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Devils team discussion (news, notes and speculation) - 2023 offseason part II

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Billdo said:
I don't want Hellebuyck, the cost isn't going to be a good idea and at some point Luke, Mercer, and Nico will need deals during Hellebuycks deal which will be difficult with the current contracts.
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Im really torn on the goalie discussion. On one hand i totally get the comfort everyone has with Schmid and VV on the other I worry that VV cant repeat last season and Schmid is still young.

Going after a Hellebuyck even as a rental for the season and letting him walk or do a sign and trade next summer could make sense as it doesnt require us to rely on Schmid if VV doesnt repeat his regular season.

If you asking which tandem I would rather have for the season its Helle/Schmid. Lets Schmid get a bit more development time and for us to make sure he's the next guy.

If Helle doesn't want to sign for a decent deal, I think there is a good chance you can "Severson" him somewhere next year.

Either way I trust that if Fitz goes after any of these goalies and gets them he has a plan long term plan. Can't doubt this dude now.
 
Devil X said:
Going after a Hellebuyck even as a rental for the season and letting him walk or do a sign and trade next summer could make sense as it doesnt require us to rely on Schmid if VV doesnt repeat his regular season.
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No it really couldn’t make sense. The cost to acquire him is going to be huge.
 
Yeah the trade price is the problem with Hellebuyck. At 50% retained basically every contender can afford him as a rental.

Elite goalie for 2.25 million? He's going to cost an absolute fortune.
 
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MauDevils said:
Yeah the trade price is the problem with Hellebuyck. At 50% retained basically every contender can afford him as a rental.

Elite goalie for 2.25 million? He's going to cost an absolute fortune.
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If WPG acts now they can have the rights to Wood, Graves, Tatar AND their choice of Vukojevic or McCarthy or Brady if they want a goalie prospect. That’s the rights to three players and a prospect. They can’t say no to that. No team tops that offer. Operators are standing by! If WPG acts now NJ will even send along the ginsu knife for a modest shipping and handling fee. That’s three players a prospect and the ginsu knife!
 
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Captain3rdLine said:
No it really couldn’t make sense. The cost to acquire him is going to be huge.
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This to me is always a false statement. Players get moved for far less then we all think they will. But thats where the Fitz trust comes in. If he thinks the price to acquire him is worth it then I'm good with it.
 
Billdo said:
I don't want Hellebuyck, the cost isn't going to be a good idea and at some point Luke, Mercer, and Nico will need deals during Hellebuycks deal which will be difficult with the current contracts.
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He’s a free agent next year.

To me you acquire Hellebuyck almost as a one year rental and see where you are after next year. It allows you to work Schmid as a full time backup and see if he can keep up the play over a larger sample size of a backup and maybe take the next step toward starter the year after. Next year a go for it and you don’t know what you are going to get from VV psychologically after the playoffs (it was the type of performance that can leave scars, and Schmid is a question mark with the limited games he played). With Hellebuyck you know what you are going to get next year.

Of course if the trade price gets too high or the other options left also have questions marks you roll with the tandem you have. But a one year run with Hellebuyck could be worth it.
 
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My3Sons said:
If WPG acts now they can have the rights to Wood, Graves, Tatar AND their choice of Vukojevic or McCarthy or Brady if they want a goalie prospect. That’s the rights to three players and a prospect. They can’t say no to that. No team tops that offer. Operators are standing by! If WPG acts now NJ will even send along the ginsu knife for a modest shipping and handling fee. That’s three players a prospect and the ginsu knife!
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HOLD IT M3S!

If WPG calls now we will also throw in the ever popular pocket fisherman! No playoffs? No problem! With the pocket fisherman you can be ready to strike down any fish like Tom Fitzgerald strikes the dreams of other GMs in trade deals.
 
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Devil X said:
This to me is always a false statement. Players get moved for far less then we all think they will. But thats where the Fitz trust comes in. If he thinks the price to acquire him is worth it then I'm good with it.
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No it isn’t whatsoever. Certain players yes. Hellebyuck won’t just like PLD didn’t. Especially in the off-season. The ones for less tend to more often be rushed ones in season. Teams have more time and more cap space to work with. Look at the big trades last off-season too. Tkachuk return was more than expected. Debrincat was certainly not cheap and around where people expected.

Not bragging but I’ve often been pretty good at guessing the ballpark of trade returns. Not even gonna try to do that with this but it’s gonna be more expensive than it’s worth doing for the amount of risk.
 
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My3Sons said:
If WPG acts now they can have the rights to Wood, Graves, Tatar AND their choice of Vukojevic or McCarthy or Brady if they want a goalie prospect. That’s the rights to three players and a prospect. They can’t say no to that. No team tops that offer. Operators are standing by! If WPG acts now NJ will even send along the ginsu knife for a modest shipping and handling fee. That’s three players a prospect and the ginsu knife!
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My Oh Meier said:
HOLD IT M3S!

If WPG calls now we will also throw in the ever popular pocket fisherman! No playoffs? No problem! With the pocket fisherman you can be ready to strike down any fish like Tom Fitzgerald strikes the dreams of other GMs in trade deals.
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Ok. But I’m only paying for shipping, not handling.
 
