Speculation: Detroit's Next Move

[Vatican Roulette]

Well Holland isn't just trading Tatar for a D man like Fowler or Shattenkirk it would take other pieces as well. So more then likely the cap would still work.

Ok, I'll get on board.

Those teams can't have an add from Detroit that gets the cap to work for either side.

 

[Vatican Roulette]

Man, they would have been in real trouble if they didn't move that Datsyuk deal.

The cap mgt is very frustrating.

 

[Number1RedWingsFan52]

Ok, I'll get on board.

Those teams can't have an add from Detroit that gets the cap to work for either side.

Yeah with Anaheim's internal cap once they resign both Lindholm and Rakell, They will be as much up against the cap as we're.

 

[Vatican Roulette]

Yeah with Anaheim's internal cap once they resign both Lindholm and Rakell, They will be as much up against the cap as we're.

Also, considering Shattenkirk, Tatar isn't a need for St. Louis.

Plus, cap.

 

[Number1RedWingsFan52]

Also, considering Shattenkirk, Tatar isn't a need for St. Louis.

Plus, cap.

Mark my words, Holland wont trade for a D man. Most likely he just brings up Ouellet and calls it a day.

 

[Vatican Roulette]

Mark my words, Holland wont trade for a D man. Most likely he just brings up Ouellet and calls it a day.

I do not disagree.

 

[drw02]

Haha what? B. Smith is not a legit top 4 d, he isn't our best all around dman. He is too dumb to be a top 4 dman in the nhl. Love him in playoffs but thats about it. He can be traded, no need to buy him out but don't go crazy and call him a top 4 nhl dman.

Yeah he is a legit top 4, the advanced numbers clearly point that out. He also passes the eye test if you watch and pay attention. He and Green are the only guys who can consistently transition the puck. Smith is good in his own end, solid offensive skills though underutilized, solid on PK, he's tough, Wings most physical D by far, throws down for his teammates when necessary, but most important of all he's an excellent skater and almost never gets beat clean. He has not yet been able to harness his full potential and I think that is IQ related honestly. If he was smarter he'd be a legit top 2 D.

 

[Michael Brand Eggs]

We're talking about Ken Holland. He doesn't do trades, even when they're absolutely necessary.

 

[topdawg]

Yeah he is a legit top 4, the advanced numbers clearly point that out. He also passes the eye test if you watch and pay attention. He and Green are the only guys who can consistently transition the puck. Smith is good in his own end, solid offensive skills though underutilized, solid on PK, he's tough, Wings most physical D by far, throws down for his teammates when necessary, but most important of all he's an excellent skater and almost never gets beat clean. He has not yet been able to harness his full potential and I think that is IQ related honestly. If he was smarter he'd be a legit top 2 D.

I guess your right. Its just weird that detroit is desperately seeking a top 4 dman and when we have one right under our noses(smith) we healthy scratch him and he averaged 5th most time on ice on our d. I guess we are saving him so he can play into his 40's, smart move i guess.

 

[WalterSobchak]

I was thinking there is a good chance they buy out Kronwall at the end of next season.

 

[WalterSobchak]

Not how it goes, I'm not talking about the arbitration hearing. DeKeyser took Detroit to arbitration and Detroit Holland took Mrazek to arbitration. The Rangers settled their 2 arbitration cases as well but were still suppose to get a 2nd buy out window and i believe another team as well. Pretty sure that any team that has 2 players that file for arbitration get a 2nd buy out window Detroit's is suppose to be from Saturday to Monday i saw.

pretty sure if Detroit takes a player to arbitration, that does not count as the 2 that would be necessary for the 2nd window.

 

[obey86]

I was thinking there is a good chance they buy out Kronwall at the end of next season.

If he doesn't rebound, I agree.

 

[obey86]

pretty sure if Detroit takes a player to arbitration, that does not count as the 2 that would be necessary for the 2nd window.

I don't believe it matters who takes who to arbitration.

