Devils team discussion (news, notes and speculation) - part IV

[Blender]

It actually does make complete sense when you remember how games are officiated. Since the general rule is to try and call an even amount of penalties and we play a cleaner game then we’re penalized less and get fewer PPs

Oh I know how the league actually works, but that's not how it should work.

 

[Devils731]

We're a speed team that gets clutched and grabbed constantly and average the 2nd least power play time in the league. Yea that makes sense.

It’s really bizarre and, I believe, highlights how susceptible refs are to influences outside of the actual infractions going on in the game.

The Devils still have an internal rep as a “bad” team and so they draw less penalties. The Devils have had leads late in games and so won’t draw penalties then. And so on.

 

[Blender]

It’s really bizarre and, I believe, highlights how susceptible refs are to influences outside of the actual infractions going on in the game.

The Devils still have an internal rep as a “bad” team and so they draw less penalties. The Devils have had leads late in games and so won’t draw penalties then. And so on.

NHL officials do not call the game by the rulebook, it's not how the league works and they don't even attempt it. It's all game management and bias.

 

[Blackjack]

Masisak has a article in the athletic speculating what a Meier return would look like, specifically from the Devils.

He acknowledges that most of the noise is around Holtz, but he thinks they should try to get Mercer instead.

He also thinks that the 2023 1st is table stakes as the second piece, and even thinks they should get a third, lesser piece (3rd round pick or similar)

So basically

Mercer
2023 1st
2024 3rd

He said if the main piece was Holtz, the minor piece should be upgraded to Mukhamadullin.

Holtz
1st
Mukhamadullin

FWIW, I think these packages are way too rich, and I wonder if some writers are looking at our cupboard and assuming that since we have a lot of assets we’ll be willing to overpay for stuff.

I said on the main board that I’d be willing to include Mercer, but not along with a 1st round pick. Mercer would be the crown jewel of the offer and anything else would be very minor (mid round pick or whatever). What team would include a better player than Mercer in their offer? It’s hard to imagine.

 

[Blackjack]

We're a speed team that gets clutched and grabbed constantly and average the 2nd least power play time in the league. Yea that makes sense.

If you’re a Devils fan and are anything but completely hostile to the NHL, I don’t understand you. It’s an utterly loathsome organization that has gleefully mistreated us at every opportunity.

From painting ridiculous lines behind the crease to neuter our best player to making us the only team to ever be punished for salary cap circumvention. The officiating we get is an absolute joke.

f*** the ever loving f***ing shit out of the NHL.

That is all.

 

[Lou is God]

Masisak has a article in the athletic speculating what a Meier return would look like, specifically from the Devils.

He acknowledges that most of the noise is around Holtz, but he thinks they should try to get Mercer instead.

He also thinks that the 2023 1st is table stakes as the second piece, and even thinks they should get a third, lesser piece (3rd round pick or similar)

So basically

Mercer
2023 1st
2024 3rd

He said if the main piece was Holtz, the minor piece should be upgraded to Mukhamadullin.

Holtz
1st
Mukhamadullin

FWIW, I think these packages are way too rich, and I wonder if some writers are looking at our cupboard and assuming that since we have a lot of assets we’ll be willing to overpay for stuff.

I said on the main board that I’d be willing to include Mercer, but not along with a 1st round pick. Mercer would be the crown jewel of the offer and anything else would be very minor (mid round pick or whatever). What team would include a better player than Mercer in their offer? It’s hard to imagine.

The latter package might be a heavy price but if Timo is onboard with an extension I would definitely pull the trigger.

But no way would I be happy dealing Mercer.

 

[Clam Jensen]

Only issue with acquiring Meier if they sign him and Bratt they would be tough to sign Graves too....

I honestly don’t consider not signing Graves a problem. He’s been serviceable this year, but it won’t be a massive hit to the team if he isn’t resigned, especially because some team will overpay for him in FA.

 

[Hisch13r]

Masisak has a article in the athletic speculating what a Meier return would look like, specifically from the Devils.

He acknowledges that most of the noise is around Holtz, but he thinks they should try to get Mercer instead.

He also thinks that the 2023 1st is table stakes as the second piece, and even thinks they should get a third, lesser piece (3rd round pick or similar)

So basically

Mercer
2023 1st
2024 3rd

He said if the main piece was Holtz, the minor piece should be upgraded to Mukhamadullin.

Holtz
1st
Mukhamadullin

FWIW, I think these packages are way too rich, and I wonder if some writers are looking at our cupboard and assuming that since we have a lot of assets we’ll be willing to overpay for stuff.

