OT: Fitness and Nutrition XII

[Kriss E]

I don't doubt you can do it. I'm saying most people can't, definitely not after just a few weeks.

There is a common trick trainers use on noobs...if you want your clients to bite on quickly, make them deadlift. They're going to see impressive jumps in weights over the first weeks/months.

That said yes, you're not going to reach 365 without putting in some work. I think that's the most I've ever deadlifted...but again, I'm not a big fan of heavy deadlifts..

 

[Mrb1p]

There is a common trick trainers use on noobs...if you want your clients to bite on quickly, make them deadlift. They're going to see impressive jumps in weights over the first weeks/months.

That said yes, you're not going to reach 365 without putting in some work. I think that's the most I've ever deadlifted...but again, I'm not a big fan of heavy deadlifts..

Took me and my shit genes an eternity to deadlift 365 and I started at 315 pretty much. Youd think the stocky mf that I am would deadlift 700 after so much focus on strength.

All my lifts are painfully average lol

 

[waffledave]

That said yes, you're not going to reach 365 without putting in some work. I think that's the most I've ever deadlifted...but again, I'm not a big fan of heavy deadlifts..

The 365 I was referring to was for bent over rows, which I think is out of reach for most people honestly. For DL it can be done in a few months, like I said before I hit 4 plates on DL after around 5 months and that's with setbacks.

 

[Mrb1p]

The 365 I was referring to was for bent over rows, which I think is out of reach for most people honestly. For DL it can be done in a few months, like I said before I hit 4 plates on DL after around 5 months and that's with setbacks.

4 plates is insane in 5 months imo. Took me like 4 years

 

[BehindTheTimes]

This is an incredible amount of weekly mileage. Amazing work.
How long have you been running consistently? Just curious how long it took you to build to that type of mileage.

I started running consistently this past June and I am currently at around 35k a week and building. I do 2-3 weekday runs at 3-5k and a long weekend run. This past weekend I did a 19km run, which is my longest to date. I am training for a half marathon in mid-august. This is my last week of hard training that will include a 21k run, before a taper week next week, followed up by the half-marathon the following week.
I plan on increasing my mileage over the course of the rest of the summer with the goal of a marathon (no date selected but am considering the idea of entering one in October)
I am also mixing in weightlifting 2-3x a week as well as cycling 2-3x a week.

Happy to read along with your journey as I fall deeper into my passion for running.

I’ve only started in late March early April this year. I started zone 2 training where I never let my heart rate go above 180-age(43) 137. I started at 8km 5 days a week, but because I was following my heart rate it was easily sustainable. Now I do two a days with ease and gym sessions. It’s all about the heart rate. I’ve eased up on it now. I’ll let it get into 140’s.

I started at 9:40 a km and now I can do a 5km run at 5:50 and a 10km at 6:05 or so lol. I’m killing it bro, the volume is not an issue for me at all. It’s slow, but it’s all about the heart rate

 

[angusyoung]

Everyone has heard of tennis elbow,but how about tennis arm? Used my old,old one as the other was being repaired and the string were way to taught. Good thing I'm a pro at self medicating and ambidextrous and can tend to myself with my acupuncture needles and cupping kit. A few good workout sessions in the pool and some ice and should be good to go in no time

 

[BehindTheTimes]

365lb rows haha, you boys are mad. I was doing 160 and thought I was doing alright.

 

[waffledave]

4 plates is insane in 5 months imo. Took me like 4 years

I did 5x5 stronglifts. Basically DL 1-2 times per week adding 10lbs each time. Progress is pretty good following that as long as you don't get hurt. I find it's a good mix of heavy and volume. But if you don't keep it up it goes away fast. Don't think I can do 4 plates anymore, at least not for reps.

 

[Kriss E]

Took me and my shit genes an eternity to deadlift 365 and I started at 315 pretty much. Youd think the stocky mf that I am would deadlift 700 after so much focus on strength.

All my lifts are painfully average lol

I'd say 2x or 2.5x your bodyweight is about a very good level of deadlifting if you're natural. Even at that...
And as mentioned, your genetics need to be highly in favor of that. I'm 6'2 with long limbs, my range of motion screws me.

 

[Kriss E]

I did 5x5 stronglifts. Basically DL 1-2 times per week adding 10lbs each time. Progress is pretty good following that as long as you don't get hurt. I find it's a good mix of heavy and volume. But if you don't keep it up it goes away fast. Don't think I can do 4 plates anymore, at least not for reps.

A steady increase of 10lbs for months is impressive..
I don't think you should deadlift that often though...

 

[BehindTheTimes]

I did 5x5 stronglifts. Basically DL 1-2 times per week adding 10lbs each time. Progress is pretty good following that as long as you don't get hurt. I find it's a good mix of heavy and volume. But if you don't keep it up it goes away fast. Don't think I can do 4 plates anymore, at least not for reps.

I did this and 3x5 starting strength and for me starting strength was far superior. 5x5 was just too much.

