Devils team discussion (news, notes and speculation) - offseason part III

[My3Sons]

You're using sensationalism and extremes to try to make a point.

Players agree to certain things in order to make money. Part of the contract is that they will not engage in certain activities. They also agree to get approval from the team to do additional activities if they have injuries.

No one is saying you "cant" do anything but if you do those activities and get injured, you risk having your contract terminated.

If a player has it in their contract not to ride motorcycles at race tracks at 150MPH, decides to do it, crashes, and gets injured to the point they can never walk again, do you think a team is paying the remaining $50M on a contract while they sit on LTIR?

Never happen in a million years.

I think there is an element of thr NHL is a job. Playing for their national team is a choice. I don’t think it’s controversial to say once hurt Nemec should back off but the idea that he should not have done so to begin with because Slovakia was an underdog is uncalled for as I see it. Guys routinely play for bad national teams. It’s not about whether the team is good. It’s about the okayed wearing their crest. If I could suit up for the US in Olympic lawyering I’d love to even if we had no chance.

 

[McDuffz88]

You're using sensationalism and extremes to try to make a point.

Players agree to certain things in order to make money. Part of the contract is that they will not engage in certain activities. They also agree to get approval from the team to do additional activities if they have injuries.

No one is saying you "cant" do anything but if you do those activities and get injured, you risk having your contract terminated.

If a player has it in their contract not to ride motorcycles at race tracks at 150MPH, decides to do it, crashes, and gets injured to the point they can never walk again, do you think a team is paying the remaining $50M on a contract while they sit on LTIR?

Never happen in a million years.

This is such an extreme way of thinking. If I'm a GM I want my players happy and for that it means to live their life how they want in the few months they have off. If you're a GM who restricts a players actions/hobbies then you're going to run out all your star players & wonder why you have nothing but scrubs working for you. Okay so you threaten to terminate Nemecs contract, what does this achieve? You either piss him off or worse Nemec can easily say okay and every other team in the entire league will offer him a contract with no questions asked. Your strategy might work on a player who isn't a wanted player but at that point why bother putting restrictions on a contract? All your doing is shooting yourself in the foot.

 

[britdevil]

This is why I love hockey.

It's a real culture clash of North Americans and Europeans.

 

[njdevils1982]

I disagree.

I'd much rather have a break than soft tissue damage. A break has a well defined recovery time and few lingering effects. A sprain or strain could bother him for months. Worst case is that this is a nagging injury that affects him all year.

i've had a broken bone in my foot and a high ankle sprain at differnet times during my soccer playing days and yes, the sprain was a much longer road to recovery than the fracture... frustrating due to not knowing when the end will be

so ya, an excuse to post this...

 

[Billdo]

Yes, let's ban players from playing for their national teams of their countries, who invested money, time, educated them, fed them, taught them hockey, invested resources in them without any real monetary exhaust. And at the same time, lets ban hockey players from riding on American roads, especially on a bicycle.

Not the best thing to say.

 

[Devils731]

Its the best thing to say. Very dark but very accurate.

It’s none of those things. Don’t try to use a recent tragedy to make a hyperbolic point.

It’s not even related to this discussion since Nemec does need permission from the Devils since his contract does say he can’t play without the Devils permission; so it’s totally reasonable to discuss if the Devils should allow(I favor allowing).

 

[Guadana]

I gotta be honest that is a really shitty thing to say. Its not even remotely funny or even relevant

It was not about funny. it was about brutality, sadness and illogicality. Everyone who is trying to find fun in this and trying to say that other person is trying to find fun in this should ask himself first.

It’s none of those things. Don’t try to use a recent tragedy to make a hyperbolic point.

It’s not even related to this discussion since Nemec does need permission from the Devils since his contract does say he can’t play without the Devils permission; so it’s totally reasonable to discuss if the Devils should allow(I favor allowing).

Its not me who said that there may be clauses in the contract prohibiting driving at a certain speed. And yes, an actual tragedy can be used as example, because both have led to trauma. In one case, fatal.


__

If someone needs to be specifically explained and it is not clear - the death of JG is a tragedy and it can be treated as a tragedy only. But you can't ban hockey players from everything in the world, because they are people, they have feelings and needs. Locking them in a room until next season won't work. Someone will break down in training, someone will die. And to use the "degree of sadness" of life declared in the argument as a reason for not accepting the argument is only a manifestation of insolvency. And it is not a little less an attempt to use tragedy, if someone believes that this was originally the use of tragedy.

 

[Moist ReadOnly]

)

You are what you are. A very representative representation of this points and overall vision. Dont change.

When given the chance to make peace, you double-down

Where have I seen that before? Hmm...

