Devils team discussion (news, notes and speculation) - offseason edition

[JimEIV]

I disagree, Bob Murray nuked that team to pieces. The Henrique + Gibson extensions were not something a "rebuilder" would've done. And yes, they got all those picks because of their roster being similar to the Rangers when they decided to rebuild and trade the pieces that were playoff performers for them for about a decade. Stop confusing how the Devils started their rebuild with a team like the Ducks/Rangers, we were basically expansion level when we started. Also, Bob Murray literally gave a divisional rival a 1D in Shea Theadore because he was so scared to lose Sami Vatanen who he wound up trading like 4 months later to us. The Ducks roster got imploded by an awful GM who outsmarted himself that they had no choice other than to rebuild. If the Devils did that, this board would have a cataclysmic meltdown and for good reason.

I am not sure how any of that has to with how their rebuild is going and whether or not we are ahead of them?

It is almost a joke to even consider we are in better shape...We've been drafting in the top 10 since 2015...They have since 2019 have gotten much better results with just 3 years of picks... Zegras in his rookie season playing 17:54 ATOI put up 61 points...Neither of our #1OA have put up 61 points to date an both have averaged over 19 minutes a game. Zegras was a #9 overall and would've been 2nd on our team in scoring. He was 2nd on his team in scoring as well so it is not like we have a ton more.

Drysdale at 19 years old is playing 20 minutes a night putting up 32 points. McTavish will be contributing next year and probably Perreault and Zellweger will also.

If we are ahead of them it is solely from us having 8 years of high picks vs only 3 for them.

 

[ZachaFlockaFlame]

I am not sure how any of that has to with how their rebuild is going and whether or not we are ahead of them?

It is almost a joke to even consider we are in better shape...We've been drafting in the top 10 since 2015...They have since 2019 have gotten much better results with just 3 years of picks... Zegras in his rookie season playing 17:54 ATOI put up 61 points...Neither of our #1OA have put up 61 points to date an both have averaged over 19 minutes a game. Zegras was a #9 overall and we've been 2nd on our team in scoring. He was 2nd on his team in scoring as well.

Drysdale at 19 years old is playing 20 minutes a night putting up 32 points. McTavish will be contributing next year and probably Perreault and Zellweger will also.

If we are ahead of them it is solely from us having 8 years of high picks vs only 3 for them.

This topic has come up like 100 times and I'm not trying to start another 4 page debate on it but you can't be serious if you think it's equally as easy to rebuild in the NHL with assets you can trade versus starting from scratch like NJ after Shero took over.

I like this guy

Dude's gonna get hired elsewhere before the season starts at this rate.

 

[JimEIV]

This topic has come up like 100 times and I'm not trying to start another 4 page debate on it but you can't be serious if you think it's equally as easy to rebuild in the NHL with assets you can trade versus starting from scratch like NJ after Shero took over.



Dude's gonna get hired elsewhere before the season starts at this rate.

You can talk assets all you want (I personally believe we had more than enough that's how we got Palmieri and Hall and were able to trade Coleman for a kings ransom) regardless If we didn't miss our top picks from 2015 through 2018 we wouldn't be in the shape we are. It really is that simple.

 

[hidek91]

You can talk assets all you want (I personally believe we had more than enough that's how we got Palmieri and Hall and we able to trade Coleman for a kings ransom) regardless If we didn't miss our top picks from 2015 through 2018 we wouldn't be in the shape we are. It really is that simple.

I think that both things are true, the fact that we started with almost no assets didn't help (Palmieri and Hall trades were amazing but they joined a team of Beau Bennetts and other Jon Merrills), the fact that having prime Schneider pushed kept us out of McDavid and Matthews sweepstakes didn't help and we'd probably be better off if we picked Rantanen instead of Zacha, McAvoy instead of McLeod and...

...

at this point of writing the post I've scrolled through 2018 draft to find a gem to replace Ty Smith pick and the very good player drafted after Smith was taken with 141st pick, his first name is Yegor and the last name is Sharangovich.

