Post-Game Talk: End of Season Discussion

[Hunter Gathers]

The Rangers rode the coattails of Derek Stepan into the post season. He, by your logic can also be a 1 year wonder? The Rangers definitely don't make it without him.

I have no idea how you can even post this and expect it to warrant a real response. Again, Stepan has been improving year-to-year on an expected path.

.915 sv% is an excellent season for a rookie goalie, especially one that started 54 games. His next season was a disaster, yes it was. But a lot might've had to do with the dreaded sophomore slump and the fact that the Flyers truly make their goalies look awful. The Jackets defense should also be given credit for Bob's turnaround along with their defensive structure of their forward corps. Tyutin, Nikitin, Johnson, Wisniewski, Erixon and Prout are an elite defense corps, very similar to that of the Rangers.

I think Bob is a solid goalie. I do not think Bob is a Vezina caliber goalie year in, year out. Hence my point.

I did not insinuate that they are comparable and I agree that they are not equivalents of each other. I just stated that Brassard's run can easily be a fluke.

If you make a statement, own it. Don't back-peddle.

If this doesn't classify as trolling, I'm not sure what will.

Then don't claim that our team sucks because we don't have John Mitchell on it. You did that earlier in the year and I will continue to bring it up.

 

[Kershaw]

I have no idea how you can even post this and expect it to warrant a real response. Again, Stepan has been improving year-to-year on an expected path.

I'm not disagreeing with you, I just think it's silly to right off Bob as a fluke after his play drastically improving, just like Stepan.

I think Bob is a solid goalie. I do not think Bob is a Vezina caliber goalie year in, year out. Hence my point.

Regardless, Columbus has an elite defense corps either way. Their forwards are just as good, if not better than the Rangers. The difference is probably goaltending, where Bob was better in one season than Lundqvist while Lundqvist has been consistently elite. That IMO is the only separation between the two teams.

If you make a statement, own it. Don't back-peddle.

But I didn't make a statement to back peddle on.

Then don't claim that our team sucks because we don't have John Mitchell on it. You did that earlier in the year and I will continue to bring it up.

Did I say that? Please show me the post. Losing John Mitchell was a major loss to the bottom 6 (along with Prust, Feds) and I still stand by that. Mitchell is probably amongst the best 4th line players in the league.

 

[Kwayry]

So the team got little or no production from the following players:
1 - Staal injured. Top 4 Dman.
2 - Clowe injured. Top 9 Winger.
3 - Powe injured. Top pker and 4th liner.
4 - Stralman injured - bottom pairing Dman.
5 - Richards scratched - supposed top line Center.
6 - Asham scratched - 4th liner.

Those are all key players that were penciled in the line up.
That exposed the lack of depth the team has.

Boston had a lousy PP, but they scored at a 30% clip against us. Our PK was supposed to be a strength, turned out to be a liability. Was Powe missed that much? Don't know but he sure could've helped.

Going back to that game 1, would the series have turned out differently if the PP scored late in regulation? I am sure it would. Funny how the PP looked better without Richards later in the series, it should have happened a lot sooner.

Boston had 3 rookie Dmen, and we didn't take advantage of them. They should have been hit everytime they touched the puck, they weren't and they built confidence.

As to the puck support system, It keeps making the team look like the keystone cops. Bruin Dmen had field day teeing off against Hank, because they had all day.
Only thing left for me to say is it's insanity itself when you keep trying the same system and expect different results.

 

[Blueshirt Special]

I agree totally with you guys. We are very close and with a few moves to add depth (through FA) we can be a stanley cup contender next season for sure. I feel that if Clowe and Staal were healthy, we wouldn't be sitting here right now wondering what if either. Getting Kreider and Miller bigger minutes will help add depth as well. We're moving in the right direction, and I think that next season, with a full camp and an offseason to add what we need, we'll be right back to the top.

In Terms of Torts, I think that he should stay for next season. We need to give him a full camp with his style. If he is fired, the only replacement I'd want is Alain Vigneault. I'm a huge fan of him and he would bring a fresh style to the team

I am down with this.

