Value of: Elias Lindholm to Minnesota

[Bond]

26 year old Mark Stone got 1 high-ish level prospect and a 2nd round pick.

It really depends where Lindholms head is at. He has no trade protection and I could see a team come out of left field to trade for him and try and sign him. Stone was Vegas or bust

 

[AKL]

It really depends where Lindholms head is at. He has no trade protection and I could see a team come out of left field to trade for him and try and sign him. Stone was Vegas or bust

Unless it's a foregone conclusion that he's signing with the team that acquires him, his cost is going to reflect the one year he has left before he can jet anywhere he wants. Stone was going to Vegas and Vegas knew they were getting him on a long term deal.

 

[Ledge And Dairy]

26 year old Mark Stone got 1 high-ish level prospect and a 2nd round pick.

Correct. Now ask yourself, was that a fair trade or even remotely close to a fair trade? Was that trade made before the season or near the deadline? When that trade was made what leverage did Ottawa have, was there a bidding war or did they take the only option available?

 

[Dr Jan Itor]

Correct. Now ask yourself, was that a fair trade or even remotely close to a fair trade? Was that trade made before the season or near the deadline? When that trade was made what leverage did Ottawa have, was there a bidding war or did they take the only option available?

Maybe not, but I don't think there is room to multiply it by 2.5x or anything.

 

[Wondercarrot]

26 year old Mark Stone got 1 high-ish level prospect and a 2nd round pick.

and the Sens have never been more ripped off than in that absurd clumsily handled disaster.

 

[Dr Jan Itor]

and the Sens have never been more ripped off than in that absurd clumsily handled disaster.

Ok, if you have a good comp for a 28 year old top 6/1B center traded with 1 year left until UFA, by all means.

Ryan O'Reilly is a little bit interesting, considering he still had term on this deal, so maybe that's more in line with Lindholm w/ extension.

 

[thestonedkoala]

Ok, if you have a good comp for a 28 year old top 6/1B center traded with 1 year left until UFA, by all means.

Ryan O'Reilly is a little bit interesting, considering he still had term on this deal, so maybe that's more in line with Lindholm w/ extension.

I'm basing it off of the Fiala trade - sort of.

Fiala was a top 6 winger that got back a top prospect (Faber) and late 1st. The value is lower as Fiala was a winger and not a center.

I'm not that bullish on Lambos or Ohgren as prospects, the 2nd is almost a third and the 1st is top 10 protected.

To put it more in perspective, Minnesota traded a 1st, a 2nd, Johan Larsson (top 50 prospect) and Matt Hackett for Jason Pominville and I believe another draft pick.

Dvorak (who was under term) got a 1st and a 2nd and it's a stretch to say he's a top 6 center.

Reinhart got a 1st and top prospect in Levi.

Lindholm isn't going to get what Eichel got, but he's going to get a bit back.

 

[Ledge And Dairy]

Maybe not, but I don't think there is room to multiply it by 2.5x or anything.

So if you don't view it as a fair trade why would Calgary?

 

[Dr Jan Itor]

So if you don't view it as a fair trade why would Calgary?

It was just a reference point, and a counter to what I felt was way overboard the other way. Not an absolute be all and end all.

 

[Ledge And Dairy]

It was just a reference point, and a counter to what I felt was way overboard the other way. Not an absolute be all and end all.

My counter is since this trade would hypothetically be taking place this offseason Lindholm's trade value should be similar to Seth Jones

 

[Dr Jan Itor]

My counter is since this trade would hypothetically be taking place this offseason Lindholm's trade value should be similar to Seth Jones

So prospect + 1st + 2nd and we'll say the other 1sts cancel out? I could see that.

 

[Digitalbooya]

I'm basing it off of the Fiala trade - sort of.

Fiala was a top 6 winger that got back a top prospect (Faber) and late 1st. The value is lower as Fiala was a winger and not a center.

I'm not that bullish on Lambos or Ohgren as prospects, the 2nd is almost a third and the 1st is top 10 protected.

To put it more in perspective, Minnesota traded a 1st, a 2nd, Johan Larsson (top 50 prospect) and Matt Hackett for Jason Pominville and I believe another draft pick.

Dvorak (who was under term) got a 1st and a 2nd and it's a stretch to say he's a top 6 center.

Reinhart got a 1st and top prospect in Levi.

Lindholm isn't going to get what Eichel got, but he's going to get a bit back.

Was Faber considered a “top prospect” though? He wasn’t even top 5 for LA according to a couple rankings I’ve seen:

Wheeler’s 2022 NHL prospect pool rankings: No. 2 Los Angeles Kings

The Kings' pool is without question, the deepest in the league.

theathletic.com

2021-22 Top 10 Los Angeles Kings Prospects - NHL Rumors

Los Angeles Kings Prospects: The combination of quality and quantity of draft picks, player development, the Kings find themselves in an excellent position.

nhlrumors.com

The only way I give up close to what Fiala was traded for is if there is some sort of extension in place. Fiala was RFA.

 

[Ledge And Dairy]

So prospect + 1st + 2nd and we'll say the other 1sts cancel out? I could see that.

Thats quite the generalization on the actual truth of that trade. Chicago paid 12th OA, 44th OA, a 20 year old prospect with relatively higher potential, and a lottery protected 1st in the following season. In exchange Chicago recieved Seth Jones and 32nd OA.

