Devils team discussion (news, notes and speculation) - 2022-23 season thread part III

[NJDevs26]

Holtz has been our worst fwd this year. I don't think there is any question on that.

The idea that we should play him on the top lines is laughable. Fan board silliness.

He's played, and had success with Boq in Utica, they are country men, Boq and McLeod can skate with the puck, covering a Holtz weakness. McLeod is a good defensive center, covering a Holtz weakness. That line probably get's cream puff matchups. Really does make a lot of sense.

Now it's time for Holtz to show he can play in this league.

Who gives a crap if they played together in Utica? You know McLeod and Boqvist aren’t scorers at the NHL level. You aren’t going to find out anything about whether Holtz can score at the NHL level playing him with them at an over-under of five minutes a game.

 

[Billdo]

Who gives a crap if they played together in Utica? You know McLeod and Boqvist aren’t scorers at the NHL level. You aren’t going to find out anything about whether Holtz can score at the NHL level playing him with them at an over-under of five minutes a game.

Yeah I don't think the guy drafted to be a sniper should be playing with guys who aren't point producers in the NHL.

 

[devilsblood]

Don't disagree with this... but the reality is he's not bigger and he doesn't play physical. So he's not a good player unfortunately lol.

He is the definition of a plug. He's plugged into the lineup because we frankly just don't have anyone better to dress in his place at the moment. As soon as Bastian and Palat are healthy, or we make a trade/waiver claim for a forward, Boqvist comes right out of the lineup. He's a plug. He doesn't have a role.



Yup.

Boq has been a disappointment this year in my eyes. I thought he had shown signs in the past, and was hoping for a continued upward trajectory towards being a solid 3rd liner.

Unfortunately it hasn't happened. Yet anyways, he has had similar slow starts the past 2 years.

Shara is in the same boat to me. Higher expectations then for Boq, but he's underperformed. And I mean that beyond point production.

 

[MadDevil]

If anybody can get Holtz going it's the offensive dynamo that is Michael McLeod.

 

[Zajacs Bowl Cut]

Good players earn those minutes and take advantage of the opportunity when given the chance.

Mercer did it. Sharangovich did it. Bratt did it. Henrique did it back in the day. etc.

Unless I'm watching something different, Holtz has done nothing to earn a look with Hischier or Hughes. Aside from him being a top 10 draft pick.

IIRC Bratt started his career playing with Hall/Hischier and Henrique started his career centering the top line when Zajac (I think?) went down..............

what do you expect a player to show playing 5 minutes a night at even strength with Michael Mcleod? Lets be serious for one second here.

Holtz has been our worst fwd this year. I don't think there is any question on that.

The idea that we should play him on the top lines is laughable. Fan board silliness.

He's played, and had success with Boq in Utica, they are country men, Boq and McLeod can skate with the puck, covering a Holtz weakness. McLeod is a good defensive center, covering a Holtz weakness. That line probably get's cream puff matchups. Really does make a lot of sense.

Now it's time for Holtz to show he can play in this league.

see what I said above. what in your wildest dreams do you expect this player to produce playing 5 mintues per night with a 4th line center, exactly? I need to know.

 

[JimEIV]

I just want Holtz to get a shot playing with one of the top 2 centers. I am not saying it has to be forever, or even a full game...but at least TRY it. If not, lets send him down and let him get his confidence back.

He is never going to succeed playing on the 4th line or with those players he is with tonight. He is not ever going to be an elite play driver.

I don't know you get Holtz a real shot with one of the top two centers?

Problem is Bratt has one of those those two spots locked up and Mercer is better than Holtz at everything.

 

[Zajacs Bowl Cut]

I don't know you get Holtz a real shot with one of the top two centers?

Problem is Bratt has one of those those two spots locked up and Mercer is better than Holtz at everything.

Mercer is slated to be on the 3rd line tonight. Like I said, I am not saying do it for a month no matter what. Lets TRY it though and see if the kid has anything.

 

[devilsblood]

Who gives a crap if they played together in Utica? You know McLeod and Boqvist aren’t scorers at the NHL level. You aren’t going to find out anything about whether Holtz can score at the NHL level playing him with them at an over-under of five minutes a game.