I said on the main board that I’d be willing to include Mercer, but not along with a 1st round pick. Mercer would be the crown jewel of the offer and anything else would be very minor (mid round pick or whatever). What team would include a better player than Mercer in their offer? It’s hard to imagine.

Looking at the Debrincat deal as a comparable (which multiple people said it’d cost less than) then I guess Holtz and our 1st is comparable to 7 and 39. Then our 2nd to the 3rd Ottawa gave up or a 3+ minor piece. If it’s Holtz, Muk, 1st I guess I begrudgingly do it. No Mercer at all.

Masisak has a article in the athletic speculating what a Meier return would look like, specifically from the Devils.

He acknowledges that most of the noise is around Holtz, but he thinks they should try to get Mercer instead.

He also thinks that the 2023 1st is table stakes as the second piece, and even thinks they should get a third, lesser piece (3rd round pick or similar)

So basically

Mercer
2023 1st
2024 3rd

He said if the main piece was Holtz, the minor piece should be upgraded to Mukhamadullin.

Holtz
1st
Mukhamadullin

FWIW, I think these packages are way too rich, and I wonder if some writers are looking at our cupboard and assuming that since we have a lot of assets we’ll be willing to overpay for stuff.

I said on the main board that I’d be willing to include Mercer, but not along with a 1st round pick. Mercer would be the crown jewel of the offer and anything else would be very minor (mid round pick or whatever). What team would include a better player than Mercer in their offer? It’s hard to imagine.

Looking at the Debrincat deal as a comparable (which multiple people said it’d cost less than) then I guess Holtz and our 1st is comparable to 7 and 39. Then our 2nd to the 3rd Ottawa gave up or a 3+ minor piece. I do Holtz, Muk, 1st begrudgingly since I’m not much of a Muk fan anyway

 

[SteveCangialosi123]

Masisak has a article in the athletic speculating what a Meier return would look like, specifically from the Devils.

He acknowledges that most of the noise is around Holtz, but he thinks they should try to get Mercer instead.

He also thinks that the 2023 1st is table stakes as the second piece, and even thinks they should get a third, lesser piece (3rd round pick or similar)

So basically

Mercer
2023 1st
2024 3rd

He said if the main piece was Holtz, the minor piece should be upgraded to Mukhamadullin.

Holtz
1st
Mukhamadullin

FWIW, I think these packages are way too rich, and I wonder if some writers are looking at our cupboard and assuming that since we have a lot of assets we’ll be willing to overpay for stuff.

I said on the main board that I’d be willing to include Mercer, but not along with a 1st round pick. Mercer would be the crown jewel of the offer and anything else would be very minor (mid round pick or whatever). What team would include a better player than Mercer in their offer? It’s hard to imagine.

Honestly, both of these deals are too much if we’re not getting him to sign a sweetheart deal. I’m not giving up all that for him to sign for 9.5+ and then possibly lose Bratt too.

 

[Zajacs Bowl Cut]

Then watch some Michigan video or games from Team USA at the recent World Juniors. Luke is all over the place and frequently not where he should be; things you sometimes get away with in the NCAA or against 20-year-olds.

He would be a liability at the NHL and even more so in the playoffs when games are tighter and positioning is crucial.

Brendan Smith gives up a scoring chance every time he is out there. Don't tell me that Luke can't be better than that....come on now.

Luke is going to step in and play. I am sorry that you don't like that. No, he isnt going to step in and play at a high level right away...almost no one does. But he is going to be a tremendous player.

 

[Devils090]

Masisak has a article in the athletic speculating what a Meier return would look like, specifically from the Devils.

He acknowledges that most of the noise is around Holtz, but he thinks they should try to get Mercer instead.

He also thinks that the 2023 1st is table stakes as the second piece, and even thinks they should get a third, lesser piece (3rd round pick or similar)

So basically

Mercer
2023 1st
2024 3rd

He said if the main piece was Holtz, the minor piece should be upgraded to Mukhamadullin.

Holtz
1st
Mukhamadullin

FWIW, I think these packages are way too rich, and I wonder if some writers are looking at our cupboard and assuming that since we have a lot of assets we’ll be willing to overpay for stuff.

I said on the main board that I’d be willing to include Mercer, but not along with a 1st round pick. Mercer would be the crown jewel of the offer and anything else would be very minor (mid round pick or whatever). What team would include a better player than Mercer in their offer? It’s hard to imagine.

