Prospect Info: Devils Win #2 Overall -- Slafkovsky vs. Jiricek vs. Nemec

What should we do with #2?

  • Slafkovsky

    Votes: 220 61.5%
  • Jiricek

    Votes: 56 15.6%
  • Nemec

    Votes: 30 8.4%
  • Trade it

    Votes: 39 10.9%
  • Other

    Votes: 13 3.6%

  • Total voters
    358
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Cooley could very well end up being the better overall player but the Devil's should definitely take Slavkovsky over Cooley. I think the points maybe don't show it, but Cooley I think is the far superior player to Nazar for example. His game I think is much more projectable to the next level. Cooley won't bust, Nazar has a decent chance to bust
Please don't take this wrong, but posts like these are extremely troubling without offering a hint of explanation.

I love the Cooley v Nazar debate because it's so close. They're similar sized and both elite skaters. Cooley gets the edge in skating because he's a bit more explosive in his acceleration and has remarkable top speed. Cooley gets a slight edge as a playmaker, but again Nazar possesses terrific vision and it's close. But I think that's everywhere I give the edge to Cooley.

Nazar is a slightly superior shooter, especially because of an almost preternatural ability to change his shot angle at the last second. Despite being just 5'10-175, Nazar is actually more physical and loves to buzz-saw his way through the interior. While Cooley prefers to circle up high looking for seams to pass through for high-danger chances, Nazar is less predictable in that he also loves to use his quick hands and high-end sticklhandling to knife towards the net himself. Nazar fears nothing, and I'd rank his compete level among the highest in the 2022 draft -- while Cooley's is very good, it's not at Nazar's level. Nazar is also the better defensive player and more versatile -- having played a great deal of right wing (Cooley just center) and on the US-NTDP top PP and PK unit (Cooley is top PP but scarcely used on the PK).

I strongly, strongly disagree that Nazar has "a decent chance to bust". His versatility allows him the talent floor of an outstanding 3rd liner, while Cooley needs a top 6 role to succeed. And, as I often say -- players with high intangibles (compete & IQ) have the highest chance of approaching their talent ceiling, and Nazar's intangibles are among the best in the 2022 draft class.

Both Logan Cooley and Frank Nazar are exciting and dynamic players. But I have Nazar at #5 and Cooley at #6, and although it's close, I'm sticking with it. One of my major reasons for ranking Nazar so highly is that I feel he has as scarce a chance to "bust" as almost anyone in the 2022 class. You can play him anywhere, in any situation, at any time. He's a coaches (and linemates) dream. He's a guy you put out there whether up by one goal or down by one goal late in the game. The kid's a winner.
 
The Phoenix Suns just got eliminated in an embarrassing game 7 against the Dallas Mavericks last niggt

Why do I mention that?

Because the Suns had the 1st overall in 2018 and took a player by the name of Deandre Ayton. Three picks later another player by the name of Luka Doncic went to the Hawks (traded to Mavs).

The reason the Suns went for Ayton over now-megastar Doncic? 'We needed size in the lineup and Ayton was the man for us'.

Now of course the NBA isnt the NHL but I use this as an example of what misery we could possibly live with if we took Slafkovsky for his size and then one of the others in Cooley Nemec Jiricek etc. become a megastar and we kick ourselves.

And just for the record I am a fan of taking Slafkovsky. But I dont think referencing his size and Fitzgerald's willingness to beefen up the offense is a good idea nor should have anything to do with the pick.
Has anyone in here said they thought Slaf was the lesser player but still advocated taking him because of need? Everyone keeps pushing back against a narrative that as far as I can see is non-existent.
 
Has anyone in here said they thought Slaf was the lesser player but still advocated taking him because of need? Everyone keeps pushing back against a narrative that as far as I can see is non-existent.
I get what you are saying, I really do, but I think it will be a massive mistake to take Slaf and not Cooley solely because he is big and we need a winger.
 