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Team Concept said:
Explain how with 4 remaining RFAs on the team waiting to be signed.
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None of those RFA's are exactly getting a Timo deal, you're talking about three fourth-liners and a sixth D in his second full season (plus Fitz alluded to trying to re-sign for less on at least one of them).

I'm not saying it wouldn't be tight, any Helle trade would have to be contingent on VV going back the other way, which would only add a difference of about $2.8 million to the payroll. That brings our cap space down to about $7.4 million. The four RFA's probably will come out to around $5.5-6 million total. Adding a couple of rookies on ELC's and voila you're basically capped out with a 22-man roster having just enough room for the VV-Helly swap.
 
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My Oh Meier said:
Who would be cheaper to acquire - Ullmark or Hellebuyck
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I think ullmark would be, but depends on what Boston is looking to do. If they need to dump cap still, and he's the guy out the door, I think it's going to be reasonably cheap. But i also am of the opinion that both are going to be cheaper to acquire in terms of trade assets than most think
 
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Goptor said:
I don't see how its doable without our 2024 1st round pick
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I don’t disagree but I’m pretty sure Winnipeg will be looking for NHL players or close to NHL ready prospects in return just like they did for PLD. Who could that be? Wouldn’t be surprised if that was Mercer or Nemec. Can’t see us doing that but unlike the Meier trade I feel like that kind of young player or prospect might be required. I think absolute best case they value Holtz and want him, Schmid and then a pick and a lesser player from the roster. Maybe Bahl.

I think the only possible best case kind of deal I could see working with us is exactly that.
Schmid, Holtz (if they like him), Bahl, and a 2nd (or even 1st) in 2025. And I don’t think something like that is worth doing for a 1 year rental.
And I think they’ll want a bigger piece such as Mercer, Nemec or a siegenthaler or Marino.
 
Captain3rdLine said:
I don’t disagree but I’m pretty sure Winnipeg will be looking for NHL players or close to NHL ready prospects in return just like they did for PLD. Who could that be? Wouldn’t be surprised if that was Mercer or Nemec. Can’t see us doing that but unlike the Meier trade I feel like that kind of young player or prospect might be required. I think absolute best case they value Holtz and want him, Schmid and then a pick and a lesser player from the roster. Maybe Bahl.

I think the only possible best case kind of deal I could see working with us is exactly that.
Schmid, Holtz (if they like him), Bahl, and a 2nd (or even 1st) in 2025. And I don’t think something like that is worth doing for a 1 year rental.
And I think they’ll want a bigger piece such as Mercer, Nemec or a siegenthaler or Marino.
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If that’s what it takes, we aren’t getting him, cause we for sure aren’t getting rid of these pieces.
 
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Tom clearly wants another goalie given how he’s looking at the Bruins goalies and Hellebuyck. Swayman could be the one to go after due to age. But Ullmark is still signed for the next 2 seasons and is also a really good goalie that can obviously do work on a good team. And Helle, well he’s great, but he’s the oldest and his ask price is insane.

But speaking of his ask, Lebrun in TSNs Overdrive said that if the devils were to be the team to go after Hellebuyck and get him, that he likely could drop his ask down to a more team friendly ask.

Either way, Tom is going hard after a goalie and is looking to get a good one. The window is open and he wants to take advantage of it asap.
 
Emperoreddy said:
Huh? We can fit him
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Not sure how you think we can fit him. I think you mentioned having 10m in cap space left (presumably from capfriendly) but that only accounts for 9 forwards and 5 D. We'd need another 5 forwards and 2 D to fill out to a standard 23 man roster.

If you figure a VV for Helle swap will cost about 2.7M more, that's 7.3M split between the 7 players. That's a little over 1.04M average for each player, and I'm pretty sure McLeod's and Bastian's numbers will throw us over.
 
Killing Joke said:
Tom clearly wants another goalie given how he’s looking at the Bruins goalies and Hellebuyck. Swayman could be the one to go after due to age. But Ullmark is still signed for the next 2 seasons and is also a really good goalie that can obviously do work on a good team. And Helle, well he’s great, but he’s the oldest and his ask price is insane.

But speaking of his ask, Lebrun in TSNs Overdrive said that if the devils were to be the team to go after Hellebuyck and get him, that he likely could drop his ask down to a more team friendly ask.

Either way, Tom is going hard after a goalie and is looking to get a good one. The window is open and he wants to take advantage of it asap.
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We also aren't talking about signing him just yet. We are talking about renting him and going for the whole thing next year.

Then we see what his ask is and we either cash back out or we see if we can make it work
 
Captain3rdLine said:
I don’t disagree but I’m pretty sure Winnipeg will be looking for NHL players or close to NHL ready prospects in return just like they did for PLD. Who could that be? Wouldn’t be surprised if that was Mercer or Nemec. Can’t see us doing that but unlike the Meier trade I feel like that kind of young player or prospect might be required. I think absolute best case they value Holtz and want him, Schmid and then a pick and a lesser player from the roster. Maybe Bahl.

I think the only possible best case kind of deal I could see working with us is exactly that.
Schmid, Holtz (if they like him), Bahl, and a 2nd (or even 1st) in 2025. And I don’t think something like that is worth doing for a 1 year rental.
And I think they’ll want a bigger piece such as Mercer, Nemec or a siegenthaler or Marino.
Click to expand...

They aren't getting pieces like that from anyone just to rent him
 
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