swiftwin
★SUMMER.OF.STEVE★
- Jul 26, 2005
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The PK dropped hard at the end because of goaltending. Weren't we like top 5 just a few weeks ago?
Proposal: Fire DJ Smith
- Thread starter KevinRedkey
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The PK dropped hard at the end because of goaltending. Weren't we like top 5 just a few weeks ago?
SensHulk
Registered User
There’s no guarantee down years might not happen again next season. I hate to say it, but what if stutzle injures his shoulder early next season? Been the trend for the last two years…
We need a coach that can overcome that. These personal milestones and accomplishments are great but we also saw a horrendous defensive awareness by DBC and Batherson (worst plus/minus). Chabot struggled but nothing was seemingly being done to get him out of the funk.
I’ve alluded to lack of accountability so many times (and that could also very well come down to lack of depth) but there needs to be an objective eye to why we missed the playoffs despite taking several steps forward. It was right there for the taking, and we had a top 4 dman in Chychrun right before going on the western road trip.
DJ doesn’t prep his team well enough for important games and he doesn’t know how to adjust when things get tough especially when our top scorers can’t do anything in important games. I love that he protects his players and that’s commendable but time and time again we see them throw away winnable games.
How about DJ’s road record? We had like 2 wins on the road since the trade deadline (Seattle and Pitt). When was the last time we had a convincing road win? MTL in late Feb? There was no reason this team should have been shut out by Chicago when they were at their highest point of the season on a 5 game winning streak.
Sens in Process
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- Oct 1, 2012
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DaveMatthew
Bring in Peter
Listening to people give this team and coach high fives for their performance this season is so funny. As if making the playoffs is some herculean task. It's not. Winning the cup is tough. Making the playoffs is not. Let's break it down:
• 16 of 32 (50%) teams make the playoffs.
• But every year, there are 5-7 teams that know they don't have a chance and aren't really trying to make it (this year it was Arizona, Chicago, Montreal, San Jose, Columbus and Anaheim).
• So to qualify this season you had to be in the top 62% of teams actually competing.
• We finished 21st out of 26 competing teams!
Crazy how far the standards in this market have fallen. Participation and good vibe trophies all around. Listening to some of the quotes, DJ's losing mentality seems to be rubbing off on a lot of the players. These guys need someone to come in and actually tell them what it takes to win.
• 16 of 32 (50%) teams make the playoffs.
• But every year, there are 5-7 teams that know they don't have a chance and aren't really trying to make it (this year it was Arizona, Chicago, Montreal, San Jose, Columbus and Anaheim).
• So to qualify this season you had to be in the top 62% of teams actually competing.
• We finished 21st out of 26 competing teams!
Crazy how far the standards in this market have fallen. Participation and good vibe trophies all around. Listening to some of the quotes, DJ's losing mentality seems to be rubbing off on a lot of the players. These guys need someone to come in and actually tell them what it takes to win.
Emerica
Registered User
- May 29, 2010
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These kids saying all the right stuff about DJ have only had him as a coach in the league. He’s their buddy, a player’s coach, of course they want him back. Even if they didn’t they wouldn’t say it publicly.
DaveMatthew
Bring in Peter
When the players on a losing team "love" their coach it's a sign of a pretty big problem. Soft, country club locker room. Not surprising though. These guys go out, make mistakes, lose games... and the coaches/management tell them how amazing and great and special they are.
Would a guy like MacKinnon, Crosby, Kucherov or McDavid ever come out and pat himself on the back for finishing 21st in the league?
The quotes coming out are worse than "respect in the handshake line" Keefe. Loser mentality.
Ya, it probably is
Read an article today in the Athletic on the Penguins who just fired Hextall and Bruke. I'm not surprised by that. Regarding Sullivan, they highlighted that Crosby and Malkin were big Sullivan fans.
I won't be surprised to see one or both of our guys shown the exit. New ownership has its privileges. But I'm fine with both staying. Hard way to start a new ownership tenure by coming in and shit canning the coach that the young stars like.
I think it's also noteworthy that Smith is back at the worlds with Team Canada.
You’re obviously entitled to your opinion and all. But I’ll trust actual NHL experienced players like Marc Methot who are contradicting what you think you know
DaveMatthew
Bring in Peter
Lol. Life is full of nuance. But pro sports is as black-and-white an industry as there is. There's a scoreboard. Wins and losses. It's easy to see who's bad and who's good.
