Devils discussion (news, notes and speculation) - offseason part II

[Better Call Sal]

I don’t envy being in Fitz’s position. I’m sure he absolutely feels he has to go big game hunting because every small gamble he’s made (and he’s done it every year since he’s been in charge) has backfired in some way. Even Vitek ended up backfiring because of how strongly he imploded after his great start in 22-23.

Unfortunately, the position is as volatile as it’s ever been and he’s far from alone in this being a need around the league. His hands are awfully close to being tied in what he needs to do.

 

[Guadana]

Yeah I can't see a world where Nashville keeps both, why wouldn't they also use Saros to get more offensive help while assuming that Askarov can play just as well as Saros did? Trotz has been burned for the past 5-7 years as a coach/GM where his teams have had tremendous goaltending but no one can put the puck in the net on the skater side, it's probably wearing thin on him now

Preds are top 10 team in scoring. They have Wood and Kemmel in prospect pool. So it’s not a problem for them. Askarov can go through 3-4-5 years of adaptation in nhl, Trotz understands importance of goalie and he understands that Askarov has no options to effect on situation.

 

[JrFischer54]

1. By that logic would you have taken Holtz over Bedard last season because "Holtz has proven he can play that the NHL level."

2. 10th overall is not a crapshoot, There's a clear difference in value between the 10th overall pick and the 28th overall pick or the 75th overall pick, just lumping in a draft pick as "crapshoot" is a complete misunderstanding of how these picks are valued. The likelihood at drafting a good player at 10th overall is much higher than drafting a good player at 28th overall, not to mention that added benefit of having team control with ELC and RFA years that makes drafted players extremely valuable.

3. If 10th overall is being overvalued then why are top 10 picks being traded for players such a rare occurrence? If you were right and 10th overall is a crapshoot or not that valuable then why has there been so few times where top 10 picks have been moved over the years?

1. yeah thats exactly what was meant lol what a stupid comment

2. i dont know if you understand what crapshoot means? so you can tell me after we draft a kid what type of production we are going to get from him and know when he will be producing at the nhl level? i really dont care about ELC/RFA years if we end up drafting a bum bottom 6 player.

3. i'm sure there are other examples but more times then not the picks that high are usually made by teams that are rebuilding they aren't expected to compete for division titles the year they got it and are fine keeping the pick. or maybe because teams have different needs and wants when in the spot who knows.

either way the devils are done with their rebuilding phase. the core is in place now go and use the pick to get help on the ice for now not 3 years from now

 

[JrFischer54]

I don’t envy being in Fitz’s position. I’m sure he absolutely feels he has to go big game hunting because every small gamble he’s made (and he’s done it every year since he’s been in charge) has backfired in some way. Even Vitek ended up backfiring because of how strongly he imploded after his great start in 22-23.

Unfortunately, the position is as volatile as it’s ever been and he’s far from alone in this being a need around the league. His hands are awfully close to being tied in what he needs to do.

yeah fitz is in a tough spot. i get not wanting to pay a premium for goaltending but also get him being fired for going cheap again and it not working out. he has more intel then we will ever have so im going to assume if he doesnt want kahak then im sure its for some reason.

 

[Lou Bloom]

1. yeah thats exactly what was meant lol what a stupid comment

2. i dont know if you understand what crapshoot means? so you can tell me after we draft a kid what type of production we are going to get from him and know when he will be producing at the nhl level? i really dont care about ELC/RFA years if we end up drafting a bum bottom 6 player.

3. i'm sure there are other examples but more times then not the picks that high are usually made by teams that are rebuilding they aren't expected to compete for division titles the year they got it and are fine keeping the pick. or maybe because teams have different needs and wants when in the spot who knows.

either way the devils are done with their rebuilding phase. the core is in place now go and use the pick to get help on the ice for now not 3 years from now

1. Obviously he doesn’t believe that, that’s why I’m pointing out the absurdity of the logic of proven NHL player > draft pick. 32 out of 32 teams would value the 10th overall pick over Holtz.

2. If the draft was a crapshoot then there’d be no difference between picking 1st overall or 32nd overall, the fact that your probability increases the closer you get to 1st overall both in terms of NHL likelihood and quality proves it’s not just a roll of the dice but rather odds built on logical probabilities.

3. That’s part of it, but there’s still plenty of teams every year picking in the top 10 that have playoff or contender hopes, they’re not all rebuilding teams. And yet in the past 20+ years there’s only been a handful of trades that involve top 10 picks for players.

You also never commented about Dallas having an extended contending window due to players like Johnston, Harley and Stankoven (all drafted after they made the playoffs) or Edmonton getting a huge boost from Bouchard (12th overall pick in 2018) who was taken after they missed the playoffs. Where would those teams be if they traded those picks because “they don’t want to wait 3 years”.

Or about the fact that you keep bringing up 3 years as if Mercer and Bratt were both impactful players 1 year after being drafted?

 

[ZYXWVUT]

I am so out on saros if those extension rumors are true that agent will wait and branch off Shesterkin. Hell I was out on that idea even before this most recent rumblings.

