Post-Game Talk: ECQF 3 (Flyers lead series 2-1): FLYERS 1 vs. Canadiens 0, Sunday, Aug. 16, 2020

[bennysflyers16]

OIh, you dont like Frost's 60% ozone start and barelky positive Corsi rel?

View attachment 361782

How about a 90% oz and a -18 rel?

Is that from yesterday ??? Insane.

Although it did appear he was getting alot of D zone draws ??

 

[Beef Invictus]

I agree with this post in full. and hope the 3rd he can change.

Even mentioning he and Hak in the same breath is just wrong.

I also hope a light bulb goes off, and it's not impossible. Like I said with the early days of Hak, coaches develop too. Hak eventually showed he was too stubborn to learn or develop at all. AV is by default more flexible.

We saw Lavi stubbornly refuse to adapt to roster realities here, only to show up in Nashville having made adjustments showing he learned from limitations here. Trotz was very much like AV. He would gameplan not just for individual teams through the regular season, but for individual games, like if there was a back-to-back and he noticed some stuff. Then in the playoffs that would stop and he'd try to force one plan down the opposition's throat, and for years he failed. The year he succeeded was the one where he treated playoffs like he treated the regular season.

So I have hope that AV can stop the goofiness that has hobbled him for ages. A coach that has demonstrated he can adjust between periods should have the capacity to do that.

 

[Jtown]

Hard pass because you won't listen even if I do. I keep trying to tell you that I'm not limiting this to coaches.

i am listening. IN fact I am the only poster asking you questions to expand upon your posts . Meaning not only have a i read your posts but i am prodding for even more information from you. I know you're not limiting this to coaches, i just am reminding you of what you already know that anytime a member of the flyers organization meets with a player that is considered a team activity and there are hard set rules on the amount of team interactions a player can have with their organization over the course of a week and month.

 

[deadhead]

ummmm what about playing Marc Staal and his 43.1 CF% over Anthony Deangelo for an entire season???

You mean when Deangelo was 22.
At 21, in Arizona, CF 45.77%, xGF 41.50%.
So it's not surprising he went back to the AHL again for more seasoning.
2017-18, 8 games in the NHL, then was sent down, came back up January 20.
Played 24 of the last 36 games.
Then started the next season - pretty typical for a young defenseman.

 

[Starat327]

Is that from yesterday ??? Insane.

Although it did appear he was getting alot of D zone draws ??

Yup. And the game before wasnt any better:

It always intrigues me when people make arguments, then find out the player theyre arguing for actually is worse than the player they were arguing against, especially as it relates to their own 'stamp of approval' in terms of metrics.

 

[LegionOfDoom91]

Thompson has 58 shifts on the fly by the way. 9 OZ, 22 NZ, & 12 DZ draws.

30.97 CF%
-18.50 CF% rel
43.41 xG%
-5.99 xG% rel

Woof.

 

[Jtown]

OIh, you dont like Frost's 60% ozone start and barelky positive Corsi rel?

View attachment 361782

How about a 90% oz and a -18 rel?

morgan stats are from a full season. this picture i imagine is from a single game? what game is that?

 

[DancingPanther]

Its not a good one.

I just can't believe that

 

[Striiker]

What he fails to mention is that those Deangelo stats are while he was on an Arizona team that overall had a 45.04 CF% and 42.40 xGF%.

 

[Jtown]

Yup. And the game before wasnt any better:

View attachment 361785

It always intrigues me when people make arguments, then find out the player theyre arguing for actually is worse than the player they were arguing against, especially as it relates to their own 'stamp of approval' in terms of metrics.

does all situations include pk? it will be hard to derive any meaningful interpretation of that stat if that is the case.

 

[Starat327]

morgan stats are from a full season. this picture i imagine is from a single game? what game is that?

I dont care about a full season. I care about here and now. Over the course of a full season, you play against different opponents, and you dont have time to make adjustments - or at least, not imapctful ones.

Here's the first game of this series too. Im sensing a theme.

 

[Starat327]

does all situations include pk? it will be hard to derive any meaningful interpretation of that stat if that is the case.

How many Offensive zone starts do you think most teams get on the PK?

 

[Jtown]

I dont care about a full season. I care about here and now. Over the course of a full season, you play against different opponents, and you dont have time to make adjustments - or at least, not imapctful ones.

Here's the first game of this series too. Im sensing a theme.

View attachment 361787

hockey reference and natural stat trick are wildly different . i dont know what to say.

 

[Beef Invictus]

morgan stats are from a full season. this picture i imagine is from a single game? what game is that?

Thompson's in-season stats on the Flyers are worse than Frost's, too.

