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Devils team discussion (news, notes and speculation) - part IV

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It's a lot of things that's killed the team this year, a la the Sherry Tweet - losing three top five defensemen and playing multiple games with bums like Cal Foote only adds more wear and tear onto kids who shouldn't have this much wear and tear (specifically Luke and possibly Bahl, at least Nemec had a full pro season last year) and it just adds to the lack of structure, adds to the goaltending issues. They also can't score their way out of trouble without Dougie, with Jack being 'off' since mid-December and Timo being 'off' most of the year. This isn't anywhere close to the team we had last year and people should stop acting like it is.

I'm not saying Lindy isn't an idiot, I'm saying he didn't get smart because of an assistant - he got smart cause he had a good roster where everything clicked last year, now the roster isn't as good and nothing's clicking this year.
 
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If Fitz does sit on his hands now only to give Calgary a ransom over the summer, that'll be a fireable offense. You can't waste a season THEN give in. Arguably that'd true even if he made the trade now (or after we lose to the Kings tomorrow) anyway.
 
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JrFischer54 said:
Well people will get their wish and we won’t spend any assets in a “lost season” we will just spend them in the summer instead lol
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Long shot but if the Devils hover around TB and the wild card by like 2-3 points going into Friday, who knows. It's just the idea that they won't win enough games to deserve the trade. If they were in second or third, the trade for a goalie would've happened already like Timo last year
 
NJDevs26 said:
If Fitz does sit on his hands now only to give Calgary a ransom over the summer, that'll be a fireable offense. You can't waste a season THEN give in.
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Why would Calgary get a ransom without retention? I swear people just make narratives in their head
 
NJDevs26 said:
It's a lot of things that's killed the team this year, a la the Sherry Tweet - losing three top five defensemen and playing multiple games with bums like Cal Foote only adds more wear and tear onto kids who shouldn't have this much wear and tear (specifically Luke and possibly Bahl, at least Nemec had a full pro season last year) and it just adds to the lack of structure, adds to the goaltending issues. They also can't score their way out of trouble without Dougie, with Jack being 'off' since mid-December and Timo being 'off' most of the year. This isn't anywhere close to the team we had last year and people should stop acting like it is.

I'm not saying Lindy isn't an idiot, I'm saying he didn't get smart because of an assistant - he got smart cause he had a good roster where everything clicked last year, now the roster isn't as good and nothing's clicking this year.
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I've said this multiple times before and I'll say it again, if the Devils need the 22-23 roster + the absurd injury luck they had last year where not a lot of guys got hurt then this team is f***ed regardless. You don't get "perfect seasons" like that start to finish in the NHL and that was arguably the second best Devils roster in history that didn't win a Cup besides 2000-2001.

Unknown Caller said:
Uhhh yeah if we don’t add Markstrom during the season Fitzgerald better not be handing over a top 15 pick for the guy in the summer.
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Or he trades Toffoli at 50% and uses those assets for Markstrom which is far more plausible than the doom and gloom bullshit on this board.
 
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ZachaFlockaFlame said:
Why would Calgary get a ransom without retention? I swear people just make narratives in their head
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It depends on your definition of a ransom I guess. As much as I don't care if they bin Holtz off at this point since he's clearly out of favor, I'd rather not deal a first-rounder AND Holtz AND a secondary piece or two for just Markstrom at no retention when we won't even have the Dougie cap hit buffer.

I'm not sure Calgary will be any more willing to budge off their ask (which is likely something to the effect of the above) this offseason since almost all the Canadian teams feel they have to be relevant every year and don't want to rebuild. I don't actually think Fitz will bite on their ask either so this isn't being doomer. Just saying 'if' he did, then what the hell was the point of blowing up a season playing poker first if you were just going to fold?
 
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NJDevs26 said:
It's not like a frigging assistant is the only loss we've had between last season and this. Dougie being hurt, Jack/Timo playing hurt, losing two other members of the D to free agency and the goalies going to shit are all much bigger reasons for the downturn than an assistant coach. And that's not even getting into the whole Tatar/Shara/McLeod role player stuff and becoming more top-heavy, which is an issue when a couple of big top end pieces aren't playing particularly well.

They absolutely are not on par with Florida talent-wise, they have top-end players (with Jack and Timo taking turns underperforming) and a whole bunch of dross around them.
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It's far more likely last year was a fluke.
 
