F Filip Zadina (2018, 6th, DET) Part 2

[MBH]

A rebound goal when you crash the net is flukey but lets forget that Zadina led the wings in individual corsi for, individual scoring chances, individual expected goals for, had the third best relative corsi for the wings, the highest expected goals for percentage for forwards, and highest expected goals for percentage while hes on the ice.

The same can be said for most games Zadina has played. So whether his goals are flukey or not (a rebound goal isnt), hes playing really good and the points hes getting are completely expected. You might as well have a big stamp across your forehead that says agenda. AA hasnt been close in their limited time playing together

Whatever.
Believe what you want.
That was a fluke goal. His first at 5 on 5.

You guys are getting all hot and bothered about a little streak.

Reminds me a lot of the Hirose BS last year.

That said, Zadina is better today than Hirose ever was and likely ever will be, and he'll only get better.

 

[MBH]

What's AA's GA/60?

Right. Thats an ugly number.
I'm not the one pretending that Zadina is way better than AA and anyone who thinks differently has an agenda, or isn't watching games.

Whoever believes that better provide some evidence.
And the numbers aren't totally clear.


On the GA/60... man, games like last night kind of show how f***ed that number can be.
Zadina had a giveaway that led to a goal against. AA got tagged for two goals against but didn't do anything to earn them.

 

[newfy]

Whatever.
Believe what you want.
That was a fluke goal. His first at 5 on 5.

You guys are getting all hot and bothered about a little streak.

Reminds me a lot of the Hirose BS last year.

That said, Zadina is better today than Hirose ever was and likely ever will be, and he'll only get better.

Its not so much about a little streak, its about the fact that you think there is somehow an argument that Athanasiou has been better lol. If you believe this is just a hot streak thats fine, but say AA will be better when this hot streak is over. He clearly hasnt been better and youre trying to say that he has been. I dont necessarily think you have a hate on for Zadina as much as your raging hard on for Athanasiou is getting in the way of you seeing things clearly, and youre talking down on Zadina because of it.

I'm not making predictions for the future or saying hes going to be a 90 point player. I'm saying in the games I've watched hes clearly been better that AA. Eye test, stats, everything show that and if you cant see that you have an agenda one way or the other, or youre a horrible judge of hockey talent.

As for calling it a little streak, that just kinda shows your agenda as well. Hes been paired consistently with players who have likely combined for roughly 6 or 7 points their last 25 games but still has really good advanced stats and really solid production. Hes a 6th overall pick that everyone knows has talent but for some reason you think this is just a little streak. Could it be a little streak and he ends up shitting the bed? Definitely, but his track record and draft pedigree combined with his underlying numbers show that hes producing exactly as should be expected for how hes playing and how good he should be. You thinking its just a little streak and not that hes actually just a good player shows youre mixed up in your evaluation or you just have preconceived notions that you refuse to give up on.

 

[ArGarBarGar]

That said, Zadina is better today than Hirose ever was and likely ever will be, and he'll only get better.

Then it might be reasonable not to make a comparison between the two in the first place.

 

[hradekbr]

Then it might be reasonable not to make a comparison between the two in the first place.

Ding Ding Ding. Exactly.

 

[raymond23]

Gonna be 40/50/90 guy in his prime

I like the way you think

 

[Barry Amsterdam]

I like the way you think

I think I like the way you like the way I think

 

[deca guard]

I like Filppula quite a lot as a center for Zadina. He still thinks the game at a very high level, and there have been some cheeky passes between the two of them that have clicked pretty well that Helm or Nielsen just weren't expecting or didn't know what to do with after receiving them. Those tight area give and go type passes are how the team are eventually free Zadina up by a step or two and start getting him some space to get that shot off at 5 on 5.

way i see flip is even though hes not as fast as when younger hes become a better play maker from experience ands doing a solid job making plays for his wingers

 

[brakeyawself]

Organisation fans who aren't hockey fans in the first place. Not a Zadina fan, and never was. i never believed he'd be an elite player in the NHL and still don't to this day. i had alot of arguements with wings fan when they teased everyone and laugh for teams passing on him but in no way i wouldn't want the kid to succeed because Montreal didn't draft him. The more Talent, the better for the league. Just not personally high on him and that since pre-draft.

Very rational. I understand many fans are extatic about Zadina and his recent run. But he seems like a player who’s either loved and destined for godhood or hated and destined for the Neil Yakupov school of adult education.
In reality he’s probably somewhere in between.

I definitely thought the hype surrounding him leading up to the draft, considering him on the same level as Dahlin and Svechnikov was going to lead to unrealistic expectations. Zadina has always had a great shot, hockey IQ, playmaking ability etc.. But he always needed work in other areas, including skating, and was never on the fast track to early NHL success. He’s not the two way player like Svech or maybe Farabee or even Laine. But I also don’t think no he’s quite the modern dynamo like Panarin or even Connor or Ehlers.

To me at least, he seems like a really good 2nd line winger or perhaps a near average 1st liner. I think James Neal is a closer comparison than those guys above. Better than Neal in certain ways even. Palmieri comes to mind more than Huberdeau. Maybe Mark Stone? Which is still terrific, just not Svech or Kakko good. I definitely think there was justification at least as to why teams passed on him where he was expected to be picked. I think he can be a 60 point type winger. But I’m even more impressed by his teammate Fabbri if they are looking for a long term wing partner for Mantha and Larkin.

