Prospect Info: Devils Win #2 Overall -- Slafkovsky vs. Jiricek vs. Nemec

[Classic Devil]

I remember a similar player to Reid, from over 20 years ago, Pierre Dagenais. Guy had a desperately wicked shot, but was pretty slow, one-dimensional. Lou/Conte liked him so much he drafted him twice! He didn't sign after the first drafting, so they picked him again. We eventually lost him on waivers.

I remember when Lou said losing Mogilny was okay because we had Dagenais waiting to contribute in the NHL.

 

[glenwo2]

I remember when Lou said losing Mogilny was okay because we had Dagenais waiting to contribute in the NHL.

Lou gonna Lou.

 

[JimEIV]

When you devote several posts to denigrating a player's best attribute and then go on to describe that attribute as 'good', that is a meaningless adjective in that context. How good? Who on the Devils has a good shot? Does Nico? How about Hughes? Tomas Tatar? Sharangovich? Who has a good shot? I know how I think about each of these player's shots, but I certainly don't know how you do, and saying good, the least descriptive word you can apply, isn't helping. Does good mean above-average? Does it mean average? How far above average is good?

I followed up exceptional with 'one of the best in the AHL', trying to rank Holtz in a continuum, granted one I don't know a lot about, but Holtz was one of the best goal scorers in the AHL, he isn't a very good skater nor is he particularly strong, so I'm making some inferences based on highlights I've seen of him and his numbers. It's hard to score that many goals without a great shot especially if a player is not a good skater or strong.

Can we be objective for a moment?

25 guys scored 26 or more goals in the AHL this season. Holtz scored goals about the same rate as Joey Anderson in the AHL this year.

I get it Anderson was 23 and Holtz is 20...but I am really not sure why you think that Holtz performance was something extraordinary? It was good ...I would argue that he produced at an expected level for a former #7 overall in the AHL and not really above that.

There really isn't a tremendous speration from his peers and players drafted behind him scored as much or more...I not seeing the uniqueness here.

Here are the Rookie Goal scorers in the AHL this year

TheAHL.com | The American Hockey League

theahl.com

 

[Blackjack]

Can we be objective for a moment?

25 guys scored 26 or more goals in the AHL this season. Holtz scored goals about the same rate as Joey Anderson in the AHL this year.

I get it Anderson was 23 and Holtz is 20...but I am really not sure why you think that Holtz performance was something extraordinary? It was good ...I would argue that he produced at an expected level for a former #7 overall in the AHL and not really above that.

There really isn't a tremendous speration from his peers and players drafted behind him scored as much or more...I not seeing the uniqueness here.

Here are the Rookie Goal scorers in the AHL this year

TheAHL.com | The American Hockey League

theahl.com

When Joey Anderson was Alex's age he was playing for Duluth and scored 11 goals in 36 games.

You also made them seem closer in age than they are. They were draft four seasons apart, Joey is three and a half years older than Alex.

If you want to be objective, I would say Alex Holtz's D+2 was a little disappointing in that you'd like to see a 7OA forward in the NHL. He definitely was not NHL ready as of last year. That said, it makes no sense to diminish what he accomplished in the AHL.

 

[Triumph]

Can we be objective for a moment?

25 guys scored 26 or more goals in the AHL this season. Holtz scored goals about the same rate as Joey Anderson in the AHL this year.

I get it Anderson was 23 and Holtz is 20...but I am really not sure why you think that Holtz performance was something extraordinary? It was good ...I would argue that he produced at an expected level for a former #7 overall in the AHL and not really above that.

There really isn't a tremendous speration from his peers and players drafted behind him scored as much or more...I not seeing the uniqueness here.

Here are the Rookie Goal scorers in the AHL this year

TheAHL.com | The American Hockey League

theahl.com

You didn't read the post, you saw what you wanted to see. Holtz's shot is exceptional. We know from watching him in the NHL that the rest of his game needs work to get to the NHL level. Otherwise, Blackjack said everything better than I would.

