Draft and UDFA Thread 2017-18

  • Xenforo Cloud has upgraded us to version 2.3.6. Please report any issues you experience.
  • We are currently aware of "log in/security error" issues that are affecting some users. We apologize and ask for your patience as we try to get these issues fixed.
Status
Not open for further replies.
I think you should use some of the philosophy you use against Koktaniemi - who's almost a year younger than Zadina.

You said Koktaniemi shows he can dominate his own age group, but Zadina is playing in the Q at almost a full year older, how does he get a pass, and Kokt doesn't (no pun) ?

I think it's a difference in the tools.

For me, Kotkaniemi's tools don't register as high as Zadina's --- pretty much across the board.

I don't think he has the same shot --- accuracy, ability, etc. I don't think he has the same offensive vision or the ability to create a play.

I think Zadina is a significantly better skater. Kotkaniemi would rank as average for me. Zadina as very good or above average.

I liked Zadina's creativity better. I think he sees the ice better from an offensive standpoint and generates more offense.

Whereas Kotkaniemi strikes me as someone who benefited from very good from his system and the veterans he played with, I think Zadina's system didn't necessarily maximize his talent and I think he was often the one dragging more marginal talent along. When I see Kotkaniemi, I see a fairly familiar vision of good, efficient, Finnish playing systems. Those teams tend to work like well-oiled machines, but removing individual components and putting them in different environments doesn't always result in the same "driving" results. They may result in guys who play important roles for 10 and 15 years and can adapt as their offensive abilities or deployment fluctuate, but I'm not sure they're necessarily the engines as frequently as one thinks they'd be.

Zadina's looked very good, consistently, against all levels of competition. I think the numbers are deceiving because of the time missed with his junior team, so there's some stat glance bias. But over a full season in the Q he scores 52 goals and 98 points. But the consistent production was there in the Q, in the playoffs and the WJC. To some extent I think we also take that for granted. There was no "rising" with Zadina, he consistently performed at a higher level.

I'd say that there's some mis-labeling with Zadina. He's consistently mentioned with the top offensive guys in the draft and he more than holds his own in those conversations, but I don't think people give him nearly as much credit as a two-way forward. Like I said, if he's a center we'd be talking extensively about his 200 foot, three zone game.

For me, even if they're close in most categories (I personally think there's a noticeable gap), I think the skating and the shot are what separates a very good second line player, from a clear first line player. That extra dash of offense and creativity is a pretty significant to me.

Now, I freely admit that Kotkaniemi could indeed develop into a first line player. It wouldn't shock me, though I personally still feel more comfortable projecting him in more of a top-six capacity at this time. Age could very well be a factor, but I'm not sure it's always as big of a factor as we think.

I think there's a tendency to assume that the younger player has more room for growth because he's not as developed or experienced. While in some cases that's true, I don't know if it's as much of a factor when you get to the higher talents of the draft. I think if you're looking at two mid- to upper-mid range prospects in Canadian juniors, and the production is similar, you may assign a greater value to the younger guy. But I also think as a board it's one of those things that we gravitate toward and probably assign a greater value to than most teams. Not to say they don't take it into consideration, but I don't know if it's not one of those areas that they talk about and then kind of move on.
 
Playing devil's advocate, a team could look at Boqvist and be a little concerned about the injury rumors, defense and timeline.

From an undersized defenseman, in an already deeper draft featuring some very good defensive prospects, that could have an impact.

I still think he's the fourth best prospect heading into the draft, but I can see where some teams might want to go with another kid in a draft like this.
 
Zadina, ridiculously good shot.

That's all I have on him.

Nothing outside his shot is worth mentioning.

One trick pony, but one nice trick that every team could use. But again, red flags allover with a one trick pony in the top ten.

That's his one elite skill, but he's still high end skill and above average in Everything else (skating, defense, hockey iq)
 
  • Like
Reactions: Edge
Would hope he's there for 26 or 28, but I doubt it. Don't think they go for him at 9.

Sorry yes should've been more clear, I meant at 9. I'm working on a prediction for the top 31, and can't quite pin down the Rangers. Their selections last year were quite off from consensus, and so I have to imagine their list is pretty different from what I might find online.
 