But back to the point, yeah, life would be easier if our picks turned out to be optimal. Not bringing Makar over Hischier example, yes, he's better but it wouldn't be fair to Hischier to group him with Zacha, McLeod or Smith. I also think that Ty Smith may turn out to actually be useful, fingers crossed.

 

[Guttersniped]

If you want to have an honest discussion and disagree with me that's fine.

But at this stage you and the other guy are acting like hyenas. Maybe one of you get my kidneys, I doubt it, but stranger things have happened.

Copp was so well above 50% on the dot in the regular season that Gallant obviously felt it pertinent to put him out there in the obvious situations.

His production at that one KEY facet of the game falling off against significantly greater and consistent competition doesn't change that he was their best option.

Do you even watch the Devils on a regular basis? McLeod doesn't have a job without his prowess. Sure, that's not technically all he brings per se, but it's still the only reason he gets an extra 1:00 of ice time per game than he should. What are his other attributes? Getting knocked out, a blocked shot every other game, and being uselessly fast (except on his way to the bench)?

Copp is a really good player and it’s a PP. Chytil had been in the ice for the beginning of the PP and Zibanejad had just gotten off the ice. Strome was out.

Zibanejad had a better FO% on the Rangers. People are wrong about Copp historically but his average on the Rangers in the regular season was 49.6% vs. Zib’s 52.3%. Copp didn’t take as many obviously. (Chytil was 43.4%.)

Copp averaged more PP time than Chytil in the regular season. The latter had one PP point all year, an assist. But yes, Copp is likely preferable for faceoffs. It’s true.

This is everyone who took a face off in the playoffs.
Zibanejad 20GP 60:25 6G 5A 11 points
36FO W 32FO L 52.94%

Strome 19GP 52:37 1G 2A 3 points
0FO W 2FO L 0%

Chytil 20GP 25:16 1G 1 point
2FO W 2FO L 50%

Copp 20GP 19:34 3A 3 points
6FO W 6FO L 50%

Lafreniere 20GP 19:04 2A 2 points
0FO W 1FO L 0%

Rooney 15GP 2:42 0 points
4FO W 1FO L 80%

Goodrow 9GP 0:48 0 points
0FO W 1FO L 0%


And I still don’t understand the what the conclusion of the debate is exactly.

Coaches definitely do like face off wins, as someone mentioned, coaches like having every advantage. It’s very nice if you can win them. So? And?

Young centers who aren’t good at them but good at hockey should get better at them? Sure? They typically do?

Defensive centers are expected to be good at face offs and usually are?

Copp isn’t a face off specialist, he’s a very good two way player. He was a key TDL edition because the Rangers forward depth comparatively sucked among the Eastern playoff teams. He ended up 5th among forwards in ATOI during the regular season on the NYR. (He was 3rd on WPG.)

Copp’s a C/W and did a lot of W in Winnipeg. Statsny had a better FO % and Lowry took more.

If we make this about McLeod, people know he gets put out just for face-offs. In fact, people often complain about that. (Just like I’m sure Rangers fans complain about Rooney being out there to take face-offs.)

As someone else mentioned, McLeod’s ice time was reduced later in the season and he had the traditional role of a 4C by February. His offense is definitely lacking and I think his ES defense is an open question (it’s hard to judge w/ our team defense) but he was a key PK guy. People might be overestimating what 1m gets you at the 4C position (outside of the top contender Cup chasers).

 

[StevenToddIves]

I am not sure how any of that has to with how their rebuild is going and whether or not we are ahead of them?

It is almost a joke to even consider we are in better shape...We've been drafting in the top 10 since 2015...They have since 2019 have gotten much better results with just 3 years of picks... Zegras in his rookie season playing 17:54 ATOI put up 61 points...Neither of our #1OA have put up 61 points to date an both have averaged over 19 minutes a game. Zegras was a #9 overall and would've been 2nd on our team in scoring. He was 2nd on his team in scoring as well so it is not like we have a ton more.

Drysdale at 19 years old is playing 20 minutes a night putting up 32 points. McTavish will be contributing next year and probably Perreault and Zellweger will also.

If we are ahead of them it is solely from us having 8 years of high picks vs only 3 for them.