As for your list, as ever, you ignore age - most AHL rookies are significantly older than Holtz - yes, Peterka and Quinn are also in their D+2, but Pelletier is in his D+3, McMann is in his D+8, Steeves was in his D+4, and the rest aren't worth going into.

This discussion doesn't belong here, but it is worth it if the Devils draft Slafkovsky and he plays in the AHL next season. We shouldn't expect him to be dominant there.

 

[JimEIV]

When Joey Anderson was Alex's age he was playing for Duluth and scored 11 goals in 36 games.

You also made them seem closer in age than they are. They were draft four seasons apart, Joey is three and a half years older than Alex.

If you want to be objective, I would say Alex Holtz's D+2 was a little disappointing in that you'd like to see a 7OA forward in the NHL. He definitely was not NHL ready as of last year. That said, it makes no sense to diminish what he accomplished in the AHL.

I am certainly not diminishing what he did....I just think the rest of you are trying to elevate to something it was not.

 

[severian]

I saw a Puljujarvi vs. Slafkovsky comparison on the main board. I am not a prospect junkie, so I'm just going by what I read. Can someone here breakdown why that is a reasonable comparison for Slavkovsky and/or why you think Slavkovsky will be the better player than Puljujarvi?

 

[Devils731]

Not sure if this was posted.

NHL.com mock drafts. Both writers have the Devils taking Slaf.

Morreale covers the Devils for NHL.com too.

“Kimelman -- Juraj Slafkovsky, LW, TPS (FIN): With Jack Hughes, Nico Hischier and Dawson Mercer, the Devils are in good shape down the middle. As New Jersey looks to build its lineup, Slafkovsky brings elite offensive skills in a power forward body (6-4, 218). He's already shown he can excel against older competition in Liiga, the top professional league in Finland, and at the 2022 Beijing Olympics, where, as the youngest player in the tournament, was named its most valuable player. Slafkovsky led all players with seven goals in seven games for Slovakia, which won the bronze medal. From a physical standpoint, he appears ready to play in the NHL next season.

Morreale -- Slafkovsky: He would be the perfect fit in New Jersey on the wing alongside one of the team's talented centers. Slafkovsky uses his size, reach and strength as an effective and active checker in the offensive and defensive zones. In addition to his success at the Olympics, he led Slovakia at the 2022 IIHF World Championship with nine points (three goals, six assists) in eight games.”

 

[StevenToddIves]

I saw a Puljujarvi vs. Slafkovsky comparison on the main board. I am not a prospect junkie, so I'm just going by what I read. Can someone here breakdown why that is a reasonable comparison for Slavkovsky and/or why you think Slavkovsky will be the better player than Puljujarvi?

Slafkovsky has the best combination of playmaking/puckhandling of any player in the 2022 class -- better than Wright or Cooley or Savoie or Geekie or Lambert or whomever. They are absolutely elite tools. Puljujarvi did not have a singular trait at such a high level. I'd also grade most of Slafkovsky's tools across the board over Puljujarvi's, especially hockey IQ.

Puljujarvi is a very good player, and I like him a lot. He's an excellent 2nd-line winger, and I think he still has a bit of untapped upside to become even better. But Slafkovsky's trio of elite tools (playmaking/puckhandling/hockey IQ) combined with a litany of other plus tools (compete/shot/skating) and a 6'4-220 frame make him truly a rare prospect.

 

[Captain3rdLine]

When you devote several posts to denigrating a player's best attribute and then go on to describe that attribute as 'good', that is a meaningless adjective in that context. How good? Who on the Devils has a good shot? Does Nico? How about Hughes? Tomas Tatar? Sharangovich? Who has a good shot? I know how I think about each of these player's shots, but I certainly don't know how you do, and saying good, the least descriptive word you can apply, isn't helping. Does good mean above-average? Does it mean average? How far above average is good?

