Proposal: Edler to Ottawa

[Canuck Luck]

The basis of this deal is that Ottawa would want to re-unite Edler and Karlsson

To Ottawa:
Alex Edler
2017 3rd round pick

To Vancouver:
Dion Phaneuf (2M retained)
2017 1st round pick

The cap hits going in and out remain the same. The Canucks get a slightly older, worse d-man whom is signed at a high cap hit up until 35. He probably won't be worth that 5M after 33-34. Edler is signed until 33. Right where age may catch up to him as well.

To get an upgrade for the next few years, as well as get out of an additional couple years on that Phaneuf contract, Ottawa downgrades from a 1st to 3rd round pick.

Canucks do this because they get a similarily aged d-man and from a 3rd to 1st. They can afford the extra few years as the Sedins will be retiring soon and its highly unlikely no one on the roster currently is going to command anywhere near the 7M each they make.

Click to read more...

 

[BondraTime]

The basis of this deal is that Ottawa would want to re-unite Edler and Karlsson

To Ottawa:
Alex Edler
2017 3rd round pick

To Vancouver:
Dion Phaneuf (2M retained)
2017 1st round pick

The cap hits going in and out remain the same. The Canucks get a slightly older, worse d-man whom is signed at a high cap hit up until 35. He probably won't be worth that 5M after 33-34. Edler is signed until 33. Right where age may catch up to him as well.

To get an upgrade for the next few years, as well as get out of an additional couple years on that Phaneuf contract, Ottawa downgrades from a 1st to 3rd round pick.

Canucks do this because they get a similarily aged d-man and from a 3rd to 1st. They can afford the extra few years as the Sedins will be retiring soon and its highly unlikely no one on the roster currently is going to command anywhere near the 7M each they make.

Awful, awful deal for the Sens.

No chance they retain any salary, let alone 10 million, not to mentiom giving up a 1st

 

[quat]

Awful, awful deal for the Sens.

No chance they retain any salary, let alone 10 million, not to mentiom giving up a 1st

So you're saying that Edler and Phaneuf have the same value, given their play, age and contracts?

That's a bold statement.

 

[FOurteenS inCisOr]

It would take a top-prospect along with that 1st.

No Phaneuf, and no 3rd from the Canucks.


And here's where fans who don't watch Edler play claim he's not worth much because he no longer puts up 40+ points a season...

 

[BondraTime]

So you're saying that Edler and Phaneuf have the same value, given their play, age and contracts?

That's a bold statement.

No, I'm saying that the Sens, as a team, aren't going to pay 2 million dollars to have a guy play for another team, all while giving up a 1st rounder.

We would be on the hook for the same money this way for the first 3 seasons, then need to find a replacement for ~5 million after.

 

[BondraTime]

It would take a top-prospect along with that 1st.

No Phaneuf, and no 3rd from the Canucks.


And here's where fans who don't watch Edler play claim he's not worth much because he no longer puts up 40+ points a season...

Agreed here.

Edler for a 1st + prospect would be a deal.

No Phaneuf, especially with 10 million in retention.

 

[Hale The Villain]

So the Sens don't upgrade on Phaneuf, end up paying 2M more in cap, and give up a 1st round pick, just because.

Yeah no thanks.

 

[Number1RedWingsFan52]

The basis of this deal is that Ottawa would want to re-unite Edler and Karlsson

To Ottawa:
Alex Edler
2017 3rd round pick

To Vancouver:
Dion Phaneuf (2M retained)
2017 1st round pick

The cap hits going in and out remain the same. The Canucks get a slightly older, worse d-man whom is signed at a high cap hit up until 35. He probably won't be worth that 5M after 33-34. Edler is signed until 33. Right where age may catch up to him as well.

To get an upgrade for the next few years, as well as get out of an additional couple years on that Phaneuf contract, Ottawa downgrades from a 1st to 3rd round pick.

Canucks do this because they get a similarily aged d-man and from a 3rd to 1st. They can afford the extra few years as the Sedins will be retiring soon and its highly unlikely no one on the roster currently is going to command anywhere near the 7M each they make.

So Ottawa retains $2 million on Phaneuf plus gives up a 1st round pick as well. Why would they do that. You don't retain that much plus move a 1st round pick and Ottawa isn't eating $10 million of Phaneuf's salary plus throwing in a 1st to boot don't see them doing that.

 

[FOurteenS inCisOr]

So the Sens don't upgrade on Phaneuf, end up paying 2M more in cap, and give up a 1st round pick, just because.

Yeah no thanks.