 

[chosen]

Lets see how Krug does vs the pens. Torts collapsing d system can make any dman look like bobby Orr.

Krug is what we were told DZ was.

 

[chosen]

CBJ fans said it after the trade last year too. I think I will take their word for it since they've watched him play every single game of his career to formulate a valid opinion on the player.

Toews earns the benefit of the doubt. He's 25 and has already won the Conn Smythe and Stanley Cup, as the best player on the winning team.

You want to believe Columbus fans who post here but you will disagree with Rangers fans who post here. What people post here is often different than what I think, too.

 

[Player big P]

Krug is what we were told DZ was.

He's played FIVE games.

 

[BlueshirtBlitz]

He's played FIVE games.

Seriously. Let's see the kid play as long as DZ has doing what he did consistently this series.

Protip: He won't. Just like MDZ will have great stretches and then look not so hot. It's the nature of non-HoF d-men.

 

[Inferno]

Krug has a VERY good shot.

that's literally all I saw from him, the rest of the drooling about his game is so RIDICULOUSLY unfounded.

Let's also acknowledge that our entire game is about GIVING UP posession to their D> they want it? we'll give it to them. ZERO pressure on him with nboody stepping out to him.

He's free to fire away. 99% of the teams out there woudl be all over him.

AND, none of us hit him this series, VERY disappointed in our physical approach to the game.

 

[Kane One]

I'm here to relay a message:

Bob Richards here. This captures every emotion I felt during the season.

 

[cd211]

Krug is what we were told DZ was.

and hes riding the wave right now.. we all thought kreider was going to be a 20g this yr.. had a hard time cracking the nhl...

he played awesome but lets see whats up all next year...

i love that we got brassard, stepan looked good, hags took big steps this year.. we have a nice core on d.. hank is a stud, top 10 goalie that will ever lace them up..

series could be way different with a healthy staal and clowe, wish we got to see whats up with him...

all said and done i like this team a lot.. got to trim some fat (pyatt, asham as a spare is fine) haley should be in next year..

dorsett and moore are great additions

I hope kreider starts next season the way he end the post season.. use that speed and size to pummel opponents.. scoring will come but kids got to work hard and he showed his strength.. ask seidenberg how he felt after the game...

all in all most wants torts head, but look at the big picture of where we ended last year, went through this year and how we actually finished the year.. to me its pretty amazing we even made the second round.. looking for one more year to prove something from torts.. he deserves it..

 

[MessierIsGod]

Krug is what we were told DZ was.

And maybe DZ would've been a krug if not for torts' make a mistake and you are benched philosophy which takes away the development of good instinct and initiatives. This coach is a bully in every way vs players who are not his "guys" and the media. Kreider should've been much better than he was. DZ should be like krug. Even McD can be much better offensively if allowed.

 

[Callagraves]

Anyone else still thinking Del Z + for ROR is a great idea?

I think i am.

 

[Punxrocknyc19*]

Anyone else still thinking Del Z + for ROR is a great idea?

I think i am.

rather get a first round pick for Del Zotto at the draft. and ROR cant be traded for a full year i believe... too much of a risk..

 

[Kershaw]

Krug has a VERY good shot.

that's literally all I saw from him, the rest of the drooling about his game is so RIDICULOUSLY unfounded.

Let's also acknowledge that our entire game is about GIVING UP posession to their D> they want it? we'll give it to them. ZERO pressure on him with nboody stepping out to him.

He's free to fire away. 99% of the teams out there woudl be all over him.

AND, none of us hit him this series, VERY disappointed in our physical approach to the game.

I thought Krug displayed a high skill level in the series. Not only did he have a good shot, but he was setting up the Bruins' forwards like crazy with his stretch passes. I also thought he could hold onto the puck for large portions of time, which gives him all the time in the world to create scoring chances. Natural instincts, it looks like Krug might have it.