I followed up exceptional with 'one of the best in the AHL', trying to rank Holtz in a continuum, granted one I don't know a lot about, but Holtz was one of the best goal scorers in the AHL, he isn't a very good skater nor is he particularly strong, so I'm making some inferences based on highlights I've seen of him and his numbers. It's hard to score that many goals without a great shot especially if a player is not a good skater or strong.



Yeah, I get that, and sometimes shots don't translate across leagues, especially when players don't have enough deception. But it's a good shot, you've said enough.

I think he has a good shot and is one the better shooters in the AHL but I don’t thinks it’s gonna be an elite NHL shot. When it’s in his wheelhouse or he’s in a perfect position to shoot it’s hard for goalies to stop but it’s not that often that’s the case. I’d say his shot is quite a bit above average but not at an Elite level. On the Devils I think Sharangovich has good shot, I think Zacha has a good shot in a similar way to Holtz (but not as good) where he has a very good shot but his release, deceptiveness and ability to get it off in non perfect positions isn’t good enough. I think Hughes on the other hand has a very nice release but doesn’t get close to as much velocity on it. I think Bratt has a pretty good shot but he just needs to figure out how to use it a little more (figured that out a bit this season). Mercer has a pretty good shot. Nice catch a release ability but he doesn’t enough velocity on it so his shot isn’t really dangerous from any decent distance.

What makes Holtz such a good goalscorer is that yes he has a good shot but it’s as much if not more about his IQ and mindset to get himself into good areas and his finishing ability. That’s what could make him a good goalscorer in the NHL and he certainly could be that but he’ll need to be able to keep up with the speed of the game and his linemates and I’m concerned that he may not be able to and it will certainly be a hurdle to him becoming a 30 goal scorer.

 

[Brodeur]

I remember when Lou said losing Mogilny was okay because we had Dagenais waiting to contribute in the NHL.

The strange thing was that we were a top 5 offense before Mogilny then things fell apart in 2001-02. That might have been Lou's diplomatic response, but I think the reality was that we had so many guys on cheap deals in 1999-01 and our payroll ballooned once everybody needed raises. Vancouver ate about a million of Mogilny's salary as part of the trade as well.

 

[bigvonbody]

According to sources, the Devils are leaning towards one of Jiricek or Slafkovsky. Don't be shocked if it's Big Dave,

 

[Billdo]

Hypothetically... Seattle calls and says we'll give you 4 and Larsson for 2. Do you think about it? It would give us a pretty damn good right side on the defensive end, a good PKer, and still gives us one of Jiricek or Nemec in all likelihood.

 

[Eggtimer]

I want to trade for a Puljujarvi in a big way. I just think he has mkre in him than he has shown to date. I’m not saying he will be the player people thought he’d be when he was drafted , but I can see him still improve given the opportunity. New team/ city/coach and out of the spot light of playing in a Canadian market. Chance for him to just relax and concentrate on hockey and not always Havig to worry about justifying his draft position.
Confidence is huge and I see him imroicjf his game if he can gain some more confidence.

I see him being able to grow his game and be like Nichushkin has done.
Even if he does not improve much more , he would be a very valuable right handed shot winger that brings a lot of what we need to our 3rd line .
He wouldn’t cost a ton to get and I feel is the perfect fit for us and has potential to maybe play his way up into the top 6. If not , he woild still be very valuable as a third line RW that does a lot of things well .

Hypothetically... Seattle calls and says we'll give you 4 and Larsson for 2. Do you think about it? It would give us a pretty damn good right side on the defensive end, a good PKer, and still gives us one of Jiricek or Nemec in all likelihood.

No. What is with this Larsson talk?

 

[Andre Palot]

I would absolutely entertain a trade down, I think you would be foolish not to.

However, not out of the top five. Anything outside of that and it wouldn't make sense. But if we did a trade down with Seattle, we could end up with Nemec or Jiricek and other assets. I'd think about that.

 

[Billdo]

I want to trade for a Puljujarvi in a big way. I just think he has mkre in him than he has shown to date. I’m not saying he will be the player people thought he’d be when he was drafted , but I can see him still improve given the opportunity. New team/ city/coach and out of the spot light of playing in a Canadian market. Chance for him to just relax and concentrate on hockey and not always Havig to worry about justifying his draft position.
Confidence is huge and I see him imroicjf his game if he can gain some more confidence.