There can be an overemphasis on size and there also seems to be the polar opposite of that — the idea that size doesn’t matter at all. It’s not even about grit, more about puck protection and reach. That giraffe Tage Thompson can do things most guys can’t because of his size.
Yea the issue comes when in listing a bunch of pluses a player has, if size is listed, literally everything else gets ignored and it becomes "just cuz big."

Never happens with anything else, shot, speed, IQ, playmaking... Just size.
 
Nazar, to me, plays a perimeter style type of game. I get that he has nice skill, he just doesn't have that "it" factor that you want a player to have while Cooley is great at playing in tight situations, has the skating ability, competitiveness, the hockey IQ and skill to be an impact player at the next level. Nazar needs time and space to make a play and I don't think he'll be a play driver in the NHL. This is me just watching every game at the u18s comparing the two but I think Cooley is a far better prospect when projecting their skill sets to the NHL level. Time will tell but I think Cooley is more like Point and Nazar is more like Boqvist. Cooley vs Nazar and Cooley wins and it's not close for me based on my viewings
 
If Slafkovsky is Zacha,
Jirichek is a big Dman that bases his game off an elite shot so he is like Eric Gelinas,
Nemec is a Dman that is good at everything but lacks a truly elite ability like John Merrill,
Who do you take #2 overall?
Zacha, Gelinas, or Merrill?
 
Show me on this doll where Slafkovsky hurt you. Mostly every mock I’ve seen post-lottery has us taken him. Pronman, Morreale, sporting news….all probably wrong I guess
I think you are reading this conversation wrong. I made a bad joke, and he's saying we won't be taking him just because of the reason, but still taking him. He was defending him.
 
The Phoenix Suns just got eliminated in an embarrassing game 7 against the Dallas Mavericks last niggt

Why do I mention that?

Because the Suns had the 1st overall in 2018 and took a player by the name of Deandre Ayton. Three picks later another player by the name of Luka Doncic went to the Hawks (traded to Mavs).

The reason the Suns went for Ayton over now-megastar Doncic? 'We needed size in the lineup and Ayton was the man for us'.

Now of course the NBA isnt the NHL but I use this as an example of what misery we could possibly live with if we took Slafkovsky for his size and then one of the others in Cooley Nemec Jiricek etc. become a megastar and we kick ourselves.

And just for the record I am a fan of taking Slafkovsky. But I dont think referencing his size and Fitzgerald's willingness to beefen up the offense is a good idea nor should have anything to do with the pick.
I have no idea who any of these basketball players even are, but I'm pretty sure it's a completely different sport.

In hockey, you don't draft a player because he has size, but you certainly factor it into the equation, especially if the player knows how to use it. There are myriad exceptions -- like with Brayden Point, who fell to the 3rd round because he was small but plays a power game like he's 6'3-220, or with Alex Nylander who went top 10 because he was skilled and 6'1-190 but played like he was 5'3-100 and never stuck in the NHL.

Juraj Slafkovsky offers a rare combination of 6'4-220 and elite skills. What his size does to advance his natural skill-set is something I could write a dissertation on, but I'll try to keep it brief. I'm not sure if you remember Jaromir Jagr, but one of his foremost abilities was using his elite hands to puck handle while using his size/strength to create a natural barrier between defenders and the puck. He was then able to use his elite playmaking to create scoring opportunities time after time with defenders draped all over him. Logan Cooley cannot do this, Matt Savoie cannot do this -- but Juraj Slafkovsky can do this.

Slafkovsky's mix of size, strength and compete level makes him absolute hell to defend down low. His ability to win board battles and simply turn away from defenders to create time and space and high-danger scoring opportunities in deep is simply unparalleled in the 2022 draft class.

Slafkovsky's ability to become an immovable object in opposing creases creates myriad scoring chances for his linemates, as he is outstanding at creating screens and general havoc. He forces defenders to collapse deeper down low to defend the constant danger he causes there. Once planted in the crease, Slafkovsky's elite hands play up for deflections and rebound chances.

The Devils have several players who possess Cooley's skills but at an even higher level with higher upside -- Hughes, Bratt and Hischier. But the Devils have zero players who can do what Juraj Slafkovsky is capable of. *Size* is not the only reason, but the fact that Slafkovsky plays his best hockey on the interior simply must must must be taken into account when assessing him for the NJ Devils.