 

[Guadana]

Sorry, admins, I admit my own guilt that I initially became involved in this.

 

[Devils731]

Its not me who said that there may be clauses in the contract prohibiting driving at a certain speed. And yes, an actual tragedy can be used as example, because both have led to trauma. In one case, fatal.

We can leave the hypothetical things that can be in a contract behind because Nemec does need permission to play these games, which the Devils are apparently not giving for the next game. Nemec does have a contract that states he needs permission to play, we don’t need to guess at what else he may or may not be allowed to do.

Relating Nemec needing permission to a recent tragedy which doesn’t have to do with actual clauses in the contract is pretty awful.

 

[forceten]

Or - maybe you are reading an inference into Guadana’s post that isn’t there.

It’s tragic what happened - but from a franchise perspective there ARE things contracts ban players from doing already. With American roads being very unsafe for cyclists (I’m more a runner but have almost been hit numerous times on my bike, plus honked at and had people mock swerve into me while shouting and cussing me out… had a close friend almost lose his wife but she survived and had to learn to walk talk etc again…) his suggestion is very relevant.

On another topic @britdevil I heard polling has a lot of Bregret… any real emphasis behind the rumor that U.K. may return to EU?

 

[Guadana]

We can leave the hypothetical things that can be in a contract behind because Nemec does need permission to play these games, which the Devils are apparently not giving for the next game. Nemec does have a contract that states he needs permission to play, we don’t need to guess at what else he may or may not be allowed to do.

Relating Nemec needing permission to a recent tragedy which doesn’t have to do with actual clauses in the contract is pretty awful.

Yes, like I said he acted in the borders of his deal. Is it good he was injured? Its not. Will he want to play for the national team again? He'll want to. Don't the Devils want to let him do that in the future? I don't know. But if they don't want to, then don't expect team friendly moves from him.

 

[britdevil]

Or - maybe you are reading an inference into Guadana’s post that isn’t there.

It’s tragic what happened - but from a franchise perspective there ARE things contracts ban players from doing already. With American roads being very unsafe for cyclists (I’m more a runner but have almost been hit numerous times on my bike, plus honked at and had people mock swerve into me while shouting and cussing me out… had a close friend almost lose his wife but she survived and had to learn to walk talk etc again…) his suggestion is very relevant.

On another topic @britdevil I heard polling has a lot of Bregret… any real emphasis behind the rumor that U.K. may return to EU?

 

[ZachaFlockaFlame]

Yes, like I said he acted in the borders of his deal. Is it good he was injured? Its not. Will he want to play for the national team again? He'll want to. Don't the Devils want to let him do that in the future? I don't know. But if they don't want to, then don't expect team friendly moves from him.

I agree with you here, that's one of the reasons I was gonna mention here yesterday if the Devils block him from playing tomorrow. He's gonna remember it in the future, some of these European guys cherish playing for their national teams over even making the NHL so it's tough to truly say. I would let Nemec play, you can't just coddle players for your sake and stop them from what they wanna do. It's also super unfair to him when we have a ton of guys who'll probably play for Team USA/Swiss in the near future too.

 

[ZachaFlockaFlame]

This is why I love hockey.

It's a real culture clash of North Americans and Europeans.

Tbh, most of us Americans are pretty indifferent to international tournaments. Some of us love them and some of us despise them, I personally like it because of the fun it brings and showing pride in your country in a different form + I'm a bigger soccer guy as well so it's just natural in that sport. I do agree that Europeans love that stuff more and it probably stems from soccer/football ( ) for you guys across the pond.

 

[Guadana]

This truly epitomizes the essence of Russia.

You will like Silayev as a player.

I agree with you here, that's one of the reasons I was gonna mention here yesterday if the Devils block him from playing tomorrow. He's gonna remember it in the future, some of these European guys cherish playing for their national teams over even making the NHL so it's tough to truly say. I would let Nemec play, you can't just coddle players for your sake and stop them from what they wanna do. It's also super unfair to him when we have a ton of guys who'll probably play for Team USA/Swiss in the near future too.

I believe he is smart enough to understand why its okay to not play against KZ. But if he will doing fine and he will have an opportunity to play against stronger team in more important game - this summer or next summer or any other time later and Devils will reject his opportunity to play - he can be that kind of person who will not like it in the future.
I hope both sides will find a way to connect for the best for both sides, Nemec should be happy for now how he was treated - he started to play regular NHL role very early, I think he had more trust than Jiricek for example. Even if its just because Hamilton was injured. Devils still could just trapped him in AHL and use some other defenseman to save one more ELC year. So far, the Devils have not done anything that Nemec could be offended by.

 

[ZachaFlockaFlame]

You will like Silayev as a player.

