OT: Failure of a team, Failure of a rebuild

[Knave]

In terms of bare minimum:

1. Get rid of both our goalies.
2. Get rid of Hamonic and Chychrun. I'd rather have AHL callups for our bottom pairing.
3. Find a defensemen to help Chabot. We did it for Karlsson. We can do it for our second pairing.
4. If we're trading Tarasenko and potentially Giroux so they can go on playoff runs, get good returns and find targets in offseason to replace them.
5. Can we do anything with Norris?

Stutzle anchors line 1
Pinto anchors line 2
Sanderson-Zub is our top pair
Chabot-Methot/Kuba like player is our second pair.

 

[Xspyrit]

3 losses in a row including a loss at home to the Coyotes. Maybe the state of affairs is not entirely DJ’s fault, maybe (with the exception of 3-4 guys) the team is just bad. What a mess!!

DJ was a Pierre Dorion hire… no one said it was all DJ, well I think

Over the years it became apparent that Dorion didn’t know what he was doing. In a rebuild, it’s a given you will be accumulating talent but building a winning team is a whole different exercise

 

[DavidpauseReinbacher]

You told me you were better than the wings at beginning of season. How is the rebuild a failure ?

 

[RickyLafleur]

You told me you were better than the wings at beginning of season. How is the rebuild a failure ?

f*** off troll

 

[otown]

What rebuild? It's a circus tent they keep putting up over and over!

 

[WORLDSTARHIPHOP]

People saying it's so difficult to do in Canada - I don't entirely agree. We were headed for what looked to be a fairly good rebuild (albeit we didn't get lucky with a superstar) if not for the absolute, complete disregard for asset management the past 3 years. With the first rounders and second rounders handed out like candy, most teams would have been able to secure a starting goalie and a good top 4 RD. At the very least.

Instead I see the team more or less being a borderline/middle of the pack team until the inevitable rebuild 2.0 happens in 3-5 years.

It's funny you say we didn't get lucky with a superstar, but we absolutely lucked out hard getting Stutzle in the first place from SJ suffering a total collapse.

Hard to imagine how much worse it could be.

 

[Senscore]

You told me you were better than the wings at beginning of season. How is the rebuild a failure ?

I guess we'll just keep beating the shit out of your team until we know for sure.


You take the bubble wrap off your marshmallow bitch captain yet?

 

[bert]

Rebuilding in Canada is very hard. Most players have Canadian teams on their NTC's/NMC's and more often than not UFA's would rather sign in the US. The Oilers were gifted one of the greatest players ever and to this point we haven't won anything with him. Keep up the good fight, keep the core together and try to continue drafting and developing players. Not much else that can be done given the current environment in the NHL IMO.

Yes the only way to build a winner in a small market is to draft and develop. This rebuild would be going alot better if the GM had simply just kept picks and players and done this organically like in the 90's when the foundation for that great sens group that was competitive for almost a decade was put together.

So when I see people say things like they need to turn the roster over when all the teams best players outside of Giroux are 24 and under. Well I think you're insane. This team doesnt need a rebuild it needs a re tool. Selling off assets for futures and leveraging the cap space the team has to sign free agents. The asset management by dorion destroyed the success of this rebuild. His inability to identify this teams needs, weaknesses and goaltending are the undoing. Trading for a small goal scorer in Debrincat when they have that or another LD in chychrun was beyond stupid. If youre gonna move those assets you have to address a need and a hole. Dont even need to talk about the goaltending decisions. All time bad.

 

[Bryanbryoil]

Yes the only way to build a winner in a small market is to draft and develop. This rebuild would be going alot better if the GM had simply just kept picks and players and done this organically like in the 90's when the foundation for that great sens group that was competitive for almost a decade was put together.

So when I see people say things like they need to turn the roster over when all the teams best players outside of Giroux are 24 and under. Well I think you're insane. This team doesnt need a rebuild it needs a re tool. Selling off assets for futures and leveraging the cap space the team has to sign free agents. The asset management by dorion destroyed the success of this rebuild. His inability to identify this teams needs, weaknesses and goaltending are the undoing. Trading for a small goal scorer in Debrincat when they have that or another LD in chychrun was beyond stupid. If youre gonna move those assets you have to address a need and a hole. Dont even need to talk about the goaltending decisions. All time bad.

100%, drafting is huge. I would say drafting, development and pro scouting are massive. I think veteran leadership helps as well, but without solid drafting Canadian teams are screwed.

 

[Sting]

It's funny you say we didn't get lucky with a superstar, but we absolutely lucked out hard getting Stutzle in the first place from SJ suffering a total collapse.

Hard to imagine how much worse it could be.

Agreed we lucked out with Stu, but he's not a superstar. Maybe one day, but I have my doubts.

 

[Adrianopolous]

Stützle is ok

 

[Agent Zuuuub]

The problem isn't Stutzle, it's that we have only one Stutzle.

 

[Micklebot]

Fix the goaltending and you're about 80% there.

After that, some tweaks to finish it off.

