Does Curtis Joseph make it into the HOF?

[GIN ANTONIC]

Price has done nothing to even mention him with the likes of Brodeur or Lundqvist and Luongo is just as much on the fence as Cujo and you forgot Barrasso who is above all but Marty

Well, he's won a Hart which none of the other goalies have done and he's won a Vezina which Luongo has not so there's that. I'm not even a huge Price fan and that's pretty obvious. He's not a Theodore/Carey one hit wonder in that regard.

Anyway, on Cujo I vote no. Hall of very good. He played through all of the clutch and grab era and his stats aren't great to be honest.

 

[The Head Crusher]

Does Curtis Joseph make it into the Hall of Fame?

4th All time in Wins for Goalies: all goalies ahead of him are in or will be with Brodeur, Roy, Belfour

Doesn't have a cup, but does have GOLD with Team Canada in 2002. Also represented his country in 98.

Played some terrific hockey in the playoffs with STL, EDM, TOR, even DET [ except Kippersoft was better]

Probably one of the greatest goalies of all time to never win a cup.

He played 1 game in the Olympics allowed 5 goals lost the only game Canada lost in that entire Tournament. That is like saying Eric Brewer should be in the HHOF because he won that same medal. Not exactly HHOF worth.

 

[Blainer114*]

I think he has the 4th most wins in history, without a doubt he should be in the hof

 

[trentmccleary]

He probably is.
But Barrasso...

- Faced slightly worse competition in his prime
- Was done as an above average netminder at 32. Hell, he was done as a STARTER at 32 (but also started earlier), at a time where tandem goaltending was more in vogue.
- Had black holes years due to many reasons when he should've been in his prime
- Was generally not cool

I mean, I can't see the line between HHOF'er and non-HHOF'er passing straight between Joseph and Barrasso, and should there be such a line, I would have serious issues determining which one should be on the "right" side and which one should be on the "wrong" side. They're similar in a way... but there's also lots to distinguish between both.

I can see what you're saying, but I think you might be overstating the difference to make them seem closer.

IMO, Barrasso has enough peak to distinguish himself from what is basically 3 average seasons as a starter difference in their cumulative totals (mostly due to Barrasso's injuries and tandem goaltending).

Calder, Vezina, Jennings
5 top-3 Vezina finishes vs. 3
Two Cups
1x1st AST, 2x2nd AST vs. 0 of either

SV% Finishes:
Top-5 = 4 vs. 2
6-10 = 2 vs. 3 (but one of Joseph's was 30 games as a backup).

He was top-10 in Vezina voting in 5 of his first 6 seasons.

Over the next decade, he back stopped two Cup winners and then finished 2nd and 3rd for the Vezina in other seasons.

Between the 5x top-3 Vezina finishes and two Cups, he has 7 peak accomplishments spread over 7 different seasons in a 15 year span. That should be enough longevity to get in even though he played fewer games than CuJo.

 

[Poignant Discussion*]

I can see what you're saying, but I think you might be overstating the difference to make them seem closer.

IMO, Barrasso has enough peak to distinguish himself from what is basically 3 average seasons as a starter difference in their cumulative totals (mostly due to Barrasso's injuries and tandem goaltending).

Calder, Vezina, Jennings
5 top-3 Vezina finishes vs. 3
Two Cups
1x1st AST, 2x2nd AST vs. 0 of either

SV% Finishes:
Top-5 = 4 vs. 2
6-10 = 2 vs. 3 (but one of Joseph's was 30 games as a backup).

He was top-10 in Vezina voting in 5 of his first 6 seasons.

Over the next decade, he back stopped two Cup winners and then finished 2nd and 3rd for the Vezina in other seasons.

Between the 5x top-3 Vezina finishes and two Cups, he has 7 peak accomplishments spread over 7 different seasons in a 15 year span. That should be enough longevity to get in even though he played fewer games than CuJo.

Just to add to this but he started as an 18 year old and won rookie of the year AND the Vezina

And these are the records he holds to this day

Most NHL assists by a goaltender (career) - 48
Most NHL points by a goaltender (career) - 48
Most consecutive NHL playoff wins - 14 (May 9, 1992 to April 22, 1993)
Shares record for most consecutive wins in one NHL playoff season - 11 in 1992
Shares record for most wins in one NHL playoff season - 16 (1992)
2nd most wins by a US born Goaltender (369)

 

[Birko19]

Cujo was a great goalie, but he's no HOFer, the same applies for Roberto Luongo btw, it boggles my mind how some ppl think he's a shoe in, based on what exactly?

 

[Rabid Ranger]

I don't see it but maybe his wins get him in....

 

[Datsyukian Deke]

He definitely deserves to be in a lot more than Paul Kariya, of all people.

 

[Kranix]

I'd take CuJo in the flames net right now.

 

[GIN ANTONIC]

He definitely deserves to be in a lot more than Paul Kariya, of all people.