I believe he is smart enough to understand why its okay to not play against KZ. But if he will doing fine and he will have an opportunity to play against stronger team in more important game - this summer or next summer or any other time later and Devils will reject his opportunity to play - he can be that kind of person who will not like it in the future.
I hope both sides will find a way to connect for the best for both sides, Nemec should be happy for now how he was treated - he started to play regular NHL role very early, I think he had more trust than Jiricek for example. Even if its just because Hamilton was injured. Devils still could just trapped him in AHL and use some other defenseman to save one more ELC year. So far, the Devils have not done anything that Nemec could be offended by.

I think he'll understand it too but ya it can't be a repeated thing where the Devils stop him from playing for his country, players are more in control of their positions/where they play/what they want in this new social media era. It's not like the old days where a player gets told to shove it or just to deal with it. And yeah, I think I'm ok with the Nemec route regardless because of having a very good RHD. He's important to us but right now having Dougie/Pesce in front of him is a god send. Kovacevic should be able to step in and play decent if Nemec is hurt to a decent extent (let's hope not)

 

[SteveCangialosi123]

 

[Devs3cups]

I have no problem with players playing for their country and I agree that letting them go compete is definitely a plus for having good relationships with your players. I’m absolutely fine with the Devils letting their players do that.

I also have no problem if the Devils decide to ask Nemec not to suit up tomorrow if there’s a chance he can hurt himself even more of if there’s some underlying pain/discomfort there. I don’t think that’s an unreasonable thing from the Devils to ask and I’m sure Nemec would see it that way. They let him go play, he got injured, now everyone involved should be careful. If the Devils end up asking Simon not to play, it’s not like they’d take him out of the tournament for no reason.

I’m sure Simon would understand that and I’m sure he’s appreciative of the team letting him play for his country, especially when one of his best friends, Slafkovsky, couldn’t go because his team apparently refused to let him go.

 

[britdevil]

Nemec playing for Slovakia, whatever happened there?

 

[Xirik]

If you need an example, from this current roster, look no further than Nico and Palat and their reactions to winning/losing this years WHC.

I have never seen Nico so sad as to when they lost that final game against Palat's Czechia. Elation and devastation and yet full of pride for having represented their countries in a meaningful tournament, where they had a chance to rise to the top of the mountain in that competition.

It hits different. I don't care what you think of the WHC, yeah it's a bit tinpot and it's certainly not best on best, but to have the chance to win something for the country that raised you? Can't beat that.



It's probably Vancouver 2010. USA wanted that bad. Unfortunately, so did Sid the Kid.

That was a fun day. People celebrating outside, fireworks, people screaming out their windows. It really did feel like all of Canada stood up at the same time and cheered. For that brief while it felt like politics nor race or creed divided us. We were all just Canadians.

I think a lot of the players competing right now at the Olympic Qualifiers are wanting to have that moment to for their country.

This is why I love hockey.

It's a real culture clash of North Americans and Europeans.

Hey! Don't group us with.....them

 

[SteveCangialosi123]

Nemec playing for Slovakia, whatever happened there?

 

[britdevil]

That was a fun day. People celebrating outside, fireworks, people screaming out their windows. It really did feel like all of Canada stood up at the same time and cheered. For that brief while it felt like politics nor race or creed divided us. We were all just Canadians.

I think a lot of the players competing right now at the Olympic Qualifiers are wanting to have that moment to for their country.


Hey! Don't group us with.....them

How Euros feel when Brits are grouped with them.

View attachment 904316

Discontinue the lithium.

 

[Incharge1976]

Again. if he broke some rules - lets terminate his deal. I believe some other teams will like it.

And dont forget to ban players for riding bicycle on american roads. Looks like it is more dangerous than international tournaments.

And of course I understand that NHL is trying to own players as much as they can because of the nature of the business and mentality. But it is working not so smooth - often players are bigger than their deals. So teams will live with it. You know why? Because players is everything this teams have. Its only players and nothing more.

He didn't break any rules, but the idea that the team should just allow him to play even if they are concerned about damaging it more because he will be upset is silly.

He has a contract with the team and the team has invested heavily in him. There will be more tournaments. It's not as if they happen once every 20 years.

I really don't care if he plays or not. If the team gives him the green light, cool. If not, I understand that too. But they shouldn't be making decisions based on "he is representing his country".

The baseball team I follow lost their closer last year for the entire year because he tore his tendon playing in the World Baseball Classic. The injury changed how each game was played last year because they lost their closer.

At the end of the day, players playing in these tournaments also have a commitment with their teammates, coaches, and executives on the clubs they play on who are actually trying to win something too.

 

[ZachaFlockaFlame]

Need to rewatch this show, it saved me during covid lol