First Impressions of St. Louis

[Ranger Angst]

Don'T the Rangers have pro scouts ? How they evaluated MSL is deplorable. Moneyball for the Rangers would be great .

 

[Fitzy]

When you are purported to be a superstar and one of the best players in the league, you should not have to rely on other people to make you a good player.

I agree, but every star works better with certain players. Crosby plays with Kunitz, not Malkin or Neal, for a reason. Gaborik played better with Christensen than Drury, Jagr played better with Dubinsky than Gomez.

 

[SingnBluesOnBroadway]

Yup, he didn't recoup the picks traded away for Nash or Clowe, so why start now?

Other GMs understand the value of high draft picks. Especially in a salary cap world.

 

[SingnBluesOnBroadway]

One of our top pair D and leading PPG player were undrafted.

And for every Dan Girardi and MZA, there are 10 Thomas Pocks and Matt Gilroys.

 

[Son of Steinbrenner]

Giving up a 1st next year sucks but hopefully it's a late 1st round pick. I just can't understand certain posters continuing to **** on this trade after a few games. Does anybody think St. Louis is washed up, after being traded to the Rangers? The guy is struggling but that doesn't mean it's over for him...

What I find amazing is this obsession with draft picks. We have posters who call the system empty yet refuse to see that Miller, Fast, Lindberg, Kristo, Allen, and Mcllrath are in the system and ALL COULD contribute next season. As much as some posters like to pretend this is 2004 and the system is barren, it's not 2004, the system is decent, and the Rangers have depth.

Did they have to include a 2015 1st round pick? I wish they didn't but the entry draft is one way to add young talent to the team.

This obsession with running down St. Louis after a few game is both sad and predictable. When somebody posts

When you are purported to be a superstar and one of the best players in the league, you should not have to rely on other people to make you a good player.

I just have to laugh. As if Ranger fans are calling St. Louis a superstar based on nothing. As if every player that joins a team does so seamlessly. As if St. Louis ISN'T a star player and hasn't earned his status in the game. The fact is certain posters have an agenda and to say St. Louis should not have to rely on other people is simply the dumbest argument I've seen on this board in a long time. What player can do it on their own? That's the level we've taken this argument? Jesus, some things never change....

Nothing wrong with hating the trade, nothing wrong with hating giving up a 1st round pick, but the nonsense in this thread is laughable and predictable.....

 

[aufheben]

So, he is a "superstar", but shouldn't be expected to make things happen on his own? Ok.

 

[Bluenote13]

Giving up a 1st next year sucks but hopefully it's a late 1st round pick. I just can't understand certain posters continuing to **** on this trade after a few games. Does anybody think St. Louis is washed up, after being traded to the Rangers? The guy is struggling but that doesn't mean it's over for him...

What I find amazing is this obsession with draft picks. We have posters who call the system empty yet refuse to see that Miller, Fast, Lindberg, Kristo, Allen, and Mcllrath are in the system and ALL COULD contribute next season. As much as some posters like to pretend this is 2004 and the system is barren, it's not 2004, the system is decent, and the Rangers have depth.

Did they have to include a 2015 1st round pick? I wish they didn't but the entry draft is one way to add young talent to the team.

This obsession with running down St. Louis after a few game is both sad and predictable. When somebody posts

I just have to laugh. As if Ranger fans are calling St. Louis a superstar based on nothing. As if every player that joins a team does so seamlessly. As if St. Louis ISN'T a star player and hasn't earned his status in the game. The fact is certain posters have an agenda and to say St. Louis should not have to rely on other people is simply the dumbest argument I've seen on this board in a long time. What player can do it on their own? That's the level we've taken this argument? Jesus, some things never change....

Nothing wrong with hating the trade, nothing wrong with hating giving up a 1st round pick, but the nonsense in this thread is laughable and predictable.....

You are using 'agenda' as your excuse.....

Excuses, excuses, excuses......

All that matters is RESULTS! Wake up !!!!!!

 

[Cake or Death]

Apparently. It's funny though, how the "pessimists" are the ones who won't settle for mediocrity, i.e. the ones who want the team to be the best they can possibly be. I enjoy watching the team just as much as anyone; that doesn't mean I don't want them to be better.

Not just gonna pretend the flaws don't exist.

Are you suggesting every fan of the team does not want the team to be the best it can be? No one should be debating that, that's idiotic. This is not a matter of people settling for mediocrity or not. Fact is, none of us have control over what the team does, whining over it won't change it. But that's what negative people do: act with negativity. The positive minded people, I would guess, aren't overly worried about what the NYR do. Me personally? I don't play on the team and I don't need a vicarious Cup through a team I don't play on. I follow the NYR cuz I love hockey and grew up in NYC. This is entertainment to me, nothing more. Beyond that, I have real goals to focus on and there are bigger, more significant fish to fry in my life.

 

[aufheben]

What interest is a discussion if the people having it don't even care about what they're discussing?

