Confirmed with Link: DJ Smith fired, Jacques Martin in as interim, Alfie as assistant

[Micklebot]

Our strongest roster last year came during our second worst stretch.

In fact I thought we were worse post tdl than we were to start the year.

This year we are out missing our second line d man during our worst stretch of hockey. That’s it.

People would understand if we were regularly good and then hiccup when we hit the injury bug. But I mean they’re injuries can’t be an excuse for some of the defensive hockey we’ve seen over the last two years.

There are certainly legitimate criticisms to be made which is why it's disappointing to see misleading claims spreed.

Our healthiest stretch was games 57-62 when only Norris and Forsberg were out. we went 5-1
Then Talbot got hurt and we lost 3 of 4, followed by Chabot Kelly and Joseph all getting hurt for the game against Edm.

This year we've been pretty bad, I don't think their struggles can be pinned on health, though I do find it funny though when you characterize Chabot as just our 2nd line Dman when he leads D in TOI/g, just an inconsequential 2nd pairing d though...

 

[BankStreetParade]

Can you explain to me how this roster, even with Joseph, Chabot, and Pinto out is underperforming our 2019-2020 team with Tierney as our #1C, Zaitsev on our #1 D pair?

If injuries are that critical (obviously they are), then factor those same injuries into the DJs first year as a coach here, because he had to deal with injuries that year too.
If you compare the two rosters only using guys who remained relatively uninjured, then take out Batherson and Bobby Ryan from that 19-20 team and compare the rosters.
One of these is legit a AHL team and the other is can't even afford to bring in a 3c because we're right at the cap. We give up more goals per game after 5 years of "development" and have an inferior win percentage.

Even without Chabot: Sandy, Chych, Zub, Brann, JBD, and Hamonic is significantly better than Zaitsev, Hainsey and Boro.

That team had a lot more experience on it.

The guys who played the most minutes: Chabot 23, Zaitsev 28, Hainsey 38, Brown 26, DeMelo 26, Reilly 26, Pageau 27, Tkachuk 20, Borowiecki 30, Tierney 25, Duclair 24.
Average age = 26.6

Compared to now: Chabot 27, Sanderson 21, Chychrun 25, Stutzle 22, Zub 28, Giroux 36, Tkachuk 24, Norris 24, Batherson 25, Joseph 26, JBD 23.
Average age = 25.5

Experience matters a lot in this league. That first group had nearly double the amount of games played, up to that season, as this current group has. Experienced teams know how to weather the ups and downs, it's that simple. A group can be way more talented on an individual basis but experience is extraordinarily important. How many teams at the deadline look to add high-quality veteran experience? Guys with Finals appearances or championships? They're not looking to add highly skilled young players because they know the guys with experience are worth their weight in gold. They know how to withstand the psychological variation of high-intensity games and moments.

This team still has a long way to go in maturity and experience. Our 2 best players, Stutzle and Sanderson, have a combined 400ish games in the NHL. They just don't know how to deal with the ups and downs yet because they're going through it for the first time.

 

[Burrowsaurus]

You said Norris was only injury post trade deadline, I was just correcting that nothing else.

Now that you’ve changed that to the western road trip, then both goalies were also out for that. Just including facts nothing more.

Obviously Norris was out the full year.

Wow goalies were injured. Doesn’t matter who is in nets we left them out to dry.

And even when the goalies weren’t injured we started the year horribly. Like… doesn’t matter who’s injured, the team sucked ass under DJ

I watched the games. Doesn’t matter who was in nets the team played poorly. Ghastly. Abhorrent.

There are certainly legitimate criticisms to be made which is why it's disappointing to see misleading claims spreed.

Our healthiest stretch was games 57-62 when only Norris and Forsberg were out. we went 5-1
Then Talbot got hurt and we lost 3 of 4, followed by Chabot Kelly and Joseph all getting hurt for the game against Edm.

This year we've been pretty bad, I don't think their struggles can be pinned on health, though I do find it funny though when you characterize Chabot as just our 2nd line Dman when he leads D in TOI/g, just an inconsequential 2nd pairing d though...

He is our second pairing d man. Okay so let’s change it. 1 player of the top 4 is out. Better? Guess what..we’re still shit. When he’s in? Under DJ guess what.. we’re still shit

 

[Micklebot]

He is our second pairing d man. Okay so let’s change it. 1 player of the top 4 is out. Better? Guess what..we’re still shit. When he’s in? Under DJ guess what.. we’re still shit

Wow, you changed your wording to continue to minimize the player, congrats for proving my point.

