Blue Jays Discussion: Dickey Wins Gold Glove.

[dredeye]

I hate to be that guy, but I'd almost rather keep Arencibia at his price tag than pay Salty, even at a discount. Chances are he'll cost about six million dollars more, while striking out just as much, and being close as mediocre defensively.

There's no harm in that. I don't want him at all. I also didn't realize he's projecting to get paid quite as highly as some here are suggesting. It was a best guess as to why they may target him.

I must add that I'm loving having to go through pages of posts if I'm off for a while. Love all the Jays banter of late

 

[p.l.f.]

AA on fan590 said the bautista to philly is totally false and hasnt spoken with any free agents yet

 

[Mr Knies Guy]

AA on fan590 said the bautista to philly is totally false and hasnt spoken with any free agents yet

Totally BSing or simply playing semantics. He's spoken to agents about free agents, there's no doubt. What's he doing then, hibernating for the winter?

 

[Mach85]

Promote this man!

How do you get peace (peas)? With a knife...

IMO, Garza. If I was a national league club, it would be Garza then Nolasco. Ubaldo would be, but his velocity decline is just way too alarming.

I think you're selling Ubaldo short. The issue with him has always been difficulty repeating his delivery, which is why he's so streaky. After CLE's pitching coach had him make mechanical changes, he was lights out. If those stick, he's an ace-level starter.

 

[Cor]

Yeah, if AA hasn't talked to any free agents, he's not doing his job

 

[trellaine201]

Yeah, if AA hasn't talked to any free agents, he's not doing his job

Beat me to it

 

[Woodman19]

AA said he hasn't made an offer to any free agents yet. Not that he hasn't talked to any.

 

[Mr Knies Guy]

AA said he hasn't made an offer to any free agents yet. Not that he hasn't talked to any.

Oh... plf said spoken to. I'm not sure I buy no offers, but I buy it more than not speaking to anyone

 

[p.l.f.]

Yeah I cant remember, was it 'hasnt spoken to' or 'hasnt negotiated with' ?
whats the dif,
What would you talk about without negotiating?

 

[Diamond Joe Quimby]

I think you're selling Ubaldo short. The issue with him has always been difficulty repeating his delivery, which is why he's so streaky. After CLE's pitching coach had him make mechanical changes, he was lights out. If those stick, he's an ace-level starter.

Way too much of a reliance on his slider as a result of his fastball losing velocity and overall effectiveness. He used the slider 25% of the time in 2013, which is by far the most in his career.

Trending decrease in velocity + increased slider use = bad news for the elbow. You're absolutely right about the delivery, and how cleaning it up aided in his resurgence. However, he still pitched countless innings with the wonky delivery, which has added to the wear and tear on that elbow. He's just too much of a risk, imo.

 

[Woodman19]

Yeah I cant remember, was it 'hasnt spoken to' or 'hasnt negotiated with' ?
whats the dif,
What would you talk about without negotiating?

what the player is looking for in a team to see if perhaps we can put together a pitch that can appeal to him other then just money.

 

[Mach85]

Way too much of a reliance on his slider as a result of his fastball losing velocity and overall effectiveness. He used the slider 25% of the time in 2013, which is by far the most in his career.

Trending decrease in velocity + increased slider use = bad news for the elbow. You're absolutely right about the delivery, and how cleaning it up aided in his resurgence. However, he still pitched countless innings with the wonky delivery, which has added to the wear and tear on that elbow. He's just too much of a risk, imo.

Fair enough, I can see why you'd have trepidation. But Garza hasn't been a picture of health either. Unless the Jays can get Tanaka or another top-2 starter via trade, I'd rather roll the dice a bit on Ubaldo than overpay Santana. Garza would be my second choice though.

 

[p.l.f.]

So you ask what he wants, or you ask if he is interested in toronto, without 'negotating' terms
Ok

 

[Diamond Joe Quimby]

Fair enough, I can see why you'd have trepidation. But Garza hasn't been a picture of health either. Unless the Jays can get Tanaka or another top-2 starter via trade, I'd rather roll the dice a bit on Ubaldo than overpay Santana. Garza would be my second choice though.

Then we mostly agree. Santana is not the play. He's fifth on the list, imo. In the case of the Blue Jays, I would hope the priority would be Tanaka, Garza, Ubaldo, and then a tie between Nolasco and Santana. Santana would get the edge if he wasn't asking for so much money. Ricky is a good NL pitcher, but I have my doubts about how effective he would be in the American League.

 

[Woodman19]

So you ask what he wants, or you ask if he is interested in toronto, without 'negotating' terms
Ok

Perhaps it could be as simple as waiting on other GM's getting back to him on trade offers that are pending. It would be rather silly to throw money at someone and then fill that hole via trade before giving him a chance to accept.