I’d be furious if they traded Mercer

Holtz, Muk and. 1st I do without blinking

 

[Azathoth]

Masisak has a article in the athletic speculating what a Meier return would look like, specifically from the Devils.

He acknowledges that most of the noise is around Holtz, but he thinks they should try to get Mercer instead.

He also thinks that the 2023 1st is table stakes as the second piece, and even thinks they should get a third, lesser piece (3rd round pick or similar)

So basically

Mercer
2023 1st
2024 3rd

He said if the main piece was Holtz, the minor piece should be upgraded to Mukhamadullin.

Holtz
1st
Mukhamadullin

FWIW, I think these packages are way too rich, and I wonder if some writers are looking at our cupboard and assuming that since we have a lot of assets we’ll be willing to overpay for stuff.

I said on the main board that I’d be willing to include Mercer, but not along with a 1st round pick. Mercer would be the crown jewel of the offer and anything else would be very minor (mid round pick or whatever). What team would include a better player than Mercer in their offer? It’s hard to imagine.

That does seem a bit rich, especially the one with Mercer, who while not quite untouchable is pretty close to being untouchable in my eyes. Maybe my memory sucks, but it always seems like when forwards are traded the general response to the trade is "Really, that's all it took? The Devils' couldn't have beat that"? (And when defensemen are traded the response to the return is usually lmao what an overpay).

 

[The Grinder]

You do what you have to do to keep Mercer.

Sign me up for something similar as:

Holtz
1st
Mukhamadullin

Or

Shara
1st
Bahl

We have assets and if we lose out on Timo we are going to be losing him to the Rags, Canes, or a Buffalo team that is getting scary enough.

 

[Nubmer6]

Masisak has a article in the athletic speculating what a Meier return would look like, specifically from the Devils.

He acknowledges that most of the noise is around Holtz, but he thinks they should try to get Mercer instead.

He also thinks that the 2023 1st is table stakes as the second piece, and even thinks they should get a third, lesser piece (3rd round pick or similar)

So basically

Mercer
2023 1st
2024 3rd

He said if the main piece was Holtz, the minor piece should be upgraded to Mukhamadullin.

Holtz
1st
Mukhamadullin

FWIW, I think these packages are way too rich, and I wonder if some writers are looking at our cupboard and assuming that since we have a lot of assets we’ll be willing to overpay for stuff.

I said on the main board that I’d be willing to include Mercer, but not along with a 1st round pick. Mercer would be the crown jewel of the offer and anything else would be very minor (mid round pick or whatever). What team would include a better player than Mercer in their offer? It’s hard to imagine.

I've been saying the standard ask are "3 P's"... A pick, a player, and a prospect.

I think Johnson also has to be shipped to them for cap purposes.

 

[Blackjack]

I've been saying the standard ask are "3 P's"... A pick, a player, and a prospect.

I think Johnson also has to be shipped to them for cap purposes.

Yeah, I should have mentioned that Johnsson back to the Sharks and 50% retention is assumed in all trades. The cap won’t work without it.

 

[Guttersniped]

Masisak has a article in the athletic speculating what a Meier return would look like, specifically from the Devils.

He acknowledges that most of the noise is around Holtz, but he thinks they should try to get Mercer instead.

He also thinks that the 2023 1st is table stakes as the second piece, and even thinks they should get a third, lesser piece (3rd round pick or similar)

So basically

Mercer
2023 1st
2024 3rd

He said if the main piece was Holtz, the minor piece should be upgraded to Mukhamadullin.

Holtz
1st
Mukhamadullin

FWIW, I think these packages are way too rich, and I wonder if some writers are looking at our cupboard and assuming that since we have a lot of assets we’ll be willing to overpay for stuff.

I said on the main board that I’d be willing to include Mercer, but not along with a 1st round pick. Mercer would be the crown jewel of the offer and anything else would be very minor (mid round pick or whatever). What team would include a better player than Mercer in their offer? It’s hard to imagine.

Masisak speculation wasn’t great when he was Devils fan but in his defense it’s hard to say here. What’s the competition? Are we paying extra to get them to take a cap dump like Johnsson back?

I wouldn’t include Mercer and don’t see that happening. Just don’t. I would be enraged and flabbergasted if it did.

Could it be Holtz, Muk & 1st? Maybe. (Maybe they throw in a pick to balance it out.)

Muk seems like a natural choice to me but he’s far from a sure thing. Very much a late 1st first value.

The 1st is looking very late. Not sure the other forward prospects move the needle. So maybe him and Holtz isn’t too much.