There are legit things to complain about, you don't need to spin things to make it seem worse, but sure, we'll pretend he's just some top 4 guy, no different than had Hamonic been out last year, right, just a top 4 D nothing to see here.

 

[Burrowsaurus]

You said Norris was only injury post trade deadline, I was just correcting that nothing else.

Now that you’ve changed that to the western road trip, then both goalies were also out for that. Just including facts nothing more.

Okay so you’re able to recount facts. When someone was injured. How long. But are you saying anything? Or just repeating facts. Are you trying to say the injuries are a valid excuse? Or not? Or just saying facts to pull some sort of gotcha lol

 

[Micklebot]

Okay so you’re able to recount facts. When someone was injured. How long. But are you saying anything? Or just repeating facts. Are you trying to say the injuries are a valid excuse? Or not? Or just saying facts to pull some sort of gotcha lol

Never seen someone get so bent out of shape that the facts of a matter were corrected....

 

[HoweHullOrr]

Pinto and Chabot should be back in late Jan. I guess we will eventually (hopefully) find out how the potential translates to results with the new coaches and healthy lineup in place.

 

[Nova Stutzlia]

Pinto and Chabot should be back in late Jan. I guess we will eventually (hopefully) find out how the potential translates to results with the new coaches and healthy lineup in place.

Do you have some info on Chabot's health?

 

[HoweHullOrr]

Do you have some info on Chabot's health?

I don't have new info. I was just basing this on what was said after the injury happened. Chabot could be back sooner than late January btw. See info below. I was just saying that both Pinto and Chabot should be back by the end of January (approx).

Thomas Chabot (lower body) has been placed on the Long-Term Injured Reserve and will be out a minimum four weeks.
Chabot was not able to complete Saturday's game, his second game after a 10-game absence due to a hand injury, exiting late in the third period after playing 22:29 with a lower-body injury and has been placed on the Long-Term Injured Reserve Thursday. In the two games, Chabot scored one point (0G / 1A) and eight shots on goal while quarterbacking the Senators' top powerplay unit. He is expected to be out a minimum of four weeks.

Source:
Darren Dreger Dec 7, 2023 @ 17:33 EST

 

[HoweHullOrr]

Do you have some info on Chabot's health?

Oops - delete.

 

[Burrowsaurus]

Never seen someone get so bent out of shape that the facts of a matter were corrected....

lol and then I corrected the corrected facts.

I bet if you ask all of us exact dates and games certain players were injured. We wouldn’t remember.

But… real fact is.. no matter who was injured, and at what time. Under DJ smith, we looked bad most of the te. That’s really the only fact that matters.

 

[Sens of Anarchy]

 

[Golden_Jet]

lol and then I corrected the corrected facts.

Actually not, you moved the goalposts, from post TDL to western road trip.
Have a good one, I’m said my points now.

 

[Nova Stutzlia]

JM gives more details about "more aggressive":

 

[The Professional]

It's probably been said but it's sad to see fans around here kind of giving up on this core.

The Sens were largely predicted to at least compete for a playoff spot this year. They have a bunch of good young players and one of the best offense in the league and on paper when healthy, a very solid top 4. How anyone can look at the roster we have on paper and say that they are nowhere near a playoff team baffles me. With the talent on the club, they absolutely should be challenging for a spot.

The problem was always coaching. You can have a lot of good young talent but if the coaching staff is just winging it and not instilling defensive discipline into them and getting them on board with a coherent system or holding them accountable for their bad play, then of course that team is going nowhere. It doesn't mean the roster itself isn't playoff caliber. With proper coaching, this should absolutely be a playoff team, there's no excuse.

And that's the frustrating part. It's been painfully obvious for a long time that DJ wasn't the right coach anymore. In the beginning of the rebuild, sure. DJ is a good players coach, a good motivator. When the team has a bunch of rookies and isn't expected to win or make the playoffs, then a coach like DJ is good.

But now, our core, while still pretty young, aren't rookies anymore. Brady, Stutzle, Batherson etc. have all broken out. Losing is no longer acceptable and you shouldn't be getting an atta boy and a pat on the back if you're not playing well. It was painfully obvious that DJ and his approach had expired since at least last season and that we needed a more technical, experienced coach.