Again, right now I feel the only way Slafkovsky is not the Devils pick at #2 is if the Canadiens draft him at #1. Nemec and Jiricek also fill needs and should be discussed, but Cooley should not enter this discussion. Among the 2022 forwards, Cooley is not the top player at #2 (it's Slafkovsky) he doesn't have the highest upside at #2 (it's Slafkovsky) and he doesn't fill the greatest need (it's Slafkovsky).
 
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Yes it is a fail if they can’t beat nico out for the second line center role. Perfect world would be draft a center he plays better then nico then you can look to move nico instead of putting him on the 3c making 7+ Still stand by what I said the devils have to come out with the best player given realistic range of possibly players they can take at 2.
You're out of your mind if you really expect any prospect to walk in and displace Nico. Yeah let's trade Nico away because we got an 18 year old. That's a way to get to the playoffs alright.....Nico is the heart & soul of this team. Trade him away and you don't have a single center who can play both ends of the ice. As good as Hughes is if you're trying to protect a lead Nico is the dude you play. He plays defense, wins board battles & wins faceoffs. Do you want us to stay in the basement? Trading Nico away will do that. Horrible team building. You're obsessed with shiny new toy syndrome. This is the 3rd post I have read of yours advocating for trading away Nico.
 
If Slafkovsky is Zacha,
Jirichek is a big Dman that bases his game off an elite shot so he is like Eric Gelinas,
Nemec is a Dman that is good at everything but lacks a truly elite ability like John Merrill,
Who do you take #2 overall?
Zacha, Gelinas, or Merrill?
I’d probably take Luca Doncic over Deandre Ayton to be honest.
 
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They both had very similar starts - Seguin NEVER hit a Pts/60 rate of 3.5 that Jack did this year so maybe you're right - But I personally think they are similar.

Seguin also played for a much, much better team...Jack had an explosion of a year production-wise but the first two years were so bad it sort of evened out.

Seguin did hit 3.3 Pts/60 in back to back years in his 4th and 5th year.

Seguin was was much better defensively in his first 3 years than Jack has been - Seguin even garnered a few 5th place votes for Selke in his first two seasons.

________________________________________________________________________

Seguin's first 3 years .596 PPG - playing 15:14

Tyler Seguin Stats for Years 2011 to 2013

[TABLE=collapse]
[TR]
[TH]GP[/TH]
[TH]G[/TH]
[TH]A[/TH]
[TH]PTS[/TH]
[TH]+/-[/TH]
[TH]PIM[/TH]
[TH]EV[/TH]
[TH]PP[/TH]
[TH]SH[/TH]
[TH]GW[/TH]
[TH]EV[/TH]
[TH]PP[/TH]
[TH]SH[/TH]
[TH]S[/TH]
[TH]S%[/TH]
[TH]TSA[/TH]
[TH]TOI[/TH]
[TH]ATOI[/TH]
[TH]FOW[/TH]
[TH]FOL[/TH]
[TH]FO%[/TH]
[TH]HIT[/TH]
[TH]BLK[/TH]
[TH]TK[/TH]
[TH]GV[/TH]
[/TR]
[TR]
[TH]203[/TH]
[TD]56[/TD]
[TD]65[/TD]
[TD]121[/TD]
[TD]53[/TD]
[TD]64[/TD]
[TD]46[/TD]
[TD]10[/TD]
[TD]0[/TD]
[TD]9[/TD]
[TD]51[/TD]
[TD]14[/TD]
[TD]0[/TD]
[TD]534[/TD]
[TD]10.5[/TD]
[TD]925[/TD]
[TD]3092[/TD]
[TD]15:14[/TD]
[TD]218[/TD]
[TD]236[/TD]
[TD]48.0[/TD]
[TD]71[/TD]
[TD]44[/TD]
[TD]70[/TD]
[TD]96[/TD]
[/TR]
[/TABLE]