No idea really, other than f*** off with the Mercer talk. (Not you, him, just to be clear on who’s f***ing off.) He’s a key roster player, now and in the future.

 

[njdevil26]

Yeah, I should have mentioned that Johnsson back to the Sharks and 50% retention is assumed in all trades. The cap won’t work without it.

Johnsson has a limited no-trade so I hope that doesn't make things difficult... but his actual salary this season is 750k. He was paid out a bonus on July 1st so trading him to get him off the books should actually be pretty easy since whatever team takes him will only have to pay him 300k or less in actual cash.

 

[PKs Broken Stick]

Why would San Jose? The Devils #1 is likely to be in the 20-25 range. For all intents and purposes a second round pick.

Why wouldn't they? They have to rebuild. If that's the best offer they get, they'd be crazy not to do it. Who knows what people will offer though, because of Meier's contract situation.

 

[Poppy Whoa Sonnet]

I’d be furious if they traded Mercer

Holtz, Muk and. 1st I do without blinking

Agree on 1

2 he'd need to come with an extension. Mark Stone with an extension only got a 2nd and Brannstrom. I can't recall a winger being traded as a rental for a package that large.

 

[Blackjack]

Johnsson has a limited no-trade so I hope that doesn't make things difficult... but his actual salary this season is 750k. He was paid out a bonus on July 1st so trading him to get him off the books should actually be pretty easy since whatever team takes him will only have to pay him 300k or less in actual cash.

Yeah, it’s just a 10 team list and I imagine he is not thrilled playing in the AHL so I don’t think it will be a problem.

 

[PKs Broken Stick]

I see a lot of Meier proposals that center around 2023 1st, Holtz and Shara/defensive prospect.

Do you guys think a 2023 1st and Casey would be enough to get it done for an extended Timo? Is it not enough/too much?

I think they'd want a prospect to "replace" Meier at minimum.

 

[Nocashstyle]

No way would I want to include Mercer in a package for Meier. 1st, Holtz, Casey, Muk, other picks, etc…sure any combination of those are fair game. But at the same time Meier’s QO really narrows down the field and I doubt any GM is going to make a deal without an extension in place - so Meier also has a lot of power dictating where he goes. The returns on these types of deals always seem underwhelming, especially with so many factors at play.

I’d hate to include Casey, especially because of the season he’s having, and one of the first players I can remember actually being a Devils fan growing up. But with the insane depth at D, he can be expendable if needed.

 

[njdevil26]

Agree on 1

2 he'd need to come with an extension. Mark Stone with an extension only got a 2nd and Brannstrom. I can't recall a winger being traded as a rental for a package that large.

I don't care if he comes with an extension. Maybe I'm overly optimistic but I feel like if he's an RFA, the Devils would be acquiring him well aware with how much money they are going to have to pay him in the offseason.

 

[Saugus]

We have assets and if we lose out on Timo we are going to be losing him to the Rags, Canes, or a Buffalo team that is getting scary enough.

This is what worries me. The West is such trash this year and most of the few contenders are capped out. If Meier gets traded, he's probably coming East.

So if we strike out on acquiring him, he's probably going to a rival. Not ideal.

 

[Devs3cups]

Masisak has a article in the athletic speculating what a Meier return would look like, specifically from the Devils.

He acknowledges that most of the noise is around Holtz, but he thinks they should try to get Mercer instead.

He also thinks that the 2023 1st is table stakes as the second piece, and even thinks they should get a third, lesser piece (3rd round pick or similar)

So basically

Mercer
2023 1st
2024 3rd

He said if the main piece was Holtz, the minor piece should be upgraded to Mukhamadullin.

Holtz
1st
Mukhamadullin

FWIW, I think these packages are way too rich, and I wonder if some writers are looking at our cupboard and assuming that since we have a lot of assets we’ll be willing to overpay for stuff.

I said on the main board that I’d be willing to include Mercer, but not along with a 1st round pick. Mercer would be the crown jewel of the offer and anything else would be very minor (mid round pick or whatever). What team would include a better player than Mercer in their offer? It’s hard to imagine.

The latter package might be a heavy price but if Timo is onboard with an extension I would definitely pull the trigger.

But no way would I be happy dealing Mercer.

I'd be shocked if he was moved and I assume Mercer is 100% off the table. Holtz + 1st or Holtz + Muk + 1st is more than fair.

Mercer is cost controlled and is exactly the type of young player/asset Fitz likes. I HIGHLY doubt Fitz would even consider moving him. I'd also have a hard time imagining who could realistically beat a 1st + Holtz + Muk offer.