Firing DJ and brining in a veteran coach like Martin who is one of the best teachers in hockey was a great move, but it should have happened a month ago at least. Now that Martin is here, he's got a lot of work to do. He's got to go back to the drawing board and teach these guys how to play a disciplined, defensive style and work on fundamentals again, which apparently DJ wasn't doing. And I'm sure the team will improve because of it. But it's probably gonna take weeks of on and off ice work, if not more, for him to right the ship. It's likely already too late to salvage the season. Why didn't we do this a month + ago when Ottawa still had a million games in hand and could very realistically catch all those wildcard teams is beyond me. We even had a stretch of like 6 days off that would have been the perfect time to bring in Jacques and run a few good practices.

It's like management decided to give up on the season and go with the status quo, even though everyone knew that this group badly needed a new coach. Coaches were getting fired left and right in the league and meanwhile, Ottawa did nothing until they basically had no choice. Very disappointing. The team will probably improve under Martin, but now we will likely fall just short of the playoffs when I honestly think that brining in a new coach wutb a new approach earlier might have saved the season.

 

[Burrowsaurus]

Actually not, you moved the goalposts, from post TDL to western road trip.
Have a good one, I’m said my points now.

That western road trip was post trade deadline.

 

[Golden_Jet]

That western road trip was post trade deadline.

Yes , that was your goal post move, after proven wrong on post TDL injuries, you needed to narrow your criteria, and even then it was still wrong, there were more injuries than just Norris.

Time to move along dude, or just admit you were wrong, like a lot of us do, when proven wrong. Either works.

 

[Do Make Say Think]

It's probably been said but it's sad to see fans around here kind of giving up on this core.

The Sens were largely predicted to at least compete for a playoff spot this year. They have a bunch of good young players and one of the best offense in the league and on paper when healthy, a very solid top 4. How anyone can look at the roster we have on paper and say that they are nowhere near a playoff team baffles me. With the talent on the club, they absolutely should be challenging for a spot.

The problem was always coaching. You can have a lot of good young talent but if the coaching staff is just winging it and not instilling defensive discipline into them and getting them on board with a coherent system or holding them accountable for their bad play, then of course that team is going nowhere. It doesn't mean the roster itself isn't playoff caliber. With proper coaching, this should absolutely be a playoff team, there's no excuse.

And that's the frustrating part. It's been painfully obvious for a long time that DJ wasn't the right coach anymore. In the beginning of the rebuild, sure. DJ is a good players coach, a good motivator. When the team has a bunch of rookies and isn't expected to win or make the playoffs, then a coach like DJ is good.

But now, our core, while still pretty young, aren't rookies anymore. Brady, Stutzle, Batherson etc. have all broken out. Losing is no longer acceptable and you shouldn't be getting an atta boy and a pat on the back if you're not playing well. It was painfully obvious that DJ and his approach had expired since at least last season and that we needed a more technical, experienced coach.

Firing DJ and brining in a veteran coach like Martin who is one of the best teachers in hockey was a great move, but it should have happened a month ago at least. Now that Martin is here, he's got a lot of work to do. He's got to go back to the drawing board and teach these guys how to play a disciplined, defensive style and work on fundamentals again, which apparently DJ wasn't doing. And I'm sure the team will improve because of it. But it's probably gonna take weeks of on and off ice work, if not more, for him to right the ship. It's likely already too late to salvage the season. Why didn't we do this a month + ago when Ottawa still had a million games in hand and could very realistically catch all those wildcard teams is beyond me. We even had a stretch of like 6 days off that would have been the perfect time to bring in Jacques and run a few good practices.

It's like management decided to give up on the season and go with the status quo, even though everyone knew that this group badly needed a new coach. Coaches were getting fired left and right in the league and meanwhile, Ottawa did nothing until they basically had no choice. Very disappointing. The team will probably improve under Martin, but now we will likely fall just short of the playoffs when I honestly think that brining in a new coach wutb a new approach earlier might have saved the season.

Has this core made a case that it is good enough?

All this core has done is underachieve.

 

[SensHulk]

It's probably been said but it's sad to see fans around here kind of giving up on this core.