For example;

Out:
Chychrun
Tarasenko
Hamonic
Brannstrom
Both goalies

In:
Ulmark
Kleven
Foegelee/Martinook
Carrier/DeMelo/Roy/Walker (ideally we get a Ciernek, but I'm trying to be realistic)

Lines are exact, but you get the idea. a more balanced roster.

Tkachuk-Stutzle-Giroux
Greig-Pinto-Joseph
Foegele/Martinook-Norris-Batherson
Kelly-Kastelic-Crookshank

Chabot-Carrier/DeMelo/Roy/Walker
Sanderson-Zub
Kleven-JBD

extas: MacEwen, Guénette

Ulmark
Sogaard

 

[Micklebot]

The problem isn't Stutzle, it's that we have only one Stutzle.

We're what, 11th in the league in scoring? I think the problem is keeping pucks out of the net. Stu for everything that he is, doesn't really fix that. We have too many offensive minded D, no D with Snarl. and we have league worst goaltending. We can try to mitigate the goalies by playing better defensive hockey, but the reality is that never works, goalies let in a soft one, you end up opening up because now you're playing from behind, then the goalie lets in more and the team gets blamed for not preventing every scoring chance

 

[Pierre from Orleans]

You told me you were better than the wings at beginning of season. How is the rebuild a failure ?

 

[The Waffler]

The optimist in me only believes the rebuild has been a massive failure…so far.

 

[Senovision]

We're what, 11th in the league in scoring? I think the problem is keeping pucks out of the net. Stu for everything that he is, doesn't really fix that. We have too many offensive minded D, no D with Snarl. and we have league worst goaltending. We can try to mitigate the goalies by playing better defensive hockey, but the reality is that never works, goalies let in a soft one, you end up opening up because now you're playing from behind, then the goalie lets in more and the team gets blamed for not preventing every scoring chance

I agree. You are bang on. I just looked up a stat that I think is important! Only 3 times when we have won out of the 25 times we have won have we scored less than 4 goals. So that means the players on our team are always trying to score a lot of goals because they know they have to because our goalies always let in those 1, 2 or 3 softies. Even though they are trying to score 4, 5, or 6 goals they can't always because we run into a hot goalie on the other team. The player's have the thought in the back of their minds that we will almost never win games 1 to 0 or 2 to 1 or 3 to 2 because our goalies are going to let in 3 or 4 goals against every game. That creates the mindset in our forwards we better get the puck out of our zone and score a goal rather than the mindset of we have to defend because ultimately our goalie is going to let us down.
We are 15th at allowing shots on our goalie.
That's not bad at 29.9 shots allowed per game.
I would think that we have been improving in this area since JM has taken over as head coach. The best in the league is Carolina at 25.6. Then there were 4 teams below 29. Then there were 11 teams in that 29 range. ( 29 to 29.9).

 

[Agent Zuuuub]

We're what, 11th in the league in scoring? I think the problem is keeping pucks out of the net. Stu for everything that he is, doesn't really fix that. We have too many offensive minded D, no D with Snarl. and we have league worst goaltending. We can try to mitigate the goalies by playing better defensive hockey, but the reality is that never works, goalies let in a soft one, you end up opening up because now you're playing from behind, then the goalie lets in more and the team gets blamed for not preventing every scoring chance

But even now we only really look dominant when Stutzle is clicking, and to just rely on one guy to be a difference maker is not sustainable.

and looking forward we will have to replace Giroux, Tarasenko, possibly Norris, Chychrun.

I mean we need d as well since we have one legit pair that we can count on, but it's not like the forwards are rosy.

 

[DrEasy]

But even now we only really look dominant when Stutzle is clicking, and to just rely on one guy to be a difference maker is not sustainable.

and looking forward we will have to replace Giroux, Tarasenko, possibly Norris, Chychrun.

I mean we need d as well since we have one legit pair that we can count on, but it's not like the forwards are rosy.

I agree that we need more depth at every position. One injury to a centre or a good D (like Zub) and the team crumbles.

We could have built up depth by accumulating assets and high picks, instead we gave them up like candy.

 

[Butchy Dakkar]

Despite our position in the standings, we're not that far away. We need to upgrade the goaltending (easier said than done). Tweak the D and we'll be much better. To say the rebuild has been a massive failure is so overly dramatic. It's a work in progress. Personally, I thought we'd be a playoff team this year but the goaltending and team D weren't up to the job. But we're not that far away.

I like the optimism. Because why not?

 

[lancepitlick]

Dorion actually said that high picks don't matter because he's a genius and will draft a Batherson in the late rounds anyways. First rounders aren't needed when you're a genius.

He also said you should pick grinders in the top 10 because the team was already playoff bound and you need grinders in the playoffs/they are hard to trade for.

Dude was a moron. I wouldn't trust him to run a lemonade stand.

 

[milkbag]

Dude was a moron. I wouldn't trust him to run a lemonade stand.

"We're a beverage company."

 

[DrEasy]

"We're a beverage company."

"We're a company"

 

[Loach]

"We're a company"

"I like to eat crayons"

 

[albator71]

Like I said last night too many poodles not enough pitbulls on this team. They have no bite in heir game, they're too easy to play against.