 

[Skinnyjimmy08]

Hey guys quick question for you....

What type of player does Nemec turn out to be?

I assume Like Hughes will be their main dman on PP1 for many years so will Nemec be more of a P2 type guy and PK type guy that kinda does everything? He doesn't hit or pims but I did notice he finished the season with a high total of blocked shots

I'm very curious about NJ over the next few years and how their d core turns out.

How many points do you guys feel he will average each season?

His stats last season were...

60gp 3g. 16a. -7. 33pims. 22hits. 73sog. 105blks.

Averaged just under 20 mins a game, just over 1 min of PP time per game and just under 1 min of PK a game

 

[NjdevilfanJim]

I don’t envy being in Fitz’s position. I’m sure he absolutely feels he has to go big game hunting because every small gamble he’s made (and he’s done it every year since he’s been in charge) has backfired in some way. Even Vitek ended up backfiring because of how strongly he imploded after his great start in 22-23.

Unfortunately, the position is as volatile as it’s ever been and he’s far from alone in this being a need around the league. His hands are awfully close to being tied in what he needs to do.

Always was a Fitz supporter but if he feels he has to go big game hunting or has to do something for sake of doing it then he should be removed....He should do everything with today and tomorrow in mind .....This teams window is only opening not closing ...

 

[HoliksGhost]

 

[Better Call Sal]

Always was a Fitz supporter but if he feels he has to go big game hunting or has to do something for sake of doing it then he should be removed....He should do everything with today and tomorrow in mind .....This teams window is only opening not closing ...

I don’t think it’s for the sake of it, I think it’s because the cheaper, short term solutions have not worked aside from Vitek’s early 22-23 production. He’s already made another of those moves with Allen. I don’t believe his job is on the line this year, but if he were to go another summer without addressing the goaltending further and it implodes again, he’ll feel the pressure start to mount.

I think he is safe through next year with Keefe behind the bench. They’ll give them time to adjust to the new coach.

 

[Monsieur Verdoux]

Friedman mentioned in the 32 Thoughts podcast that Jeremy Colliton is a candidate for an assistant coach role in the Devils.

 

[JimEIV]

Let the defense mature and fix the forwards and goaltending will be easier to find after that.

 

[Cheddabombs]

Friedman mentioned in the 32 Thoughts podcast that Jeremy Colliton is a candidate for an assistant coach role in the Devils.

Average age of our coaching staff is gonna be similar to the average age of our roster in the mid 2010's

 

[JimEIV]

We need forwards more than anything in my opinion.

After Jack, Nico, Timo, Bratt.... throw in Mercer our forwards suck... Haula is semi useful still... Palat I think is really done. That's only half a team.

It's amazing how little depth there is anywhere in the organization right now.

 

[Better Call Sal]

We need forwards more than anything in my opinion.

After Jack, Nico, Timo, Bratt.... throw in Mercer our forwards suck... Haula is semi useful still... Palat I think is really done. That's only half a team.

It's amazing how little depth there is anywhere in the organization right now.

There will be plenty of possible options in free agency to revamp the bottom 6. Depends on what you're hoping for there.

Jack, Nico, Bratt, Timo, Haula, Mercer, Palat and Lazar will be there. Presumably Bastian as well. Holtz, we'll see where he stands but let's assume he's still here somehow. Gives you 2-3 extra spots if you want to make one of the names above a spare.

Thank You - CapFriendly - NHL Salary Caps

Thank you for the amazing 9 years

www.capfriendly.com

 

[JimEIV]

There will be plenty of possible options in free agency to revamp the bottom 6. Depends on what you're hoping for there.

Jack, Nico, Bratt, Timo, Haula, Mercer, Palat and Lazar will be there. Presumably Bastian as well. Holtz, we'll see where he stands but let's assume he's still here somehow. Gives you 2-3 extra spots if you want to make one of the names above a spare.

Thank You - CapFriendly - NHL Salary Caps

Thank you for the amazing 9 years

www.capfriendly.com

It's more than just the bottom 6...

We have 4 very good players...2 centers and two RW's...if Timo is a RW...

Mercer is a RW so he doesn't really fit if Bratt and Timo are occupying the right side. 2 forward are needed for the top 6... essentially replacing Toffolli and the nonsense of Haula in the top 6.

Palat looks done and Haula doesn't belong anywhere near the top 6 in my opinion.

Every single line from 1 through 4 needs additional help...line 4 needs a complete overhaul.

And none of that really addresses depth...that just ices a team.

 

[Zajacs Bowl Cut]

Palat definitely is not "done" lol I don't even like the guy and his contract but to say he is "done" is silly.

no team has 6 legitimate "top 6" forwards. The Devils unquestionably have 4. Mercer if he bounces back can be a 5th. Plenty of options in FA to fill out the "middle 6".