 

[Bluenote13]

Are you suggesting every fan of the team does not want the team to be the best it can be? No one should be debating that, that's idiotic. This is not a matter of people settling for mediocrity or not. Fact is, none of us have control over what the team does, whining over it won't change it. But that's what negative people do: act with negativity. The positive minded people, I would guess, aren't overly worried about what the NYR do. Me personally? I don't play on the team and I don't need a vicarious Cup through a team I don't play on. I follow the NYR cuz I love hockey and grew up in NYC. This is entertainment to me, nothing more. Beyond that, I have real goals to focus on and there are bigger, more significant fish to fry in my life.

You said this is entertainment for you, what are you doing on a Rangers message board? Looking for new positive chants ? Are you being entertained ? Shouldn't you be out in the world being a positive non whining winner ?

 

[McRanger]

The Rangers, or any team in a cap world, need to wary of moving too many picks. Specifically high picks.

And if they do move them, they need to make up the difference by drafting quality players outside the top 60. A team doesn't have to live or die by 1st or 2nd round picks, but it often does.

As for St. Louis, he needs to start producing. I have no reason to think he won't, but time is running out for him to make an impact this year.

 

[Bleed Ranger Blue]

The Rangers, or any team in a cap world, need to wary of moving too many picks. Specifically high picks.

And if they do move them, they need to make up the difference by drafting quality players outside the top 60. A team doesn't have to live or die by 1st or 2nd round picks, but it often does.

As for St. Louis, he needs to start producing. I have no reason to think he won't, but time is running out for him to make an impact this year.

I think a good argument can be made that, over the last decade, the Rangers have been very good at drafting outside of the 1st round.

I'd work on getting better players in the 1st round rather than being so willing to chuck those picks into trades, but thats just me. I'd love to know what Sather is thinking, but that seems to change on a whim.

 

[McRanger]

I think a good argument can be made that, over the last decade, the Rangers have been very good at drafting outside of the 1st round.

I'd work on getting better players in the 1st round rather than being so willing to chuck those picks into trades, but thats just me. I'd love to know what Sather is thinking, but that seems to change on a whim.

Since the '05 lockout the Rangers have drafted reasonably well in the top 60.

They have not drafted well outside of the top 60. Aside from Hagelin I don't think they've drafted a single top 9/top 4 player.

To offset losing picks they need to pick up players in this draft and the next, outside the top 60, that will eventually have some sort of impact with the big club.

It's an inadvisable strategy but you can get away with being flippant with 1st and 2nd rounders, like Detroit was in the decade leading up to its '08-'09 SCF teams, if you can kill it in the middle rounds.

The Rangers haven't shown any ability to do that. At all.

 

[Jersey Girl]

What I find amazing is this obsession with draft picks. We have posters who call the system empty yet refuse to see that Miller, Fast, Lindberg, Kristo, Allen, and Mcllrath are in the system and ALL COULD contribute next season. As much as some posters like to pretend this is 2004 and the system is barren, it's not 2004, the system is decent, and the Rangers have depth.

Funny thing is, when it comes to prospects, scouts rank the Rangers prospects as a team at or near the bottom of the league. And that's BEFORE we begin to feel the effects of Sather trading away so many first and second round draft picks in consecutive years.

 

[Bleed Ranger Blue]

Since the '05 lockout the Rangers have drafted reasonably well in the top 60.

They have not drafted well outside of the top 60. Aside from Hagelin I don't think they've drafted a single top 9/top 4 player.

To offset losing picks they need to pick up players in this draft and the next, outside the top 60, that will eventually have some sort of impact with the big club.

It's an inadvisable strategy but you can get away with being flippant with 1st and 2nd rounders, like Detroit was in the decade leading up to its '08-'09 SCF teams, if you can kill it in the middle rounds.

The Rangers haven't shown any ability to do that. At all.

Agreed.

I understand why the Rangers can't get top-end offensive talent through the draft. I get that.

I have no clue why the Rangers can't develop 3rd/4th liners internally with later picks. Its inexcusable.

 

[TheDirtyH]

Funny thing is, when it comes to prospects, scouts rank the Rangers prospects as a team at or near the bottom of the league. And that's BEFORE we begin to feel the effects of Sather trading away so many first and second round draft picks in consecutive years.

San Jose has been the same story for a while, actually more. There's no one right way to do things.

 

[SingnBluesOnBroadway]

You said this is entertainment for you, what are you doing on a Rangers message board? Looking for new positive chants ? Are you being entertained ? Shouldn't you be out in the world being a positive non whining winner ?

Maximus! Maximus! Maximus!

 

[Son of Steinbrenner]

Funny thing is, when it comes to prospects, scouts rank the Rangers prospects as a team at or near the bottom of the league. And that's BEFORE we begin to feel the effects of Sather trading away so many first and second round draft picks in consecutive years.