I see him being able to grow his game and be like Nichushkin has done.
Even if he does not improve much more , he would be a very valuable right handed shot winger that brings a lot of what we need to our 3rd line .
He wouldn’t cost a ton to get and I feel is the perfect fit for us and has potential to maybe play his way up into the top 6. If not , he woild still be very valuable as a third line RW that does a lot of things well .


No. What is with this Larsson talk?

I just think it would be something to at least consider.

 

[BurntToast]

I saw a Puljujarvi vs. Slafkovsky comparison on the main board. I am not a prospect junkie, so I'm just going by what I read. Can someone here breakdown why that is a reasonable comparison for Slavkovsky and/or why you think Slavkovsky will be the better player than Puljujarvi?

I seen this as well, and something needs to be said about mentality. Puljujarvi’s struggles were very public. I am sure blame can be spread to both management and the player. Plus, playing in the Edmonton bubble probably didn’t help. It can be the media but Puljujarvi’s reaction to adversity was less than stellar.

Slaf left his home years ago to chase his dream and to improve. Slaf struggled this season but his play kept him in the top 10 conversation and once he broke out, he hasn’t looked back.

 

[Eggtimer]

I would absolutely entertain a trade down, I think you would be foolish not to.

However, not out of the top five.

…. No way you pass on Slafkovsky when you were gifted him through a miracle lotto win …. You just don’t unless you get something massive back and or can be assured that Slaf is still there 100% certain at the pick you move down to. But that’s very very unlikely

 

[Forge]

Hypothetically... Seattle calls and says we'll give you 4 and Larsson for 2. Do you think about it? It would give us a pretty damn good right side on the defensive end, a good PKer, and still gives us one of Jiricek or Nemec in all likelihood.

No...I don't want Larsson.

 

[Devils731]

Hypothetically... Seattle calls and says we'll give you 4 and Larsson for 2. Do you think about it? It would give us a pretty damn good right side on the defensive end, a good PKer, and still gives us one of Jiricek or Nemec in all likelihood.

I think about it and not long after say, “I don’t want Larsson with 3 years remaining on his contract.”

I’m not necessarily opposed at seeing the Devils go from 2 to 4 but Larsson adds no value to a trade, imo.

 

[Xirik]

No...I don't want Larsson.

You don't miss him at all?!

 

[Billdo]

I think about it and not long after say, “I don’t want Larsson with 3 years remaining on his contract.”

I’m not necessarily opposed at seeing the Devils go from 2 to 4 but Larsson adds no value to a trade, imo.

My thought process was he's a decent enough third pairing right hand defenseman. Sure three years is a bit but we don't have RHD besides McCarthy in the pipeline. Would give us time to figure out what he is and then Jiricek or Nemec to force their way in especially if Severson isn't back after this year. Regardless it's probably not even a possibility nor am I sold on the idea anyway.

 

[StevenToddIves]

Stick at #2, take Slafkovsky. If Montreal takes Slafkovsky #1, then trade down with Seattle and take Jiricek or Nemec #4 and Seattle's #35 overall pick.

 

[RSeen]

Can we be objective for a moment?

25 guys scored 26 or more goals in the AHL this season. Holtz scored goals about the same rate as Joey Anderson in the AHL this year.

I get it Anderson was 23 and Holtz is 20...but I am really not sure why you think that Holtz performance was something extraordinary? It was good ...I would argue that he produced at an expected level for a former #7 overall in the AHL and not really above that.

There really isn't a tremendous speration from his peers and players drafted behind him scored as much or more...I not seeing the uniqueness here.

Here are the Rookie Goal scorers in the AHL this year

TheAHL.com | The American Hockey League

theahl.com

Are you really being objective comparing players who are 3+ years apart in age?

 

[LeedsMonster]

The more I think about it, the more I want Gauthier...