F Alexis Lafreniere (2020, 1st, NYR) part 4

[APVJ]

Worst producing 1st oa ever.

 

[Pavels Dog]

It's absurd that people have a problem with the criticism (though I get being annoyed in general by the piling on, that's never run for a fanbase). We're talking about the 1st overall pick here, and not a Hischier/Erik Johnson/Nugent-Hopkins type 1st overall. More like a tier below Crosby and McDavid. This is a kid who everyone knew was the face of the 2020 Draft years before.

The "he's a rookie playing in the NHL as an 18/19 year old, cut him some slack" argument is for lesser, non bluechip prospects. Or for any prospect who is doing okay, not great. You all know this is another story entirely and legitimately worth critiquing. This is highly unusual for a prospect of Lafreniere's stature, no ifs ands or buts about it.

The other thing is I don't think anyone is saying he sucks or isn't the real deal. If anything most people are legitimately puzzled and looking for an explanation other than "he's a rookie, the points will come". All people want to do is discuss it without being accused of undermining him. It's the opposite; I believe most people, myself included, are inclined to attribute a very specific reason for his start to his career, whatever that reason may be. I repeat, I don't think anyone believes for a second he's not the real deal.

I guess I can only speak for myself though.

Agreed. As someone who was essentially holding out a bit of hope of being able to draft this kid for YEARS, hearing so much talk about "wait for Lafreniere, he's the real deal", everyone talking about how big his impact would be, how if we drafted him he would change our team.. it seems very legit to question what is going on with him. Patience is great, but like you say we weren't supposed to have to treat Laf like we do "normal" prospects.

 

[blindpass]

He has two less points than Zibanejad who scored 75 pts in 57 games last year and has had much better deployment than Laf gets. Good players can stuggle. They can run hot and cold, have issues that you might not be aware of or capable of understanding. They develop differently.

There's absolutely no reason to question his underlying talent or doubt that he'll get to the point where he's an effective if not dominant NHL player. If he goes another game, or two, or five or ten without breaking out consider not wasting everyone's time here by barking about it. We can all follow the stats just fine.

 

[Hfbsux]

Reminds me of Thornton’s rookie year. We all know how bad of a career he ended up having. Wasn’t Lecavalier struggling in his first half of his rookie year? Shitty 1st overall picks..

 

[Frolov 6'3]

Can we now just stop with mentioning Joe Thornton.
That was 25 years ago. This is getting ridiculous.


If Lafreniere was playing in the AHL, nobody would even bother. Now he is in the NHL, perhaps not as good as advertised, and he is close to a bust already.

 

[Jersey Fresh]

Nobody cared about Hughes oiSH% last season either.

It's not unexpected the way people chose to tier Lafreniere as this near-generational player that his underwhelming play is being noticed.

 

[CTHabsfan]

Can we now just stop with mentioning Joe Thornton.
That was 25 years ago. This is getting ridiculous.


If Lafreniere was playing in the AHL, nobody would even bother. Now he is in the NHL, perhaps not as good as advertised, and he is close to a bust already.

Joe Thornton isn't the only player to put up subpar numbers in his rookie season before having an outstanding career. Lafreniere also had the disadvantage of not being able to play a game for 10-months before his NHL debut, thanks to a worldwide pandemic. I think we should give it a few years before we start labeling him "a bust'.

 

[Hfbsux]

Stamkos had no point in his first 7 NHL games. Another bad 1st pick.

 

[Frolov 6'3]

Daigle had 16 points in his first 13 NHL games. Just another bad 1st pick.

 

[ViewsFromThe6ix]

Joe Thornton isn't the only player to put up subpar numbers in his rookie season before having an outstanding career. Lafreniere also had the disadvantage of not being able to play a game for 10-months before his NHL debut, thanks to a worldwide pandemic. I think we should give it a few years before we start labeling him "a bust'.

Again, people are moving the goal posts.

I can't tell you how many people told me he was on par with Matthews and Eichel as a prospect because of his CHL accomplishments, despite him never playing a second against men in any capacity. Do you not see how stupid that was?

There just seems to be a ton of revisionist history here. If he was producing "told you! he was as good as we told you!". Now that he's not, people start bringin up Thornton and the pandemic.

 

[Goptor]

Marc-Andre Fleury only had 1 point in his rookie season and still went on to be a star in the NHL.

 

[TopChedder]

Again, people are moving the goal posts.

I can't tell you how many people told me he was on par with Matthews and Eichel as a prospect because of his CHL accomplishments, despite him never playing a second against men in any capacity. Do you not see how stupid that was?

There just seems to be a ton of revisionist history here. If he was producing "told you! he was as good as we told you!". Now that he's not, people start bringin up Thornton and the pandemic.