We just missed the playoffs for the 6th straight year. We finished 21st out of 32 teams. This is not a success.
I think DJ thought the question was about the arena PA system. I agree they can both use upgrades Deej.
Micklebot
Moderator
- Apr 27, 2010
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We finished exactly where preseason projections had us in spite of some significant injury set backs
, but along the way showed some pretty significant developments from guys like Tkachuk, Stützle, Sanderson and Brannstrom.
Here's where the athletic had us, along with a link to the write-up if you have a subscription. A projection like this probably isn't accounting for the team being top 5 in Lost WAR from injuries, or looking at the team knowing that they'll be missing both NHL goalies at the same time for nearly a full month.
So you can complain about how this season was a failure because we missed the playoffs, or you evaluate performance taking into account realistic expectations and mitigating factors. The two appear to be mutually exclusive options.
, but along the way showed some pretty significant developments from guys like Tkachuk, Stützle, Sanderson and Brannstrom.
Here's where the athletic had us, along with a link to the write-up if you have a subscription. A projection like this probably isn't accounting for the team being top 5 in Lost WAR from injuries, or looking at the team knowing that they'll be missing both NHL goalies at the same time for nearly a full month.
So you can complain about how this season was a failure because we missed the playoffs, or you evaluate performance taking into account realistic expectations and mitigating factors. The two appear to be mutually exclusive options.
Wins and Losses are objectively measurable but determining success any given year for an NHL team is completely subjective except for 1 team that wins it all. Ultimately 31 teams end the year disappointed. All I care about is seeing the team tangibly improve year to year and I think a 13 point improvement from last year, all things considered, accomplished that.
DaveMatthew
Bring in Peter
When evaluating the past: focus on "realistic expectations" and mitigating factors
When projecting the future: take a completely over-optimistic view
That sums up many Sens fan.
You're right, this team largely met external expectations this season. But the external view of the Ottawa Senators is much harsher than what fans on this board or Sens Twitter think.
The external view is that this team, as currently constructed, (from a roster + coaching perspective) is not going to be a legitimate cup contender over the next 3-4 seasons. If you asked the Athletic to project the top 10 NHL teams over the next 4 years, I doubt anyone puts Ottawa on that list. Most analysts would say we'll be in the conversation for a wildcard, but not a real threat.
Pretty disappointing state and outlook after 6 years of rebuilding.
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Agent Zuuuub
Registered User
- Jan 2, 2015
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he lets them play how they want, with no repercussions and accountability for losing.
cherry picking and blowing defensive coverage for offense. of course they love him.
cherry picking and blowing defensive coverage for offense. of course they love him.
Micklebot
Moderator
- Apr 27, 2010
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Oh, are you staff on the athletic, didn't realize you spoke for them and how they view the outlook of the team.
Pretty much everytime I hear guys like Ferraro, Poulin or Mike Johnson, they are really complimentary on the teams future outlook.
But they're obviously wrong, it's Doom and gloom I tell ya,
BoardsofCanada
Registered User
Why is this so hard to believe? Our players are just not as good... not as experienced. Why is that such a reach? It's not coaching. Our players just need to mature.
DaveMatthew
Bring in Peter
What will the NHL standings look like in three years? We predict the future
What will the NHL standings look like in three years? Our panel rates every franchise in five key categories to make projections.
theathletic.com
Ranked 14th in the NHL here. 10th in the East. 7th in the Atlantic. 25/26 will be 9 years after the "rebuild" started. The Athletic staff thinks we'll be a middle-of-the-pack NHL team, fighting for a wildcard spot in the East.
Like I said, the perception of this team's future on Sens Twitter is way more optimistic compared to neutral observers around the league.
So if you want to say we met external expectations this year, and fans should be happy with that, that's fine. But the external expectation is that this team will not be a Stanley Cup contender in the near future. So you have to acknowledge that, too. Neutral observers think this team will be mediocre for years to come. There aren't many who think we're on the verge of any real breakout.
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The irony is that ’some posters’ are willing to agree with this particular quote, but little else that DJ says when it doesn’t fit with their expert opinions.“The heat is fair. You’re in Canada and that’s fair. People want their teams in the playoffs and when you don’t make it, who do you blame right away? You blame the coach,” Smith said. “And I know criticism is part of the job. But part of my job is blocking that out and doing the best with what we have.”
