growing as a player. I'm starting to warm up to him more and more.

Kayvon is going to drop to the lower end of the top 10, for sure. I'm not sure in which order, but I think Hutchinson, Neal, Walker, and Sauce are off the board before the Giants pick at 5. That leaves the Giants their choice of Johnson, Ekwonu, Cross, Kayvon, Stingley, Hamilton, and Lloyd.

 

[bbny]

Giants should not even be thinking about WRs or RBs at this point. They need to build the OLine or give Wink some toys. I'd be more than happy with a combo of Ekwonu/Cross/Thibodeaux for #5 and 7. I know reports say they don't love Thibodeaux's attitude but it could be poker.

Unless they're getting a first for Toney he's not going anywhere this year. He hasn't proven a thing in the NFL. Talk about a reach. Gettelman's tenure was brutal.

RB yes. WR disagree. Look at the impact of WRs around the league, and they are getting paid a large cap percentage. Tons of positional value right now. We have a Golladay anchor contract right now because we didn’t draft one and went and overpaid for one instead.

I really think the Giants need to lean offense heavily this draft. 2+ OL, TE, WR. Your high paying positions there are OT and WR.

The Giants defense was leagues ahead of the offense already. Wink can work with what’s there this year, supplemented with later round picks this draft. The Giants absolutely need offensive pieces either to support Jones OR a drafted rookie QB next year. If the infrastructure isn’t there for success in an offensive league, the defense means nothing.

 

[HFsNumber1Heel]

RB yes. WR disagree. Look at the impact of WRs around the league, and they are getting paid a large cap percentage. Tons of positional value right now. We have a Golladay anchor contract right now because we didn’t draft one and went and overpaid for one instead.

I really think the Giants need to lean offense heavily this draft. 2+ OL, TE, WR. Your high paying positions there are OT and WR.

The Giants defense was leagues ahead of the offense already. Wink can work with what’s there this year, supplemented with later round picks this draft. The Giants absolutely need offensive pieces either to support Jones OR a drafted rookie QB next year. If the infrastructure isn’t there for success in an offensive league, the defense means nothing.

The thing with WRs is they can draft one in the later rounds.

The OLine needs to be fixed for the longterm or Jones is not going to have any time to find all these guys.

 

[sbjnyc]

The thing with WRs is they can draft one in the later rounds.

The OLine needs to be fixed for the longterm or Jones is not going to have any time to find all these guys.

You can draft QBs in the later rounds too and have aout the same level of success.

 

[bernmeister]

OP, do we wanna keep this thread and possibly rename title?
Or just start a new thread make everything current for 2022?

I suggest the latter but defer, pls advise.

 

[bernmeister]

re NYJ 2 deals, 1 involving upcoming draft.

Other stuff also a need but priority #1 IMO i nail down the OL, keep Wilson safe. Can upgrade his WRs etc later. Sure, gamebreakers will be gone but high end QB arm w/enuf time can pick apart defs.

Deal 1: Jets - Chargers
LA drafted Slater, OL who can slide anywhere, in this scheme would likely be a C or a G.
Williams + Williams, (Quincy + Quinnen) both D studs that help Chargers D that needs beef/pressure, plus throw in Cameron Clark to be a depth G, + NYJ 4th round 117 OA
for
Slater + LAC 3rd = 79OA

deal 2, NYJ - DET
first 1st rounder 4OA + T George Fant
for
T Sewell

Sewell if I remember 6OA has not disappointed, Lions can get an impact player for an impact player. Dep on how they play their cards, they could flip down and add multiple higher guys incl a QB which they need.

Jets would then have OL including:
Pennel + Bechton at T
Tucker at G
Slater at either C or G, depending on what is best fit.
If everyone remains healthy, that is signif protection.
They have some guys w/size and can develop, but the above are ready day 1.

Jets can then use other picks to draft or deal for pick upgrade to address various needs

 

[ponzu4u]

All this talk about Walker going #1 OA? Don't follow college closely enough but it seems risky when a guy's rise happens entirely after the season is over. Too much time to overthink things between season ending and the draft.