Funny thing is those rankings can change after this season is complete. Funny thing is the players I mentioned can all contribute to the Rangers next season. Funny thing is the Rangers will have a chance to trade for a 1st or 2nd round pick next year. Funny thing is the draft is only one way to improve a roster. Funny thing is those rankings don't mean anything.

Funny thing is once a player is drafted nobody cares WHERE he came from. Want proof? Nobody mentions the Rangers have the 6th pick in the 2006 draft on the roster. Nobody mentions the Rangers have the 4th pick in the 2005 draft. The Rangers had one first round pick in 2009, yet we have two on the current roster. Do you get what I'm saying? It sucks the Rangers don't have a 2015 1st round pick but that doesn't mean they won't eventually have a player drafted in the 1st round in 2015.

The Rangers shouldn't have traded a 1st for Callahan but it's not the end of the world. Certain posters like to pretend the system is barren when it isn't. Certain posters like to regurgitate the same arguments from 10 years ago, when the Rangers actually had zero depth in the system. Like I said, it's both laughable and predictable....

 

[Jersey Girl]

The Rangers shouldn't have traded a 1st for Callahan but it's not the end of the world. Certain posters like to pretend the system is barren when it isn't. Certain posters like to regurgitate the same arguments from 10 years ago, when the Rangers actually had zero depth in the system. Like I said, it's both laughable and predictable....

Yeah, not barren, just ranked really low in comparison to other teams. Ranking prospects is an inexact science, but people like to talk about our prospect pool like it's at the top of the league. Laughable and predictable.

It's not...it's ranked closer to the bottom.

 

[Son of Steinbrenner]

Yeah, not barren, just ranked really low in comparison to other teams. Ranking prospects is an inexact science, but people like to talk about our prospect pool like it's at the top of the league. Laughable and predictable.

It's not...it's ranked closer to the bottom.

Yet we have prospects that can come in and legitimately compete for a spots in camp next season. It's a weird concept I know, and we will have posters that rip those kids apart YET will pine for whatever unknown 1st round pick that we won't have a chance to draft after next season..

 

[Thirty One]

Yet we have prospects that can come in and legitimately compete for a spots in camp next season. It's a weird concept I know, and we will have posters that rip those kids apart YET will pine for whatever unknown 1st round pick that we won't have a chance to draft after next season..

So much this.

 

[Jersey Girl]

Yet we have prospects that can come in and legitimately compete for a spots in camp next season. It's a weird concept I know, and we will have posters that rip those kids apart YET will pine for whatever unknown 1st round pick that we won't have a chance to draft after next season..

And yet other teams also have prospects that can come in and compete next season - weird concept, I know - and in some cases this season.

And scouts' general consensus is their prospects are rated more highly than our prospects. Weird concept, I know.

Of course you'll bring us back to 'anything can happen, those are just rankings', which has some merit. but just like there is a chance our low ranking is too low, there is also a chance our low ranking is too high. Weird concept, I know.

 

[jskramer83]

Yeah, not barren, just ranked really low in comparison to other teams. Ranking prospects is an inexact science, but people like to talk about our prospect pool like it's at the top of the league. Laughable and predictable.

It's not...it's ranked closer to the bottom.

It's all relative, a major reason for this is because most of our top prospects from the past 4 years are no longer prospects and playing for us.

We might be low now, but also have some good young talent as our NHL players

 

[Jersey Girl]

It's all relative, a major reason for this is because most of our top prospects from the past 4 years are no longer prospects and playing for us.

We might be low now, but also have some good young talent as our NHL players

The same can be said about a lot of other teams. This natural attrition is taken into account by scouts when ranking prospects.

 

[Son of Steinbrenner]

And yet other teams also have prospects that can come in and compete next season - weird concept, I know - and in some cases this season.

So do the Rangers. Do you know who number 20 is? That's Chris Kreider, he will probably finish in the top 3 for in the Calder voting this season. Who is the backup goalie on the Rangers? Cam Talbot....Gee, I wonder what system he came from. Has Talbot been important to the team this year? Who is this young guy J T Miller? Is he on the roster? Has he been given chances to improve the roster this season. When the Rangers defense was banged up, did Connor Allan come in and play well? Did the Rangers borrow him from another team? The Rangers had Fast on the roster the first month of the year and he's had a good year developing in Hartford. Who is this guy Lindberg that will compete for the 3rd/4th line center role next year? Gee, I hope he's a Ranger prospect. Wow, other teams will have prospects too...That's amazing!

And scouts' general consensus is their prospects are rated more highly than our prospects. Weird concept, I know.

What scouts have given this "general consensus"? You said scouts so start naming some.

Of course you'll bring us back to 'anything can happen, those are just rankings', which has some merit. but just like there is a chance our low ranking is too low, there is also a chance our low ranking is too high. Weird concept, I know

So you say I'll say anything can happen and then come back with

just like there is a chance our low ranking is too low, there is also a chance our low ranking is too high.

Ya know, I can interpret that as you saying anything can happen. Hmm, if we are ranked too low or too high that might mean......gasp....Anything can happen.......