Score in the NHL? I'm not sure he can even get shots off in the NHL. I'm not sure he can play at all at this level.

And I'll say it again, McLeod has a higher assist/60 then Hughes this year. Guys trashing McLeod as a player while trying to shoe horn Holtz onto the top line is funny.

 

[OmNomNom]

i never find holtz's positioning to be all that great in the time he's played, nor does he move his feet to get into good shooting spots

 

[Zajacs Bowl Cut]

Score in the NHL? I'm not sure he can even get shots off in the NHL. I'm not sure he can play at all at this level.

And I'll say it again, McLeod has a higher assist/60 then Hughes this year. Guys trashing McLeod as a player while trying to shoe horn Holtz onto the top line is funny.

bro McLeod sucks. Getting a few lucky assists through 1/3 of a season does notchange that. We know what he is. Stop trying to pretend hes more than he actually is.

 

[SteveCangialosi123]

Holtz’s poor play on the boards and inability to win battles or stay on his feet is a bigger problem than his skating to me. When he improves in that area, he’ll be able to get a look with Nico or Hughes. It wouldn’t be wise right now, because I think he’ll drag them down. Nico has cooked with Tatar and Zetterlund because they all constantly win those battles.

Just put him in the minors already, it’s okay that he isn’t there yet.

 

[Jets012]

Lines look great tonight besides Smith over Bahl and that 4th line. Holtz should be in Utica

 

[devilsblood]

bro McLeod sucks. Getting a few lucky assists through 1/3 of a season does notchange that. We know what he is. Stop trying to pretend hes more than he actually is.

Ah, lucky assists. Yeah, that's the ticket.

Holtz has the worst shot rate on team. That includes d-men. Bad luck, I assume.

 

[tailfins]

\

Okay so here apparently is the lineup tonight against Philly.

Bratt is with Jack.

Sharangovich is there, too.




Interesting that Holtz is in the lineup as well.

I wonder how much rope Lindy is giving him.

Boq McLeod Holtz is a disaster.

Ruff basically saying he's only playing three lines today.

If they're going to do this, I'd rather they just do 11-7 and get Bahl rotated in.

 

[JimEIV]

Mercer is slated to be on the 3rd line tonight. Like I said, I am not saying do it for a month no matter what. Lets TRY it though and see if the kid has anything.

I just saw the lineup for tonight... I think it's really dumb to have Zetterlund in the top 6 over Mercer.

Mercer has 3 goals and 4 points in his last 5 games. So let's drop him to the 3rd line? Seems really dumb to me?

 

[Whaddagoal]

I just saw the lineup for tonight... I think it's really dumb to he ave Zetterlund in the top 6 over Mercer.

Mercer has 3 goals and 4 points in his last 5 games. So let's drop him to the 3rd line? Seems really dumb to me?

But, didn't you see how well Nico/Zetts were during that massive streak...?

It was a killer line for much of that awesome stretch......

 

[SteveCangialosi123]

Fans always want the young guy to play over the veteran and lots of the time they don’t deserve it, but I think Bahl is genuinely much better than Smith. That’s not even a knock on Smith, he’s done a nice job and better than I expected. But Bahl is showing me a lot every time he’s in.

He moves so well for a huge guy. His reach has a noticeable impact on the game. He can deliver punishing hits. Any offense he can bring is more than Smith is capable of. But injuries happen, he’ll get his opportunity.

 

[JimEIV]

But, didn't you see how well Nico/Zetts were during that massive streak...?

It was a killer line for much of that awesome stretch......

Just seems to me the shuffle ruins more lines than does good. That 4th is going to get Zero time, the 3rd line looks disjointed to me and we took goal scoring out of the top 6.

 

[devilsblood]

But, didn't you see how well Nico/Zetts were during that massive streak...?

It was a killer line for much of that awesome stretch......

Z also has the best on ice goals against rate on the team. Nico will be getting the defensive matchups.

(Holtz has the worst rate here too).

\

Boq McLeod Holtz is a disaster.

Ruff basically saying he's only playing three lines today.