If Giants end up with Cross and one of Johnson/Walker... feels like it'll sting not coming away with one of Thibideaux/Sauce/Neal/Ickey... but i don't follow CFB much

 

[Chytilmania]

I'm hoping for KT and Jameson Williams for the Jets, go with the high risk/high reward.

Not really interested in them taking Sauce at 4, and please no Kyle Hamilton with 4 or 10.

Not really sure what they do if the first 3 picks are Hutch/KT/Ekwonu

Same I want KT and Williams or Wilson. Big needs and positions we never draft in the 1st.

If Hutch/KT/Icky go then I guess Neal? That's probably worst case scenario.

 

[Filip Chytil]

McShay over at ESPN says his info points towards Walker going #1. Pauline at PFN says Baalke wants Walker, but Khan wants Hutch. Breer's column today really demonstrates how involved Khan has been this offseason. Very much at the forefront of the entire process.

Peter King in his column says "to expect a surprise" at #1.

Albert Breer notes that DET had a big showing at Oregon's pro day. Most observers seem to feel that if Hutch is there at 2, DET will take him.

McShay also said some people around the league believe Houston has Stingley ranked higher than Gardner. Breer also mentions that Houston likes Stingley and G. Wilson quite a bit. CAR is quite high on Cross as is NYG. Breer notes some PTSD around the league with tackles in a Mike Leach led offense after Andre Dillard didn't work out. Scouts believe Cross has superior core and lower body strength though. Pauline previously noted in a podcast that while Cross is believed to be the most natural LT in the draft, he never came out of a 3 pt stance in Leach's offense. Always in a 2 pt stance.

NO and LAC reportedly have interest in Penning per McShay.

Breer says JD really likes Ekonwu. Pauline previously noted that the Jets coaches really like KT, but the front office has some more concerns.

 

[17futurecap]

McShay over at ESPN says his info points towards Walker going #1. Pauline at PFN says Baalke wants Walker, but Khan wants Hutch. Breer's column today really demonstrates how involved Khan has been this offseason. Very much at the forefront of the entire process.

Peter King in his column says "to expect a surprise" at #1.

Albert Breer notes that DET had a big showing at Oregon's pro day. Most observers seem to feel that if Hutch is there at 2, DET will take him.

McShay also said some people around the league believe Houston has Stingley ranked higher than Gardner. Breer also mentions that Houston likes Stingley and G. Wilson quite a bit. CAR is quite high on Cross as is NYG. Breer notes some PTSD around the league with tackles in a Mike Leach led offense after Andre Dillard didn't work out. Scouts believe Cross has superior core and lower body strength though. Pauline previously noted in a podcast that while Cross is believed to be the most natural LT in the draft, he never came out of a 3 pt stance in Leach's offense. Always in a 2 pt stance.

NO and LAC reportedly have interest in Penning per McShay.

Breer says JD really likes Ekonwu. Pauline previously noted that the Jets coaches really like KT, but the front office has some more concerns.

Nice roundup, thanks!

 

[Filip Chytil]

This was from Breer's article:

For my money, the Hutchinson/Walker debate is the most interesting one this year. On one end, you have a hyperproductive collegiate star—good enough to become just the third defensive lineman to become a Heisman finalist in a quarter century (Hutchinson joined Chase Young and Ndamukong Suh). On the other, you have a chiseled-out-of-granite physical marvel who you have to project that production with. I asked a few guys for their take on the debate. Here are a couple of viewpoints on it …

• NFC exec: “To me, Hutchinson, you know what you’re getting—a consistent player, a 10-sack-a-year guy. The first pick, you’d imagine getting someone better. But the idea of a Myles Garrett or even a Nick Bosa, you have to get that out of your head here. He’s a good player. He’s safe. With Travon, it’s going to come down to how you use him, and how confident you are in your coaching and your scheme, and how confident you are in the person to max out his potential. … But when I walked up on the guy, I immediately said, ‘This guy’s a top-10 pick.’ The guy’s a freak. He looks like Myles Garrett.”