This is fun for me. Okay, Devils Young Core Vs. Anaheim Young Core, let's do it:

GOALIE:
Anaheim is probably hampered by that Gibson deal ($6.4 million until all of us go to work by jet-pack), although Stolarz is a back-up with some upside. Devils have the Blackwood enigma and a future possibility of Daws.
CONCLUSION: Both teams need to do something.

DEFENSE:
Anaheim has a terrific top young stud for RD in Drysdale, while NJ has a top young stud for LD in Luke Hughes. Hughes has more upside. Anaheim's top prospects I'd order as Helleson, Zellweger, Thrun, LaCombe, Moore and Nickl. NJ's top prospects I'd order as Mukhamadullin, Okhotyuk, Bahl, McCarthy and Misyul. Anaheim has no good young D, Devils have Siegenthaler. Smith is likely trade bait.
CONCLUSION: Prospects are about even, but I'd give Hughes a slight edge over Drysdale and if you count Siegenthaler, the Devils get a thin margin at the future of the position.

WING: Anaheim has two top-six prospects in Perreault and Pastujov, who it's heartbreaking to think was taken just a pick before the Devils for some reason took Samu Salminen last year. They have a couple of okay prospects in Brayden Tracy, Sean Tschigerl and Trevor Janicke, so not much depth. On the big club Troy Terry is a young stud, while they have some pretty good support talent in Comtois, Lundestrom and Steel.
The Devils have Bratt to match Terry, and if you consider Mercer a wing he would trump anything else Anaheim has. Also, Sharangovich. The Devils have two more high-end prospects coming in Holtz and Gritsyuk, and ok depth with Foote, Thompson, and Clarke coming up and a couple decent prospects, though bad late drafting in the past two years has hurt the team here.
CONCLUSION: Edge Devils. Even if we match Bratt with Terry and Holtz/Gritsyuk with Perreault/Pastujov, the Devils have more prospect depth and more young NHL talent.

CENTER: Anaheim has a wildly impressive future top 2 in Zegras and McTavish. The Devils also have one with Hughes and Hischier. Anaheim has Groulx and Coangelo on the farm, while the Devils have Boqvist on the team.
CONCLUSION: Even. Both teams are wildly blessed with high-end talent, both teams need to think about future depth.

FINAL CONCLUSION: The Devils right now have a superior rebuild to Anaheim. Pat Verbeek has done a great job in his limited time there, while Fitzgerald has done well except for in his late-round drafting, which has certainly rammed a nail in the tires a bit. The future is indeed bright for Anaheim, especially building around maybe the only young center duo which could conceivably match the Devils Hughes/Hischier duo. I'm optimistic for the Ducks here, but I'd rather be the Devils.

 

[Guttersniped]

Their rebuild didn't really begin until 2019 when we got our 2nd #1 overall. From 2011 to 2018 they made the playoffs 7 out of 8 years and got to the Western Conference Finals twice during that time...The missed for the last 4 years and here is what they did:

2019 They picked up Zegras and Braden Tracey with their 1st and second pick
2020 they picked up Drysdale and Perreault with their 1st and 2nd pick
2021 McTavish and Zellweger with their 1st and 2nd pick

That is phenomenal if you ask me. I guarantee you the Ducks won't toil in the muck as long as we have.

Martin Madden was the Ducks’ Director of Amateur Scouting from 2008-09 to 2019-20 until he was finally kicked upstairs to Assistant GM.

Madden is about as good as they come in the NHL and the Duck have had tremendous success drafting under him. It isn’t just him as they drafted pretty well before him but they had some ridiculously crazy good ones under him.

2011 is particularly impressive, their first pick was 30, they had 7 picks and they ended up with: Rickard Rakell, John Gibson, William Karlsson (a late bloomer who was traded early on tho), and Josh Manson.

They do a fantastic job with player development as well.

 

[Guttersniped]

Anaheim does have a player in the Stanley Cup finals. Its more successful than the Devils have been.

Is that a comparison?

 

[Bleedred]

I'm sure nobody on here would want him. I've fought that fight on the main boards a few times. I think his play & contract just kills any value.

But do I think that Fitz is going to kick the tires on this given how bad the goaltender situation is? Yeah, I do. Gibson still has fans.