If they're going to do this, I'd rather they just do 11-7 and get Bahl rotated in.

As I argue above, I actually like the line.

But the one concern I have is that Ruff will just bench it.

 

[Bleedred]

\

Boq McLeod Holtz is a disaster.

Ruff basically saying he's only playing three lines today.

If they're going to do this, I'd rather they just do 11-7 and get Bahl rotated in.

Yeah, I'll wait to see if he actually uses the 4th line more than the last two games, but something tells me ''Fool me once, shame on you, fool me twice, shame on me''. And I'm highly skeptical he gives them an adequate amount of minutes, while Hughes gets DeBoer era Kovalchukian amounts of ice time, as well as the rest of the ''Horses'' getting whipped into the ground.

He came out at the morning presser last game and talked about how we need to get back to rolling 4 lines again. Did the guys that on that line even average 2 more minutes than they/or the guy they were replacing did the night before?

There's really no reason to go balls to the wall like this against Philly. We can beat them pretty soundly as long as we show up, which we kind of didn't last time, despite winning.

 

[Triumph]

I think that fourth line has a chance of working, but I don't think we will see it much tonight. McLeod is a decent playmaker, Boqvist too, and Holtz can shoot. The former two skate well. I bet they end up on the bench by the 2nd period though.

 

[My3Sons]

Don't disagree with this... but the reality is he's not bigger and he doesn't play physical. So he's not a good player unfortunately lol.

He is the definition of a plug. He's plugged into the lineup because we frankly just don't have anyone better to dress in his place at the moment. As soon as Bastian and Palat are healthy, or we make a trade/waiver claim for a forward, Boqvist comes right out of the lineup. He's a plug. He doesn't have a role.



Yup.

Not how I used plug and obviously I wasn’t clear in the point I was trying to make. You are posting about something adjacent to my point but not mutually exclusive from it.

 

[NjDevsRR]

If they want to try Holtz in the top 6 then the lineup should be this. Haula needs to be on that line to cover up for Holtz skating and D deficiencies.

Tatar Hischier Bratt
Haula Hughes Holtz
Sharangovich Boqvist Zetterlund
Wood McLeod Insert Anyone

When Palat is back:

Tatar Hischier Bratt
Palat Hughes Holtz
Sharangovich Haula Zetterlund
Wood McLeod Boq/Bastian

 

[devilsblood]

I think that fourth line has a chance of working, but I don't think we will see it much tonight. McLeod is a decent playmaker, Boqvist too, and Holtz can shoot. The former two skate well. I bet they end up on the bench by the 2nd period though.

Holey Mackeral, talking about 4th liners and we are in (near) total agreement. This really is a big moment for me.

Though I can't let a reply go without disagreeing on something, Boq has been a better scorer in the NHL then he has been a playmaker, pretty devoid on the latter.

If they want to try Holtz in the top 6 then the lineup should be this. Haula needs to be on that line to cover up for Holtz skating and D deficiencies.

Tatar Hischier Bratt
Haula Hughes Holtz
Sharangovich Boqvist Zetterlund
Wood McLeod Insert Anyone

When Palat is back:

Tatar Hischier Bratt
Palat Hughes Holtz
Sharangovich Haula Zetterlund
Wood McLeod Boq/Bastian

Spoiler alert. They don't.

 

[JimEIV]

Yeah, I'll wait to see if he actually uses the 4th line more than the last two games, but something tells me ''Fool me once, shame on you, fool me twice, shame on me''. And I'm highly skeptical he gives them an adequate amount of minutes, while Hughes gets DeBoer era Kovalchukian amounts of ice time, as well as the rest of the ''Horses'' getting whipped into the ground.

He came out at the morning presser last game and talked about how we need to get back to rolling 4 lines again. Did the guys that on that line even average 2 more minutes than they/or the guy they were replacing did the night before?

There's really no reason to go balls to the wall like this against Philly. We can beat them pretty soundly as long as we show up, which we kind of didn't last time, despite winning.

This post made me check on Jack's ice time...to my surprise he's only 56th in the league among forwards in Avg time one ice. Nico is 38th.

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