Edler > Phaneuf

 

[Sens of Anarchy]

Edler > Phaneuf

I'd like Edler on the Sens but he isn't so much better right now that it warrants the 1st pick and 2M retained salary. So .... come again.

Is that 3m bonus paid to Edler for this year (16/17)?


I'd say if you want the 1st / 3rd swap you have to start by taking out the retained bit.

 

[Homesick]

It would take a top-prospect along with that 1st.

No Phaneuf, and no 3rd from the Canucks.


And here's where fans who don't watch Edler play claim he's not worth much because he no longer puts up 40+ points a season...

I don't think this deal favours the Canucks but Edler isn't nearly as good as Canuck fans want him to still be.
Hell, even if you want to say I only watch the Oilers/Canucks games I'd say he's brutal. Not that he can't bounce back but a 1st, and Phaneuf @5 million isn't that far off.

 

[Langdon Alger]

Edler > Phaneuf

That may be true, not sure because I don't watch too many Canuck games, but this deal won't happen anyway. Ottawa is not trading Phaneuf so shortly after acquiring him, Melnyk is not retaining salary in any deal, let alone this won, and Ottawa already has traded it's 2nd round pick in 2017. They don't want to move their first as well.

Ottawa is looking for another defenceman to play on the third pairing, but they want a cheaper option. They also don't want to part with a first rounder to make it happen.

 

[JuniorNelson]

The meat and potatoes of this deal are Phaneuf for Edler? I'd do that deal, if Edler wanted it. Vancouver runs a weakling squad that accepts defensemen being run every play. If Edler has had enough and is tired of being a loser, I think he is entitled to be heard.

 

[Sting]

Ottawa doesn't have room for Edler. They are not going to pay the price for him either. I think he's a good d-man who is overrated by Vancouver fans.

The difference between Edler and Phaneuf is not retained salary and a 1st round pick. That's laughable.

 

[Homesick]

That may be true, not sure because I don't watch too many Canuck games, but this deal won't happen anyway. Ottawa is not trading Phaneuf so shortly after acquiring him, Melnyk is not retaining salary in any deal, let alone this won, and Ottawa already has traded it's 2nd round pick in 2017. They don't want to move their first as well.

Ottawa is looking for another defenceman to play on the third pairing, but they want a cheaper option. They also don't want to part with a first rounder to make it happen.

You spelled Juan wrong

 

[Cogburn]

Nope. Phaneuf is older and I haven't been a fan of his in Calgary or Toronto. That first being dangled isn't enough to make that deal for me.

If Phaneuf is working for Senator fans, wonderful, let's not rock the boat then.

 

[Langdon Alger]

You spelled Juan wrong

Is that Bill Shakespeare over there? I can't see real well.

 

[biturbo19]

It's an interesting idea to mull over as a Canucks fan. Taking on all those years of Phaneuf (even with retained money) is a really tough sell, while downgrading the defence. The 1st round pick makes it something i'd have to at least think about though. Depends a bit on what sort of 1st that Sens pick ends up being, which is tricky. If it's a late pick, or more of a mid-pick where one might find a Logan Brown/White/Chabot type prospects - it becomes a ton more enticing.

I'm probably less hard on Phaneuf than most Canucks fans are likely to be, and less inclined toward an unrealistic trade everything that's not bolted down and "blow it up to tank" sort of philosophy. So i do think Phaneuf would be a serviceable partial replacement for Edler for the next few years, which would be helpful to any winning aspirations as opposed to just dealing Edler for futures alone (banking on Tanev to stabilize Phaneuf).

Edler playing with Karlsson though, would be a guy who generates the sort of points we saw from Edler when he was playing with Ehrhoff...which would be tough to watch.

I think value-wise it's an interesting premise and probably not too far off. But then, i can see why Sens fans wouldn't be too interested. It's a clear upgrade for them, but Methot is just fine playing with Karlsson who can carry that pairing, so spending an extra $2M on the cap and a 1st round pick to upgrade a 2nd pairing may not be "worth it".

And from the Canucks end, i think the better avenue to pursue is probably to just hang on to Edler for now, with the potential to move him for a younger (very near NHL ready) NHL defenceman at some point. Or if/when Juolevi has shown he's ready to play in the NHL and help offset the loss of Edler for a more pure futures package.


Probably not a real deal to get done there, but a creative premise. Interesting to think about.

 

[Sens of Anarchy]

Is that Bill Shakespeare over there? I can't see real well.

stuck on Phoenix

 

[Nucklehead Supreme]

Ottawa doesn't have room for Edler. They are not going to pay the price for him either. I think he's a good d-man who is overrated by Vancouver fans.