 

[Mrb1p]

I'd say 2x or 2.5x your bodyweight is about a very good level of deadlifting if you're natural. Even at that...
And as mentioned, your genetics need to be highly in favor of that. I'm 6'2 with long limbs, my range of motion screws me.

Yep Im all femurs and arms so all my lifts suffer lol.

 

[Kriss E]

Yep Im all femurs and arms so all my lifts suffer lol.

I'm also turning 40 next year so I feel like I have to do dynamic stretches in bed before I can get out of it..
At least I use 60s for single arm DB curl and one arm row 120lbs.

After the summer, I'm gonna trim down seriously. I want to see my 6 pack before I turn 40 next summer again. After that, shit can go downhill real quick.

 

[Mrb1p]

I'm also turning 40 next year so I feel like I have to do dynamic stretches in bed before I can get out of it..
At least I use 60s for single arm DB curl and one arm row 120lbs.

After the summer, I'm gonna trim down seriously. I want to see my 6 pack before I turn 40 next summer again. After that, shit can go downhill real quick.

60s? Thats insane Id be scared to blow a tire.

Were 10 years apart and Im already feeling the age slow me down lol, especially recovery wise and all.

 

[Kriss E]

60s? Thats insane Id be scared to blow a tire.

Were 10 years apart and Im already feeling the age slow me down lol, especially recovery wise and all.

I use a bit of momentum but I keep it pretty clean and controlled.
Ya you get hit with a slowdown waves starting late 20s...early 30s..late 30s..
I changed my training habits though...ego stays in check. Not trying to hit new weights or PRs everytime I go to the gym. I don't fight the weights when they're heavy. But the biggest change is incorporating light days so I'm not completely beaten up and can sustain my 5-6x/week training days.

September will bring in more changes with a strong focus on nutrition and will pick up movement/yoga classes to improve my flexibility.

I've also recently added sled work as a stable for warm ups, too early to tell the impact, but hearing Ben Patrick swearing by it made me want to try it.

 

[PavelBrendl]

Spent all winter on a bike trainer and made absolutely insane fitness gains. Before riding from Montreal to NYC back in June, I'd gotten my FTP (functional threshold power) up to 340 watts.

Life got crazy busy since coming back, and I've only been riding 1-2 times per week, outside of commuting. I started hitting the gym since the time commitment is lower (45 mins- 1 hr per session, vs 1-3hrs for a good ride) and I wanted to work on my sprint power. Got back on the trainer a couple of weeks ago (I don't have a power meter on my outdoor bike) and the sprint power was there, but I couldn't believe how much I'd already lost my form. 10 minutes at 315 watts and I was absolutely shattered. Then finally got Covid last week and have been a lump since. I'm sitting here just losing my mind, thinking about all that progress going down the drain.

 

[Mrb1p]

I use a bit of momentum but I keep it pretty clean and controlled.
Ya you get hit with a slowdown waves starting late 20s...early 30s..late 30s..
I changed my training habits though...ego stays in check. Not trying to hit new weights or PRs everytime I go to the gym. I don't fight the weights when they're heavy. But the biggest change is incorporating light days so I'm not completely beaten up and can sustain my 5-6x/week training days.

September will bring in more changes with a strong focus on nutrition and will pick up movement/yoga classes to improve my flexibility.

I've also recently added sled work as a stable for warm ups, too early to tell the impact, but hearing Ben Patrick swearing by it made me want to try it.

Sleds are insane, man. Insane. Sleds, Yoke, farmers, natural rocks and other weird implements that target GPP should be a staple. Loui Simmons was onto something.
Ive been using the spud Inc. One with a tire DIY plate attachment (I shouldve just bought one, the hassle wasnt worth it lmao, it was during the height of covid.) I really like backward sled drags, killer quad workout.

 

[snakeye]

I rowed 365 last week, serpent dude is raining on my parade saying it probably looked like shit.

Haha maybe a little.. I mean you mentioned your back was injured. Considering that, I find it hard to imagine a bent over row at 365 lb.

 

[BehindTheTimes]

Just did a 5km easy run this
Morning. 5:43/km. I didn’t do a warmup and my first 2kms were 6:18 and 5:58. If I had have done a warmup I’d be at my 5:30 target I was hoping for by end of august. Either way, I should get there next week and by the end of august is basically a guarantee now. Man I love this training haha.

 

[Mrb1p]

Haha maybe a little.. I mean you mentioned your back was injured. Considering that, I find it hard to imagine a bent over row at 365 lb.

My back was injured in March 2021.

Three days ago I pulled something in my left lat by sneezing too hard. It was 2 days after rowing this.

 

[waffledave]

A steady increase of 10lbs for months is impressive..
I don't think you should deadlift that often though...

The program is basically workout A and B alternating, 3x a week. DLs are in workout B, so basically after 2 weeks you would have done 3 workouts with DLs. Also, the DLs are 1x5 instead of 5x5, though with the warm ups you end up doing 3-4 sets of 5 DLs with lower weight before you try for the 10lbs increase. I started with a low weight so I went a few months without being challenged much, but it does make a difference IMO over the long term. It was only after 3 plates that I found it really started to get hard.

