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Player Discussion Derek Ryan

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Oilhawks said:
You seem like a really smart guy. Can you explain why almost every player gets worse here? Or is it all because "hOlLaNd hAs DeMeNtIa"
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Who gets worse here that wasn't reasonably expected?
Ryan. 35 and declining. Signed to a 2 year deal by Holland.
Kassian. Career 4th liner. Signed to a ridiculous contract by Holland.
Perlini. Washed out of the league. Signed by Holland.
He didn't f***ing do anything to fix the bottom 6 with a shit ton of cap. And now it, rationally, still sucks. Holland brings in 4th liners, ahl tweeners, and old men to play our bottom 6 and people act surprised like "wow all these great pieces suddenly dropped off out of nowhere, can't blame Holland". Bullshit.
 
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NashtoNowitzki said:
Who gets worse here that wasn't reasonably expected?
Ryan. 35 and declining. Signed to a 2 year deal by Holland.
Kassian. Career 4th liner. Signed to a ridiculous contract by Holland.
Perlini. Washed out of the league. Signed by Holland.
He didn't f***ing do anything to fix the bottom 6 with a shit ton of cap. And now it, rationally, still sucks. Holland brings in 4th liners, ahl tweeners, and old men to play our bottom 6 and people act surprised like "wow all these great pieces suddenly dropped off out of nowhere, can't blame Holland". Bullshit.
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Holland had a shit ton of cap to fix the bottom 6?

what
 
NashtoNowitzki said:
Who gets worse here that wasn't reasonably expected?
Ryan. 35 and declining. Signed to a 2 year deal by Holland.
Kassian. Career 4th liner. Signed to a ridiculous contract by Holland.
Perlini. Washed out of the league. Signed by Holland.
He didn't f***ing do anything to fix the bottom 6 with a shit ton of cap. And now it, rationally, still sucks. Holland brings in 4th liners, ahl tweeners, and old men to play our bottom 6 and people act surprised like "wow all these great pieces suddenly dropped off out of nowhere, can't blame Holland". Bullshit.
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Ryan, Foegele, Ennis, Athanasiou and Kulikov all underperformed relative to expectations.

Ennis, Athansiou and Kulikov have all performed better on their new teams.

Edit: Bear has looked better on the Canes than he looked here last season. Though credit to Tippett for giving him the chance he needed to prove himself the season prior.
 
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Oilhawks said:
They’ll waive him, Calgary will pick him up and Sutter will squeeze some more life out of him
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So be it. The guy's been a double-agent for them so far. Time to wake his ass up by letting him ride the bus for a while.

Let's see what we've got in Seth Griffith. Can't be any worse.
 
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Ninety7 said:
Nurse kind of handcuffed this team when he signed that enormous contract. No discount. Nothing. Not that he’s obligated to do that, but damn I really wish he at least threw the team a little bit of a bone here.
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He's still a 5.5 million player (give or take) this season... that doesn't kick in till next season. He's currently on a value contract given how important he is to our blueline.
 
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NashtoNowitzki said:
Holland doesn't get to hand out $10m to Keith and Barrie and then act like he didn't have any money for forwards. That is an astronomically stupid number for those 2 players.
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Also
2 years for Ryan
2 years for Smith
2 years for Turris

A lot of failed bets on older players in decline.
 
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KeithIsJustOkay said:
He also gave Kassian his bloated extension...
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I wrote that and deleted it along with Shore (I know he is cheap but 2 years?)

I decided the post to focus just on giving age 30+ guys term and watching it blow up before Xmas when most those guys have another full season after this one.

Kass and Barrie contracts are near 30... Both really bad signings but a different kind of bad signing.lol
 
Czechboy said:
I wrote that and deleted it along with Shore (I know he is cheap but 2 years?)

I decided the post to focus just on giving age 30+ guys term and watching it blow up before Xmas when most those guys have another full season after this one.

Kass and Barrie contracts are near 30... Both really bad signings but a different kind of bad signing.lol
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The 2 year deal thing to me is fine for cheap burryable contracts. Cause if they have a good first year and its only 1 year signed then you pay more in year 2, if not you just wasting the owners money.

2 year deals on risky players that you can't burry, thats an issue.
 
CycloneSweep said:
The 2 year deal thing to me is fine for cheap burryable contracts. Cause if they have a good first year and its only 1 year signed then you pay more in year 2, if not you just wasting the owners money.