Senators 'believe we're a playoff team' but will have to wait another season to prove it
The Senators missed the playoffs by that minuscule margin — six points — in 2022-23 but believe next year they should break through.
Smith agrees the heat is fair. Why can't some posters?
The fact is DJ is taking the heat for the team, he does it on purpose, he’s told us that. I don’t think you’ll find posters who don’t think he deserves some heat. You will find poster who think people who post things like ‘he’s traSH’ etc is beyond ‘heat’ and into online asshole poster territory.
There is a difference, things are never as black and white as some people pretend. This whole idea that you’re either with us or with the terrorists would be hilarious if it didn’t have such real life implications from those who actually think this way.
Golden_Jet
Registered User
- Sep 21, 2005
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Losing both goalies before the western road trip,Boston also lost to Chicago and Chicago knocked Pittsburg out of the playoffs.
Lol at your lol. Ya what would ex players know.
Come on dude, you can’t honestly be saying that Brady and Stu are fearful of career suicide if they say a bad thing about DJ… That is crazy.
Both Brady and Stu have come out into the media and made strong unsolicited comments of support for their coach, in response to the online pressure from expert fans. They are online and they have pushed back.
You may not like it or agree with it, but let’s not be dumb enough to pretend as though they are fearful of their careers here. I find it embarrassing when fans have such high opinions of their own uneducated opinions that they let them supersede the opinions of the players and people directly involved.
Only two other teams had three 35 goal scorers… Edmonton and TO…. Wild.
and we still had 3 other 20 goal guys with DBC close to 30. and missing a 35 goal man in Norris….
This team can score.
DaveMatthew
Bring in Peter
I mean Marc Methot "predicted" that we'd be better than the Leafs this year, so I guess not much? I like the guy, he's good on TV and entertaining on Twitter, but he's not spending too much time analyzing the league. He admits as much. When he's on TSN 1200 he pumps up the Sens. When he's on TSN 1050 he pumps up the Leafs. When he's on Twitter he has fun with people who take being a fan way too seriously.
And what does that have to do with anything. Marc Methot was brought up to counter your statement that “When the players on a losing team "love" their coach it's a sign of a pretty big problem.”. He thinks the exact the opposite and I’d say he knows a lot more about NHL dressing room dynamics than anyone here.
Micklebot
Moderator
- Apr 27, 2010
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And how do you think adding Chychrun might have affected that (based on their stated methodology, it should have a significant impact since current roster was the biggest factor)? An article from Dec likely has some recency bias from the Nov-Dec skid we went through. Detroit at 10 shipped out a couple big pieces, I wonder if they still feel the same way about them after seei g them ship out Hronek and Bertuzzi?What will the NHL standings look like in three years? We predict the future
What will the NHL standings look like in three years? Our panel rates every franchise in five key categories to make projections.
Ranked 14th in the NHL here. 10th in the East. 7th in the Atlantic. 25/26 will be 9 years after the "rebuild" started. The Athletic staff thinks we'll be a middle-of-the-pack NHL team, fighting for a wildcard spot in the East.
Like I said, the perception of this team's future on Sens Twitter is way more optimistic compared to neutral observers around the league.
So if you want to say we met external expectations this year, and fans should be happy with that, that's fine. But the external expectation is that this team will not be a Stanley Cup contender in the near future. So you have to acknowledge that, too. Neutral observers think this team will be mediocre for years to come. There aren't many who think we're on the verge of any real breakout.
14th on the aggregate on an out of date eval, but you doubt anyone on staff puts them in the top 10, idk, I think that's your bias showing.
Like I said, I follow a lot of national media coverage, they are pretty optimistic, both Dreger and Poulin just recently said they expect the team to make the playoffs next year. I don't go on sens Twitter so I'll have to take your word on whatever they are saying.
SensHulk
Registered User
Yeah I’ll buy that part. That was extremely tough and unfortunate. I still think we shouldn’t have been shutout so it tells me we crumble when we don’t have the lead….we also lost to Vancouver earlier in the season (at home) when everyone was beating them (and we had our starting goalies intact) and then proceeded to lose again to them (again crumbling when we fall behind).
The road record doesn’t get talked about as much but as good as we are on home ice, we were just as atrocious on the road (if not more). This needs to change. Had zero confidence in road games
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