Fire Ken Holland: 2022-2023 edition

[TopShelfGloveSide]

Yeah I got a lengthy ban at that time.

By that same measure one winning streak doesn’t redeem Hollands body of work. If the team has another lengthy playoff run then we will reevaluate.

Ahh that’s fair enough. My fault.

 

[GOilers88]

The issue isn't so much the exact spot in the standings. Personally I'd actually rather finish 2nd/3rd in the division than 1st b/c I'd much rather deal with a team like Vegas/Seattle/Calgary/LA than the impending threat of wildcard seed Colorado with all their players coming back from injury right before playoffs. The issue is the team isn't playing up to standard against strong teams for the most part and once you're 1 or 2 rounds in the playoffs you'll almost certainly be up against powerhouse teams barring some Cinderella run carried by an opposing goalie.

The fact that for the first 3 months of the season the fanbase was copiuming about the easy January to February stretch of games is alarming in and of itself. The copium ended up working out with teams like the Ducks and Sharks spotting us some free wins, but a contender shouldn't need it in the first place. If you're truly a great team you're the reason that opposing team's schedules are hard, you shouldn't be the one circling the Anaheims/SJs/Arizonas/Chicagos on the clendar.

I thought they've generally played well against the stronger teams. They've beaten Vegas, Seattle, Carolina, Tampa, NYR, Pittsburgh, Minnesota, and Dallas so far. Sure a couple of teams like St. Louis and Washington have gotten the better of them, but there's still a bunch of hockey left to be played.

I find the playing down to lesser teams to be the bigger issue, but most of them won't be in the playoffs anyways, and if they do make it I still think the Oil would come out on top.

Every team hits a funk at some point, and I don't see anything wrong with enjoying a few tune up games against the bottom half to get yourself back on track.

 

[Spawn]

I thought they've generally played well against the stronger teams. They've beaten Vegas, Seattle, Carolina, Tampa, NYR, Pittsburgh, Minnesota, and Dallas so far. Sure a couple of teams like St. Louis and Washington have gotten the better of them, but there's still a bunch of hockey left to be played.

I find the playing down to lesser teams to be the bigger issue, but most of them won't be in the playoffs anyways, and if they do make it I still think the Oil would come out on top.

Every team hits a funk at some point, and I don't see anything wrong with enjoying a few tune up games against the bottom half to get yourself back on track.

Oilers are a ~.500 team against playoff teams. The only reason they are in the spot they’re in is because they tend to beat up on the dregs of the league.

 

[GOilers88]

Oilers are a ~.500 team against playoff teams. The only reason they are in the spot they’re in is because they tend to beat up on the dregs of the league.

They've shown they can beat the top teams repeatedly. Maybe that's different over a 7 game series, but we've seen them beat or at least hang with the top dogs.

 

[AM]

Its also on the players. How good are the fprwards at defence? How much do they help out?

It’s all on the forwards. They are back checking more now so the defense and goalies look better.

 

[JustNapalmIt]

Oilers are a ~.500 team against playoff teams. The only reason they are in the spot they’re in is because they tend to beat up on the dregs of the league.

Imagine being this obtuse

Yeah I got a lengthy ban at that time.

By that same measure one winning streak doesn’t redeem Hollands body of work. If the team has another lengthy playoff run then we will reevaluate.

Well, if one actually followed along, it doesnt need redeeming.
So theres that.
But thats kinda hard

 

[MessierII]

The issue isn't so much the exact spot in the standings. Personally I'd actually rather finish 2nd/3rd in the division than 1st b/c I'd much rather deal with a team like Vegas/Seattle/Calgary/LA than the impending threat of wildcard seed Colorado with all their players coming back from injury right before playoffs. The issue is the team isn't playing up to standard against strong teams for the most part and once you're 1 or 2 rounds in the playoffs you'll almost certainly be up against powerhouse teams barring some Cinderella run carried by an opposing goalie.

The fact that for the first 3 months of the season the fanbase was copiuming about the easy January to February stretch of games is alarming in and of itself. The copium ended up working out with teams like the Ducks and Sharks spotting us some free wins, but a contender shouldn't need it in the first place. If you're truly a great team you're the reason that opposing team's schedules are hard, you shouldn't be the one circling the Anaheims/SJs/Arizonas/Chicagos on the clendar.

We’ve had wins against lots of the best teams all year though. We’ve beat Carolina, Tampa twice, Florida twice, Vegas twice, Dallas. This teams shown they can beat the best. That hasn’t really been an issue at all.