A Zadina - Valeno - Bertuzzi line in the future still sounds pretty good to me.

 

[newfy]

8 points his last 10 games.

That puts him in on 36% of detroits goals in that time frame for context. Pretty solid for a rookie winger who spent a large chunk of those ten games with 2 assists in 33 games Frans Neilsen as his center and 3 points in his last 25 game Darren Helm as his other winger. Really starting to like what I see from him. Plays a game that looks better when he has talent around him to play with

 

[deca guard]

8 points his last 10 games.

That puts him in on 36% of detroits goals in that time frame for context. Pretty solid for a rookie winger who spent a large chunk of those ten games with 2 assists in 33 games Frans Neilsen as his center and 3 points in his last 25 game Darren Helm as his other winger. Really starting to like what I see from him. Plays a game that looks better when he has talent around him to play with

yes if hes on a talent line hes getting space to work with and with his edges and hands hes a serious weapon in that space

 

[PG Canuck]

Need to see his minutes go up and deployment get better for this to be sustainable IMO. Like him as a player but I’d like to see him with Larkin.

 

[newfy]

Finally filled Montreals net tonight with the late 3rd period game winner. Coming off the heels of that snipe against Chicago last game

 

[Christien]

He’s starting to figure it all out

 

[Gravity]

Happy Zadina is starting to put it all together. He certainly looks like a promising young player.

 

[nbwingsfan]

For the average player this would be his first pro season, so he’s ahead of schedule IMO. Turing out to have a pretty good season so far after so many undeservedly turned on him at the beginning of the season.

 

[raymond23]

 

[LarKing]

Those were all lucky plays. Luckiest points I’ve ever seen.

 

[Artorius Horus T]

Zadina this season:

Among 1999 born players in the NHL.
10th in points and in goals.

Among U21 players in the NHL
17th in points, 14th in goals.

Among U22 players in the NHL
33rd in points, 28th in goals.

I suppose not terrible but, how much hype he got....
how high he was drafted...

 

[Hen Kolland]

Zadina this season:

Among 1999 born players in the NHL.
10th in points and in goals.

Among U21 players in the NHL
17th in points, 14th in goals.

Among U22 players in the NHL
33rd in points, 28th in goals.

I suppose not terrible but, how much hype he got....
how high he was drafted...

He played 28 games. Was he supposed to lead those age groups?

“Stats without context are not comparison tools.”

I want you to repeat that sentence to yourself every morning when you wake up and every night before you go to sleep.

 

[LarKing]

Zadina this season:

Among 1999 born players in the NHL.
10th in points and in goals.

Among U21 players in the NHL
17th in points, 14th in goals.

Among U22 players in the NHL
33rd in points, 28th in goals.

I suppose not terrible but, how much hype he got....
how high he was drafted...

Yikes this is a dumb post.

 

[drw02]

Zadina this season:

Among 1999 born players in the NHL.
10th in points and in goals.

Among U21 players in the NHL
17th in points, 14th in goals.

Among U22 players in the NHL
33rd in points, 28th in goals.

I suppose not terrible but, how much hype he got....
how high he was drafted...

.5 PPG in his first 37 NHL games, in which outside of a few games with Larkin and Mantha he was mostly getting 2nd or 3rd line minutes and PP2 on the most talent devoid team in the league with trash linemates like Nielsen, Filppula, Helm, Abdelkader. He's doing fine and was starting to really come on late in the season before suffering a long term injury. if you actually watched him play it's pretty easy to see the high end skill is there.

 

[WingsMJN2965]

Zadina this season:

Among 1999 born players in the NHL.
10th in points and in goals.

Among U21 players in the NHL
17th in points, 14th in goals.

Among U22 players in the NHL
33rd in points, 28th in goals.

I suppose not terrible but, how much hype he got....
how high he was drafted...

How about you do him versus other talent in his draft year instead of comparing him to a bunch of guys way further along in their development?

Better yet, how about you do PPG rather than total production? Considering Zadina played less than 30 games and most of the guys above him production wise played 60+.

Nevermind that his most common linemates were Filppula, Helm, and Glendening... Wonder why his production suffered.

 

[newfy]

Zadina this season:

Among 1999 born players in the NHL.
10th in points and in goals.

Among U21 players in the NHL
17th in points, 14th in goals.

Among U22 players in the NHL
33rd in points, 28th in goals.

I suppose not terrible but, how much hype he got....
how high he was drafted...

Played at a 23 goal, 44 point pace on the worst team in ~20 years where his most common linemates were Helm and Filppula and averaging 15 minutes a game. Thats pretty damn solid for a 19/20 year old.

Now do those stats with points per game to account for the fact he only played 28 games, it would make your agenda less obvious

 

[Martinez]

Zadina this season:

Among 1999 born players in the NHL.
10th in points and in goals.

Among U21 players in the NHL
17th in points, 14th in goals.

Among U22 players in the NHL
33rd in points, 28th in goals.

I suppose not terrible but, how much hype he got....
how high he was drafted...