46 Even Strength Goals
51 Even Strength Assist
97 Even Strength Points
.478 Even Strength Points per Game

Pts/60
Year 1: 1.5
Year 2: 2.9
Year 3: 2.4

________________________________________________________________________________________

Jack Hughes first 3 years .650 PPG playing 18:02


[TABLE=collapse]
[TR]
[TD]3 yrs[/TD]
[TD]NHL[/TD]
[TD]166[/TD]
[TD]44[/TD]
[TD]64[/TD]
[TD]108[/TD]
[TD]-45[/TD]
[TD]26[/TD]
[TD]33[/TD]
[TD]11[/TD]
[TD]0[/TD]
[TD]5[/TD]
[TD]45[/TD]
[TD]19[/TD]
[TD]0[/TD]
[TD]430[/TD]
[TD]10.2[/TD]
[TD]761[/TD]
[TD]2994[/TD]
[TD]18:02[/TD]
[TD]505[/TD]
[TD]921[/TD]
[TD]35.4[/TD]
[TD]51[/TD]
[TD]33[/TD]
[TD]147[/TD]
[TD]187[/TD]
[/TR]
[/TABLE]

33 EV Goals
45 EV Assist
78 EV Points
.469 Even Strength Points per game


Pt/60
Year 1: 1.3
Year 2: 1.7
Year 3: 3.5
Seguin got two 5th place Selke votes in 2011-12 and one 4th place Selke vote in 2012-13.

Seguin also spent the vast majority of both of those seasons playing on a line with Marchand (one 3rd & one 5th place vote in 2011-12 & two 5th place votes in 2012-13) and Bergeron (won Selke by +714 vote margin in 2011-12 & 2nd in voting, losing to Toews by -10 votes, in 2012-13).
 
Please don't take this wrong, but posts like these are extremely troubling without offering a hint of explanation.

I love the Cooley v Nazar debate because it's so close. They're similar sized and both elite skaters. Cooley gets the edge in skating because he's a bit more explosive in his acceleration and has remarkable top speed. Cooley gets a slight edge as a playmaker, but again Nazar possesses terrific vision and it's close. But I think that's everywhere I give the edge to Cooley.

Nazar is a slightly superior shooter, especially because of an almost preternatural ability to change his shot angle at the last second. Despite being just 5'10-175, Nazar is actually more physical and loves to buzz-saw his way through the interior. While Cooley prefers to circle up high looking for seams to pass through for high-danger chances, Nazar is less predictable in that he also loves to use his quick hands and high-end sticklhandling to knife towards the net himself. Nazar fears nothing, and I'd rank his compete level among the highest in the 2022 draft -- while Cooley's is very good, it's not at Nazar's level. Nazar is also the better defensive player and more versatile -- having played a great deal of right wing (Cooley just center) and on the US-NTDP top PP and PK unit (Cooley is top PP but scarcely used on the PK).

I strongly, strongly disagree that Nazar has "a decent chance to bust". His versatility allows him the talent floor of an outstanding 3rd liner, while Cooley needs a top 6 role to succeed. And, as I often say -- players with high intangibles (compete & IQ) have the highest chance of approaching their talent ceiling, and Nazar's intangibles are among the best in the 2022 draft class.

Both Logan Cooley and Frank Nazar are exciting and dynamic players. But I have Nazar at #5 and Cooley at #6, and although it's close, I'm sticking with it. One of my major reasons for ranking Nazar so highly is that I feel he has as scarce a chance to "bust" as almost anyone in the 2022 class. You can play him anywhere, in any situation, at any time. He's a coaches (and linemates) dream. He's a guy you put out there whether up by one goal or down by one goal late in the game. The kid's a winner.
Nazar, to me, plays a perimeter style type of game. I get that he has nice skill, he just doesn't have that "it" factor that you want a player to have while Cooley is great at playing in tight situations, has the skating ability, competitiveness, the hockey IQ and skill to be an impact player at the next level. Nazar needs time and space to make a play and I don't think he'll be a play driver in the NHL. This is me just watching every game at the u18s comparing the two but I think Cooley is a far better prospect when projecting their skill sets to the NHL level. Time will tell but I think Cooley is more like Point and Nazar is more like Boqvist. Cooley vs Nazar and Cooley wins and it's not close for me based on my viewings.
 