Kariya had a MUCH better peak than Cujo.

 

[Gardner McKay]

I think he should be in.

 

[THall4]

Luongo has two second team all star selections and a Jennings trophy. Joseph doesn't even have that.

Not to mention Luongo also has 2 World Championship gold medals, 1 World Cup gold and 2 Olympic gold medals. If Luongo gets in this will be why.

And could have over 500 wins when he retires.

 

[Ruok]

If Joseph gets in, then Fluery is a lock. 2 Cups, Olympics gold medal and could finish top 3 in wins

That's the weird thing about just looking at statistics though, Joseph was a better goalie in his time relative to his peers than Fluery has ever been.

edit: and on a completely different note, Joseph had my favorite goalie helmet as a kid. It was pretty sweet.

 

[StoneHands]

If Joseph gets in, then Fluery is a lock. 2 Cups, Olympics gold medal and could finish top 3 in wins

Why, because he played on a consistently great team? Fleury has never been been close to an individual award and he has a total of 2 Vezina votes in 12 seasons.

When the HoF voters look at Fleury's career they aren't going to see him as a 2 time Cup winner and Olympic gold winner. He didn't even play in the Olympics when he won the Gold and he started 1 playoff game last season and was got rocked and lost the game. He literally had nothing to do with that Cup or Olympic Gold. Even the one Cup he won when he was a started the team was despite his average play. If anything, his playoff resume is going to be a detriment to his chances.

 

[Kurt Cobain]

I think he should. As a Devils fan, who's team went up against Cujo when he was a Leaf in some epic playoff series, I just have tremendous respect for him and consider him a top 15 goalie of all time. Through the 90s into the early 2000s he was imo, he was easily the 5th best goalie during the era that produced the highest end goaltenders in the history of the game. The only better goalies, and this is in no order whatsoever were: Roy, Brodeur, Hasek and Belfour. There's nothing to he's ashamed of when being called the best goalie in the world following those four. I can't think of a goaltender besides those four I listed that were better than Cujo during that time period. Richter had a chance but his knees and his unwillingness to get the hell out of NY in the late 90s and early 2000s, because of dedication to the team that gave him his chance which I respect, but it did hinder his overall career. Khabibulin had his moments but stills fall short.

I'm babbling now, but yes Curtis Joseoh should be a member of the hockey hall of fame. 454 career wins and 50+ shutouts. I also think you could argue that he's the best goaltender to never win a Vezina trophy.

 

[Soundgarden]

IMO, Joseph IS the fence. It's hard to decide what side of the fence the actual fence is on... but if you're better than Joseph, you're in, and if you're worse you're out.

That's what I'm thinking, kind of sucks for him, but someone's got to be that guy and he's it. Perfect example.

 

[FoxyClean]

Only goalies currently outside of the hall who will get in:

Brodeur
Lundqvist
Luongo
Price

Price would need at least 3-5 more years of consistent great play to be mentioned among the other 3. The only players you can definitively say will make it into the HOF are the ones that could retire TODAY and be inducted. If Carey Price retires today, he isn't a HOFer. If he's a top goalie for another 5+ years, is he a HOFer? Yeah, obviously. But with goalies especially, you never know when things can go downhill fast.

 

[Schenn]

The nostalgia in me wants him to make it. But he doesn't have much hardware.

 

[jetsfan91]

If he didn't choke in Detriot he probably would.

 

[Doctor No]

If he didn't choke in Detriot he probably would.

I, too, hold Curtis Joseph responsible for the Red Wings scoring only six goals in the equivalent of five-plus games.

Good call.

 

[SladeWilson23]

I, too, hold Curtis Joseph responsible for the Red Wings scoring only six goals in the equivalent of five-plus games.

Good call.

To be fair, Giguere was inhuman that year......until he faced the Devils that is.

 

[CDN24]

I don't see it but maybe his wins get him in....

And maybe the losses keep him out.

He is 4th all time in wins and 3rd all time in losses. It is more a stat of longevity than actual goalie greatness. He was a very good goalie but was never IMO an elite one. There were always 4-5 guys better than him. Very good but not HOF. Very similar to Luongo,.

 

[Birko19]

I, too, hold Curtis Joseph responsible for the Red Wings scoring only six goals in the equivalent of five-plus games.

Good call.

Its not Cujo's fault and he did not play too bad, but his period in Detroit was unfortunate for his career, being sent down and all did not help, though I blame the Wings for that, not Cujo, I felt bad for the guy.

 

[TOGuy14]

Leafs fan and huge Cujo fan, think he belongs in the Hall of Very Good, but not HOF.

The only thing he has that REALLY stands out is his win total, which is just a cumulative thing based on longevity.

 

[Bones45]

No way -- guy was avg in a long career --- did nothing to stand out.

HOF in any sport is for performance above and beyond most all... and that aint the case with him.