 

[Spawn]

Imagine being this obtuse

which part

 

[Trafalgar Sadge Law]

I thought they've generally played well against the stronger teams. They've beaten Vegas, Seattle, Carolina, Tampa, NYR, Pittsburgh, Minnesota, and Dallas so far. Sure a couple of teams like St. Louis and Washington have gotten the better of them, but there's still a bunch of hockey left to be played.

I find the playing down to lesser teams to be the bigger issue, but most of them won't be in the playoffs anyways, and if they do make it I still think the Oil would come out on top.

Every team hits a funk at some point, and I don't see anything wrong with enjoying a few tune up games against the bottom half to get yourself back on track.

We’ve had wins against lots of the best teams all year though. We’ve beat Carolina, Tampa twice, Florida twice, Vegas twice, Dallas. This teams shown they can beat the best. That hasn’t really been an issue at all.

IDK even in some of the games we won vs potential playoff teams it felt like we were getting beatdown hard with Skinner and McDrai magic stealing us a game. Both games vs the Flames, the Blues win, the Wild win, and one of the Panther wins off the top of my head all felt like this with the opposing team caving in our non McDrai lines but Skinner stonewalling them, often with a save count starting with a 4. Also while we split the series vs Carolina and Dallas etc so far record wise, it certainly felt like we were getting beaten down like dogs (though that might be a Jack Campbell glove induced illusion, I think I'm traumatized from those two games). The only times I felt we were completely abusing a potential playoff team so far this season were the Pittsburgh game, the recent Seattle game, and the two Islanders games (one of which we lost, props to you Sorokin and f*** you Campbell).

I do agree there's nothing wrong with collecting some free points against the dregs of the league, but come later playoff rounds there's no more free wins. Even vs LA and Calgary last season we had to fight tooth and nail to get a lot of those wins and Colorado/Tampa were a whole different story from those two. Obviously even a dynasty level team can have games where they get their shit pushed in, but for once I'd like to be the team opposing teams circle on the calendar as a threat and not the team circling San Jose on the calendar for charity wins.

 

[GOilers88]

IDK even in some of the games we won vs potential playoff teams it felt like we were getting beatdown hard with Skinner and McDrai magic stealing us a game. Both games vs the Flames, the Blues win, the Wild win, and one of the Panther wins off the top of my head all felt like this with the opposing team caving in our non McDrai lines but Skinner stonewalling them, often with a save count starting with a 4. Also while we split the series vs Carolina and Dallas etc so far record wise, it certainly felt like we were getting beaten down like dogs (though that might be a Jack Campbell glove induced illusion, I think I'm traumatized from those two games). The only times I felt we were completely abusing a potential playoff team so far this season were the Pittsburgh game, the recent Seattle game, and the two Islanders games (one of which we lost, props to you Sorokin and f*** you Campbell).

I do agree there's nothing wrong with collecting some free points against the dregs of the league, but come later playoff rounds there's no more free wins. Even vs LA and Calgary last season we had to fight tooth and nail to get a lot of those wins and Colorado/Tampa were a whole different story from those two. Obviously even a dynasty level team can have games where they get their shit pushed in, but for once I'd like to be the team opposing teams circle on the calendar as a threat and not the team circling San Jose on the calendar for charity wins.

I get where you're coming from, and I won't say I completely disagree, moreso that I guess maybe we just see some of those games a little differently. I will say however that if it felt like Skinner was stealing us wins, then that's one more thing we can cross off the list of things people have been saying we never get for a while now. I don't want to just write those off, because it seems oftentimes a big point of contention around here is that opposing teams sometimes don't deserve to win but we always seem to have the 2nd best goalie and they do. If we're getting games where that goes our way, I'm not going to knock it.

I'm certainly not going to say the Oilers are a great team. They definitely have some holes. But I think overall when they all play hard, they can, and have, beaten even the best of teams. It comes down to consistency and finding the right piece to add down the stretch. McDrai are always going to give the boys an edge, and will often be the big standout for wins, but imo that's just the beauty of having two guys that are that good. We can definitely upgrade, but I think we're pretty close, especially if Skinner continues to improve and Campbell continues to settle in. The team doesn't have to be great up and down the lineup precisely because they have McDrai.

Just my opinion of course.