Nazar, to me, plays a perimeter style type of game. I get that he has nice skill, he just doesn't have that "it" factor that you want a player to have while Cooley is great at playing in tight situations, has the skating ability, competitiveness, the hockey IQ and skill to be an impact player at the next level. Nazar needs time and space to make a play and I don't think he'll be a play driver in the NHL. This is me just watching every game at the u18s comparing the two but I think Cooley is a far better prospect when projecting their skill sets to the NHL level. Time will tell but I think Cooley is more like Point and Nazar is more like Boqvist. Cooley vs Nazar and Cooley wins and it's not close for me based on my viewings
Nazar is the more interior player to Cooley, I'm not sure what you're seeing. Nazar prefers the tight areas, Cooley likes to circle high and make plays in space. Cooley has little in common stylistically with Point and Nazar has even less in common with Boqvist.

In the U-18 tournament, Cooley had 3 goals and 10 points in 6 games playing on the first line between first-round locks Cutter Gauthier and Jimmy Snuggerud. Frank Nazar had 3 goals and 9 points on the second line between likely-first-rounder Ian Howard and 16 year old John Leonard. I'm not sure where Cooley was far better in the tournament. They were both equally outstanding.
 
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Please don't take this wrong, but posts like these are extremely troubling without offering a hint of explanation.

I love the Cooley v Nazar debate because it's so close. They're similar sized and both elite skaters. Cooley gets the edge in skating because he's a bit more explosive in his acceleration and has remarkable top speed. Cooley gets a slight edge as a playmaker, but again Nazar possesses terrific vision and it's close. But I think that's everywhere I give the edge to Cooley.

Nazar is a slightly superior shooter, especially because of an almost preternatural ability to change his shot angle at the last second. Despite being just 5'10-175, Nazar is actually more physical and loves to buzz-saw his way through the interior. While Cooley prefers to circle up high looking for seams to pass through for high-danger chances, Nazar is less predictable in that he also loves to use his quick hands and high-end sticklhandling to knife towards the net himself. Nazar fears nothing, and I'd rank his compete level among the highest in the 2022 draft -- while Cooley's is very good, it's not at Nazar's level. Nazar is also the better defensive player and more versatile -- having played a great deal of right wing (Cooley just center) and on the US-NTDP top PP and PK unit (Cooley is top PP but scarcely used on the PK).

I strongly, strongly disagree that Nazar has "a decent chance to bust". His versatility allows him the talent floor of an outstanding 3rd liner, while Cooley needs a top 6 role to succeed. And, as I often say -- players with high intangibles (compete & IQ) have the highest chance of approaching their talent ceiling, and Nazar's intangibles are among the best in the 2022 draft class.

Both Logan Cooley and Frank Nazar are exciting and dynamic players. But I have Nazar at #5 and Cooley at #6, and although it's close, I'm sticking with it. One of my major reasons for ranking Nazar so highly is that I feel he has as scarce a chance to "bust" as almost anyone in the 2022 class. You can play him anywhere, in any situation, at any time. He's a coaches (and linemates) dream. He's a guy you put out there whether up by one goal or down by one goal late in the game. The kid's a winner.
Nazar sounds like a Mercer-type player.
 
Yes it is a fail if they can’t beat nico out for the second line center role. Perfect world would be draft a center he plays better then nico then you can look to move nico instead of putting him on the 3c making 7+ Still stand by what I said the devils have to come out with the best player given realistic range of possibly players they can take at 2.
I’m only drafting a center if it’s Shane Wright. And then I’m rolling Nico-jack-Wright. If and when wright surpasses Nico then I’m rolling jack-Wright-Nico. Just like Edmonton rolls mcdavid-draisatil-nugent hopkins
 
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Has anyone in here said they thought Slaf was the lesser player but still advocated taking him because of need? Everyone keeps pushing back against a narrative that as far as I can see is non-existent.
Then maybe people arent being honest with themselves because if Slafkovsky was 6'1 like Wright, I doubt everyone would be vying for him with 'size' always coming up

Ive stated before I would like Slafkovsky and I think hes certainly skilled enough to be 2nd overall. So Im in no way trying to discredit him as the pick.

