Devils team discussion (news, notes and speculation) - offseason part I

[Mgd31]

Not sure how I feel about Sullivan. I wish we went outside the Pittsburgh connection route.

 

[njdevils1982]

Worms like in Pink Floyd’s the Wall?

you must be old enough to remember vera lynn

 

[MB3]

At least you gave us where you got the information and we can believe, disbelieve, or ignore as we like.

Much better than when people say they see something on Twitter rumors with no tweets.

lmao yes it should be made clear that I am a residential architect in Florida who has absolutely zero connection to the team. my friend is connected in some capacity, a capacity I will not divulge, but connected enough where I typically walk in through a different entrance when I visit NJ and typically enjoy Devils games in Prudential from a suite filled with Brooks Brothers' suits and mediocre sushi.

 

[Cheddabombs]

the devils will have jack hughes nico hischier jesper bratt timo meier kurtis macdermid luke hughes and simon nemec for the better part of the next decade+

what a time to be alive. let's go get a goalie and win some stanley f***ing cups.

Jesper Bratt, Timo Meier and who?

 

[MB3]

Jesper Bratt, Timo Meier and who?

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smh mh smh smhmhmhmh mhmh of course you're a nico hischier hater.

 

[Devils731]

Jesper Bratt, Timo Meier and who?

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Everyone else on that list will literally die without a thicc boi to protect them. Is that what you want???

Now the protection will happen after those other guys have been maimed, but at least they’ll live!

 

[Its Always Sundstrom]

Everyone focuses on their forwards. Yes, being top heavy, losing Nylander and not getting Conn Smyth-type performances from the other 3 is bad (for them).

But the Leaf’s Top 4 is trash. Brodie came back for Game 4 but he‘s cooked. Their defense isn’t good at anything. Reilly is the only offensive guy but no one stands out defensively.



HockeyViz
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The Athletic
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So I did drop acid today.

 

[NJDfan86]

Their top 6 didn’t get tougher. And their D is still poorly constructed.

I can’t stand strawmans…or semantics. In this argument we get a healthy helping of each.

I just distilled the debate you are having down to its simplest form - you are lamenting an absence from the market that is due to a lack of available players, not a decision any GM is actually making. The only readily available players who can add toughness are generally not great players - because if they were teams wouldn't give them up - which is why posters constantly bring up players like Reaves or MacDerimid (you know, players who actually changed teams).

Presenting someone who can fill this hole would have fewer people calling out the low level thugs.

 

[HBK27]

my buddy who tipped me off about the bratt extension and the severson trade just said sully and pittsburgh are mutually parting in the next 24 hours and that sully/nj will be announced within a week.

if he's wrong I won't post his shit again. but he's usually not wrong.

Hard to see how NJ would have any contact with Sullivan given he's still under contract with Pittsburgh, but let's see how this plays out...

 

[Patrik26]

lmao yes it should be made clear that I am a residential architect in Florida who has absolutely zero connection to the team. my friend is connected in some capacity, a capacity I will not divulge, but connected enough where I typically walk in through a different entrance when I visit NJ and typically enjoy Devils games in Prudential from a suite filled with Brooks Brothers' suits and mediocre sushi.

I was doubting all this until ........

 

[HoliksGhost]

I can't wait for Fitz big move this summer.

Ilya Sorokin, Brady Tkachuk, Jacob Markstrom, Steven Stamkos

One of those players will be a Devil.

Only one of them ? Very disappointing

 

[Stephen Gionta]

Only one of them ? Very disappointing

Yes Just one! Stammer and Palat are back together!

 

[PKs Broken Stick]

https://www.reddit.com/r/hockey/s/DVioL1bRVF

I can't think of any Devil in the top 6 that would do what Jamie Benn does in this clip aside from maybe Meier ^ but I can think of atleast 4 players in the top 6 that would of been flattened like Stankoven was. Granted Stankoven is probably the smallest player in the NHL right now but Benn didn't hesitate to stick up for his teammate with a big clean hit. That's the kind of grit the top 6 is missing. I don't care what people do after the play is dead mucking it up or whatever , it's about the play on ice when their is no stoppage that matters the most.

PERFECT. This is exactly what I want on this team and what "toughness" or whatever you want to call it, looks like to me. Icing goons who have 0 effect on the ice doesn't do shit.

 

[HoliksGhost]

Not sure how I feel about Sullivan. I wish we went outside the Pittsburgh connection route.

I’m good with bringing in a veteran coach like Sullivan, look at the results the Rangers are having with cry baby Laviolette coming in.

 

[guitarguyvic]

I just distilled the debate you are having down to its simplest form - you are lamenting an absence from the market that is due to a lack of available players, not a decision any GM is actually making. The only readily available players who can add toughness are generally not great players - because if they were teams wouldn't give them up - which is why posters constantly bring up players like Reaves or MacDerimid (you know, players who actually changed teams).