He is not on the same level as Eichel and Matthews. I was laughing when people were saying that lol

 

[blindpass]

Again, people are moving the goal posts.

I can't tell you how many people told me he was on par with Matthews and Eichel as a prospect because of his CHL accomplishments, despite him never playing a second against men in any capacity. Do you not see how stupid that was?

There just seems to be a ton of revisionist history here. If he was producing "told you! he was as good as we told you!". Now that he's not, people start bringin up Thornton and the pandemic.

The consensus certainly wasn't that he was in Matthews or Eichel territory, not sure why the standard he should be measured against is the dumbest take anyone had on his upside. I'll admit I expected he'd produce somewhat better than he has -- I thought the 40 pt (in 54 games) predictions were on the high side, but not completely out of the question. 25 pts seemed like a good guess. That seems silly now.

I also thought Zibanejad would easily be a point per game player this year, not 3 pts after 13 games. We are still dealing with small sample sizes and unusual circumstances. The overreactions (like calling him a bust) are just as goofy as the Matthews comparisons were.

I think a lot of people have strange ideas about development and performance. It isn't always linear and there are lots of variables involved.

 

[Hisch13r]

Can we now just stop with mentioning Joe Thornton.
That was 25 years ago. This is getting ridiculous.


If Lafreniere was playing in the AHL, nobody would even bother. Now he is in the NHL, perhaps not as good as advertised, and he is close to a bust already.

Good to know that a rough 13 games to start his career=close to a bust already...

lol This place is f***ing insane

 

[SwedishFire]

Can we now just stop with mentioning Joe Thornton.
That was 25 years ago. This is getting ridiculous.


If Lafreniere was playing in the AHL, nobody would even bother. Now he is in the NHL, perhaps not as good as advertised, and he is close to a bust already.

No we cant. It hadnt changed that much in the last 25 years actually. cool down. Why so frustrated?

 

[Frolov 6'3]

Good to know that a rough 13 games to start his career=close to a bust already...

lol This place is f***ing insane

Reading comprehension is your friend.

 

[The don godfather]

He looks like a deer in the headlights out there send him down to learn the game before he gets ruined.

 

[Fatass]

He looks like a deer in the headlights out there send him down to learn the game before he gets ruined.

Yes Lafreniere should be developing in the A. But he’s still going to grow into a really good player. Kid has all the skills, size, smarts and leadership qualities to be an excellent National League player. I, like you, would just rathe4 see him dominating the A, than being dominated in the NHL.

 

[wings5]

He looks like a deer in the headlights out there send him down to learn the game before he gets ruined.

The only other pro option for him would be to assign him to European pro leagues. I very much doubt the Rangers would do this but wouldn't be a horrible move imo

 

[CreamOfTheCrop]

He's gonna be just fine, he will recover, he hasn't played in so long. First year will be about learning and next year, he will be solid.

NeverDontGiveUp Laffy Taffy.

 

[Pavel Buchnevich]

The people claiming he doesn't belong in the NHL are the ones who haven't watched much so far. He looks like an NHL'er. It's a discussion that needs to go away.

Talk about how he's not playing well enough, if you want, but this is a really bad point to make. It's based purely on the box score when Lafreniere has an incredibly low on ice SH%.

 

[foggyvisor]

He is not on the same level as Eichel and Matthews. I was laughing when people were saying that lol

He'll be better than Matthews in the playoffs.

 

[Rangerfan4life90]

Again, people are moving the goal posts.

I can't tell you how many people told me he was on par with Matthews and Eichel as a prospect because of his CHL accomplishments, despite him never playing a second against men in any capacity. Do you not see how stupid that was?

There just seems to be a ton of revisionist history here. If he was producing "told you! he was as good as we told you!". Now that he's not, people start bringin up Thornton and the pandemic.

Overall, the bottom line, he's not a bust 13 games into his career with his underlying stats showing up in his favor. This is Jack Hughes part 2, essentially. He's looked better than what Kakko showed in his rookie year last season. Nobody (most at least) is saying he'll be an Eichel/McDavid level player, but he'll be a franchise player.

 

[TopChedder]

He'll be better than Matthews in the playoffs.

Sure.

 

[TopChedder]

Overall, the bottom line, he's not a bust 13 games into his career with his underlying stats showing up in his favor. This is Jack Hughes part 2, essentially. He's looked better than what Kakko showed in his rookie year last season. Nobody (most at least) is saying he'll be an Eichel/McDavid level player, but he'll be a franchise player.

He will be fine. However will be a teir below McDavid/Eichel/Matthews I include Eichel even though he was a 2nd overall because I feel he would be first during most drafts.

But who knows, he could turn a switch next year and go god mode.