NJDevs26 said:
It depends on your definition of a ransom I guess. As much as I don't care if they bin Holtz off at this point since he's clearly out of favor, I'd rather not deal a first-rounder AND Holtz AND a secondary piece or two for just Markstrom at no retention when we won't even have the Dougie cap hit buffer.

I'm not sure Calgary will be any more willing to budge off their ask (which is likely something to the effect of the above) this offseason since almost all the Canadian teams feel they have to be relevant every year and don't want to rebuild. I don't actually think Fitz will bite on their ask either so this isn't being doomer. Just saying 'if' he did, then what the hell was the point of blowing up a season playing poker first if you were just going to fold?
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They'll been an obvious indicator this week if this management believes in Holtz, if they trade Toffoli then they want to see Holtz in that spot the rest of this year regardless of Lindy behind the bench.

Emperoreddy said:
It's far more likely last year was a fluke.
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Meh, as negative as I am right now, this team is fine long term. They have every cornerstone you need skater wise. 1C, 2C, good wings for the most part, very lethal defense in today's age that can skate/score. Siegs/Marino getting back to their defensive stalwart level would do WONDERS for them in 24-25.

Unknown Caller said:
No it’s far more likely this year is a fluke. Just a shitstorm of bad luck.
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Ya, with all the bullshit that has happened, they're still a bubble team. This type of season would utterly sink most teams in the league. We just don't have the coach or goaltending to save us.
 
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NJDevs26 said:
It depends on your definition of a ransom I guess. As much as I don't care if they bin Holtz off at this point since he's clearly out of favor, I'd rather not deal a first-rounder AND Holtz AND a secondary piece or two for just Markstrom at no retention when we won't even have the Dougie cap hit buffer.

I'm not sure Calgary will be any more willing to budge off their ask (which is likely something to the effect of the above) this offseason since almost all the Canadian teams feel they have to be relevant every year and don't want to rebuild. I don't actually think Fitz will bite on their ask either so this isn't being doomer. Just saying 'if' he did, then what the hell was the point of blowing up a season playing poker first if you were just going to fold?
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I wouldn't trade Holtz or a 1st rounder for Markstrom let alone both.
 
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Lou Bloom said:
I don't care about spending assets, I care about spending them wisely. And in my mind a 35 year old goalie making $6M is not that.
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It’s for two years relax. I don’t think it will cost anymore or less then it would to get him now. Where else are you going to find an experienced goalie on a short term contract that’s proven he can handle a full work load? Doubt any are on the market and if so I’m sure they will be more expensive.

Lou Bloom said:
I wouldn't trade Holtz or a 1st rounder for Markstrom let alone both.
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Well then expect more of the same goaltending issues next year
 
The only reason Calgary would receive a legit haul for Markstrom is retention. If that's gone then they're out of their minds thinking they're getting one + Markstrom's comments yesterday
 
ZachaFlockaFlame said:
The only reason Calgary would receive a legit haul for Markstrom is retention. If that's gone then they're out of their minds thinking they're getting one + Markstrom's comments yesterday
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Well not the only reason. He's still a 'starting goalie' better than a lot of contenders' nominal starters and the demand will only go up more in the offseason for one.
 
JrFischer54 said:
It’s for two years relax. I don’t think it will cost anymore or less then it would to get him now.
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Unless the price is minimal I don't want him now or the offseason.
JrFischer54 said:
Where else are you going to find an experienced goalie on a short term contract that’s proven he can handle a full work load? Doubt any are on the market and if so I’m sure they will be more expensive.
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Why do we need a goalie with those qualifications? The Golden Knights won the Stanley cup with two inexperience goalies. Look at the current playoff teams and how many of them don't have a goalie that fits that description. Markstrom will be 35 next season, why are we assuming he won't have any decline in his play over the next two seasons? For $6M you can sign a goalie like Stolarz or Brossoit and have money left over to sign a solid forward and you wouldn't be trading away significant pieces to do so.
JrFischer54 said:
Well then expect more of the same goaltending issues next year
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Yeah because relying on Adin Hill and Logan Thompson really sunk the Golden Knights season last year. Having Alex Lyon as your starting goaltender must be really hurting the Red Wings. The Kings going cheap for David Rittich and Cam Talbot instead of spending money on Joonas Korpisalo must have been a bad decision.
 
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NJDevs26 said:
Well not the only reason. He's still a 'starting goalie' better than a lot of contenders' nominal starters and the demand will only go up more in the offseason for one.
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And then the Devils just tell them to f*** off and walk to Saros who's younger + more likely to last
 
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