The Sens were largely predicted to at least compete for a playoff spot this year. They have a bunch of good young players and one of the best offense in the league and on paper when healthy, a very solid top 4. How anyone can look at the roster we have on paper and say that they are nowhere near a playoff team baffles me. With the talent on the club, they absolutely should be challenging for a spot.

The problem was always coaching. You can have a lot of good young talent but if the coaching staff is just winging it and not instilling defensive discipline into them and getting them on board with a coherent system or holding them accountable for their bad play, then of course that team is going nowhere. It doesn't mean the roster itself isn't playoff caliber. With proper coaching, this should absolutely be a playoff team, there's no excuse.

And that's the frustrating part. It's been painfully obvious for a long time that DJ wasn't the right coach anymore. In the beginning of the rebuild, sure. DJ is a good players coach, a good motivator. When the team has a bunch of rookies and isn't expected to win or make the playoffs, then a coach like DJ is good.

But now, our core, while still pretty young, aren't rookies anymore. Brady, Stutzle, Batherson etc. have all broken out. Losing is no longer acceptable and you shouldn't be getting an atta boy and a pat on the back if you're not playing well. It was painfully obvious that DJ and his approach had expired since at least last season and that we needed a more technical, experienced coach.

Firing DJ and brining in a veteran coach like Martin who is one of the best teachers in hockey was a great move, but it should have happened a month ago at least. Now that Martin is here, he's got a lot of work to do. He's got to go back to the drawing board and teach these guys how to play a disciplined, defensive style and work on fundamentals again, which apparently DJ wasn't doing. And I'm sure the team will improve because of it. But it's probably gonna take weeks of on and off ice work, if not more, for him to right the ship. It's likely already too late to salvage the season. Why didn't we do this a month + ago when Ottawa still had a million games in hand and could very realistically catch all those wildcard teams is beyond me. We even had a stretch of like 6 days off that would have been the perfect time to bring in Jacques and run a few good practices.

It's like management decided to give up on the season and go with the status quo, even though everyone knew that this group badly needed a new coach. Coaches were getting fired left and right in the league and meanwhile, Ottawa did nothing until they basically had no choice. Very disappointing. The team will probably improve under Martin, but now we will likely fall just short of the playoffs when I honestly think that brining in a new coach wutb a new approach earlier might have saved the season.

I understand the new ownership not wanting to come in and rattle the birdcage. Likely the timing of it all didn’t afford them the chance to make sweeping changes so they viewed it as a year of learning. Problem is I think they were too passive and should have still held an objective eye in recognizing the competitive window opening up. These ‘kids’ are like in their 3rd/4th/5th year and more. It’s time for action.

Look at how aggressive the Vegas knights are. Say what you want about their ways but they know all that matters is winning and they’re aggressive as hell. It’s probably why they ended up with Mark Stone as well. Status quo isn’t an option. Don’t think anyone is complaining about stability there, they’ve had numerous coaching changes and even had a GM change.

 

[WallyD]

Do you have some info on Chabot's health?

Just wondering... do league LTIR or the players union rules limit an injured player's ability to participate? Thinking on-ice practices (if able), team meetings, player coach meetings, video sessions, etc... Obviously I get that an injured player likely does not travel with the team, but I mean while the team is home. The point is that Chabot (and others) would benefit from working with the team including new coaching staff in advance of a return to the ice. Translates to less they need to catch up on later.

 

[Nova Stutzlia]

Just wondering... do league LTIR or the players union rules limit an injured player's ability to participate? Thinking on-ice practices (if able), team meetings, player coach meetings, video sessions, etc... Obviously I get that an injured player likely does not travel with the team, but I mean while the team is home. The point is that Chabot (and others) would benefit from working with the team including new coaching staff in advance of a return to the ice. Translates to less they need to catch up on later.

I believe (but could be wrong) Pinto could practice with team in the 10 days before his return.
Perhaps the rules are different for LTIR.

 

[Golden_Jet]

Just wondering... do league LTIR or the players union rules limit an injured player's ability to participate? Thinking on-ice practices (if able), team meetings, player coach meetings, video sessions, etc... Obviously I get that an injured player likely does not travel with the team, but I mean while the team is home. The point is that Chabot (and others) would benefit from working with the team including new coaching staff in advance of a return to the ice. Translates to less they need to catch up on later.

Yes they can participate

 

[WallyD]

It's probably been said but it's sad to see fans around here kind of giving up on this core.