• AFC GM: “Trent [Baalke] drafts off traits, and I like Walker. I just think with Hutchinson, you’ve seen it, you don’t have to imagine. But yeah, Walker’s the prettiest specimen.”

• Another AFC GM: “I’d take Walker. He’s just got freaky stuff to him, and the way they used him in the 3–4 at Georgia, they didn’t just put him at one spot. He can do whatever you want. He was great as a three-technique. And he did all of it because he’s a great kid and a great teammate.”

So this really comes down to what is versus what might be. In the case of Walker, I even had one exec go so far to say he thought the Georgia 3–4 was an awkward fit for the player—and that he’d be much better served playing a traditional end role in a four-man front. But then, the trouble with that is that Walker didn’t do a whole lot with the reps he got rushing from that sort of spot (a lot of his splash plays came in chase-down situations). And, well, you get the idea. This one’s in the eye of the beholder. Which is probably another reason why the Jaguars are still talking over what they plan to do early Thursday night.

 

[bbny]

The thing with WRs is they can draft one in the later rounds.

The OLine needs to be fixed for the longterm or Jones is not going to have any time to find all these guys.

Yes 100%. Personally I think the perfect draft has the Giants getting 2 good OL with the first 3 picks, assuming the value is right. I’m in a probable minority where if the dominoes fell right and they had the opportunity to get both Neal and Ekwonu at 5 and 7, I would support the Giants in doing so. Neal at RT. Ekwonu at G and provides T depth in case Thomas regresses or Neal isn’t working…or injuries. There’s too many questions to be answered on offense, and they won’t get answered without an aggressive effort to shore up the OL. The league these days has shown that offense matters a lot more than defense.

 

[Filip Chytil]

Dane Brugler over at the Athletic says people he trusts think Johnson has a better shot at going 4 than KT.



Lots of varying reports on NYG and KT. Peter King in his article that I linked in the previous post said NYG are indeed interested in KT. Other sources (Duggan at the Athletic) have said they're not so interested.

Other notes:

-Keep an eye on CAR. The thought is they'll take a T. The big issue they have is, besides QB, they're really thin on picks in the middle part of this draft. This draft should be fairly deep in those middle rounds thanks to COVID. CAR might be a trade down candidate, but who is the team trading up? Tough to say.

-Breer and McShay both think a QB doesn't go in the first 19 picks of this draft.

-Some buzz about ATL liking Drake London from McShay and King.

-I've seen SEA at 9 linked to Stingley, Penning, J. Davis, J. Johnson.

 

[Filip Chytil]

Greg Cosell is quite high on Jermaine Johnson and not so high on KT. He also talked up Ebiketie out of Penn State and both Cosell and Ross Tucker were speaking very highly of Logan Hall the other day on Ross Tucker's podcast.

Cosell is also not a Drake London fan.

Cosell thought Ojabo showed more natural explosiveness and athleticism than Hutch did. Ojabo tore his Achilles at Michigan's Pro Day. Would've been a top 15 pick, possibly higher, had he not suffered the injury. The word is teams have a 2nd round grade on him now.

Dr. Jess Flynn is a sports medicine doctor up in Massachusetts who regularly comments on NFL injuries. She recently wrote an entire piece on an injury guide to the 2022 NFL Draft. This is what she wrote on Ojabo:

David Ojabo (Michigan) - David ruptured his achilles tendon at his pro day in March. New surgical techniques involving an “internal brace” protects the repair and allows athletes to bear weight and start rehab much sooner than they used to. Much like Adrian Peterson’s quick recovery and post-ACL tear performance adjusted the lens of how we see ACL injuries, Cam Akers’ remarkable return just five and a half months after achilles surgery has changed our expectations after achilles tears. It’s important that Akers’ recovery was remarkable, NOT typical. Any team taking Ojabo should expect that his recent injury will affect the majority of his rookie season. In the NFL, the majority of linebackers who suffer achilles injuries do return to the game, but their performance is usually decreased the first season back. While Ojabo may fall a bit in the draft due to concerns about potentially losing some of his burst, I don’t expect him to fall too far.