Presenting someone who can fill this hole would have fewer people calling out the low level thugs.

I’m simply pointing out the facts of the issue, not the reasons why a GM may or may not have addressed said issue. The Leafs have had more than half a decade to try to address the issues with their top players, I’m not getting into a retrospective of what moves they could have made or who they could have gone after.

I don’t think it’s what you say. The people who like to argue strawmans and semantics about “toughness” by and large tend to be the people who dismiss its importance in the top 6.

 

[NJDfan86]

I’m simply pointing out the facts of the issue, not the reasons why a GM may or may not have addressed said issue. The Leafs have had more than half a decade to try to address the issues with their top players, I’m not getting into a retrospective of what moves they could have made or who they could have gone after.

I don’t think it’s what you say. The people who like to argue strawmans and semantics about “toughness” by and large tend to be the people who dismiss its importance in the top 6.

Or, they determined that very few players who posses this toughness and talent are available to fill a teams top 6 - and you admitted that you have no answers, but expect people to earnestly engage you in debate about it's merits instead of pointing out the actual players who are moved for toughness reasons?

 

[Zippy316]

lmao yes it should be made clear that I am a residential architect in Florida who has absolutely zero connection to the team. my friend is connected in some capacity, a capacity I will not divulge, but connected enough where I typically walk in through a different entrance when I visit NJ and typically enjoy Devils games in Prudential from a suite filled with Brooks Brothers' suits and mediocre sushi.

Please tell me your source is saying they’re gonna do some house cleaning with their Associate Coach and goaltending coach.

 

[PKs Broken Stick]

Yes Just one! Stammer and Palat are back together!

Did they have a good relationship?

Isn't Sullivan and Fitz friends? That scares me a lot.

 

[Devs3cups]

 

[Cheddabombs]

22 empty net goals against

 

[Guttersniped]

The issue as I see it as that there seems to be some segment of fans and the hockey world that equate toughness with strictly bottom 6 forwards who fight and hit but don’t do much else well. When in reality, you need toughness in your top 6, and what that entails is a mix of two way commitment, being hard on the puck, forecheck relentlessness, and the willingness to be a pest or at minimum push back physically/not be bullied.

The maple leafs did not properly address any of that. Their star players are softies both mentally and physically in the playoffs.

Also, the construction of the D-core is way off. No real #1 and no depth.

They got Bertuzzi & Domi, who aren’t bullied, or soft.

You know what they also aren’t? Two-way forwards.

A stint with Boston and now Toronto has gotten Bertuzzi to acknowledge that that defense as a concept exists, so that’s nice, but “two way commitment” might be a stretch.

Same with Domi, there’s a reason he’s on his 7th team at 29.

Getting a gritty two-way player who can produce and play in the top six isn’t easy. They aren’t cheap unless you draft or develop them yourself, assuming you can get them.

Everyone who keeps pinning for this hypothetical ideal for the Devils has to put more thought into identifying who they actually are and how to actually get these types of players.

And not call players who are defensive and/or offensive black holes “two-way forwards” because they’re “gritty”.

Toronto couldn’t/ didn’t keep the better supporting forwards they have (Hyman, JVR, Kadri, Bunting, Mikheyev, etc) and continually struggles to rotate in new cheap forward depth.

The defense was always a weakness. That probably peaked when they put together a 38 yo Giordano, a 32 yo Muzzin, a yo 31 Brodie and a 27 yo Reilly in 21-22 but the first three are either out or cooked.

 

[I Hate Tie DOMI]

Sure it's a little misleading, but being on the ice for 22 empty net goals against can't be ignored either. That's a horrible stat on its own.

 

[TrufleShufle]

Sure it's a little misleading, but being on the ice for 22 empty net goals against can't be ignored either. That's a horrible stat on its own.

I think that says just as much about the goalies.

 

[ZachaFlockaFlame]

Sure it's a little misleading, but being on the ice for 22 empty net goals against can't be ignored either. That's a horrible stat on its own.

I mean, who else would have played that spot? Dougie is the legit the only other roster option you'd play in the specific scenario and he was obviously hurt. I would agree that Luke did look out of place there but there's legit no one else on the backend you'd play unless you go crazy and go 6F down a goal.

I don't see how anyone can argue against Bedard and Faber being #1 and #2 - pretty clear distinction between them and the rest.

No I agree, I'm just saying people are gonna nit pick Luke being there. He was also better than Faber driving offense while Faber was elite defensively. Nothing much that needs to be dissected since everyone knows that to be the case. When Luke was on, he's a better player than Faber but Faber is definitely the safer to the two options at this point in their careers. Also would help if Luke had a partner like Brodin like Faber had

 

[NJDevs26]

At least you gave us where you got the information and we can believe, disbelieve, or ignore as we like.

Much better than when people say they see something on Twitter rumors with no tweets.

That and we'll know very quickly if there's something to it when/if the announcement on a parting of the ways with Sullivan comes today or tomorrow lol