 

[kovazub94]

Posters who bemoan this season as a disappointment (top 8 finish) and then dismiss short camp as an excuse (other teams had to deal with this as well) are out of their mind. 22 other teams that also "dealt" with it finished the season worse than us. Only 4 teams would finish better. Of this remaining group of contenders they all have a common trait of deep rosters and its continuity - holding their respective rosters together for at least a few seasons. The Rangers unfortunately significantly revamped the roster from last season. If you have to blame something other than no camp / short season / injuries then blame the management because they purposely allowed certain players go who probably should have stayed (at least they should have kept Mitchell as a bottom 6 / PK specialist) plus they underestimated market value of Prust (I bet in their post season meeting last year they were penciling him into this years roster). These mistakes compounded by Nash trade and other factors not in the management's control what cause the second round exit. Not enough though to give them a failing grade.

Overall, this offseason is going to be even tougher because if they want to continue with this roster for next year with only spot upgrades via UFA or internally with youth infusion - there are a lot of questions they would have to deal with:

1. Keep Richards for another season? I think they would have to lean to keep him if there is confidence that he'll have a come back season. Comeback implies at least a competent 2C level of play. I mean Richards - Stepan - Brass - Boyle (with hopefully Miller / Lindberg providing further depth if needed) is a contender quality and much better than Step - Brass - Boyle. Unless keeping Richards creates problem signing our RFAs, then it becomes a non-issue and Richards goes.

2 (or 1a because its as important as the first one). Extend of Staal eye injury. If he fully or close to it recovers then it fixes most of the team's issues on defense - if MDZ and Moore are our 3 pair and Eminger plus hopefully McI are proving further depth - the team would be set (Stralman must be signed as well). Otherwise we are going to have issueS on defense that would need to be addressed.

3. Clowe. Two back to back concussions should be very concerning. I think he was brought here with a long term of at least two or three more seasons in mind. Post concussions - this becomes a difficult issue to pounder this offseason.

If these issues resolve successfully (it should be clear what I mean by successfully) then the Rangers should be in better position for a deeper run next year (nothing guarantees SC) because the team would be with better quality depth of a roster and continuity that was lacking this season (some could disagree but IMHO with Staal, Clowe and 2C level of play from Richards we could've gone past the Bruins.

 

[kovazub94]

This is pretty concerning coming from a CBJ fan who's watched him for I assume his whole career. Would suck to be stuck with the NA version of Alexei Kovalev on the roster.

Clearly you are ignorant of Kovalev's contribution to 1994 SC.

 

[azrok22]

Anyone else still thinking Del Z + for ROR is a great idea?

I think i am.

Not with ROR's contract status.

 

[cd211]

Posters who bemoan this season as a disappointment (top 8 finish) and then dismiss short camp as an excuse (other teams had to deal with this as well) are out of their mind. 22 other teams that also "dealt" with it finished the season worse than us. Only 4 teams would finish better. Of this remaining group of contenders they all have a common trait of deep rosters and its continuity - holding their respective rosters together for at least a few seasons. The Rangers unfortunately significantly revamped the roster from last season. If you have to blame something other than no camp / short season / injuries then blame the management because they purposely allowed certain players go who probably should have stayed (at least they should have kept Mitchell as a bottom 6 / PK specialist) plus they underestimated market value of Prust (I bet in their post season meeting last year they were penciling him into this years roster). These mistakes compounded by Nash trade and other factors not in the management's control what cause the second round exit. Not enough though to give them a failing grade.

Overall, this offseason is going to be even tougher because if they want to continue with this roster for next year with only spot upgrades via UFA or internally with youth infusion - there are a lot of questions they would have to deal with:

1. Keep Richards for another season? I think they would have to lean to keep him if there is confidence that he'll have a come back season. Comeback implies at least a competent 2C level of play. I mean Richards - Stepan - Brass - Boyle (with hopefully Miller / Lindberg providing further depth if needed) is a contender quality and much better than Step - Brass - Boyle. Unless keeping Richards creates problem signing our RFAs, then it becomes a non-issue and Richards goes.