The difference between Edler and Phaneuf is not retained salary and a 1st round pick. That's laughable.

Most of us believe that he is a #2/3 Dman, he is better all around now than a few years ago. It's the stat watchers and the people who love to analyze players based on small sample sizes that bash the guy that bring out the real homers. For example, he doesn't put up as many points so he sucks now, or that he is injured all the time so he sucks etc. Both of which are baseless and complete BS.

As for the deal, I don't think either team does this, we need young blue liners not guys over 30, and the difference between Dion and Alex is not retention and a 1st round pick on the part of the Sens.

 

[Canuck Luck]

For all the people complaining about the retention, you do realize Phaneuf has a cap hit of 7M and Edler of 5M? So basically all this retention does is make it that the Sens pay Edler 7M instead of Phaneuf 7M. They aren't taking on any additional salary and are getting the better player, who is 1 year younger, and is signed to a more friendly contract in terms of length to age. So why wouldn't they retain exactly?

Really because of 2 seasons where they retain 2M that Edler isn't signed for? Phaneuf would be 34 and 35 those seasons. How is that not a benefit to the Sens to avoid paying Phaneuf 7M per for those years and only get away with a 2M penalty? I'm sure you could easily re-sign Edler for the same 5M or less by that time. He would be in the tail end of his career too at 33 and 34 years of age at that point. D-men past 33 do not sign for more than 5M unless they are the elite of the elite.

I swear people on these boards just see retention and get bent out of shape without thinking things through. They just see dead cap space. When GM's have to buyout players for even more than that for longer term to get rid of a player past his prime making way too much money, they think they could have dealt him before that point and avoided the buyout.

 

[M2Beezy]

With Benning as GM the Canucks just might do a trade this stupid so who knows but on the other hand kinda suprised by the Sens fans here rejecting the deal i think they gots a lot of bitterness from the Leafs fleecing them in the Phaneuf trade

 

[Nucklehead Supreme]

For all the people complaining about the retention, you do realize Phaneuf has a cap hit of 7M and Edler of 5M? So basically all this retention does is make it that the Sens pay Edler 7M instead of Phaneuf 7M. They aren't taking on any additional salary and are getting the better player, who is 1 year younger, and is signed to a more friendly contract in terms of length to age. So why wouldn't they retain exactly?

Really because of 2 seasons where they retain 2M that Edler isn't signed for? Phaneuf would be 34 and 35 those seasons. How is that not a benefit to the Sens to avoid paying Phaneuf 7M per for those years and only get away with a 2M penalty? I'm sure you could easily re-sign Edler for the same 5M or less by that time. He would be in the tail end of his career too at 33 and 34 years of age at that point. D-men past 33 do not sign for more than 5M unless they are the elite of the elite.

I swear people on these boards just see retention and get bent out of shape without thinking things through. They just see dead cap space. When GM's have to buyout players for even more than that for longer term to get rid of a player past his prime making way too much money, they think they could have dealt him before that point and avoided the buyout.

Are they paying him 7 million? I though the maple leafs retained when they traded him?

 

[Sens of Anarchy]

With Benning as GM the Canucks just might do a trade this stupid so who knows but on the other hand kinda suprised by the Sens fans here rejecting the deal i think they gots a lot of bitterness from the Leafs fleecing them in the Phaneuf trade

Please provide the details of the fleece... please mention all the dead wood salary we sent them... IMO we fleeced them if anything.

 

[Canuck Luck]

I'd like Edler on the Sens but he isn't so much better right now that it warrants the 1st pick and 2M retained salary. So .... come again.

Is that 3m bonus paid to Edler for this year (16/17)?


I'd say if you want the 1st / 3rd swap you have to start by taking out the retained bit.

You've admitted Edler > Phaneuf. He's also signed for 2 less years AND is a year younger. So why would the Canucks want to trade him for an older, crappier player who ASLO has a cap hit thats 2M higher? The only way is if the plus is huge.

There is a reason why Toronto dealt him to you for a bunch of cap dumps and a 2nd round pick. Think about it, Ottawa is Toronto's biggest rivals so they would have to offer a much better deal than any other team, yet all the Leafs got back was cap dumps and a 2nd. Clearly no other team even came close to that.

Let that sink in for a moment and then tell me Phaneuf is anywhere near as valuable at 7M as Edler at 5M. Thats why Phaneuf has to come at Edler's cap hit of 5M and Ottawa gets Edler at Phaneuf's of 7M.