Devils team discussion (news, notes and speculation) - part IV

[Louskoolaid89]

kuznetsov on waivers. 7.8mm till next year. Would you claim him? He’s a center but that’s a big contract for a player who’s declined the last few years. I’m not sure what his off the ice status is

No we are stupidly desperate for a goalie instead.

 

[ZYXWVUT]

They're not doing that.

Exactly. And it’s not the only issue that prevent it from being possible, but by far the biggest reason it won’t is because the goaltending isn’t close to good enough to hold consistency to go on any type of decent stretch that is longer than a few games, and even then you aren’t gonna win X in a row, similar to the stretch whenever they won say 5/6. Still loss(es) sprinkled in. We’ve seen it all year, not sure what additional proof is needed.

 

[Maine Fan]

I have a feeling you're right, sadly.

I think the urge to "salvage the season" will be too much for Fitz and he will inevitably decide to acquire Markstrom.

I don't think this season, if that is making the playoffs, can be salvaged at this point without giving up too much and still no guarantees.

 

[NjDevsRR]

They're not doing that.

Hard to do that when you don’t have a single winning streak longer than three games this year

Exactly. And it’s not the only issue that prevent it from being possible, but by far the biggest reason it won’t is because the goaltending isn’t close to good enough to hold consistency to go on any type of decent stretch that is longer than a few games, and even then you aren’t gonna win X in a row, similar to the stretch whenever they won say 5/6. Still loss(es) sprinkled in. We’ve seen it all year, not sure what additional proof is needed.

Some y'all need to fix your sarcasm detectors

 

[Ripshot 43]

Some y'all need to fix your sarcasm detectors
View attachment 828609

Bought one for you

 

[forceten]

Markström's age is a problem, but he has one poor and one mediocre season, otherwise he has been consistently good.

Yes but those two seasons were two of his most recent three before this year. He turns 35 midway through next year. No no no no.

We bitch about trading a young Shara for an older (but younger than Markstrom) Toffoli, and getting older and slower in general, and we want to trade real assets for a guy who might bust a testicle walking to the toilet for the third time in a normal leaky prostate evening?

This is the kind of shit that makes you Mike Milbury and the Isles of the early 2000s - trade away the window and your entire asset pool and win nothing

 

[Xirik]

Adin Hill plays like nothing like Marty lol

Goalies have ego's and perhaps Brodeur likes goalies that play like him? Most of those are pretty athletic goalies, Meanwhile Helle has a sportsnet article about how boring his style is.

You are welcome.

LMAO

 

[devilsblood]

Amongst D-men who have played at least 50 minutes of 5v5 TOI, Luke Hughes is dead last, 10 out of 10, in pts/60.

I know points is not a great metric for d-men, and posters are definitely going to point to on ice shooting % being near the bottom of that group, and this is definitely Lindy's fault (eye roll) but dead last?

The multitude of gaffe's would be more acceptable if he was contributing more offensively.

 

[NjDevsRR]

Amongst D-men who have played at least 50 minutes of 5v5 TOI, Luke Hughes is dead last, 10 out of 10, in pts/60.

I know points is not a great metric for d-men, and posters are definitely going to point to on ice shooting % being near the bottom of that group, and this is definitely Lindy's fault (eye roll) but dead last?

The multitude of gaffe's would be more acceptable if he was contributing more offensively.

This is like Jack circa first two seasons. A child who is learning the game. He will surge by 2025-2026

 

[SteveCangialosi123]

Amongst D-men who have played at least 50 minutes of 5v5 TOI, Luke Hughes is dead last, 10 out of 10, in pts/60.

I know points is not a great metric for d-men, and posters are definitely going to point to on ice shooting % being near the bottom of that group, and this is definitely Lindy's fault (eye roll) but dead last?

The multitude of gaffe's would be more acceptable if he was contributing more offensively.

Kevin Bahl and Brendan Smith have an 11% on ice shooting percentage. Luke’s is 6.8. Nothing but pure luck there.

 

[devilsblood]

This is like Jack circa first two seasons. A child who is learning the games. He will surge by 2025-2026

Ya, a very apt example, somehow it didn't occur to me.

 

[guitarguyvic]

Completely unknowable and probably false. Goaltending skill exists. The Flames and Devils both give up 3.1 xGA per game all strengths. They aren’t some great defensive team.

Let’s bookmark the post and revisit in in eight months.

 

[devilsblood]

Kevin Bahl and Brendan Smith have an 11% on ice shooting percentage. Luke’s is 6.8. Nothing but pure luck there.

Ramdom for Bahl and Smith to be that high.

Less so with Luke.

 

[SteveCangialosi123]

Let’s bookmark the post and revisit in in eight months.

So the reverse must be true in your “goaltending skill doesn’t exist” universe. Vitek would be in the Vezina conversation on Calgary. That works better if you ignore Vladar is .890, Wolf is .878.

Ramdom for Bahl and Smith to be that high.

Less so with Luke.

Your belief is that Luke Hughes is not creating lots of offense at even strength? Sounds not remotely true.

 

[TrufleShufle]

This is like Jack circa first two seasons. A child who is learning the game. He will surge by 2025-2026

Yup, and this was talked about going into the season, at this stage he's going through learning what not to do. He can do so much and has for so long coming into this league, not he needs to learn what doesn't work and stick with what does, trim the fat. Exactly like Jack.