2 (or 1a because its as important as the first one). Extend of Staal eye injury. If he fully or close to it recovers then it fixes most of the team's issues on defense - if MDZ and Moore are our 3 pair and Eminger plus hopefully McI are proving further depth - the team would be set (Stralman must be signed as well). Otherwise we are going to have issueS on defense that would need to be addressed.

3. Clowe. Two back to back concussions should be very concerning. I think he was brought here with a long term of at least two or three more seasons in mind. Post concussions - this becomes a difficult issue to pounder this offseason.

If these issues resolve successfully (it should be clear what I mean by successfully) then the Rangers should be in better position for a deeper run next year (nothing guarantees SC) because the team would be with better quality depth of a roster and continuity that was lacking this season (some could disagree but IMHO with Staal, Clowe and 2C level of play from Richards we could've gone past the Bruins.

best analysis in this thread..

1- first part about our team concept.. you need to keep a team together for awhile to have success.. we revamped our entire offense not once but twice in less then a year.. you cant have success that way..

2- A healthy staal and Clowe, withc richards playing at a 2c like you said, we'd be hard to beat and easily wouldv'e went 7th in a hard fought series...

all in all not to disappointed where we ended up.. beginning of the year thought cup or bust.. after seeing how we were during the year, the trades we made and how we managed to get to the 2nd round, is a huge success..cant wait to see what happens this offseason..

 

[RangerBoy]

The Rangers need more depth. From player 1 to player 30 in the organization.

 

[RangerBoy]

ROR can't be traded until February 28,2014 because of the offer sheet. His qualifying number is $6.5M when he is arbitration eligible next summer.

 

[chosen]

He's played FIVE games.

I would trade DZ right now for Krug. You wouldn't. We disagree.

DZ may become a good offensive defenseman. Krug, after a measly 5 games, has displayed more offense than DZ in a few years. Neither of us knows how it will turn out, but I would opt for Krug. Granted, this might be the high point of Krug's career, but DZ does not seem like a long term solution as the Rangers power play leader to me.

 

[chosen]

Krug has a VERY good shot.

that's literally all I saw from him, the rest of the drooling about his game is so RIDICULOUSLY unfounded.

Let's also acknowledge that our entire game is about GIVING UP posession to their D> they want it? we'll give it to them. ZERO pressure on him with nboody stepping out to him.

He's free to fire away. 99% of the teams out there woudl be all over him.

AND, none of us hit him this series, VERY disappointed in our physical approach to the game.

You don't think Krug has a great first step and excellent instincts?

 

[BLONG7]

Does Richie get bought out?

 

[Inferno]

It's not about Torts, the players or Sather...it's about the 3 of them working to build an identity that they want.

Torts clearly wants a grind it out, physical, defensive team.

Why is Sather bringing in guys like Richards, Nash, Gaborik, Brassard, and MZA? Clowe makes sense. Pyatt makes sense. Dorsett, etc all make sense. Drafting JT Miller, Dylan McIlrath, even Chris Kreider (when he uses it) all makes sense...

but the rest of those guys DON'T. If you want to be a physical team, BE a ****ing physical team.

If you want to be a speed team, guys like Hagelin, Kreider, McD, Moore, Brassard, Callahan, etc all make sense. all above average skaters or better.

If you want to be a skill team, then guys like Brassard, Nash, Stepan, etc make sense.

What we have right now is a ****ing mishmash of players that don't have an identity up and down the lineup.

Why did we win last year? Because by and large the entire team had that singular identity. Dubi, Cally, Prust, Feds, even guys like Mitchell, etc. they play *that* way. We could have a game plan and had the personnel to do it.

But this year, we didn't have the guys to play THAT game, we also didn't have the guys to play a skill game, or a speed game. Youve got fast guys with slow guys, physical guys with midgets, passers with...passers. No shooters.

Just a ****ing cluster****.

If Sather is trying to transform us into a skill based puck possession team, then he and Torts need to be on the same page, and he needs to get the personnel to do that. Right now, too many square pegs.

You can blame Torts, you can blame Sather, you can blame the players, but the truth is, it's really a combination of all these aspects, starting first and foremost with our lack of identity.