That's his one elite skill, but he's still high end skill and above average in Everything else (skating, defense, hockey iq)

But man, what a skill.

Even if you figure everything else checks in about very good, that shot potentially adds some excellent offense and creates a fairly complete package.

You put that on a line with Chytil, Zibanejad, Andersson, whoever and he adds a damn intriguing element.

He's my third ranked prospect. I'd LOVE to add that to our stable.

I'd trade up for that in a heartbeat in some of the scenarios we've discussed on here.
 
Sorry yes should've been more clear, I meant at 9. I'm working on a prediction for the top 31, and can't quite pin down the Rangers. Their selections last year were quite off from consensus, and so I have to imagine their list is pretty different from what I might find online.
Right now to me, the pick (if they stay at 9) is going to be reactionary based on who’s left
 
What do you think the chances are of you guys taking Kravtsov?

Would hope he's there for 26 or 28, but I doubt it. Don't think they go for him at 9.

Sorry yes should've been more clear, I meant at 9. I'm working on a prediction for the top 31, and can't quite pin down the Rangers. Their selections last year were quite off from consensus, and so I have to imagine their list is pretty different from what I might find online.
I for one wouldn’t be shocked to see them take him at 9 at all. As others have said, I’d prefer to get him later, but if he’s their guy and none of the top guys slip, I can see them grabbing him at that spot rather than chancing that he’ll last much lower. We know that at least one scout Bobby Mac interviewed had him in the top 5...
 
  • Like
Reactions: HatTrick Swayze
But man, what a skill.

Even if you figure everything else checks in about very good, that shot potentially adds some excellent offense and creates a fairly complete package.

You put that on a line with Chytil, Zibanejad, Andersson, whoever and he adds a damn intriguing element.

He's my third ranked prospect. I'd LOVE to add that to our stable.

I'd trade up for that in a heartbeat in some of the scenarios we've discussed on here.

Hmmm...where have I heard that one before?
 
Hmmm...where have I heard that one before?

Totally part of the "Designs by Jas" collection.

Didn't think it was possible at the 3 spot, but man if he slides out of the top 5, I'd do the deal in a heartbeat and get into the teens.

How does a Zadina and Kravstov first round sound? Ya'all wanted skill and high end talent to compliment what we have.
 
But man, what a skill.

Even if you figure everything else checks in about very good, that shot potentially adds some excellent offense and creates a fairly complete package.

You put that on a line with Chytil, Zibanejad, Andersson, whoever and he adds a damn intriguing element.

He's my third ranked prospect. I'd LOVE to add that to our stable.

I'd trade up for that in a heartbeat in some of the scenarios we've discussed on here.
I agree with you, he's #4 for me and i love his release.
 
Totally part of the "Designs by Jas" collection.

Didn't think it was possible at the 3 spot, but man if he slides out of the top 5, I'd do the deal in a heartbeat and get into the teens.

How does a Zadina and Kravstov first round sound? Ya'all wanted skill and high end talent to compliment what we have.

If we could squeeze Boqvist in there, too, I’m not sure I could envision a better Day 1. But, I’ll settle for Addison.

Oh, then get me Alex Turcotte next year and I’d say Gorton fulfilled his promises.
 
Last edited:
If we could squeeze Boqvist in there, too, I’m not sure I could envision a better Day 1. But, I’ll settle for Addison.
No secret that I love Addison, but I feel like he could be one of those players where we look back in a few years and go “he was taken where?!” That said, he does have a lot of work to do to get there
 
Totally part of the "Designs by Jas" collection.

Didn't think it was possible at the 3 spot, but man if he slides out of the top 5, I'd do the deal in a heartbeat and get into the teens.

How does a Zadina and Kravstov first round sound? Ya'all wanted skill and high end talent to compliment what we have.

Sounds like a lot of complaining that we didn't add a high-end RHD. :laugh:

Jokes aside, that'd be a coup for this org.
 
I'm gonna be frustrated when both Tkachuk and Zadina somehow fall and the Rangers take Tkachuk...
 
Status
Not open for further replies.

Ad

Ad