2 year deals on risky players that you can't burry, thats an issue.
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We have a lot of guys that we could bury in the AHL right now... several more that we should bury in AHL but won't get enough cap relief. It's a lot of deadweight. We have even more deadweight next year... Smith, Kass, Shore, Ryan, Keith are all back next year (as you know). I don't see any of them being more valuable a year from now then they are today. I don't see Barrie become more valuable either.
 
Czechboy said:
We have a lot of guys that we could bury in the AHL right now... several more that we should bury in AHL but won't get enough cap relief. It's a lot of deadweight. We have even more deadweight next year... Smith, Kass, Shore, Ryan, Keith are all back next year (as you know). I don't see any of them being more valuable a year from now then they are today. I don't see Barrie become more valuable either.
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Barrie is tradable still. Maybe we won't get anything back but whatever.
Smith if has more injury problems goes on LTIR, Shore was actually looking like a solid 4th liner. Ryan can MOSTLY be buried but maybe a team claims him off waivers. Keith depending on his play could be an issue.
IMO our team will be worse next year as we are not even going to have the cap to keep the lineup we do now and will lose one of Yamamoto or Pulju.
 
CycloneSweep said:
Barrie is tradable still. Maybe we won't get anything back but whatever.
Smith if has more injury problems goes on LTIR, Shore was actually looking like a solid 4th liner. Ryan can MOSTLY be buried but maybe a team claims him off waivers. Keith depending on his play could be an issue.
IMO our team will be worse next year as we are not even going to have the cap to keep the lineup we do now and will lose one of Yamamoto or Pulju.
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That's pretty close to how I feel too...

Aside from possible losing one of Yam or JP...

we also don't have a legit starting goalie for next year... Koski is gone, Smith is in his 40's and Skinner will be ready to be a 1B full time. Our goaltending, to me, projects to get worse.
 
NashtoNowitzki said:
Holland doesn't get to hand out $10m to Keith and Barrie and then act like he didn't have any money for forwards. That is an astronomically stupid number for those 2 players.
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I can see your point on Keith, but he didn't overpay Barrie at all. Barrie at that deal is a good bet, because he is a tradeable asset at that dollar value. We needed him this year in case Bouchard didn't pan out as well.

I could see Barrie being traded in a hockey trade sooner or later. Somebody will want to bolster their powerplay for the playoffs. Edmonton needs to add...something. Shut down defenseman maybe? Some quality depth forwards?

As per the original discussion, I don't mind Ryan at 4C still. What I can't stand is that we have plugged in AHL'ers to play beside him. Turris is bad. Perlini is bad. Benson might figure it out, but right now, he's not there. To truly fix this team's forward depth issues, we need to keep Kassian on the 4th, find a solid 3rd line LW to play on the 4th line with Ryan and Kassian (or bump Sceviour there and hope he can play both sides). Right now, to be what we need to be come playoff time, I think we need either two solid 3rd lines (Centre and RW to play with Foegle), or a 2nd liner (RW to play in Yamamoto's spot) and a 3C.
 
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Oilhawks said:
Ryan, Foegele, Ennis, Athanasiou and Kulikov all underperformed relative to expectations.

Ennis, Athansiou and Kulikov have all performed better on their new teams.

Edit: Bear has looked better on the Canes than he looked here last season. Though credit to Tippett for giving him the chance he needed to prove himself the season prior.
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Big surprise. He went to arguably the best team in the league, playing with one of their best dmen.
 
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Not that he's an incredible player, but I really think when Shore gets back (and IF he can pick up his play where he left off before getting injured), it will have a big trickle down effect in making our bottom 6 much more effective.
 
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KeithIsJustOkay said:
Perhaps he's saying that the funds should've been better allocated than a sharply declining Keith, an overachieving Barrie, and a question mark in Ceci.
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Hey now, I was against Ceci but leave him out of this, he has arguably been our best and most consistent defender.
 
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Stoneman89 said:
Big surprise. He went to arguably the best team in the league, playing with one of their best dmen.
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It certainly helps, and I think that's a big part of why. He's also on one of the best coached teams in the league. Bear played much better here the first season than last as well
 
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Oilhawks said:
It certainly helps, and I think that's a big part of why. He's also on one of the best coached teams in the league. Bear played much better here the first season than last as well
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I’m not entirely down on Foegele cause he went from playing with Staal and Fast to playing with a mix of McLeod, Ryan, Sceviour and Kassian….which is a substantial downgrade.
 
I really like McLeod and Foegele as a tandem. Big, fast and McLeod getting better every game. Get a solid 3rd (Shore) in there, and I think they are an impact line.
 
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