 

[Its Always Sundstrom]

Let Gibson rot on Anaheim. He’s shit. If he’s looking for a home outside of Anaheim, then he needs to ask them to buy him out (because he’s probably nearly as useless as Schneider when he got bought out in 2020, you didn’t see anybody wanting him on that contract) or he can simply ask them to terminate his contract or retiring is an option. He’s washed up and he’s got 3 years left on his deal and makes more than quite a few goalies who are much better than he is.

Vejmelka is meh. Better than Gibson and the contract doesn’t suck.

Elvis also has too much term left. I’m not convinced he’s worse than Gibson though. I wonder if Columbus buys him out or tries to start fresh with a clean slate with him since there’s now new management, and it seemed the last management team is who wanted him out.

I don’t think any of them are known quantities, other than Gibson 5+ years ago now.

Elvis has had a couple of good seasons though.

I still think it’s going to be Markstrom. And it won’t cost the 10th overall.

It seems the bridge has possibly been burned in Calgary with him after some of the comments he made later in the year.

There still a small part of me that thinks getting this emotionally beaten down Latvian out of the NHL’#s version of Siberia would rejuvenate him. A boy can dream…

If by hockey gods you the best goalie coaches in the NHL, then sure, the hockey gods blessed Nashville and the Rags. (Ian Clark in Vancouver is the other blessed one.)

f*** the Salt Flats, bring Schwab home!

Side note. Just watched the doc about him. He is an insanely likeable dude.

Where is it available?

 

[Forge]

Where is it available?

In the United States, it's Hulu.

Canada I think it's Amazon

 

[Guttersniped]

1. Obviously he doesn’t believe that, that’s why I’m pointing out the absurdity of the logic of proven NHL player > draft pick. 32 out of 32 teams would value the 10th overall pick over Holtz.

2. If the draft was a crapshoot then there’d be no difference between picking 1st overall or 32nd overall, the fact that your probability increases the closer you get to 1st overall both in terms of NHL likelihood and quality proves it’s not just a roll of the dice but rather odds built on logical probabilities.

3. That’s part of it, but there’s still plenty of teams every year picking in the top 10 that have playoff or contender hopes, they’re not all rebuilding teams. And yet in the past 20+ years there’s only been a handful of trades that involve top 10 picks for players.

You also never commented about Dallas having an extended contending window due to players like Johnston, Harley and Stankoven (all drafted after they made the playoffs) or Edmonton getting a huge boost from Bouchard (12th overall pick in 2018) who was taken after they missed the playoffs. Where would those teams be if they traded those picks because “they don’t want to wait 3 years”.

Or about the fact that you keep bringing up 3 years as if Mercer and Bratt were both impactful players 1 year after being drafted?

Bouchard is a great example of how it gets later real fast, he was a guy Edmonton was supposed to move for a player “to help them win” for a couple of years because they couldn’t wait for him to contribute.

But we can also trade the player we get later whenever we want.

The Ekholm trade did a lot to turn that team around. The Oilers traded a guy at the TDL that they drafted at #32 the summer before, another pick they were “supposed” to trade at the draft according to that thinking.

You don’t trade for “NHL talent” you make an actual trade, and if there isn’t one that makes sense, then you keep your powder dry.

Historically, teams that make desperation short term “win now” moves when they aren’t winning both 1) don’t win the short term 2) have trouble winning in later because they don’t have the depth or the assets to get it.

 

[JimEIV]

RW.
Bratt
Timo
Mercer
Holtz
Bastian

C
Jack
Nico
Haula

LW
1 goal in 25 games Palat

Extra forward his whole career Lazar...or is he our 4th center? Either way this guy is an extra.

Foote?

Palat out to pasture an we literally need a new LW for every line. Or play musical chairs with the entire left side.

 

[Zajacs Bowl Cut]

Lazar was one of our most consistent players last year. He is not an "extra" lol wtf?

 

[britdevil]

Lazar is fine as 4th line C. But I don't think the guys body is up to it. He's always injured or nursing an injury.

Palat definitely is not "done" lol I don't even like the guy and his contract but to say he is "done" is silly.

no team has 6 legitimate "top 6" forwards. The Devils unquestionably have 4. Mercer if he bounces back can be a 5th. Plenty of options in FA to fill out the "middle 6".

Not done at all. Dude just had a great Worlds.

He's the kind of player you want in the playoffs.

 

[BurntToast]

If Shesterkin gets a mega deal Markstrom might be the best option.

Saros or Ullmark with no extension is a big risk. Risk to walk and a Risk to the cap structure if, the Devils do sign them to an extension.

 

[Rhodes 81]

I agree we need forwards more than anything else, but it's not so bleak. The hardest spot to fill is the 2nd top 6 LW spot if none of Bratt, Meier, Mercer can play there. You can't have an entire top 6 of + level talent. It's our top 4 forwards' job to elevate their linemates.

You can pretty much assume one of Palat and Haula will be in the top six and that just has to be ok. Neither one of them are as bad as they are made out to be by some here. As long as both aren't consistently playing in the top six and we add one difference maker to the bottom two lines we will be ok.

We just need that, a better version of Haula, and a replacement for McLeod as the driving force for the 4th line.