LeBrun: Dubois wants out of Winnipeg, will not sign a contract for next season

[Boss Man Hughes]

Even with his supposed red flags he still performs better than Suzuki. But im sure Suzuki gets a bunch more excuses.

Absolute garbage. Suzuki was the better player even though most of his decent teammates missed a big chunk of the year.

 

[TS Quint]

They don't exactly have the same players around them do they....

Yeah, "40 goal man" Caufield is an awful player.

It’s not an excuse to look at Winnipeg’s wingers and point out the obvious fact that Suzuki was playing with significantly less talent, especially with Caufield hurt half the season. Suzuki also has a far better two way game and brings more intangibles.

In love the excuses and the intangibles are through the roof lol

Maybe Suzuki will never reach his potential because we might never see a season where Caufield isn't injury plagued.

 

[Boxertim]

Can’t Suzuki and PLD both be good?

 

[nhlfan9191]

Yeah, "40 goal man" Caufield is an awful player.


In love the excuses and the intangibles are through the roof lol

Maybe Suzuki will never reach his potential because we might never see a season where Caufield isn't injury plagued.

His intangibles are threw the roof. He’s been labelled as a very good leader(opposite of Dubois) and he’s a very two way center. And yes, Caufield was the only real top 6 on the team that he got to play with. Dubois was surrounded by them all year. Yet their offensive production was almost identical.

 

[Mortimer Snerd]

I said a playoff spot. Didn't say anything about contending.



Of course they should. There's no point in keeping Connor and Morrissey either. They should tear it all down now since half the team wants out. However, if they don't want to do that, they can put together some moves to still try and make the playoffs.

The problem with rebuilding, is that nothing is guaranteed. You're more likely to end up back in the mushy middle again than be an elite contender though. Law of averages. 5 elite true contenders at any given time, 5 teams that just suck, and 22 teams where a career year here and there might get you to the playoffs or a crazy run for the Cup. Just like you're more likely to never get out of the 2nd rd than win the Cup even once(see Washington). Rebuilding isn't done at the drop of a hat. The NHL is a business, and nobody wants to suck for 5 years with no guarantee you get anything for it.

Saying that, one of the best times to actually say, ok, we're going to start over, is when top players start wanting out. Buffalo, right after the lockout when they had those great teams, and both Briere and Drury walked out on the same day in 2007, they ended up wasting 6 years trying to be competitive, until they finally dealt Vanek and said we're done.

The Jets could get a ton for Connor and Morrissey, in addition to whatever they could get for the other 3, and start a real rebuild. But if they don't want to, it doesn't matter if they should.

There are no guarantees no matter what they (or anyone else) does or doesn't do. There are only probabilities. Fear of a rebuild is as likely to lead to the bottom as is a rebuild. Just comes a few years later but without the running start. Takes much longer as a result.

 

[Baksfamous112]

Absolute garbage. Suzuki was the better player even though most of his decent teammates missed a big chunk of the year.

Useless comparison imo. Different environment, role, teammates etc.. They pretty equal and play the game differently.

 

[TS Quint]

His intangibles are threw the roof. He’s been labelled as a very good leader(opposite of Dubois) and he’s a very two way center. And yes, Caufield was the only real top 6 on the team that he got to play with. Dubois was surrounded by them all year. Yet their offensive production was almost identical.

I get it. It's hard to put up points with a 20g Smurf and a player who scores 38 points and it's considered a "break out" year. The intangibles just to stay in a positive state of mind playing with such a lack of talent is impressive.

 

[Hunter368]

Useless comparison imo. Different environment, role, teammates etc.. They pretty equal and play the game differently.

Exactly. One had better line mates and one had more TOI/less competition for quality ice. In the end, the two players while they play a different style & different strengths both are very very similar value. People who say otherwise have a agenda their pushing. PLD will get slightly more money for a 8 year deal due to the extra year of UFA, guessing about 8.25 million x 8 years.

 

[Baksfamous112]

Exactly. One had better line mates and one had more TOI/less competition for quality ice. In the end, the two players while they play a different style & different strengths both are very very similar value. People who say otherwise have a agenda their pushing. PLD will get slightly more money for a 8 year deal due to the extra year of UFA, guessing about 8.25 million x 8 years.

Exactly. They just want a pissing contest. Two very good players

 

[Canadienna]

I get it. It's hard to put up points with a 20g Smurf and a player who scores 38 points and it's considered a "break out" year. The intangibles just to stay in a positive state of mind playing with such a lack of talent is impressive.

Caufield missed half the year, and Suzuki was doing well before then. Dach also missed some time and once Monahan went down spent more time centering his own line.

Hard to blame Suzuki for not lighting it up playing with Rafael Harvey-Pinard, Mike Hoffman, Rem Pitlick and Jesse Ylonen.

Suzuki and Dubois are similar calibre players imo, who play quite a different style from one another.

 

[Guffman]

You don't think Dubois is part of the Jets core? He's not "lumped in with the core," he's a huge part of it.

Jets were puttering around without a legit 2C for a few years. Definitely nice we got Dubois but that didn’t propel us to any significant accomplishments.

I dunno… not sure what “core” is necessarily defined as. Dubois was an important player, but he wasn’t one that was driving the team/leading and his departure wouldn’t negatively affect the culture.