 

[Nasty Nazem]

Way too much of a reliance on his slider as a result of his fastball losing velocity and overall effectiveness. He used the slider 25% of the time in 2013, which is by far the most in his career.

Trending decrease in velocity + increased slider use = bad news for the elbow. You're absolutely right about the delivery, and how cleaning it up aided in his resurgence. However, he still pitched countless innings with the wonky delivery, which has added to the wear and tear on that elbow. He's just too much of a risk, imo.

Weird thing is, despite his terrible mechanics combined with bad control and reliance of slider, he is still healthy... like all the time. You'd have to go back to his minor league days to see he didn't have a season in which he made 30+ starts -- which is only because of innings limits.

Will he continue to stay healthy this way? Who knows... but he has a really amazing track record of staying healthy. That said, I still think Ubaldo is a disaster waiting to happen.

 

[Mach85]

Then we mostly agree. Santana is not the play. He's fifth on the list, imo. In the case of the Blue Jays, I would hope the priority would be Tanaka, Garza, Ubaldo, and then a tie between Nolasco and Santana. Santana would get the edge if he wasn't asking for so much money. Ricky is a good NL pitcher, but I have my doubts about how effective he would be in the American League.

Agreed on Nolasco, I've always seen him as a back-end guy in the AL, and the Jays have plenty of cheaper options. Ervin's strand rate also seems like it's sure to regress. For 20 mil plus, too many questions about consistency.

Anyone else think Colon has to be on PED's still and just hasn't been caught? The man makes David Wells look like a gym rat, is over 40 years old and pitching like he was in his 30's, and has a previous brush with the PED police. The potential benefit of a couple of 15 mil plus contracts if he gets away with it far outweighs the risk of getting caught, considering he'd probably just retire.

 

[Woodman19]

I have no interest in bringing anyone in unless they are mid rotation guys with stuff. We have plenty of guys in the system who can be plugged into the back of the rotation and at worst match the performance of some of the veterans at a fraction of the cost and with much more upside.

 

[p.l.f.]

Good for Scherzer, awesome numbers

 

[Eyedea]

Andy Burns has 15 hits in his last 10 games with a slash line of .429/.524/.600. He's been mashing in the AFL to a tune of an .865 OPS. 7 walks and 4 strikeouts in the last 35 ABs too. Kenny Wilson has been better too getting 6 hits and two home runs in his past 3 games to bring his OPS over .750. Still needs to cut down his Ks though.

 

[trellaine201]

Can someone tell me 3-4 top Catchers? I am having a hard time. I look at some of the stats on potential players. The latest jason castro. Not eye numbing numbers but why was he an all star?

Catchers must be hard to find, decent ones. Is the league lacking??

 

[Eyedea]

Can someone tell me 3-4 top Catchers? I am having a hard time. I look at some of the stats on potential players. The latest jason castro. Not eye numbing numbers but why was he an all star?

Catchers must be hard to find, decent ones. Is the league lacking??

Yes they are severely lacking. Top catchers would be Posey, Molina and Mauer. Since Mauer is now transitioning to 1B, the third is probably Sal Perez or Jonathan Lucroy.

 

[trellaine201]

okay, where is JP

considering whats out there maybe we should hold on to him, maybe he will have a better year.

 

[calcal798]

Then we mostly agree. Santana is not the play. He's fifth on the list, imo. In the case of the Blue Jays, I would hope the priority would be Tanaka, Garza, Ubaldo, and then a tie between Nolasco and Santana. Santana would get the edge if he wasn't asking for so much money. Ricky is a good NL pitcher, but I have my doubts about how effective he would be in the American League.

If we are looking for two SP via free-agency I'd rather a guy like Tim Hudson then Ubaldo or Santana. Groundball Pitcher that would bring some solid experience. I probably wouldnt even go after Ubaldo and Santana.

 

[DatsyukianDeke*]

The Blue Jays plan to turn to the trade market before trying to sign any big free agents, writes Shi Davidi of SportsNet.ca. The Jays appear likely to try to deal for Jeff Samardzija of the Cubs, and they already asked about Reds catcher Ryan Hanigan, who may have become superfluous when Cincinnati signed Brayan Pena. They may have also considered a run at Astros catcher Jason Castro. Jays GM Alex Anthopoulos notes that the Jays are not likely to deal veteran players for prospects. They could, however, trade catcher J.P. Arencibia, or a reliever.

http://www.mlbtraderumors.com/2013/11/east-notes-mets-blue-jays-nationals.html