The Sens were largely predicted to at least compete for a playoff spot this year. They have a bunch of good young players and one of the best offense in the league and on paper when healthy, a very solid top 4. How anyone can look at the roster we have on paper and say that they are nowhere near a playoff team baffles me. With the talent on the club, they absolutely should be challenging for a spot.

The problem was always coaching. You can have a lot of good young talent but if the coaching staff is just winging it and not instilling defensive discipline into them and getting them on board with a coherent system or holding them accountable for their bad play, then of course that team is going nowhere. It doesn't mean the roster itself isn't playoff caliber. With proper coaching, this should absolutely be a playoff team, there's no excuse.

And that's the frustrating part. It's been painfully obvious for a long time that DJ wasn't the right coach anymore. In the beginning of the rebuild, sure. DJ is a good players coach, a good motivator. When the team has a bunch of rookies and isn't expected to win or make the playoffs, then a coach like DJ is good.

But now, our core, while still pretty young, aren't rookies anymore. Brady, Stutzle, Batherson etc. have all broken out. Losing is no longer acceptable and you shouldn't be getting an atta boy and a pat on the back if you're not playing well. It was painfully obvious that DJ and his approach had expired since at least last season and that we needed a more technical, experienced coach.

Firing DJ and brining in a veteran coach like Martin who is one of the best teachers in hockey was a great move, but it should have happened a month ago at least. Now that Martin is here, he's got a lot of work to do. He's got to go back to the drawing board and teach these guys how to play a disciplined, defensive style and work on fundamentals again, which apparently DJ wasn't doing. And I'm sure the team will improve because of it. But it's probably gonna take weeks of on and off ice work, if not more, for him to right the ship. It's likely already too late to salvage the season. Why didn't we do this a month + ago when Ottawa still had a million games in hand and could very realistically catch all those wildcard teams is beyond me. We even had a stretch of like 6 days off that would have been the perfect time to bring in Jacques and run a few good practices.

It's like management decided to give up on the season and go with the status quo, even though everyone knew that this group badly needed a new coach. Coaches were getting fired left and right in the league and meanwhile, Ottawa did nothing until they basically had no choice. Very disappointing. The team will probably improve under Martin, but now we will likely fall just short of the playoffs when I honestly think that brining in a new coach wutb a new approach earlier might have saved the season.

Not so sure most are giving up on or hating the core players. It's mostly fans frustrated as hell that such a supposed strong core of players apparently with skills up the wahzoo can't seem to manufacture better results. Only time will tell which of these players are as good as billed and which are duds. The onus is on those players to provide evidence one way or the other.

I for one am willing to give them a shot at proving themselves, to turn a corner. My hope is that players I think highly of become even better under new leadership. Perhaps some players I am not as impressed with find their grove under new coaching. Every player has a chance to accept change and contribute to collective team success. Any players bitter about the changes, who won't accept new systems and leadership can just move along - see ya! I would hazard a guess that winning fixes lots! Start playing as a team, expect to win and be very open to continuous improvement. Their days and careers will be much more enjoyable that way. So too the fan experience.

 

[LiseL]

That 3-0 lead was nice when we had it.

But like always it was because Korpisalo was playing lights out.

I agree. Just like it's difficult for players to play hard for a full 60 minutes, isn't it just as difficult for a goalie to continuously make numerous huge saves the entire game? I will wait to judge our goaltending once the defensive side of things gets cleaned up on a consistent basis that results in fewer give-aways, break-aways, extended D-zone time.

 

[LiseL]

I agree that the goaltending on most nights has been brutal, but yesterday it was different.

This team collapsed well before the 3rd goal (and it was a softie) and were getting dominated by Arizona for a good 20 minutes prior to it. Arizona!

If anything, Korpisalo was the reason we stayed ahead for as long as we did.

I totally agree. A former post stated that the team became deflated after the softie (3rd goal). I've noticed they become deflated as soon as the opponent score a goal. Their play started changing after Arizona scored their 1st goal. Our goalies would have to produce shutouts for this team to play well the entire game. Even then, I think they'd take their foot off the gas at some point. There's a reason once goalies leave Ottawa, their stats improve dramatically. Korpi had good numbers before he got here. Goalies can also lose focus during a game. How about the team bailing him out once in awhile? He's certainly done it for them time and time again.