The value of pick 44 and the exclusion of pick 32 is probably about on par with Minnesota's 53th pick. So that leaves us with value for Boqvist + #12 and the protected 1st. Minnesota's 1st is 21st OA so for arguments sake lets say Rossi and #21 are about the same value as Boqvist and #12 (though I don't think Rossi has done anything to prove he's worth more than Boqvist was at the same age).

To conclude my ask would be Rossi + #21 + #53 + Minny's protected 2024 1st.

 

[thestonedkoala]

Was Faber considered a “top prospect” though? He wasn’t even top 5 for LA according to a couple rankings I’ve seen:

Wheeler’s 2022 NHL prospect pool rankings: No. 2 Los Angeles Kings

The Kings' pool is without question, the deepest in the league.

theathletic.com

2021-22 Top 10 Los Angeles Kings Prospects - NHL Rumors

Los Angeles Kings Prospects: The combination of quality and quantity of draft picks, player development, the Kings find themselves in an excellent position.

nhlrumors.com

The only way I give up close to what Fiala was traded for is if there is some sort of extension in place. Fiala was RFA.

I was thinking he would sign an extension.

Faber was considered a top prospect. He was seen as having value in the 1st round

 

[Digitalbooya]

I was thinking he would sign an extension.

Faber was considered a top prospect. He was seen as having value in the 1st round

Is that actually true or is that what Wild fans said to cope with losing Fiala?

 

[Dr Jan Itor]

Thats quite the generalization on the actual truth of that trade. Chicago paid 12th OA, 44th OA, a 20 year old prospect with relatively higher potential, and a lottery protected 1st in the following season. In exchange Chicago recieved Seth Jones and 32nd OA.

The value of pick 44 and the exclusion of pick 32 is probably about on par with Minnesota's 53th pick. So that leaves us with value for Boqvist + #12 and the protected 1st. Minnesota's 1st is 21st OA so for arguments sake lets say Rossi and #21 are about the same value as Boqvist and #12 (though I don't think Rossi has done anything to prove he's worth more than Boqvist was at the same age).

To conclude my ask would be Rossi + #21 + #53 + Minny's protected 2024 1st.

If Lindholm comes with an extension (can't remember if Jones did) and we get a Calgary 2024 2nd, I could see the framework. Or try and do Foligno + 2024 2nd instead of the 2024 1st since we'd need to move out salary anyway. Foligno can be a TDL asset for Calgary.

Definitely not risking that on Lindholm being here just 1 year though.

 

[Digitalbooya]

To conclude my ask would be Rossi + #21 + #53 + Minny's protected 2024 1st.

Delusional as always.

 

[AKL]

If Lindholm comes with an extension (can't remember if Jones did) and we get a Calgary 2024 2nd, I could see the framework. Or try and do Foligno + 2024 2nd instead of the 2024 1st since we'd need to move out salary anyway. Foligno can be a TDL asset for Calgary.

Definitely not risking that on Lindholm being here just 1 year though.

That's also assuming the value should be close to the Seth Jones deal, which is just one guys opinion.

To conclude my ask would be Rossi + #21 + #53 + Minny's protected 2024 1st.

Well it's certainly your right to ask.

 

[Digitalbooya]

95% sure that's the guy that told me Mangiapane was more valuable than Fiala after the 21-22 season.

 

[Ledge And Dairy]

If Lindholm comes with an extension (can't remember if Jones did) and we get a Calgary 2024 2nd, I could see the framework. Or try and do Foligno + 2024 2nd instead of the 2024 1st since we'd need to move out salary anyway. Foligno can be a TDL asset for Calgary.

Definitely not risking that on Lindholm being here just 1 year though.

With Jones the draft was middle of July so he was already in the last year of his contract. Thus he was allowed to negotiate with another team so technically Chicago traded for him as a rental but they had already worked out an extension.

If the Flames are selling Lindholm they will almost certainly be a lotto tean, meaning their 2024 2nd would be at latest 43rd OA. I would not be inclined to include that pick.

No interest in Foligno for any reason but making the cap work, not removing value to take him on either. You can just ship him off somewhere else like Columbus did with Bjorkstrand.

(I should clarify that I have zero interest in trading Lindholm personally. Just stating the value I would want i a return if we had to move him).

Well it's certainly your right to ask.

If you aren't willing to pay up what he's worth you can find a legitimate 1C elsewhere. Maybe Washington will retain on Kuznetsov for you

 

[AKL]

If you aren't willing to pay up what he's worth you can find a legitimate 1C elsewhere. Maybe Washington will retain on Kuznetsov for you

He's not worth 2 1sts + top prospect + 2nd though. Just because you said he is doesn't mean it's true.

 

[Digitalbooya]

Everyone knows that Chicago screwed up with the Jones trade. Why we are using that as a value meter is beyond me.

 

[HighLifeMan]

He's not worth 2 1sts + top prospect + 2nd though. Just because you said he is doesn't mean it's true.

He's worth what the market dictates he's worth - and that's always changing.

From the outside - it's nearly impossible to project these player values. One thing we do know however is that 28 year old center's who are one season removed from scoring 40+ goals and being a Selke runner up are not available very often (if ever).

So much of it depends on Lindholm's willingness to go to and extend in various locations.

 

[Ledge And Dairy]

He's not worth 2 1sts + top prospect + 2nd though. Just because you said he is doesn't mean it's true.

Lol ok whats your offer then?

 

[AKL]

Everyone knows that Chicago screwed up with the Jones trade. Why we are using that as a value meter is beyond me.

Because Calgary fans like what it means for them if we do.

It's like when people told us we'd get a 2nd and a mediocre prospect for Fiala because of the Buchnevich trade.