 

[nhlfan9191]

Wait a sec. Didn't Suzuki play with "40 goal scorer" caufield and "untouchable" dach?

You can't talk out of both sides of your mouth.

This is why Habs fans have the reputation they do in these threads

So would you trade Dach for Kyle Connor?

Caufield was out half the year.. What do you mean? And we were switching Dach between C and wing. He’s a natural centerman and that’s where he looks the best in and around the front of the net. Habs fans have a reputation because they are educated on what’s going on with their players? What does that make you just spitting non sense about a team you clearly didn’t even bother to take a little time to educate yourself on before talking?

 

[TS Quint]

Caufield missed half the year, and Suzuki was doing well before then. Dach also missed some time and once Monahan went down spent more time centering his own line.

Hard to blame Suzuki for not lighting it up playing with Rafael Harvey-Pinard, Mike Hoffman, Rem Pitlick and Jesse Ylonen.

Suzuki and Dubois are similar calibre players imo, who play quite a different style from one another.

I agree with that.

 

[HabsAddict]

If I had to choose who is more important on the team, it would be Suzuki over Dubois.

If I had to choose who is a better value, it's Dach over Dubois.

What Dubois does is give us is an excellent center group that we can compete with.

If this trade happens, fine, but let's be clear, Dubois is not going to make us 20 points better by himself. He's not elite. We need Mailoux and several other pieces to blossom before we are contenders.

 

[Poppy Whoa Sonnet]

This is all giving me flashbacks to Panarin to NY, Tavares to TOR, and (almost) Gaudreau to NJ. This sort of talent becoming available and wanting to play for your organization, willing to take a "discount" in order to go to your team. It is very hard to stay the course and say no when that happens, but it might be just the right move to make if the player's age curve doesn't really fit your timeline.

 

[HabsAddict]

This is all giving me flashbacks to Panarin to NY, Tavares to TOR, and (almost) Gaudreau to NJ. This sort of talent becoming available and wanting to play for your organization, willing to take a "discount" in order to go to your team. It is very hard to stay the course and say no when that happens, but it might be just the right move to make if the player's age curve doesn't really fit your timeline.

At this point we don't know how serious Dubois is about playing for us. If he was, there wouldn't be a five team announcement UNLESS that was a bit of PR to help the Jets.

We will know in less then 2 weeks.

 

[tbcwpg]

At this point we don't know how serious Dubois is about playing for us. If he was, there wouldn't be a five team announcement UNLESS that was a bit of PR to help the Jets.

We will know in less then 2 weeks.

I think Brisson was trying to do the Jets a bit of a favour leaking that. If it's just two teams, he knows the offers will be lower and he knows that the Jets aren't usually ones to rush into things either, so try to get the offers up a bit to let the Jets move him.

 

[TS Quint]

Caufield was out half the year.. What do you mean? And we were switching Dach between C and wing. He’s a natural centerman and that’s where he looks the best in and around the front of the net. Habs fans have a reputation because they are educated on what’s going on with their players? What does that make you just spitting non sense about a team you clearly didn’t even bother to take a little time to educate yourself on before talking?

I took your advice and started to educate myself on Habs players. I generally took Habs fans at face value that when the 20 goal Smurf went down it hurt Suzuki's production. I was wrong. Suzuki did just as well playing with those AHLers. How much does the Smurf get paid on that next contract to make no impact? Yikes.

 

[LPHabsFan]

How many other situations have there been where a player who's 1 year away from free agency, who is an RFA, who clearly wants to leave, then goes and gets traded for full value?

 

[HabsAddict]

How many other situations have there been where a player who's 1 year away from free agency, who is an RFA, who clearly wants to leave, then goes and gets traded for full value?

It happens in NHL2000 all the time.

 

[TS Quint]

How many other situations have there been where a player who's 1 year away from free agency, who is an RFA, who clearly wants to leave, then goes and gets traded for full value?

What's full value?

 

[Poppy Whoa Sonnet]

How many other situations have there been where a player who's 1 year away from free agency, who is an RFA, who clearly wants to leave, then goes and gets traded for full value?

Trouba? Fiala? Were those full value?

 

[LPHabsFan]

What's full value?

Hard to say. There's so much stupidity going around it's hard to tell what's going on. part of it is judging peoples reaction after the trade and comparing it to what people thought he would get prior to the trade going down.

 

[HabsAddict]

I think Brisson was trying to do the Jets a bit of a favour leaking that. If it's just two teams, he knows the offers will be lower and he knows that the Jets aren't usually ones to rush into things either, so try to get the offers up a bit to let the Jets move him.

We'll see in less then 2 weeks.

Habs are not first timers in phoney "I love the Habs" just to drive up the price. Nor would Dubois be the first one to use us.

What would be unprecedented is the level of drama declaring that you want to play for a certain team, but signing the highest offer.

 

[LPHabsFan]

Trouba? Fiala? Were those full value?

One of them went for a decent prospect drafted in the 2nd round plus the 19th overall and the other went for an average serviceable defenseman (at the time though later developed into more) and the 20th overall pick. I don't know if it's the case but I would think that fans of the Rangers/Wild expected and/or hoped they'd have gotten more. We'd have to look at the trade threads to see for sure.