I don't think he'll kick the tires on him.

Acquiring him is a death sentence for pretty much any GM in the league.

 

[Cheddabombs]

Lol not comparing rebuilds again, let's go back to talking about faceoffs

 

[Hisch13r]

Lol not comparing rebuilds again, let's go back to talking about faceoffs

We're making the rounds

 

[Devils731]

Lol not comparing rebuilds again, let's go back to talking about faceoffs

Claude Vilgrain has a great name and the Haitian Sensation is also a great nickname.

What are some other Devils players with great nicknames or titles?

Roland Melanson had Rollie the Goalie (it rhymes) which I like.

 

[Andre Palot]

We're making the rounds

This is missing goal song but still, pretty much everything is covered.

 

[EXTRAS]

does tatar get an NHL contract next year?

 

[Hisch13r]

does tatar get an NHL contract next year?

Impossible to know without knowing how he plays. He's certainly capable of having a good year or it's possible he just declined a bunch.

 

[Goptor]

Is that a comparison?

View attachment 558470

Corey Perry is still on their payroll and was in the Finals the past 3 years.

 

[MadDevil]

Explain how “Michael, Michael Motorcycle” became Lange’s weird catchphrase while your at it.

Scratch my back with a hacksaw!

 

[Hisch13r]

Scratch my back with a hacksaw!

Slap me silly Sidney!

 

[glenwo2]

Yeah I'd need something back from Anaheim to feel better about eating Gibson's contract. Also Zellweger is a pretty good prospect for them, should've been the pick over Stillman. Either him or Stankoven, still salty to this day about it, lol. But yeah I'd take our rebuild over theirs anyway for the most part.

I know it's probably pronounced Stan-KOH-Ven but I think it's funnier if it's Stank-Oven.

When did we get a beat writer back... I must have missed this.

Interesting times!

According to his PINNED TWEET, probably March 14 :

 

[glenwo2]

I like this guy

Ryan is pro-active as F.

Holy crap...

 

[glenwo2]

This topic has come up like 100 times and I'm not trying to start another 4 page debate on it but you can't be serious if you think it's equally as easy to rebuild in the NHL with assets you can trade versus starting from scratch like NJ after Shero took over.



Dude's gonna get hired elsewhere before the season starts at this rate.

Doubt that.

TG, in comparison, had been covering the Devils for 14 years before getting the call from NHL.com

14 years, Flame.

I think it's safe to say Ryan will be here for at least that long(if not longer).

 

[Guttersniped]

Slap me silly Sidney!

No kink-shaming please.

 

[Billdo]

Doubt that.

TG, in comparison, had been covering the Devils for 14 years before getting the call from NHL.com

14 years, Flame.

I think it's safe to say Ryan will be here for at least that long(if not longer).

Once they realize they get 100 clicks on each article from the same 100 IP addresses they'll can him. The market isn't strong enough for a dedicated beat writer no matter how desperate for one we all are.

 

[Guttersniped]

Once they realize they get 100 clicks on each article from the same 100 IP addresses they'll can him. The market isn't strong enough for a dedicated beat writer no matter how desperate for one we all are.

That’s the spirit lol

 

[Jack Be Quick]

What in the world are you talking about right now? The only reason this is hardly an honest discussion is because you haven’t made one decent argument and are just saying stupid things at this point.

Copp wasn’t way above 50% this season and he was under 50% after going to the rangers. He went 36 games as a less than 50% faceoff man and he wasn’t way above it before that. He is far from a faceoff specialist. Every faceoff could very easily go either way and 99% of faceoffs lead to nothing.

I think 99 out of 100 people on here would agree that McLeod played more than he should. Not sure how that proves the importance of faceoffs whatsoever.

1 goal doesn’t prove anything either. For every goal off a faceoff like that there’s a thousand+ that lead to absolutely nothing other than a quick possession change of which there are hundreds in a game.

You’re honestly wasting my time (and the posters that have to read this) at this point because I haven’t heard an intelligent response (like you’re talking about hyenas and your kidneys for some reason).

I have 0 interest in answering another one of your posts unless you come up with a half-decent , half-intelligent argument. Have a good night.