 

[WalterSobchak]

I don't believe it matters who takes who to arbitration.

http://www.silversevensens.com/2015/6/10/8737195/nhl-buyout-rules-refresher-guide

The one exception to this extra window is when the only arbitration case is team-elected, and that player earned more than $1,750,000 (in 2013 dollars - it's adjusted up based on league average salary) in the previous season. In that specific case, the window does not open.

so I was partially right...I think (legaleeze is hard)

 

[drw02]

I guess your right. Its just weird that detroit is desperately seeking a top 4 dman and when we have one right under our noses(smith) we healthy scratch him and he averaged 5th most time on ice on our d. I guess we are saving him so he can play into his 40's, smart move i guess.

Detroit isn't seeking a top 4 D, they seek a top 2.

Please feel free to explain why the numbers are all wrong and your brilliant analysis of Smith is right.

 

[DavidBL]

Detroit isn't seeking a top 4 D, they seek a top 2.

Please feel free to explain why the numbers are all wrong and your brilliant analysis of Smith is right.

Because that is what his usage suggests? 5th in ESTOI/G, 6th in PKTOI/G, 4th in PPTOI/G. 6th in RelQoC if you like those numbers. Even that chart you posted designates his role as a bottom pairing D. What these number should tell us is that he did extremely well in that role. The question is if he can keep that up if given more responsibility. Maybe he can. His coach didn't think as much though.

 

[drw02]

Because that is what his usage suggests? 5th in ESTOI/G, 6th in PKTOI/G, 4th in PPTOI/G. 6th in RelQoC if you like those numbers. Even that chart you posted designates his role as a bottom pairing D. What these number should tell us is that he did extremely well in that role. The question is if he can keep that up if given more responsibility. Maybe he can. His coach didn't think as much though.

What does his usage suggest about his performance? Are you suggesting because was Smith was 5th in TOI that means he would obviously be the best on the team in damn near every meaningful advanced statistical category? And despite the fact QoC isn't very credible and tends to wash out over time? What it suggests is he's being underutilized and sadly wouldn't be close to the first time it's happened in the country club known as the Detroit Red Wings where loyalty and time served matter most.

 

[IKEA]

Has Cleary been re-signed?

 

[Ingvar]

I hope this fancy stats would convince Ducks to trade Tatar+Smith for Fowler. Does it work cap-wise?

 

[Esq]

Has Cleary been re-signed?

Came in here for this. Not disappointed.

 

[Number1RedWingsFan52]

Has Cleary been re-signed?

Not yet, But it wouldn't shock me if he is.

 

[Pinkfloyd]

They don't NEED to buy him out so there is no reason to do so - it isn't like he's Stephen Weiss. Howard may be the most overpaid backup in the league but at least he can fill that role. 17-18 we'd have nearly 5 million off the cap so Howard and Weiss wouldn't be on our roster.
Why do that for marginal cap space if you can finagle around it a different way?

I don't see KH using this buyout window at all.

Because 3 million in cap space this season isn't marginal cap space and chances are that a retention trade will eat up more cap space than a buyout.

 

[T_Cage]

Has Cleary been re-signed?

Nicely done

 

[Blue Goose]

I was thinking there is a good chance they buy out Kronwall at the end of next season.

Ooh, that would be a LOT of dead cap space. If the Wings did that, Kronwall/Weiss would combine for $4.69M in dead space for '17-18, and $5.54M in '18-19 (the first year of Larkin's new contract).

Detroit isn't seeking a top 4 D, they seek a top 2.

Question: If Detroit acquires a Top 2 D-man (presumably in exchange for Tatar or Nyquist), wouldn't that automatically push Smith to the bottom pair behind Green, Kronwall, DeKeyser and the newly-acquired player? Furthermore, given their cap situation, are the Wings really in a position to extend Smith with a pay raise when he hits UFA next summer? That's why I was wondering if it would be better to buy him out, or possibly use him in the same trade to acquire that Top 2 D.

 

[91Fedorov]

I hope this fancy stats would convince Ducks to trade Tatar+Smith for Fowler. Does it work cap-wise?

I (and I think most Ducks fans) would be on board with Fowler for Tatar +. That's actually why I read your boards, I'm hoping for news on a deal. But I don't think the + could be a D man. Our problem is that we have too many D men.

I hope a trade of this nature comes soon. I've loved having Fowler on our team, but a move is needed for us. I think you guys would love having him here too.