But you're kidding yourself if you dont think over half the fanbase doesnt want him because our top-6 producers are small compared to league average. And because of Fitzgeralds comments about getting bigger up front, which shouldnt involve Slafkovsky because we can acquire bigger wingers in the two years before he likely makes the NHL.
 
I have no idea who any of these basketball players even are, but I'm pretty sure it's a completely different sport.

In hockey, you don't draft a player because he has size, but you certainly factor it into the equation, especially if the player knows how to use it. There are myriad exceptions -- like with Brayden Point, who fell to the 3rd round because he was small but plays a power game like he's 6'3-220, or with Alex Nylander who went top 10 because he was skilled and 6'1-190 but played like he was 5'3-100 and never stuck in the NHL.

Juraj Slafkovsky offers a rare combination of 6'4-220 and elite skills. What his size does to advance his natural skill-set is something I could write a dissertation on, but I'll try to keep it brief. I'm not sure if you remember Jaromir Jagr, but one of his foremost abilities was using his elite hands to puck handle while using his size/strength to create a natural barrier between defenders and the puck. He was then able to use his elite playmaking to create scoring opportunities time after time with defenders draped all over him. Logan Cooley cannot do this, Matt Savoie cannot do this -- but Juraj Slafkovsky can do this.

Slafkovsky's mix of size, strength and compete level makes him absolute hell to defend down low. His ability to win board battles and simply turn away from defenders to create time and space and high-danger scoring opportunities in deep is simply unparalleled in the 2022 draft class.

Slafkovsky's ability to become an immovable object in opposing creases creates myriad scoring chances for his linemates, as he is outstanding at creating screens and general havoc. He forces defenders to collapse deeper down low to defend the constant danger he causes there. Once planted in the crease, Slafkovsky's elite hands play up for deflections and rebound chances.

The Devils have several players who possess Cooley's skills but at an even higher level with higher upside -- Hughes, Bratt and Hischier. But the Devils have zero players who can do what Juraj Slafkovsky is capable of. *Size* is not the only reason, but the fact that Slafkovsky plays his best hockey on the interior simply must must must be taken into account when assessing him for the NJ Devils.

Again, right now I feel the only way Slafkovsky is not the Devils pick at #2 is if the Canadiens draft him at #1. Nemec and Jiricek also fill needs and should be discussed, but Cooley should not enter this discussion. Among the 2022 forwards, Cooley is not the top player at #2 (it's Slafkovsky) he doesn't have the highest upside at #2 (it's Slafkovsky) and he doesn't fill the greatest need (it's Slafkovsky).
The parallel to the NBA example was to show that team need as of today is overblown when drafting at 2. Thats all I was insinuating. Deandre Ayton is a big center while Luka Doncic is a superstar scorer, which it seemed Phoenix already had and is why I say current team need for a draft pick that high is risky. They passed on a potential instant HoFer whos only 23 and leading league playoff scoring

Slafkovsky is a great prospect and Id love to have him and his size. Im not silly enough to think we take him simply because hes skilled because, quite frankly, he isnt as 'purely skilled' as some of these other picks, its his skill along with his size that is tantalizing. If he was 6'1" would he still be at 2nd overall in mock drafts?

Im not claiming the Devils will only pick him for his size, im claiming thats the majority of the reason why our fans want him. And there is nothing wrong with that, but itll lead to major disappointment if they dont take him; when in reality we could end up signing a Nichuskin and draft a Nemec, and then what does size have to do with it anymore?

Just putting my thoughts out there on that aspect of all of this. Im a Devils supporter through and through so even if we reached for a name I havent heard of, Ill support the pick and find positives in it
 
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