 

[MessierII]

IDK even in some of the games we won vs potential playoff teams it felt like we were getting beatdown hard with Skinner and McDrai magic stealing us a game. Both games vs the Flames, the Blues win, the Wild win, and one of the Panther wins off the top of my head all felt like this with the opposing team caving in our non McDrai lines but Skinner stonewalling them, often with a save count starting with a 4. Also while we split the series vs Carolina and Dallas etc so far record wise, it certainly felt like we were getting beaten down like dogs (though that might be a Jack Campbell glove induced illusion, I think I'm traumatized from those two games). The only times I felt we were completely abusing a potential playoff team so far this season were the Pittsburgh game, the recent Seattle game, and the two Islanders games (one of which we lost, props to you Sorokin and f*** you Campbell).

I do agree there's nothing wrong with collecting some free points against the dregs of the league, but come later playoff rounds there's no more free wins. Even vs LA and Calgary last season we had to fight tooth and nail to get a lot of those wins and Colorado/Tampa were a whole different story from those two. Obviously even a dynasty level team can have games where they get their shit pushed in, but for once I'd like to be the team opposing teams circle on the calendar as a threat and not the team circling San Jose on the calendar for charity wins.

We’ve barely played the bottom teams. That’s why we have the most games vs the bottom 10 left in the nhl.

Also you need to watch more hockey outside of the oilers. You think Boston has only won won games they outplayed their opponent this year? Good teams find ways to win games even when they don’t play well. Sometimes a goalie steals a game, sometimes the pp goes off, sometimes the stars steal one. That’s literally the mark of a good team. Finding ways to win even when you don’t play your best.

 

[KeithIsActuallyBad]

if I were Holland I wouldn’t look at that Nurse contract.

 

[Spawn]

This thread is too much.


very quiet in here, where did you guys go?

Nice timing on the bump.

 

[Mr Kot]

Can i come in and hate Holland again? is that allowed?

 

[CantHaveTkachev]

Can i come in and hate Holland again? is that allowed?

yup, Oilers lost

start with some talking points:
- Nurse contract
- defense
- lack of depth in the bottom 6

that should cover it

 

[Mr Kot]

yup, Oilers lost

start with some talking points:
- Nurse contract
- defense
- lack of depth in the bottom 6

that should cover it

thanks was really tired and couldnt post it. this saves time.

 

[oobga]

 

[Old Boys Club]

This guy has had nearly 4 years to improve the team and has not done diddly f***ing squat.

Are you ready for him to trade a 1st + 2nd for Lafferty and Edmundson, because that's what you're getting not some Karlsson or Chychrun pipedreams.

 

[5 Mins 4 Ftg]

Legendary Patience.

 

[SwedishFire]

This guy has had nearly 4 years to improve the team and has not done diddly f***ing squat.

Are you ready for him to trade a 1st + 2nd for Lafferty and Edmundson, because that's what you're getting not some Karlsson or Chychrun pipedreams.

He has done a massive job, its his signings of Nurse and Barrie as 1st pair that failed hard and setback the whole team defense. Nurse isnt just a great defensive player he needs to be.

 

[9GWG9]

A few warts but when compared to Chiarelli and what he inherited how could you.

 

[Stoneman89]

I thought they've generally played well against the stronger teams. They've beaten Vegas, Seattle, Carolina, Tampa, NYR, Pittsburgh, Minnesota, and Dallas so far. Sure a couple of teams like St. Louis and Washington have gotten the better of them, but there's still a bunch of hockey left to be played.

I find the playing down to lesser teams to be the bigger issue, but most of them won't be in the playoffs anyways, and if they do make it I still think the Oil would come out on top.

Every team hits a funk at some point, and I don't see anything wrong with enjoying a few tune up games against the bottom half to get yourself back on track.

I don't think there was a lot of joy from playing the sisters of the poor recently. Every single game was a struggle, regardless of result.

 

[Stoneman89]

He has done a massive job, its his signings of Nurse and Barrie as 1st pair that failed hard and setback the whole team defense. Nurse isnt just a great defensive player he needs to be.

Nurse isn't a very good offensive option. And I certainly wouldn't classify him as a defensive whiz. So, the question becomes, what is he? A good skater, and a big body. But he does seem to have issues trying to go against other big bodies too many times, and his decision making in general seems to be head scratching even at this stage in his career. He is now a veteran with lots of games under his belt. I wish he'd play like one, but I just can't see it.

 

[BlackDogg]

Holland's giant watch stopped.

 

[bestmyfeeling]

i thought this was hilarious, and probably somewhat true tbh HAHA