You still see it with Jack, he gets overly excited playing with Luke sometimes and it's like he reverts to making overly pretty plays while underestimating his opponents, like he did his first year and change. Once they both start to get back in the groove and learning their competition, it's going to be lights out. Just hope it doesn't take much longer...

 

[devilsblood]

Your belief is that Luke Hughes is not creating lots of offense at even strength? Sounds not remotely true.

Outside of the occasional full ice rush, I can't says he's been noticeably adept at creating chances.

 

[devilsblood]

Yup, and this was talked about going into the season, at this stage he's going through learning what not to do. He can do so much and has for so long coming into this league, not he needs to learn what doesn't work and stick with what does, trim the fat. Exactly like Jack.

You still see it with Jack, he gets overly excited playing with Luke sometimes and it's like he reverts to making overly pretty plays while underestimating his opponents, like he did his first year and change. Once they both start to get back in the groove and learning their competition, it's going to be lights out. Just hope it doesn't take much longer...

I think a bigger issue for Luke is not doing things that don't work, but instead just unforced errors like falling over the blue line and just losing the puck out of nowhere.

He's definitely had a pretty full plate though, and I actually think his D play has been pretty solid.

Also like his brother, the frustration has been pretty apparent.

 

[SteveCangialosi123]

Outside of the occasional full ice rush, I can't says he's been noticeably adept at creating chances.

He’s out there for 2.13 GF per 60 vs 3.05 expected GF per 60. He creates many chances — no D out there for more scoring chances per 60. The puck not going in is obviously coloring your perception.

 

[longislanddevil]

It has been said by multiple posters but I’ll echo the sentiment. Toffoli MUST either be extended (no more than three years) or traded. It isn’t acceptable in my eyes to simply let him walk this summer. I have no qualms dealing him now. This team doesn’t deserve us being buyers or even remaining status quo, if an opportunity to help our long term outlook presents itself. If we can fetch a 1st round pick for him, it can be flipped in the summertime in a deal for a Saros or Ullmark.

Another benefit of trading him is seeing what Holtz can do with an extended look in the top 6. The more I think about it…my preference would be to ship Toffoli out.

 

[guitarguyvic]

So the reverse must be true in your “goaltending skill doesn’t exist” universe. Vitek would be in the Vezina conversation on Calgary. That works better if you ignore Vladar is .890, Wolf is .878.

I don’t know the intricacies of what’s going on in Calgary, nor do I care to. I know what’s going on with this team however, and it’s a very clear pattern that extends across multiple seasons. It’s very obvious that some combination of this garbage system, our goalie coach, and the quality/inexperience of the goaltenders is causing every goalie that puts on this uniform to perform poorly.

So yeah if you change just one of those things, you maybe MAYBE might see some improvement in the goaltending, but at best it’s gonna be nominal and overall will probably still be subpar. Markstrom is an aged goalie who recently had a junky season of his own…he’s certainly not gonna be the guy to overcome those other factors with this team.

But like I said, feel free to bookmark and revisit in eight months.

 

[hidek91]

I kind of would just like to take our shot at really fixing the position for a bit (if we fire ruff, of course).

Quick is a short term fix who may not even be a fix given seasons previous to this one

This ship has sailed, NYR management must be lurking here!

 

[longislanddevil]

Trade Toffoli, give Timo PP1 time and promote Holtz.

THIS!!!

 

[Triumph]

I don’t know the intricacies of what’s going on in Calgary, nor do I care to. I know what’s going on with this team however, and it’s a very clear pattern that extends across multiple seasons. It’s very obvious that some combination of this garbage system, our goalie coach, and the quality/inexperience of the goaltenders is causing every goalie that puts on this uniform to perform poorly.

So yeah if you change just one of those things, you maybe MAYBE might see some improvement in the goaltending, but at best it’s gonna be nominal and overall will probably still be subpar. Markstrom is an aged goalie who recently had a junky season of his own…he’s certainly not gonna be the guy to overcome those other factors with this team.

But like I said, feel free to bookmark and revisit in eight months.

It's a very clear pattern that extends across multiple seasons except for one season but it extends across multiple seasons but it includes several goalies that aren't in the league anymore for good reason but also I don't care about other teams so xG is fake.

With the next coach you will just say the same stuff. It's the same exact principle, just flipped.

 

[guitarguyvic]

It's a very clear pattern that extends across multiple seasons except for one season but it extends across multiple seasons but it includes several goalies that aren't in the league anymore for good reason but also I don't care about other teams so xG is fake.

With the next coach you will just say the same stuff. It's the same exact principle, just flipped.

Except one season? Vitek wound up cratering by the end of the season and in the playoffs. He happened to last a bit longer than the others…that’s what you’re going with to dispute the pattern?

Some of the goalies we used aren’t in the league anymore…ok and? Some of them are. What exactly do you think this proves?

And xG is trash, I don’t need to know about any other team to know that. Anything that judges scoring chances based almost strictly off of location is f***ing dumb. Another bet I’d be willing to make is that in 5 years xG as it’s used today is gonna be recognized as the idiotically flawed analysis that it is, and will be abandoned.

 

[Guttersniped]

Completely unknowable and probably false. Goaltending skill exists. The Flames and Devils both give up 3.1 xGA per game all strengths. They aren’t some great defensive team.

Yes.

Here’s a comparison.


vs


One guys getting a lot more help.