I did this and 3x5 starting strength and for me starting strength was far superior. 5x5 was just too much.

Yeah I know what you mean. The 5x5s start to really become a horrible grind after a while. Especially squats since you squat every workout. Once you go above 250lbs it really starts to get brutal... You have 5 or 6 warmup sets of 5 and then 5x5 after, that's like 11 sets of 5. And it's a 5 lbs increase every workout on squats. I stopped after I hit 3 plates cause I sort of lost the motivation at that point, and the squats alone were taking me an hour with all the warmup sets.

But, I do really like the mix of volume and heavy that 5x5 gives you. I do regular cycles of hitting a target (like 3 plates squat) and then I deload by 50% or more and start again. I don't know if this really does anything for me but my body appreciates the rest and I'm not staying completely inactive. Doing the 5x5 with lower weights becomes easier and I need less rest between sets, so I can do the workouts faster too. And add in some additional auxiliary lifts.


I am seeing a huge improvement overall due to playing flag football this summer. For many years I have only done jogging and lifting weights (and spliced in with periods of doing nothing at all). I haven't done any type of high intensity stuff like football in many years. It was absolutely brutal at the start and honestly still kind of sucks for 2-3 days after a game, but the workout I get from sprinting in football is fantastic. My cardio is better, my energy is better, I am working muscles that haven't been touched in years. Even my digestion and stuff has improved. Now that the season is over I need to find another sport because the thrill of competition pushes me way above what I normally do.

 

[snakeye]

Imo 5x5 should be used in conjunction with this video clip:



Don't kill yourself doing it. Should feel more like a casual workout. I've done it before for a bit, felt a little easy but saw great results in my 3rm.

My back was injured in March 2021.

Three days ago I pulled something in my left lat by sneezing too hard. It was 2 days after rowing this.

Damn rows lol.. Had something similar happened to me a month ago after a day of pulling where I went a little hard. Felt fine but was coughing at night. The next few days I had violent back spasms so bad that I was involuntarily letting out sounds worthy of an exorcism.

 

[waffledave]

Imo 5x5 should be used in conjunction with this video clip:



Don't kill yourself doing it. Should feel more like a casual workout. I've done it before for a bit, felt a little easy but saw great results in my 3rm.

A big part of the 5x5 program is deloads. If you do feel like you killed yourself, then you deload 10% next workout. If you fail to hit your reps two workouts in a row, you deload 10%. If you miss a week of training, you deload 10% (and 30% if you miss 2 weeks). You should never go to failure. If you did it counts as a failed attempt.

The progression is important too. You don't start 5x5 at a high weight. If you've never done it before, you start literally with just the bar. You won't feel challenged for a long time and it will feel easy, but like the guy said in the video, you will be able to keep it up, be consistent, less injuries, better form, etc... and the build-up will still give you some gains.

I used to avoid the deloads and ended up hurting my shoulder bad enough that I couldn't do shit for 6 months. Sprained my AC joint and my arm was in as sling forever. I actually thought I broke my collarbone.

Now if I don't feel I did well enough on a lift to progress and add weight next time, I won't, and sometimes I will even deload a bit. I don't care about the constant "only-up" attitude anymore. I know I CAN do it since I've done it before, so I can instead focus on being consistent. Maybe I'm not following the 5x5 rules to the letter but I am still enjoying myself and getting benefits out of it.

 

[Kriss E]

Imo 5x5 should be used in conjunction with this video clip:



Don't kill yourself doing it. Should feel more like a casual workout. I've done it before for a bit, felt a little easy but saw great results in my 3rm.

Don't think it should feel like a casual workout though. You need to put in the effort. The point of staying around a 70-80% range is that you can do it more often, and if you want to progress, you will have to augment volume/weight.

Training to failure is more of an old school approach, but very much like lighter training, it needs to be designed properly. Think of the conjugate system who'll push max strength 2x/week but the other two days are light-dynamic work days.
What Firas is saying has been around for a while though, Pavel Tsatsouline has been saying it for over two decades, pretty sure Firas even refers to him during the full Rogan episode.

 

[Mrb1p]

Don't think it should feel like a casual workout though. You need to put in the effort. The point of staying around a 70-80% range is that you can do it more often, and if you want to progress, you will have to augment volume/weight.

Training to failure is more of an old school approach, but very much like lighter training, it needs to be designed properly. Think of the conjugate system who'll push max strength 2x/week but the other two days are light-dynamic work days.
What Firas is saying has been around for a while though, Pavel Tsatsouline has been saying it for over two decades, pretty sure Firas even refers to him during the full Rogan episode.

Its not old school, theres plenty of new studies that show that failure still is king. RP and Mike Israetel have a lot of info on this

The notion that a workout should feel casual is... I dont know? I guess its fine for general health.