And that's with Thompson rocking a huge 109 PDO

 

[Striiker]

How is it possible that there's even a Frost vs Thompson conversation happening?

It's 2020.

 

[Beef Invictus]

How is it possible that there's even a Frost vs Thompson conversation happening?

It's 2020.

Here is your answer:

It's 2020.

 

[Starat327]

does all situations include pk? it will be hard to derive any meaningful interpretation of that stat if that is the case.

Game 1 5 on 5, 86% start, -7 rel. Well below youre 60% and "barely positive" threshold.

Game 2: 50% oz and a -20 rel. Also well below your standards

Game 3: I'm sure this will surprise you, so ill make sure i post this one too. 86% oz and a -11 corsirel

You were saying something about Frost's 60 oz and "barely positive" corsirel, though?

 

[Starat327]

How is it possible that there's even a Frost vs Thompson conversation happening?

It's 2020.

Because some people will do anything they can to defend "hockey guy" culture. Or coaches. cant forget that. Gotta make sure you are knob-slobbing coaches decisions, because one day, he may call you up and ask if you want an autograph - but only if you blindly followed and agreed with every one of his decisions.

 

[Jtown]

Starat. Check out natural stat trick and compare the numbers

 

[deadhead]

As other teams make runs in the playoffs while trusting and relying on young talent, we are content to struggle and suck leaning on garbage shitty veterans because our management is convinced that terrible veterans are magical.

How many teams are playing more starters under the age of 25?
And we have two who are injured.

Flyers (7), NAK, TK, Farabee, Provorov, Sanheim, Myers, Hart [Hagg, Bunnaman are not starters]
Caps (2)
Pens (3)
Carolina (6)
CBJ (8)
NYI (2)
Bos (6)
TB (5)
Mon (7) if you count Evans
STL (2)
Col (10)
Dal (4)
WIN (6)
Nash (2)
Min (5)
CHI (7)
VGK (4)
EDM (6)
CAL (6)
VAN (7)
AZ (6)

 

[Starat327]

Starat. Check out natural stat trick and compare the numbers

Much like Jojo, Im gonna hard pass. I don't honestly need statistics to show me how bad Thompson has been. This was just a simple exercise that was already too great a waste of time, if we're being honest.

 

[flyersnorth]

His decisions in the regular season were largely good. A massive upgrade on Hakstol, especially on offense. His usage of Hagg and Ghost were erroneous. Allowing the PP to exist as it has is erroneous.

His decisions around Frost were wrong. They were called out as wrong at the time, and now we are still dealing with it. We needed centers and forwards in general and he rejected a good option.

This series has been bad; bad enough that once again, we have to hope our best players can overcome decisions out of their control. More bad than good, whereas the regular season was more good than bad. This has been a common problem with AV. NYR fans I'm friends with spent the whole regular season telling me "wait until the playoffs." We can see what they meant now.

I think we largely agree on things.

I would disagree on some of the details, but in the end, that's the kind of stuff I'd rather shoot the breeze about over bevvies in a crowded pre-Covid bar!

 

[Starat327]

How many teams are playing more starters under the age of 25?
And we have two who are injured.

Flyers (7), NAK, TK, Farabee, Provorov, Sanheim, Myers, Hart [Hagg, Bunnaman are not starters]
Caps (2)
Pens (3)
Carolina (6)
CBJ (8)
NYI (2)
Bos (6)
TB (5)
Mon (7) if you count Evans
STL (2)
Col (10)
Dal (4)
WIN (6)
Nash (2)
Min (5)
CHI (7)
VGK (4)
EDM (6)
CAL (6)
VAN (7)
AZ (6)

Just out of curiosity, why wouldnt you count Evans?

 

[deadhead]

Just out of curiosity, why wouldnt you count Evans?

Because he's only played 3 of 7 games so far.

 

[Beef Invictus]

How many teams are playing more starters under the age of 25?
And we have two who are injured.

Flyers (7), NAK, TK, Farabee, Provorov, Sanheim, Myers, Hart [Hagg, Bunnaman are not starters]
Caps (2)
Pens (3)
Carolina (6)
CBJ (8)
NYI (2)
Bos (6)
TB (5)
Mon (7) if you count Evans
STL (2)
Col (10)
Dal (4)
WIN (6)
Nash (2)
Min (5)
CHI (7)
VGK (4)
EDM (6)
CAL (6)
VAN (7)
AZ (6)

And yet we are still struggling because we choose to rely on garbage veterans instead of playing obviously superior youth. Our GM and coach have decided Grant and Thompson are Magical Veterans. The same as it ever was.